456 réponses à ce sujet

[Bayonet Hipshot]

So now there is very little point in getting Static Cage ? It seems to have been nerfed.

[PapaCharlie9]

it was/is near the name section of the description that shows up when mousing over skills. It was a bit buggy, but I could reliably get it to switch. I can't load my save at the moment... kids are watching toons on my gaming rig.

Please post a screenshot when you can, this is one of the many mysteries/bugs of the patch.

[capn233]

Energy Barrage is pretty whimsical now too, with some shots going in random directions and not hitting. I wish I had a standard test pre-patch, to convince myself that it isn't nerfed for damage.

 

But FWIW, Chain Lightning instantly breaks the SB finishing animation (at least, if you pause first) and refills the charge. It's currently my alternate attack for SB.

 

Yeah.  From playing AW a bit in MP, you can fill the charges pretty quickly.  And the first couple swings are a lot more powerful than SB has been for a while in that mode.  Autoattacks even fill it at a decent rate.

 

As for SP, maybe on average you don't get as much DPS from SB, but I can't see how you couldn't fill it fairly rapidly with a combo of decloaking blast and frost step.  CL would be a good choice with FF off, not as hot with it on.  And there is always Fire Mine.

[PapaCharlie9]

When something is imbalanced it decreases diversity within the game. People gravitate towards it. This doesn't change from multiplayer to single player. Players are more likely to choose the more powerful option.

 

Ideally all classes would have their own niches and reasons to play them. These round of nerfs and buffs are a step towards equalizing skill trees and specializations, to make combat more rewarding experience instead of just pressing one button over and over. 

Agreed. An "I win!" button is fun for about 13 seconds, then it's boring. Remember Thousand Cuts/Flask of Fire before it was patched? 

 

If there is an argument against balance, it's that DAI to date has done it so badly that any improvement seems marginal.

[Aulis Vaara]

Because it's bad for game balance to have a class that doesn't sacrifice damage for defensive utility? 
 
It's bad for balance to have a skill that can universally carry a class?
 
Balance is good, because it increases diversity within the game, rather than decrease it. Like it or not, the Knight Enchanter's overwhelming power and utility was edging out the other specializations in terms of the benefits it offered. So they redefined how easy it is to play the class. That's good. 
 
And you can still walk into the middle of combat and start swinging your sword around. It's just not as mind numbingly broken as it was.

I've already sacrificed damage when I choose a defensive skill, because there are only eight slots to put abilities in.

Also, have you even played a Knight Enchanter? Before AND after?

Also also, they haven't created diversity. A normal attack combo, with a staff, at range, is something like 1100% weapon damage, a three swing combo with Spirit Blade was 1200% weapon damage, now it's 675%. Now, the sword combo is slightly faster, but it IS melee range.

Was Spirit Blade itself overpowered? No. Is it now severely underpowered unless YOU DO THE SAME THINGS AS EVERY OTHER CLASS? Yes, it bloody well is and that doesn't make the class more dynamic at all. In fact, it is now forced to be like every other class. That is not fun. In fact, that defeats the purpose of specialization in the first place.

Was the Knight Enchanter overpowered? Possibly, but no more so than a Necromancer with a 1% heal-on-hit masterwork, and it was definitely not the fault of Spirit Blade.

[Felis Menari]

*snip*

I assume it took a 50% damage hit in SP due to the fact that SP gets crafted gear while MP does not. Crafted gear boosts your damage excessively.

So in other words, the devs are injecting the MP balancing thought process into SP. That's a mistake, clear as day. I'm not saying that there shouldn't be some semblance of balance in SP, but it shouldn't be as strict as MP.

[PapaCharlie9]

All thus hubbub about KE and the unfixed weakness/shock bug and necro's over here...getting a buff making them viable.
*poorly imitated wind noises*

Edit: @Papa As I remember Elemental Barrage's hit actually do hit. They just go every which way but north to hit.

I did Sulevin's Cradle yesterday and my EB's were definitely not hitting the target every time. Now, true, that's just the visual appearance/animation. For all we know, those could be extra shots on top of the spec'd ones that do hit (e.g., max is supposed to be 12 and all 12 hit, but they add a random 1 to 3 that go wild for visual effect). It might not make a difference for damage, but it certainly is disconcerting to see some of your shots go every which way and not hit the target.

