3173 réponses à ce sujet

[Teddie Sage]

Alright people, since we don't have the Lobby anymore, I made this meanwhile while it comes back... if it ever comes back.
http://forum.bioware...he-lobby-group/

[Liamv2]

We've actually already made a fallback forum. Well Vroom did.

 

http://vroomvroom.freeforums.net/

[Teddie Sage]

Oh neat. Will join those.
Though can't promise I'll keep up.

[Dubozz]

we have removed the Off-Topic boards. We want to keep the conversations on our boards focused on BioWare and our games. 

thats NEW BIOWARE guys, enjoy!

[Deathangel008]

well, now they have an already 84 pages long "conversation focused on bioware", but i dont think that this is the art of conversation they wanted.

[Reezus Christ]

Oh, they will. They'll prove you wrong by not posting anything at all. This idea that the end of PAX will bring this Messianic return of sanity or discourse is grabbing at straws.

I post from my phone on the BSN all the time. Literally, almost every single post I do is done from a mobile device. Bryan just got a ton of praise for posting from a treadmill. It's not a monolithic effort to put together a few sentences to say "gone at PAX, we are still listening" or "talking internally about everyonems feedback," but we haven't seen that.

If someone really wanted to, they could post on here now, PAX not withstanding. And it will be only mildly more convenient for them to do so when PAX is over. Heck, if Bioware can dig their heads in the same after the ME3 Ending fiascos when the forums went nuclear, what makes anyone think they can't just ignore this one thread that is neither spilling over into other parts of the forum or generating much traffic?

Yeah I have a feeling this will be the harsh truth of the matter, if not already. People can still keep an eye on the place from time to time but no use sitting here waiting. Let's all join hands in harmony over on the VSN now. *Vroom vroom*

[bEVEsthda]

Hey, everyone!

 

In order to provide a better experience on our forums, we have decided to reduce the number of public boards. These changes will take place over the course of today (Monday, August 24th).

 

In part this is intended to bring some of the smaller but similar boards together. For instance, the customization boards such as Character Creator and Classes & Builds have been combined into Combat & Strategy, and the Multiplayer subboards have been merged into a single Multiplayer board. For most of these merges, we found that our users tend to post in the larger, more prominent forums already, and our changes reflect that.

 

You'll also notice that instead of individual News & Announcement and Feedback & Suggestion boards for each game, we now have these boards for each game franchise. This way, the latest news and feedback for each series will be easier to find.

 

We've renamed Scuttlebutt to General Discussion, and we'll no longer have separate sections for spoilers vs. non-spoilers. Instead, we will expect posters to be more diligent about hiding spoilers and labeling threads that contain spoilers.

 

Do you have in mind some 'vision' of how you want the forums to be? And are you thus working towards specifically that?

 

Or would you say that your approach to the forums is more organic? Like in letting the forums evolve their own culture, but implements changes in order to streamline and simplify activities?

 

Regardless: These changes by themselves look like something I would feel familiar with.

 

Finally, we have removed the Off-Topic boards. We want to keep the conversations on our boards focused on BioWare and our games. Since other communities do exist for such off-topic discussions, we feel it's important to foster conversations within our community that can't be found outside these boards.

 

Thanks,

 

The BioWare Team

 

This is harder for me to comment. The reason is of course my very volatile and impatient nature, though I sometimes feel I can derive an almost perverse pleasure from restraining myself.

 

I do struggle with the reasoning though. "...foster conversations within our community..." ? Are you thinking of whatever discussions emerging and evolving regarding Bioware games and Bioware, or are you specifically aiming for an envisioned subset of "conversations"? Like, for example, discussions only about the games' content, and nothing peripheral?

 

Regardless, - and this is not yet another question, it's just me putting words to my thoughts - it's hard to not get the feeling that the removal of Off Topic is exactly that: A removal. Removing something. Because you can hardly have problems with bandwidth or server space.

There are very few forums about which don't have an Off Topic -section. There are reasons for that.

[DaemionMoadrin]

So I guess this is it, uh? BioWare Asocial Network... 

 

BAN? Sounds about right.

[MegaIllusiveMan]

Just passing here to say, again, that locking the OT Forums was a bad choice...

 

Don't believe me? Look in all these Thread responses.

 

I don't know what else is there to be said. I'm tired of reinforcing my point here. Guess I'll just come back to the ME3 Forums. Heh...

[Monica21]

I really wish I knew why the "Open Letter to Bioware Regarding Explicit Content" thread was still open. That one's a head-scratcher.

[N7M]

...must ...not... Godwin...!

