443 réponses à ce sujet

[Dr. rotinaj]

DA needs some appealing black ladies. Vivienne with her bald head looks like an African bush-woman, what, I guess, isn't very appealing for the majority of male players. Somebody like e.g. Brooks in the Citadel DLC of ME 3 would be better.

 

Man where do I even begin...

 

I've seen people write damn near essays about why Vivienne is unappealing. People go on and on about how she has a flawed perspective on the Circle, she's a social climber, she's arrogant as hell, she's petty, she's rude, it goes on and on. I've also seen people clamour to her defence. They argue that she has a more realistic view on the danger of magic, that she can be compassionate, that she is ambitious and skillfully navigated the game to rise to the top. Right after launch there were threads posted every week titled "I hate Vivienne" or "Why all the Viv hate?". She was extremely polarizing because of her personality and actions.

 

But you are gonna disregard all of her defining characteristics and say that she isn't appealing to the majority because "she looks like an African bush-woman"??? Jack was shaven in Mass Effect 2 but she definitely has a fanbase (me included) that find her attractive. Or is it somehow different because she's black? Short hair on Vivienne looks unkempt and unattractive but on Jack she's the sexy rebel. 

[Bfler]

A bush woman? What the hell. Lady walks into a room decked to the 9's in a magical technicolor dream coat and she looks like she lives in the bush? This is indeed a disturbing universe.

 

The head, not the clothes

[ItFactorScott]

In future games can we just have some genderless alien creature incapable of feeling anything remotely romantic towards another being? I've had enough of these male vs female, hetrosexual vs homosexual threads on here. It's impossible to cater to everyone and make them all happy so the easiest option is to just cater to nobody.

[Dancing_Dolphin]

Well OP, it was bound to happen eventually, at least you are polite about it. People have preferences and not all preferences can be met. You either learn to be flexible and adjust, or get use to being disappointed now and then. I know this because I'm a woman gamer.

[Bfler]

In future games can we just have some genderless alien creature incapable of feeling anything remotely romantic towards another being? I've had enough of these male vs female, hetrosexual vs homosexual threads on here. It's impossible to cater to everyone and make them all happy so the easiest option is to just cater to nobody.

 

A game full of Quarians (pre-extended cut).

[karushna5]

As I said, I personally don't have issues with how the romances turned out in DAI. However I really don't see how the romance option in ME or BG or whatever effect the decision to limit male option so much in the first place. An eye for an eye is not a healthy point of view, just because female gamers had limited options in the past guess what, male gamers should get the same treatment.

 

Dragon age in general kept things quite equal until DAI. In origins you had 4 options  1 straight female, 1 straight male and 1 of each bisexual companions. In DA2 you could romance whoever you wanted since everyone was bisexual (not a good design if you ask me which is why I suppose it was changed). Then we get to DAI where straight males are limited to 2 options (1 of which female characters can experience in the same manner) while straight females get 3 unique romances (cullen, solas, blackwall) and 1 that is available to gay male characters as well.

 

If you look at it from the unique romance side, straight females get 3 times what males get, which wouldn't be such an issue if the number of options straight males have wasn't limited to 1. Even Mass Effect 2, which was arguably the most imbalanced in that matter (from what I personally have played) had 2 very unique option for straight females.

 

Just like in Mass effect, when they had the girls dumped, not out of meaness but because they were already writing for tons of characters that may be dead and they took the least popular ones and got rid of them. The fact that left some players with no options wasn't really considered. The frustrating part isn't that you are unhappy with the options, but that there have certain blinders. It's less revenge and more annoyance that when something similiar happens to you, its always treated as the big mistake, and somehow the game did wrong by Straight Men when really they treated you no different than gay men or lesbian women, and no different to straight women in their other games.

 

There is a sense that you are fine with our feet being sore most of the time, but how could someone sell You shoes that don't fit. If you came in and while talking said you didn't really like Cassandra or Josephine it would be less of an issue, but so many guys come in and say as a Straight Man they feel they were treated unfairly. There becomes a sense that you feel you deserve more. When really, straight women have not often been the ones to have the privledged extra. And thats what they got, extra.

