Merrill was the most invested blood mage that we've been given access too and she retained her sweet personality. Incongruity like that needs to be dropped!
I think that was the point of the character, to make you wonder if blood magic was automatically evil or if it was just another tool. From a gameplay perspective I found it annoying that you couldn't build her as a healer.
It'll probably depend on the role of the next protagonist. If it's another "Hawke" like role or story, Blood Magic is more than plausible.
If it's another "Inquisitor" role, I doubt it. Leading armies/nations as a Blood Mage is just...wrong. It always made sense for developers to scrap Blood Magic from Inquisition (for the Inquisitor's use, at least).
Unless they REALLY want to take branching storylines to its full potential and give us the choice of leading one of two distinct types of armies/organizations, one comprised of Blood Mages/sympathizers or the one opposed to such things. But then we would be talking about nearly two games worth of content. Not sure they would have the ambition to pull that trigger.
Make it harder to learn, certainly. But otherwise, I thought that the gameplay presentation of Blood Magic was good and powerful without being too OP (it could be op in Origins with the right spell combination.)
Lifeforce to power spells? Check
Control others? Check
Take others lifeforce to enhance your own? Check
Massive damage applied straight to the blood? Check.
And sure, having the Inquisitor as a Blood Mage would raise a lot of warning lights and reactions. But what's wrong with that? In fact, it may be an opportunity that this series really needs. A chance to grey the otherwise mostly black/white issue of blood magic and really show that it can be a force for good when the Herald of Andraste is using it for good.
Imagine if a Blood Mage Inquisitor is confronted by skeptical Chantry-loyal individuals. On one hand, they see blood magic as evil. And yet, the Inquisitor just saved them with this magic and is also apparently divinely anointed by the christ-figure of their religion. If Andraste is giving her blessing to a blood mage, then what does that really mean? Does this mean that Andraste does not necessarily condemn blood magic, but rather how it's used?
Of course, this is theoretical. But removing a Blood magic specialization removes a great opportunity for a challenge to both the status quo and to the PC.
Can Warriors and Rogues get a stupidly OP specialization that eats up a bunch of development resources too, then?
Can Warriors and Rogues get a stupidly OP specialization that eats up a bunch of development resources too, then?
Rogues already have a stupidly OP Assassin spec (in DA2 and DA:I, in DA:O it was meh).
It doesn't eat much resources though.
Rogues already have a stupidly OP Assassin spec (in DA2 and DA:I, in DA:O it was meh).
It doesn't eat much resources though.
May I just say that Assassin in Origins is not meh at all. All its passives, plus the abilities of "Dirty Fighting" and "Riposte", including the Rogue passives that allow you do backstabs from the front, make Assassin unbelievably powerful. You just cut through the toughest foes like butter.
Unless they are elites or bosses who cannot be stunned. Then Mark of Death + maneuvering to the back of them should do the trick.
Although Mage is my favorite class among the Dragon Age series (among all RPGs actually), in Origins I had more Rogue Wardens than anyone else, and they were all Assassins. It takes a while to build into the ultimate killing machine, but once you get there it's so worth it.
The only underwhelming aspect of being an Assassin in Origins is if your character is an Archer. Same goes for Duelist.
I hope it does return, but i also hope party members know it, and react to it , or say something, maybe even leave your party if they see you use it.
In Awakenings if Anders is given the blood mage spec he does comment and that which I thought was a nice touch.
Learning from a demon? Demon's going to want favors.
Technically the demon traded you blood magic in return for her keeping control of Connor. So favour fulfilled lol.
It depends on the overall plot of the next game.
I think the devs didn't use it due to gameplay-lore segregation; afterall, it would not make too much sense for the Herald of Andraste to be a blood mage. It's laughed at and criticized how characters in previous games can be blood mages yet aren't punished for it in game (except for the deleted scene in DAO) and worst of these same characters then hate blood magics despite being one themselve depending on playthrough.
May I just say that Assassin in Origins is not meh at all. All its passives, plus the abilities of "Dirty Fighting" and "Riposte", including the Rogue passives that allow you do backstabs from the front, make Assassin unbelievably powerful. You just cut through the toughest foes like butter.
Unless they are elites or bosses who cannot be stunned. Then Mark of Death + maneuvering to the back of them should do the trick.
Although Mage is my favorite class among the Dragon Age series (among all RPGs actually), in Origins I had more Rogue Wardens than anyone else, and they were all Assassins. It takes a while to build into the ultimate killing machine, but once you get there it's so worth it.
The only underwhelming aspect of being an Assassin in Origins is if your character is an Archer. Same goes for Duelist.
That's not just a matter of build. It's a matter of play type. You're playing with a build centred on fine movement. Since rogues don't flank or dance around a target without micromanagement you're babysitting a particular way (not just switching characters or aiming AOE cones).