Exactly. 

The BioWare forums are here for the games. They're not meant to be a built in captive audience for petty playground antics or user self-aggrandizement. This forum has often gotten used as such, so much so that BioWare/EA appears to have had enough of it and is putting an end to it. 

[N7M]

I really wish I knew why the "Open Letter to Bioware Regarding Explicit Content" thread was still open. That one's a head-scratcher.

...even the very wise cannot see all ends.

[MrFob]

Ok, first of all, I really appreciate Bryan chiming in here and giving us some insight from the perspective of a BW team member. That is great! Thanks!

 

I have to admit though, I am still a bit confused (possibly because of my naivete) because it seems whenever we raise the point that these forums are not frequented a lot by the devs and if we do get a dev response to that it seems to be focused on explaining why they don't want or like to post here and why they prefer other media for communication, like Reddit, FB or Twitter.

 

Most of these arguments are good and most of the explanations are understandable but despite the technical issues that are mentioned for 2 or more years now by them time and time again, there doesn't seem to be a great deal of concern about this within the company, no push to rectify the situation. This leads me to conclude that everyone seems to ultimately be ok with the situation and of course, the community team has an easy job if the pressure for improvement only comes from the side of the forum users and not from the other side.

 

The inevitable conclusion is that there is apparently no interest by the devs to post here, not because of the arguable imperfect environment but simply because they don't care to make the effort. See, I would hope that the people who make games like Dragon Age or Mass Effect are just as - or rather even more - passionate and crazy about the stuff they make than the fans. I am very passionate about my own RL job and I love to talk about it. I do love to talk about my work stuff with my colleagues but I even more love to talk about it with interested outsiders (not in small part because I can sound impressive ).

I am surprised that a similar desire doesn't seem to exist within BW (or if it does, I don't see it). And again, I am not talking about new info on upcoming projects, I don't want to trick you devs into betraying the carefully laid out plans of the marketing department. I propose just to chat about trivialities, about past games that were part of, about funny anecdotes from the development of , say, Mass Effect 2 or something.

The example I want to bring forward is this thread in the ME3 story section about little things in the trilogy that are hard to notice but fun, once you find them.It's 180 pages chock full of incredible details that can be found in the ME universe. There is no ending hatred or whatever in there, it's just fun. Yet, there is no dev post in this thread. I am amazed by that because you'd think these are exactly the things that they'd love to chat about (be that as a writer, artist, level designer or whatever). I know if I were a dev who made some of this stuff, it would kill me to lurk in that thread without posting.

 

Also, you wouldn't find something like that thread on twitter or facebook. You'll find it here, where people don't come to you because they saw a like from some friend and stopped by while browsing their cell phones on the toilet and make a quick "ME is cool" post. ... Ok maybe that was, a bit of a generalization and possibly hyperbole so let me tone that one down. The thing that is special about these forums is that the people here have put in an effort to get there. They must have searched for your games and possibly dug through a number of posts before they find what they were looking for and - yes - also endured some weird and possibly even some more hostile comments on the way. But they put in the effort and that makes this community just a bit more explosive to the more interested fans. Now I am not saying that these don't also show up on FB or twitter but I think it's fair to say that the mingle with a lot of people who got to your pages by chance (the very purpose of a social network, which the BW forums fortunately are not).

This is great for marketing purposes and it's great for spreading news. So I actually don't begrudge BW the fact that they focus their announcements on these platforms.

However, again, what confuses me is that no one at BW seems to want to discuss their stuff with the people (dare I say) Nerds who are just as crazy as they are. I know I'd want to and when I make mods or a fan fiction or whatever, I also put out the news on FB but I know I'll have my best discussions about it here or on the me3explorer boards or the nexus or the TES boards if it's a Skyrim mod. I am just surprised that isn't the case for the devs apparently.

 

Because if I am completely wrong and it is actually the case, then you guys need to push for a better environment from your end. There is only so much the average forum user can do (and I think this thread alone proves that we are trying). The power to cange things is not in our hands.

 

And if I am right, well, then I guess I'll just stay confused.

 

On that note, sorry for the wall of text.

[DaemionMoadrin]

I really wish I knew why the "Open Letter to Bioware Regarding Explicit Content" thread was still open. That one's a head-scratcher.

 

Because we don't actually have moderation here. A proper mod would recognize that a topic is done and close the thread to prevent it from degenerating into spam or worse.

The BioMods only care about the forum rules, they don't bother with moderating discussions.