 

Really though, straight guys got a normal amount. No extra, it is true, but a normal amount. They didn't like their options, I get that and that is okay, but you got a fair number. It really becomes, someone else got extra other than you guys. If there is to be more, you feel you were unfairly treated by not getting it. And even that is okay! But the lack of awareness that normally it has been different, and that it almost seems entirely taken as an insult to Straight Men, gets on our nerves by the tone of entitlement whether meant or not.

[Fullmetall21]

 

 

Again, straight guys have the same number of options as always.  The only thing that's changed is that you don't like your options this time around.  Not liking your options =/= as not having options.  There's, literally, no way possible for Bioware to meet everyone's subjective "wants" in a romance option.  Sometimes you hit gold and like both of your options.  Sometimes you strike out and don't like either of them.  Either way, it's not a big deal.

 

That is quite wrong to assume about me, I really like the Cassandra romance and I consider it to be one of the better romances in Dragon Age in general, second only to Morrigan from Origins. My main problem is the attitude people have that female gamers had limited options in the past so it just makes sense that males should get that treatment as well. It was wrong before and it is still wrong now. That and there is also the problem of diversity.

 

As it stands in DAI if someone wants to roll a straight male Inquisitor you have only 1 unique romance option to go with that is available to you, Cassandra. Josephine's romance is the exact same for male and female protagonists. Females get 3 completely unique romances which means there is a lot more replay value and diversity for female characters than their male counterparts. As you correctly mention that was a problem in Origins with people who wanted to roll a gay character, however that issue is somewhat fixed from DA2 forward.

 

That particular problem does not affect me personally though since I always kinda romance the same person (the one i like best) every time after I complete all the other romances once but I can see how that could be a problem for people who want to make these little differences to keep the playthrough interesting and for whatever reason don't want to roll a female character.

[daveliam]

That is quite wrong to assume about me, I really like the Cassandra romance and I consider it to be one of the better romances in Dragon Age in general, second only to Morrigan from Origins. My main problem is the attitude people have that female gamers had limited options in the past so it just makes sense that males should get that treatment as well. It was wrong before and it is still wrong now. That and there is also the problem of diversity.

 

As it stands in DAI if someone wants to roll a straight male Inquisitor you have only 1 unique romance option to go with that is available to you, Cassandra. Josephine's romance is the exact same for male and female protagonists. Females get 3 completely unique romances which means there is a lot more replay value and diversity for female characters than their male counterparts. As you correctly mention that was a problem in Origins with people who wanted to roll a gay character, however that issue is somewhat fixed from DA2 forward.

 

That particular problem does not affect me personally though since I always kinda romance the same person (the one i like best) every time after I complete all the other romances once but I can see how that could be a problem for people who want to make these little differences to keep the playthrough interesting and for whatever reason don't want to roll a female character.

 

It's less about it being okay for straight males to get less options because every other demographic has gotten less in the past.  It's more about the fact that every other demographic has gotten less in the past and been told to deal with it because 'it's not a dating sim'.  And, yes, there were always complaints about it, but the sheer number of threads decrying the injustice for straight males is telling to some capacity.  I strongly doubt that these same people will have such a strong outcry when, inevitably, another game rolls around where straight guys get the majority (Likely ME:A, given their track record.  Remember that by ME3, straight guys had 6 options for full romances, whereas everyone else only had 2).  Will it still be such a terrible injustice for the groups who get less options then?  I know that it's a different series, but Bioware makes both so it's certainly relevant. 

 

I'm also not really sure if I see how it matters if Cassandra is the only straight character for straight guys.  If you want diversity for straight male characters, then you still have two options.  If you are going to play all of the options in the game, then you can have 2 romance options for straight male characters (Cassandra and Josephine) and 3 for straight female characters (Cullen, Solas, Blackwall) and still not double up.  Josephine's sexuality doesn't affect the diversity for straight male character playthroughs at all.

