53 réponses à ce sujet

[andy6915]

The scene with low approval where you see movers taking stuff, when she's trying to bait you. Do they actually take anything from anywhere, or is that scene harmless? Like do they take a seat from the Inquisitor's room or something?

[Dabrikishaw]

It does nothing negative to you. Just an empty, passive aggressive gesture on her part.

[Potato Cat]

You'd think so by the way Vivieene haters talk about it. But no.

[Cz-99]

Yes, they've earned themselves a death sentence.

 

Just waiting on the DLC for that.

Soon...

[lynroy]

I never understood the point of it. It greatly confused me the first time one of my Inquisitors had that scene. This has no effect on me, why should I care? Where's my 'Attempting to care, please wait' dialogue option?

[Reznore57]

I never understood the point of it. It greatly confused me the first time one of my Inquisitors had that scene. This has no effect on me, why should I care? Where's my 'Attempting to care, please wait' dialogue option?

 

Yeah but if you don't play her game , the scene isn't working anymore and she wouldn't look badass , just stupid.

[esper]

It is such a bad written scene. I am still confused by it.

 

How does Vivienne think that this will test my characters limits again? My real life reaction was and is still... sure knock yourself out if you want to. It is funiture.

I don't care. My dalish character don't care. (She knows nothing about interior decorating anyways).

 

Vivienne test no limits because she doesn't push against anything important for me or my character.

 

So it does do something. It makes Vivenne seems incredible petty, and it shows that the writers apperently can't write a political mastermind. (Again it is funiture.)

[DuskWanderer]

The fact that it's petty is the point. Vivienne can't exactly destroy the Inquisition, the Inquisitor is the only person who can do something about the rifts, and they are a power, like it or not. 

[Dai Grepher]

Yes it does. At the end of the game she cleans you out of ALL your stuff.

[Arshei]

Yes, they've earned themselves a death sentence.

 

Just waiting on the DLC for that.

Soon...

 

If Bioware make a DLC to do that:

 

I will pay ANYTHING

[teh DRUMPf!!]

Or we could use our authority as the Herald of Andraste / Inquisitor to turn it around on her, like smiling and ordering the movers to get rid of this new furniture too, or order them to leave all our old furniture in Vivienne's little balcony (wouldn't that just frost her cookies?), or order them to throw all of Vivienne's furniture out with our old furniture. Something.

 

The point of that scene was Vivienne showing the mighty Herald/Inquisitor the limits of their power, and that her influence can affect them. That is why you cannot tell those movers to do anything. She employed a group of people that do not happen to respect your authority, hence why they are listening to her and do not seem to care that they are messing around with the Inquisitor's stuff.

 

Players just hate it when their character does not get his/her way. Too bad for them, it does make sense in this scene.

[BabyPuncher]

It's not particularly reassuring that this is BioWare's idea of a 'badass' character who is a master of breaking people down.

[Reznore57]

The point of that scene was Vivienne showing the mighty Herald/Inquisitor the limits of their power, and that her influence can affect them. That is why you cannot tell those movers to do anything. She employed a group of people that do not happen to respect your authority, hence why they are listening to her and do not seem to care that they are messing around with the Inquisitor's stuff.

 

Players just hate it when their character does not get his/her way. Too bad for them, it does make sense in this scene.

 

Well , not really.

You could tell her to take a hike if she's unhappy in Skyhold.

I mean what does she do for you ?

She brings you a bit of influence with the war table mission but when she tries to sell herself she says she's the leader of the Loyalist mages.

Except she doesn't provide any loyalist mage to help with the Breach...

 

The main court mage is now Morrigan , if you would bother to investigate...

The whole thing about Wicked Heart is you can't get access to the Empress and warn her ...well her "official " court mage is here , Madame de Fer!Well nope.

There's the councils of herald , but again her main link to the council is laying in a bed dying.

The only thing she does is tell you "Go speak to the council , they're important."

But even talking with Gaspard you can guess that.

So ...

 

The woman got nothing .The only thing the game does is trying to hide her true lack of influence , not yours.

 

And I actually do like when character get in my way , I was disappointed in Cassandra for example , I like her a lot , but I was waiting to butt head with her...fighting for leadership.

Never happened sadly.

[Wynterdust]

Yup, this scene as a whole is pretty dreadful. Basically your dialogue choices are: Look an idiot, look an idiot, look an even bigger idiot. There is no reason for not being able to turn it back around on her or just be completely indifferent about it other than to give the false impression that Viv is some mastermind when in reality, she is not. If it was anything other than furniture, that actually meant something, then perhaps it wouldn't be so bad...

 

As a result, my Inquisitors no longer have the time to go out of their way to meet with her and invite her to join. Shame that. I still have the power here!

[Korva]

So it does do something. It makes Vivenne seems incredible petty, and it shows that the writers apperently can't write a political mastermind.