[Elhanan]

I really wish I knew why the "Open Letter to Bioware Regarding Explicit Content" thread was still open. That one's a head-scratcher.

Perhaps opinions differ, and more support the idea than some initially believed.

[Reezus Christ]

...even the very wise cannot see all ends.

Lol "wise"...

[Fast Jimmy]

Exactly.
The BioWare forums are here for the games. They're not meant to be a built in captive audience for petty playground antics or user self-aggrandizement. This forum has often gotten used as such, so much so that BioWare/EA appears to have had enough of it and is putting an end to it.

There is literally nothing here on these boards that cannot be found in other places, usually done better. The devs are ghosts here, by and large, so there is zero added value to Bioware's DA/ME forum sections versus those found elsewhere. The only difference was the name Bioware at the top may invite some developer interaction or involvement (a moot point for the last few years) and the people here.

If people are the only thing that separates this place from a fan forum or even a place like the DA or ME Wiki discussion sites, then does it make sense to cut out some of the longest lasting people? It's a common adage that the value of a forum is the amount and quality of unique content it presents. In the DA/ME sections, that exists largely in their mod community and their Feedback sections. The rest is mostly pedestrian requests, praise or criticism, usually rehashing of threads and posts made thousands of times prior.

The part of the forum that saw the most value added, the most catalogued and useful content, was Off-Topic. I kept track of comic book news more up to date than my friends who stalk comic book Facebook groups and news channels. I was introduced to new music I would have never seen before by the What Are You Listening To thread. I had news updates of things happening in the gaming industry that were larger than Bioware or EA's games and could provide feedback and ask questions that would have never been allows on a Gaming News comments section.

The Off Topic may have been filled with silly posts and nonsense, but it was also a treasure trove of discussion that worked better than combing through dozens of different pages, news sites and areas across the web and it was filled with not nameless faces and sites, but personalities and people I knew and enjoyed.

Bioware may have intended the forum to only be about their games, but they followed the basic tenets of having a forum by including an Off Topic section simply because it is a smart idea, no matter what your forum's purpose is. And Bioware's Off Topic was above and beyond those seen elsewhere because it was filled with people who really cared and were consistent through years of changes in Bioware.

So what does the forum have now? Do you want technical support for your game? Well, you go to EA for that. Do you want to hear the latest information on an upcoming title? Well, you go to Twitter/Facebook for that. Do you want to talk to devs? Well, you go to Conventions for that. Do you want to talk about your desire to have more nudity and sex with Bioware's characters? JACKPOT! THIS IS YOUR PLACE!



Pardon me while I bask in the glory of the value of the new and improved forums.

[Monica21]

Perhaps opinions differ, and more support the idea than some initially believed.

 

Except no one is talking about the idea anymore, so that's unlikely.

[Dobbysaurus]

A bullet or an actual slug? I don't want you to shoot yourself though. I'm just wondering if you're down for actually eating a bullet with a fork and knife, hot sauce off to the side, and a bag of hot cheetos to wash it all down.

 

No, I meant an actual slimy, slithering slug. But no hot cheetos!

[bEVEsthda]

Ok, first of all, I really appreciate Bryan chiming in here and giving us some insight from the perspective of a BW team member. That is great! Thanks!

 

I have to admit though, I am still a bit confused (possibly because of my naivete) because it seems whenever we raise the point that these forums are not frequented a lot by the devs and if we do get a dev response to that it seems to be focused on explaining why they don't want or like to post here and why they prefer other media for communication, like Reddit, FB or Twitter.

 

Most of these arguments are good and most of the explanations are understandable but despite the technical issues that are mentioned for 2 or more years now by them time and time again, there doesn't seem to be a great deal of concern about this within the company, no push to rectify the situation. This leads me to conclude that everyone seems to ultimately be ok with the situation and of course, the community team has an easy job if the pressure for improvement only comes from the side of the forum users and not from the other side.

 

The inevitable conclusion is that there is apparently no interest by the devs to post here, not because of the arguable imperfect environment but simply because they don't care to make the effort. See, I would hope that the people who make games like Dragon Age or Mass Effect are just as - or rather even more - passionate and crazy about the stuff they make than the fans. I am very passionate about my own RL job and I love to talk about it. I do love to talk about my work stuff with my colleagues but I even more love to talk about it with interested outsiders (not in small part because I can sound impressive ).

I am surprised that a similar desire doesn't seem to exist within BW (or if it does, I don't see it). And again, I am not talking about new info on upcoming projects, I don't want to trick you devs into betraying the carefully laid out plans of the marketing department. I propose just to chat about trivialities, about past games that were part of, about funny anecdotes from the development of , say, Mass Effect 2 or something.