[Bigdawg13]

I've already sacrificed damage when I choose a defensive skill, because there are only eight slots to put abilities in.

Also, have you even played a Knight Enchanter? Before AND after?

Also also, they haven't created diversity. A normal attack combo, with a staff, at range, is something like 1100% weapon damage, a three swing combo with Spirit Blade was 1200% weapon damage, now it's 675%. Now, the sword combo is slightly faster, but it IS melee range.

Was Spirit Blade itself overpowered? No. Is it now severely underpowered unless YOU DO THE SAME THINGS AS EVERY OTHER CLASS? Yes, it bloody well is and that doesn't make the class more dynamic at all. In fact, it is now forced to be like every other class. That is not fun. In fact, that defeats the purpose of specialization in the first place.

Was the Knight Enchanter overpowered? Possibly, but no more so than a Necromancer with a 1% heal-on-hit masterwork, and it was definitely not the fault of Spirit Blade.

 

 

No need.  Rift mage is nerfed if they use shock (and static cage is is AMAZZINNNNGG /singing).  Plus their mana regen is based on damage output.  That means if they insert a dispel, or barrier, or fade step, blah blah blah (insert your complaints about KE sequence you like to use) then their mana regen goes to pot.  Then they are the same as you.

 

Necromancers get their damage based on killing stuff.  Guess what, once again it is all based around DAMAGE DAMAGE DAMAGE.  

 

KE's were the one class that could spit that concept right in the eye.  Guess what, you can't anymore.  You're just like everyone else.  You can't have your cake and eat it too.

 

It's like sweet sweet beautiful music to my ears.

[PapaCharlie9]

Yeah.  From playing AW a bit in MP, you can fill the charges pretty quickly.  And the first couple swings are a lot more powerful than SB has been for a while in that mode.  Autoattacks even fill it at a decent rate.

It takes too long to switch from the SB finishing animation to starting auto attacks, though. I think the challenge now is to min/max the alternate skills that refill the charge the fastest and minimize the down time between actions. Fire mine is on the extreme end of the refill chart, but it's not 100% reliable (enemies don't always trigger it) and it takes something like 3 seconds to activate?

[PapaCharlie9]

So now there is very little point in getting Static Cage ? It seems to have been nerfed.

I think that's an overreaction. It's still very effective for CC. Sure, you now have to do other stuff to make up for the loss of "free" damage that it use to deal, but that's probably how it was intended to be used all along. It's a Cage, not a Microwave. And the upgrade still does damage, just not as much.

 

I cast an upgraded Cage over an Antivan Fire circle and that was pretty satisfying. Took out a mob of undead in a couple of seconds, on NM.

 

Has anyone retested to see if Static Cage cancels Weakness? It would be awesome if the reason it got nerfed was in order to fix that problem.

 

EDIT: I thought I read that the upgrade was reduced to 15% damage, but I can't find that reference and experimentation suggests it is still 50%.

[Aulis Vaara]

No need.  Rift mage is nerfed if they use shock (and static cage is is AMAZZINNNNGG /singing).  Plus their mana regen is based on damage output.  That means if they insert a dispel, or barrier, or fade step, blah blah blah (insert your complaints about KE sequence you like to use) then their mana regen goes to pot.  Then they are the same as you.
 
Necromancers get their damage based on killing stuff.  Guess what, once again it is all based around DAMAGE DAMAGE DAMAGE.  
 
KE's were the one class that could spit that concept right in the eye.  Guess what, you can't anymore.  You're just like everyone else.  You can't have your cake and eat it too.
 
It's like sweet sweet beautiful music to my ears.

So, what you're trying to say is that monotony is a good thing? I'm really not sure what stance you're taking here. How is being like everyone else "having your cake and eating it too" ?

[devSin]

So now there is very little point in getting Static Cage ? It seems to have been nerfed.

How was it nerfed? I haven't noticed any difference, though I haven't spent too much time with it yet.

[Felis Menari]

No need. Rift mage is nerfed if they use shock (and static cage is is AMAZZINNNNGG /singing). Plus their mana regen is based on damage output. That means if they insert a dispel, or barrier, or fade step, blah blah blah (insert your complaints about KE sequence you like to use) then their mana regen goes to pot. Then they are the same as you.