Ultimately, I found rogues to be pretty weak in DAO because of the opportunity cost - the time it took me to ensure a rogue was properly position for backstabbing could have been used to give multiple commands to mages to nuke enemies into oblivion. Even with spell failure on nightmare, I found mages far easier to use.
No there is a very important passive that allows Rogues to backstab from the front if an enemy is stunned, meaning no flanking/dancing action required. Get it on your Warden, Leliana, and Zevran and they'll cut through everyone.
Thankfully, the tactics section in Origins is in depth enough to have our rogues set to use their stunning abilities first then start hacking away. Not much micromanagement involved.
Technically the demon traded you blood magic in return for her keeping control of Connor. So favour fulfilled lol.
Blood magic is a kind of magic that needs to be integrated into non-combat gameplay in order to be believable, like it did in the scene with Idunna in DA2. As just another combat specialization it's superfluous. You'd need scenes that illustrate what makes blood magic special.
^
Agree , things like blood magic which is one of the most important manifestation in the game and which a lot of Thedas history revolves around it , is needed to feel special in game and not something to toss around at will , and it needed to be addressed in the correct manner , take blood mage Hawke for example , a maleficarum runs around Kirkwall in time of panic of magic in general let alone blood magic and no ones care nor confronts them for employing it.
Another thing is it should be learned in game via a plot like in DAO deal with the demon and not an already available specialization to spend a point on like in DA2.
And the game should display the dangers and effects of using it such as weakening the veil which in return can cause demons to enter the world , and improve the act of sacrificing one's own blood or someone else.
The grey ones taint too should be shown more detail in game if we should come across it once again.
What everyone semms to be forgeting is that most what we know about blood magic is mostly comming from chantry sources and realisticly a lot of it simply can not be true or better said its blown out of realistical proportions because even if half of the chantry stories about dangers of bloodmagic were true Tevinter cud have never endured for 1000+ years especialy in the times of the old empire when bloodmagic usage was a lot more common in Tevinter than it is currently. Another thing to think about is that most bloodmages that fall to posesion we meet so far are basicly desparate people using it as a last ditch effort to save themselves without any real prior knowlidge or training about it.
Also if you guys have noticed it semms that prety much everyone powerfull that has knowlidge of the old magic( Solas-in the dialouge when he asks you about what you think about bloodmagic, Morigan, ancient elves in general dont rly have anything negative to say about bloodmagic they merly view it as another form of magic).
Now dont get me wrong bloodmagic according to what we know does semm a bit riskier for the mage using it compared to regular magic which kinda does mean it is not meant for weak minded and ofcourse there is the potential in it to become power hungry and abuse it, than again whenever there is power avilable theres always potential for abuse.
So provided the next game is going on in Tevinter we should definetly get the specialization back, plus as a side bonus they can intruduce new lore about it from the non chantry perspective in a land where the powerfull have been using it for many centuries without dooming the nation and its inhabitants.
In my opinion if done properly it cud be very interisting to play it and it cud give you options to develop your character a lot like for example are you a resp
What everyone semms to be forgeting is that most what we know about blood magic is mostly comming from chantry sources and realisticly a lot of it simply can not be true or better said its blown out of realistical proportions because even if half of the chantry stories about dangers of bloodmagic were true Tevinter cud have never endured for 1000+ years especialy in the times of the old empire when bloodmagic usage was a lot more common in Tevinter than it is currently. Another thing to think about is that most bloodmages that fall to posesion we meet so far are basicly desparate people using it as a last ditch effort to save themselves without any real prior knowlidge or training about it.
Also if you guys have noticed it semms that prety much everyone powerfull that has knowlidge of the old magic( Solas-in the dialouge when he asks you about what you think about bloodmagic, Morigan, ancient elves in general dont rly have anything negative to say about bloodmagic they merly view it as another form of magic).
Now dont get me wrong bloodmagic according to what we know does semm a bit riskier for the mage using it compared to regular magic which kinda does mean it is not meant for weak minded and ofcourse there is the potential in it to become power hungry and abuse it, than again whenever there is power avilable theres always potential for abuse.
So provided the next game is going on in Tevinter we should definetly get the specialization back, plus as a side bonus they can intruduce new lore about it from the non chantry perspective in a land where the powerfull have been using it for many centuries without dooming the nation and its inhabitants.
In my opinion if done properly it cud be very interisting to play it and it cud give you options to develop your character a lot like for example are you a resp
You are arguing from the viewpoint of lore, and I'm sure the DA team would mostly agree that it would be interesting to have blood magic in their next game, if properly implemented.