The example I want to bring forward is this thread in the ME3 story section about little things in the trilogy that are hard to notice but fun, once you find them.It's 180 pages chock full of incredible details that can be found in the ME universe. There is no ending hatred or whatever in there, it's just fun. Yet, there is no dev post in this thread. I am amazed by that because you'd think these are exactly the things that they'd love to chat about (be that as a writer, artist, level designer or whatever). I know if I were a dev who made some of this stuff, it would kill me to lurk in that thread without posting.

 

Also, you wouldn't find something like that thread on twitter or facebook. You'll find it here, where people don't come to you because they saw a like from some friend and stopped by while browsing their cell phones on the toilet and make a quick "ME is cool" post. ... Ok maybe that was, a bit of a generalization and possibly hyperbole so let me tone that one down. The thing that is special about these forums is that the people here have put in an effort to get there. They must have searched for your games and possibly dug through a number of posts before they find what they were looking for and - yes - also endured some weird and possibly even some more hostile comments on the way. But they put in the effort and that makes this community just a bit more explosive to the more interested fans. Now I am not saying that these don't also show up on FB or twitter but I think it's fair to say that the mingle with a lot of people who got to your pages by chance (the very purpose of a social network, which the BW forums fortunately are not).

This is great for marketing purposes and it's great for spreading news. So I actually don't begrudge BW the fact that they focus their announcements on these platforms.

However, again, what confuses me is that no one at BW seems to want to discuss their stuff with the people (dare I say) Nerds who are just as crazy as they are. I know I'd want to and when I make mods or a fan fiction or whatever, I also put out the news on FB but I know I'll have my best discussions about it here or on the me3explorer boards or the nexus or the TES boards if it's a Skyrim mod. I am just surprised that isn't the case for the devs apparently.

 

Because if I am completely wrong and it is actually the case, then you guys need to push for a better environment from your end. There is only so much the average forum user can do (and I think this thread alone proves that we are trying). The power to cange things is not in our hands.

 

And if I am right, well, then I guess I'll just stay confused.

 

On that note, sorry for the wall of text.

 

The devs have to answer for themselves - and they have, I gather - but I have no trouble understanding that this takes time. Lots of time. And they can't really do it on paid working hours. Besides, they probably have something else, urgent, to do. My guess is that they had the luxury of a more relaxed working situation, in the old days, before EA. Perhaps the old Bioware also valued forum interaction more. And maybe all the turmoil involving DA2 and ME3 have something to do with that forum interaction is not regarded as positively any longer.

 

I mean, it's easy to understand. It takes time for me too. Which is why I also don't comment a lot of stuff. I'm also kinda tired of some questions, and other, which are my interests, are long lost causes. So what's the point. Maybe I have been on Bioware's forums too long. I date all the way back to BG, and I have grown old since then.

That devs comments in other avenues is part of their personal internet culture, I assume.

So long as EA/Bioware don't have any explicit policy of actively participating on the forums, I guess we just have to accept the feeling of abandonment. I would think they check out the situation now and then though.

[Elhanan]

No one is apparently a bit of an exaggeration. What I have noticed is that those that support the idea are quickly shouted down by those of a differing opinion. This is also noticed at other forums on the same topic.

As for OT, I miss the Workday Cheer humor, and the old Skyrim thread; tons of good gaming info stored in there.

[N7M]

Except no one is talking about the idea anymore, so that's unlikely.

Demonstrating the need to moderate users not close the thread. 

[MrFob]

The devs have to answer for themselves - and they have, I gather - but I have no trouble understanding that this takes time. Lots of time. And they can't really do it on paid working hours. Besides, they probably have something else, urgent, to do. My guess is that they had the luxury of a more relaxed working situation, in the old days, before EA. Perhaps the old Bioware also valued forum interaction more. And maybe all the turmoil involving DA2 and ME3 have something to do with that forum interaction is not regarded as positively any longer.

 

I mean, it's easy to understand. It takes time for me too. Which is why I also don't comment a lot of stuff. I'm also kinda tired of some questions, and other, which are my interests, are long lost causes. So what's the point. Maybe I have been on Bioware's forums too long. I date all the way back to BG, and I have grown old since then.

That devs comments in other avenues is part of their personal internet culture, I assume.

So long as EA/Bioware don't have any explicit policy of actively participating on the forums, I guess we just have to accept the feeling of abandonment. I would think they check out the situation now and then though.