[BronzTrooper]

As it stands in DAI if someone wants to roll a straight male Inquisitor you have only 1 unique romance option to go with that is available to you, Cassandra. Josephine's romance is the exact same for male and female protagonists. Females get 3 completely unique romances which means there is a lot more replay value and diversity for female characters than their male counterparts.

 

tbf, gay men and les women are also restricted to one 'unique romance option'.  Dorian for gay men, and Sera for les women.  Only straight women got more than straight men, but they also got more than gay men and les women.  Straight men aren't being singled out to have less options.

[BronzTrooper]

A game full of Quarians (pre-extended cut).

 

Wouldn't salarians be better?

[Uirebhiril]

That is quite wrong to assume about me, I really like the Cassandra romance and I consider it to be one of the better romances in Dragon Age in general, second only to Morrigan from Origins. My main problem is the attitude people have that female gamers had limited options in the past so it just makes sense that males should get that treatment as well. It was wrong before and it is still wrong now. That and there is also the problem of diversity.

 

 

You're right, it isn't a "fairness" thing. There's no need to tell people that it's "fair" for men to have "less" romances because women didn't have as many options in other games. On the other hand, it IS fair to say, "Well, you had more in other games, and this time it shakes out that women have a few extra." Complaining about that does come across as being a bit petulant that the extra didn't fall the way a particular individual wanted it to. Everyone still has at least two options in DAI, and even if they might not like the options available, they were there.

 

And to be honest, had Cullen and Solas not been added in the extra time they had for development my canon Inquisitor would have stayed single. I like Bull, but there's no way I'm going along with his romance and Blackwall skeeves me out. Me, personally, the player. So I understand not feeling comfortable romancing someone just to have a romance... but then I also romanced Josephine as a female qunari, Cass as a human male, and plan to do a male elf for Dorian next. They've all been fun so far. The game's options are not itself the limiting factor here.

[Fullmetall21]

It's less about it being okay for straight males to get less options because every other demographic has gotten less in the past.  It's more about the fact that every other demographic has gotten less in the past and been told to deal with it because 'it's not a dating sim'.  And, yes, there were always complaints about it, but the sheer number of threads decrying the injustice for straight males is telling to some capacity.  I strongly doubt that these same people will have such a strong outcry when, inevitably, another game rolls around where straight guys get the majority (Likely ME:A, given their track record.  Remember that by ME3, straight guys had 6 options for full romances, whereas everyone else only had 2).  Will it still be such a terrible injustice for the groups who get less options then?  I know that it's a different series, but Bioware makes both so it's certainly relevant. 

 

For someone like me who enjoys playing both genders it should be the same thing. Limited options tend to favor one gender over the other and therefore affecting your initial choice about what gender do I want to roll. 

 

tbf, gay men and les women are also restricted to one 'unique romance option'.  Dorian for gay men, and Sera for les women.  Only straight women got more than straight men, but they also got more than gay men and les women.  Straight men aren't being singled out to have less options.

 

You are correct which is why I mentioned that this problem was somewhat fixed and not just fixed. We could certainly have more unique options for everyone with out singling someone out as the most favorable. But that is a more complicated matter that is also affected by the choice of Bioware to make some characters bisexual. That being said though, having a character being bisexual adds to his/her own uniqueness so I really can't tell you what should be done in the matter to keep all of these things in balance.

[ItFactorScott]

A game full of Quarians (pre-extended cut).

 

 

Wouldn't salarians be better?

 

Better still Geth. No gender, no emotion, no desire for love, perfect

[daveliam]

For someone like me who enjoys playing both genders it should be the same thing. Limited options tend to favor one gender over the other and therefore affecting your initial choice about what gender do I want to roll. 