 

Yes, and this is hardly news. Bioware's "masterminds" win because the writers inflict everyone around these charactes with a case of Spineless Stupidity, denying both the PC and other NPCs any brains or agency in the matter. See also: Bhelen in the dwarven noble origin. The way this scene treats the Inquisitor is just another example, if a really petty one.

 

I really wanted to like Vivienne, but she is just a disappointment and a big wasted opportunity overall.

[thesuperdarkone2]

Yes, and this is hardly news. Bioware's "masterminds" win because the writers inflict everyone around these charactes with a case of Spineless Stupidity, denying both the PC and other NPCs any brains or agency in the matter. See also: Bhelen in the dwarven noble origin. The way this scene treats the Inquisitor is just another example, if a really petty one.

I really wanted to like Vivienne, but she is just a disappointment and a big wasted opportunity overall.

The Bhelen example only counts if the dn agrees to kill trian. Otherwise, yes he does outplay you

[teh DRUMPf!!]

I mean what does she do for you ?
She brings you a bit of influence with the war table mission but when she tries to sell herself she says she's the leader of the Loyalist mages.
Except she doesn't provide any loyalist mage to help with the Breach...
 
The main court mage is now Morrigan , if you would bother to investigate...
The whole thing about Wicked Heart is you can't get access to the Empress and warn her ...well her "official " court mage is here , Madame de Fer!Well nope.

 
WOW, you missed a lot.
 
 

Who in all of Southern Thedas, besides the Qunari and Dalish and Avvar and other people who don't care for Andrasteism and thus wouldn't be welcome past Inquisition doors, would not respect the Herald of Andraste's authority? (I mean, if Vivienne's movers don't respect the Inquisitor's authority within Inquisition walls, the Inquisitor should very well be able to ask someone who does to kindly to escort these lovely gentlemen out, or to thank Vivienne for her thoughtfulness and promise to hire their own movers to return the favor very soon.)

 

You think that 100% of the faithful grovel at the Herald's feet? Chancellor Rodrick was an immediate example of your character not having unanimous support.

 

Quite frankly, I thought the way that the sheeple of Haven went from seeing you as Public Enemy #1 to a Messiah figure was completely and utterly ridiculous. It actually reminded me of a scene in Blazing Saddles where the town's new (and black) Sheriff holds himself hostage so the people about to shoot him will refrain from doing so ("They're so DUMB!"). Honestly, Rodrick raised a lot of sensible questions about the Herald for anyone who was not present at the Temple to see the memory. Hell, the Fade is not always a very reliable source of information, so even relying on the memory is not the wisest thing. The Chantry is not even on your side for a long time, and even after the Breach is closed there are factions that gun for you (Sr. Natalie).

 

Regardless, it is quite plain to see that there are plenty of people who do not give a damn about the Herald. Can the Herald stop attacking enemies like the free men of the Dales, the Renegade Templars, or random sellswords by saying "I am the Herald of Andraste!" -? You can't. The movers were like sellswords. They do not give a damn about your character being happy with them, just about the coin they will be getting.
 

Or, you know, like I said before (if you had eyes to read), if none of that it would be feasible (and I don't care if it's not), it would be really nice if the writers included the "Attempting to care, please wait" dialogue option. Vivienne's only doing this petty, childish, passive-aggressive ploy to get under your skin, which wouldn't work if the Inquisitor legitimately did not give a darn. (And judging by the comments here, most players don't.)

I did read that. It was too stupid to warrant response. Though I would be more than happy to show you the ways in which it is stupid if you wish...

If you are going to claim that someone moving your furniture around is not an annoyance, I call BS. Imagine if you were going to your desk to do work/study, only to see that it is not there (nor your bed, or other furniture you use) and have to go track it down only to find it some place where you do not want it (rinse and repeat for every other piece of your furniture missing) and thus need to have it moved back. Are you really going to claim this would not bother you?? You are either lying to me or lying to yourself.

... Which brings me to my next point. This would be like if Vivienne set your horses loose into the wilds and players responded by saying, "Durr well I don't care. I walk everywerr. I never use my mountz!" What matters to you the player is not the same thing as what matters to characters who actually "experience" the events first-hand. You are not bothered by what Vivienne does because you the player are not affected, but your character still is. And it does make sense for them to be annoyed, whether you understand it or not.

Video-game logic = fail.

[Isaidlunch]

Why can't I punch Vivienne like I punched Dorian? Isn't that sexism?

[Deebo305]

I've never had this scene since I generally like Vivienne but saw on youtube and it reminded of this

[Korva]

Bhelen never outplayed anyone -- he "won" by writer's fiat because his sibling was never allowed to "play" to begin with. Same with Vivienne. It doesn't demonstrate anything other than supremely lazy writing.

[Flog the Undying]

Why can't I punch Vivienne like I punched Dorian? Isn't that sexism?

 

No.

[Scofield]

The scene worked as intended, as seen by the replies here in this thread

[andy6915]

Wow, didn't expect this to turn into an argument. My usual "quick questions" typically just get a response or 2 answering the question and then the topic dies off (which I don't mind since it fulfilled its purpose). Weird.