However, the problem of making blood magic accessible to the protagonist is not a lore problem. It's a resources problem. "Properly implemented" blood magic goes beyond mere combat gameplay, and it will require a significant investment of resources for a subset of players of one class. So I think it's safe to say that it will only ever be "properly implemented" if it becomes a major theme of the story. Unfortunately, in order to make that work, the protagonist must have access to it, and non-mages don't have that. So there are several significant hurdles to overcome.
I like the scenario I mentioned earlier: the protagonist is canonically mageborn, but if you choose a non-mage class, you haven't been trained beyond basic control. That way, you can still have knowledge of blood magic, and it can become a major theme of the story. Lore-wise, such a setup shouldn't be very difficult to rationalize if the next game plays in Tevinter.
I like this idea. Sort of like the werewolf and vampire abilities in Skyrim were separate from magic and shouts. This would be fun. Maybe connected to race or class but still a separate thing.
There is a Tevinter blood mage on the Storm Coast.
And he's a tough son of a b****. Seriously, that blood mage puts up a good fight and takes a while to kill. Though he was pretty screwed on my current playthrough, I just happened to have a party with lots of stunning and knockdown skills between them, so he wasn't able to get a single spell off since he spent 95% of the fight off his feet.
No there is a very important passive that allows Rogues to backstab from the front if an enemy is stunned, meaning no flanking/dancing action required. Get it on your Warden, Leliana, and Zevran and they'll cut through everyone.
Thankfully, the tactics section in Origins is in depth enough to have our rogues set to use their stunning abilities first then start hacking away. Not much micromanagement involved.
You can rest assured that if the next Dragon Age is set in Tevinter that blood magic and blood mages will surely be everywhere as it is almost worshipped there and looked upon as a norm. I as well hope it makes a return for blood magic is so dark and has such a cruel history behind it and this always makes for non-boring and reviled enemies. Blood magic is a sort of frightening art and could very well be the main driving factor behind the villain or his plot and still be a success in my opinion. But that's very interesting, tevinter??? Hmmm... Like I said, surely bioware could not include Tevinter without somehow having blood magic being a huge factor in the plot.. We can only wait and see!!
Also, blood magic is clearly not fully understood by anyone.
One thing I realised after playing Descent: if lyrium is the blood of titans, that makes the use of lyrium by mages (*drum roll*)... blood magic
I understand why it didn't return in DAI, but I really hope they can work it back into the story for DA4.
Blood magic is a kind of magic that needs to be integrated into non-combat gameplay in order to be believable, like it did in the scene with Idunna in DA2. As just another combat specialization it's superfluous. You'd need scenes that illustrate what makes blood magic special, like this:
The problem when implementing such things, however, is that non-bloodmages don't have that option, which means a lot of resources will have to be spent in order to cater to a small minority of players - the subset of mage players who want to use blood magic.
So here's what I'd like to see as a solution: if the protagonist is a mage, they know blood magic by default. You have the option to never use it, but you do have the knowledge and it can always figure into any encounters written for you if you're a mage. You could even extend this to other classes: the protagonist is mageborn by default, only if you choose another class, you never learned anything of magic beyond basic control - and the basics of blood magic. This setup would be rather appropriate for a story set in Tevinter.
Not a fan of the idea of all classes being mage born but completely with you on the idea that blood magic (if included) should be a feature outside of combat. Its one of the reasons I was actually glad it was removed.
Within the lore and culture of the world, blood magic is such a big deal that it just seems wrong for it not be dealt with beyond maybe one line of throw away dialogue. Plus it always bugged me that in DA:O and DA2 when you could choose to become a blood mage, you were a pretty lame one. Throughout the series people are always talking about how powerful blood magic is but what the PC could do with it is pretty meh. Really not sure how you could have a blood mage spec that felt accurate to the lore that wasn't insanely OP though.Only thing i can think is to have them be able to do things outside of combat to show it. The occasional option to influence peoples minds in conversation (kind of like how Force Persuade works in SWTOR) for example. Like Leldra said though, that would mean putting quite a lot of resources into something that only applied to one mage spec.
One final thing, if it ever does come back i really hope they do what DA:O did and make you actually have to learn it. In DA:O you had to make a deal with a demon to learn it - in DA2 you can just select it (even though having Merril teach you would have been a perfectly logical way to have to learn it). I could be wrong but the impression i always got was that blood magic had to actually be taught, it wasn't something you could just pick up on your own.
Blood magic is a kind of magic that needs to be integrated into non-combat gameplay in order to be believable, like it did in the scene with Idunna in DA2. As just another combat specialization it's superfluous. You'd need scenes that illustrate what makes blood magic *snip*
Exactly, I would like to add that this option should be included into the other schools of magic. There are no mages outside the combat, which is rather frustrating.
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