 

You are correct which is why I mentioned that this problem was somewhat fixed and not just fixed. We could certainly have more unique options for everyone with out singling someone out as the most favorable. But that is a more complicated matter that is also affected by the choice of Bioware to make some characters bisexual. That being said though, having a character being bisexual adds to his/her own uniqueness so I really can't tell you what should be done in the matter to keep all of these things in balance.

 

I just don't think it's possible to make everyone happy in this situation.  There are really only 4 possible outcomes:

• They choose not to do romances
  • Everyone who enjoys romance content is unhappy
• They choose to make 4 bisexual romances (2 of each gender)
  • The people who find all bisexual LI's to be "unbelievable" are unhappy (see DA2)
• They choose to follow the 2/2/2 model (1 straight/1 gay/1bisexual per gender)
  • People will complain about characters being written to 'fill quotas'
• They choose to have uneven distribution of romances
  • People who get 'less options' will complain (see ME3 & DA:I for recent examples)

To be honest, since they can't please everyone, they should just do what they want to do.  Which, given their past statements, is to make sure that there are at least two options per gender/sexuality combination.  Beyond that, they aren't concerned with making it equal.

[Call Me Jord]

Didn't we have this thread a year ago....

 

HAVE I GONE BACK IN TIME AND NOW HAVE TO WAIT 1 YEAR FOR THE LAST DLC 

 

[Dieb]

The head, not the clothes

 

Many black women cut their hair short.

 

Brooks had perfectly straight hair.

[Fullmetall21]

I just don't think it's possible to make everyone happy in this situation.  There are really only 4 possible outcomes:

• They choose not to do romances
  • Everyone who enjoys romance content is unhappy
• They choose to make 4 bisexual romances (2 of each gender)
  • The people who find all bisexual LI's to be "unbelievable" are unhappy (see DA2)
• They choose to follow the 2/2/2 model (1 straight/1 gay/1bisexual per gender)
  • People will complain about characters being written to 'fill quotas'
• They choose to have uneven distribution of romances
  • People who get 'less options' will complain (see ME3 & DA:I for recent examples)

To be honest, since they can't please everyone, they should just do what they want to do.  Which, given their past statements, is to make sure that there are at least two options per gender/sexuality combination.  Beyond that, they aren't concerned with making it equal.

 

As it happens, I agree with you Bioware can't please everyone, which is also the reason why I think these kind of threads are pointless. One side will argue that the other has been favored and they been left out or vice versa depending on the game you look at. Even when Bioware made everyone available to everyone people still complained so the best thing we can do is leave it to the writers to decide who gets what, you get to experience the story from the shoes of the protagonist and somewhat affect it but ultimately it is still their story.

[karushna5]

That is quite wrong to assume about me, I really like the Cassandra romance and I consider it to be one of the better romances in Dragon Age in general, second only to Morrigan from Origins. My main problem is the attitude people have that female gamers had limited options in the past so it just makes sense that males should get that treatment as well. It was wrong before and it is still wrong now. That and there is also the problem of diversity.

 

As it stands in DAI if someone wants to roll a straight male Inquisitor you have only 1 unique romance option to go with that is available to you, Cassandra. Josephine's romance is the exact same for male and female protagonists. Females get 3 completely unique romances which means there is a lot more replay value and diversity for female characters than their male counterparts. As you correctly mention that was a problem in Origins with people who wanted to roll a gay character, however that issue is somewhat fixed from DA2 forward.

 

That particular problem does not affect me personally though since I always kinda romance the same person (the one i like best) every time after I complete all the other romances once but I can see how that could be a problem for people who want to make these little differences to keep the playthrough interesting and for whatever reason don't want to roll a female character.

Once again it is not deserve. it is not a revenge on our part. We are mentioning the past because that is the norm. It isn't for you to feel you had this coming. You don't. It is the great fuss so many of you are making, and even making arguments many gay players and straight women players have been making, without the insight that this sometimes happens. it is frustrating, I get that. Someone else got more, that is no fun.