 

I am not asking for a constant stream of posts every five minutes. I am also not asking for any kind of organized posting. In fact, I am not really asking for anything from the devs. I am just expressing my confusion over their apparent lack of desire to come to these boards, while they are apparently active on other platforms (which takes just as much time).

Besides, I am pulling a 50+ hour week and have other stuff that I do in my free time as well. But I am a Nerd who likes BW games, so every now and so often I come here and  check what's going on and maybe post something. It's not that hard.

Maybe it really is just a job and they are happy when they do get to go home after a hard 10+ hour workday and they can leave all this crap behind them. Maybe none of the ~800 employees takes joy out of checking out what's going on here. I couldn't blame them really. But I can be a bit disappointed that in that case, the passion would apparently have been drained out of game development at BW.

[Barbarossa2010]

There is literally nothing here on these boards that cannot be found in other places, usually done better. The devs are ghosts here by and large, so there is zero added value to Bioware's DA/ME forum sections versus those found elsewhere. The only difference was the name Bioware at the top may invite some developer interaction or involvement (a moot point for the last few years) and the people here.

If people is the only thing that separates this place from a fan forum or even a place the DA or ME Wiki discussion sites, then does it make sense to cut out some of the longest lasting people? It's a common adage that the value of a forum is the amount and quality of unique content it presents. In the DA/ME sections, that exists in their mod community and their Feedback sections. The rest is mostly pedestrian requests, praise or criticism, usually rehashing of threads and posts made thousands of times prior.

The part of the forum that saw the most value added, the most catalogued and useful content, was Off-Topic. I kept track of comic book news more up to date than my friends who stalk comic book Facebook groups and news channels. I was introduced to new music I would have never seen before by the What Are You Listening To thread. I had news updates of things happening in the gaming industry that were larger than Bioware or EA's games and could provide feedback and ask questions that would have never been allows on a Gaming News comments section.

The Off Topic may have been filled with silly posts and nonsense, but it was also a treasure trove of discussion that worked better than combing through dozens of different pages, news sites and areas across the web and it was filled with not nameless faces and sites, but personalities and people I knew and enjoyed.

Bioware may have intended the forum to only be about their games, but they followed the basic tenets of having a forum by including an Off Topic section simply because it is a smart idea, no matter what your forum's purpose is. And Bioware's Off Topic was above and beyond those seen elsewhere because it was filled with people who really cared and were consistent through years of changes in Bioware.

So what does the forum have now? Do you want technical support for your game? Well, you go to EA for that. Do you want to hear the latest information on an upcoming title? Well, you go to Twitter/Facebook for that. Do you want to talk to devs? Well, you go to Conventions for that. Do you want to talk about your desire to have more nudity and sex with Bioware character's? JACKPOT! THIS IS YOUR PLACE!



Pardon me while I bask in the glory of the value of the new and improved forums.

Exactly. Agreed. And not to mention it was all done under the banner of Bioware AND EA. Their logos and brands were always present, always in the back of our minds, even if we were talking about Fallout 4, or who might be behind a given monitor.

They could take credit in enabling these relationships and discussions, and dare I say friendships? It was a gesture of goodwill on their part...and much of it was due to Bioware. It was a credit to them. They should have been proud of it. It's been one of their few successes (at least as I see it as one of their consumers and customers) as of late. At least they had a small community of devotees who would peripherally visit daily or maybe weekly, no matter the numbers. These devotees might not always agree, they might be ill-tempered at times, but they DID care at least to some degree about the company that gave them a bit more than just a few games.

Does OT really help them with mass marketing? Of course not. But, there is value added as has been discussed ad nauseum. But, if nothing else, it didn't hurt them in the least to maintain a small core of devotees, many whom have been here for years, even if they talked about other things.

I'm not so bent out of shape about them doing it, cold hard calculus and public retreats an all, but how they did it was just bad manners, and the vast majority of OT posters and lurkers deserved a little better. Hell, if nothing else, at least look how many confirmed BW/EA games purchases are under each avatar. That alone, deserves more than 12 minute's notice.

[Barbarossa2010]

No one is apparently a bit of an exaggeration. What I have noticed is that those that support the idea are quickly shouted down by those of a differing opinion. This is also noticed at other forums on the same topic.

As for OT, I miss the Workday Cheer humor, and the old Skyrim thread; tons of good gaming info stored in there.

I agree about the Skyrim thread. That was pure joy. There are a lot of good memories of sharing and interaction there (and yes even ugly arguments). But it was rarely over the top when 1000s of pages are considered;, not to mention, as you said, it is a goldmine of information for newer players.