 

But straight men didn't lose out. They had less female characters. They decide the characters before the romances. There were only 5 women and one couldn't be romanced due to past games, so when extra romances were possible, Cullen and Solas were added, which is why they are more restricted. That is why Straight men got less. The reason people are bringing up the past isn't because we think you deserve it, but because your complaints are very blind to the fact that the shoe has been on the other foot, and you are acting like a travesty happened, or you were shafted.

 

You were not. I am a lesbian, and I am annoyed that straight women got extra as well (although knowing it would have been Blackwall and Iron Bull I understand). But I don't act like this doesn't happen, or I was terribly wronged. When straight women had the chance for 0 options in ME3 they didn't raise as much of an issue as this. And they had less than everyone else, not the same but acting like their sexuality was wronged when they got the same they always had but didn't get the extra.

 

It wasn't fair straight women got extra, i agree, but romances don't always divide evenly, I should know. Its part of it. But straight men were not wronged. They were not cheated. They didn't get less. They didn't even get less than they had before. Why people are annoyed is you are treating this like you haven't had extra loads of times and not only extra, but sometimes definitely had others reduced while yours increased which is way more frustrating.

 

You guys aren't saying Straight Women had a couple extra than everyone and thats unfair. You are saying Straight Men deserve more, either through implication or outright. Straight Women got extra, and Straight Men deserve extra if there is extra. We were treated unfairly by not getting preferential treatment like we have had before.

 

People bring up the past because, sometimes one group will have more and one have less, but you act deserving of the more, and act insulted and put uppon when you have the same but someone else has more. Basically, Straight women got an extra scoop than Straight Men and Women usually have, and you are throwing a tantrum when usually your group gets the extra scoop. You can't see how we might find it annoying?

[TammieAZ]

Many black women cut their hair short.

 

Brooks had perfectly straight hair.

 

There are also black women with perfectly straight hair . 

 

And also with hair or without Viv is freaking gorgeous .

[KaiserShep]

The head, not the clothes

So is the same true of Jack?

[FKA_Servo]

I just don't think it's possible to make everyone happy in this situation.  There are really only 4 possible outcomes:

• They choose not to do romances
  • Everyone who enjoys romance content is unhappy
• They choose to make 4 bisexual romances (2 of each gender)
  • The people who find all bisexual LI's to be "unbelievable" are unhappy (see DA2)
• They choose to follow the 2/2/2 model (1 straight/1 gay/1bisexual per gender)
  • People will complain about characters being written to 'fill quotas'
• They choose to have uneven distribution of romances
  • People who get 'less options' will complain (see ME3 & DA:I for recent examples)

To be honest, since they can't please everyone, they should just do what they want to do.  Which, given their past statements, is to make sure that there are at least two options per gender/sexuality combination.  Beyond that, they aren't concerned with making it equal.

 

Personally, I'm 100% ok with either of the last three options. I just hope they don't ditch them (they won't), and I'll roll new characters appropriately if there's someone who's arc I'd like to explore.

 

Also, end of the day, I think the inability of some straight guys to roleplay anything other than some straight guy is profoundly weird. They're probably not elves in real life either.

[Catche Jagger]

ha... hahaha... Hahahaha.... Hahahahah! HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!! HAHA HAHA HA HAAAAAAA! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! HAHAHAHAHAha! *hack* HAHA! *cough* HAHAHA *hack* haha *wheeze* ...ha.

This is dumb. All of it is dumb. Stop. Stop it. You're making a fool of yourself. Go home before it's too late.

[KaiserShep]

But what if he's home already?

[TammieAZ]

But what if he's home already?

 

 Log off and take a nap.

[jtav]

I prefer "all bisexual" myself. Locking myself out of content at the character creator can be paralyzing.

I think guys have a very small point. Both Cass and Josie encourage a certain knight in shining armor idealized romance, in the same way Fenris and Anders were dark, brooding men who needed to be fixed. Cass/Josie and Sera might've provided more contrast.