Necromancers get their damage based on killing stuff. Guess what, once again it is all based around DAMAGE DAMAGE DAMAGE.

KE's were the one class that could spit that concept right in the eye. Guess what, you can't anymore. You're just like everyone else. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

It's like sweet sweet beautiful music to my ears.

I cycled through spells like a good little boy on my AW, so to me this change to SB (in SP, at least) seems like a kick right to the daddy bags. In MP, the change isn't too bad since you can get good damage out of it. But with the subpar damage percentage in SP...the devs look like they don't know what they're doing. Not quite, anyways. The changes to SB come off as a desperate attempt to balance it (no defending/deflecting blade in MP? Are you ******* kidding me?). It's lame band-aid fix for an ability that Bioware apparently failed to properly create in the first place.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

I think that's an overreaction. It's still very effective for CC. Sure, you now have to do other stuff to make up for the loss of "free" damage that it use to deal, but that's probably how it was intended to be used all along. It's a Cage, not a Microwave. And the upgrade still does damage, just not as much.

 

I cast an upgraded Cage over an Antivan Fire circle and that was pretty satisfying. Took out a mob of undead in a couple of seconds, on NM.

 

Has anyone retested to see if Static Cage cancels Weakness? It would be awesome if the reason it got nerfed was in order to fix that problem.

 

Static Cage when upgraded still deal shocked damage, so no, I don't think so. I believe they nerfed Static Cage to make it a strict alternative to Pull of the Abyss.

 

Speaking of fixed abilities, I have been hearing rumors about the pets raised by Spirit Mark not dying when you decide to do raise another one. Is this true ?

[actionhero112]

I've already sacrificed damage when I choose a defensive skill, because there are only eight slots to put abilities in.

Also, have you even played a Knight Enchanter? Before AND after?

Also also, they haven't created diversity. A normal attack combo, with a staff, at range, is something like 1100% weapon damage, a three swing combo with Spirit Blade was 1200% weapon damage, now it's 675%. Now, the sword combo is slightly faster, but it IS melee range.

Was Spirit Blade itself overpowered? No. Is it now severely underpowered unless YOU DO THE SAME THINGS AS EVERY OTHER CLASS? Yes, it bloody well is and that doesn't make the class more dynamic at all. In fact, it is now forced to be like every other class. That is not fun. In fact, that defeats the purpose of specialization in the first place.

Was the Knight Enchanter overpowered? Possibly, but no more so than a Necromancer with a 1% heal-on-hit masterwork, and it was definitely not the fault of Spirit Blade.

 

It takes around 3~ seconds to do a spirit blade combo, and about 5~ seconds to do a staff combo. Spirit blade also has an AoE and comes in a elemental damage type that is not resisted by anything. Effectively it was broken by itself. 

 

Necromancer previous this patch was severely underpowered due to misleading ability damage. In fact, as many of these posts in the thread ascertain, the class was barely playable, due to two of it's abilities being largely irrelevant. Heal on hit reviving isn't even something unique to the necromancer and can be replicated by multiple classes. It's not even powerful, unless you plan on dying a ton.

 

This doesn't stop you from using spirit blade like you have been, it's just a nerf for you and your playstyle. It was unhealthy for the game to have that much utility and damage in one class.

 

Do I have to explain why spirit blade was so good again? 

 

- Bonus Damage to guard and barrier was through the roof

- Unresisted elemental type

- AoE

- Reduced cooldowns by 1 everytime you hit

- Steroid applied to rune damage which then scaled with crit

- Generated protective shield which increased with # of mooks hit

 

I mean it was really staggering. It got a deserving nerf, but also a compensatory buff to a certain playstyle. That playstyle was not yours. 

[Felis Menari]

The bonus guard/barrier damage was certainly nuts, but that got toned down in MP a while back, and then it was fine. Any tinkering after that was unnecessary. *sigh* Maybe if SB did physical damage instead of spirit then this whole mess could have been avoided.

[PapaCharlie9]

It takes around 3~ seconds to do a spirit blade combo, and about 5~ seconds to do a staff combo. Spirit blade also has an AoE and comes in a elemental damage type that is not resisted by anything. Effectively it was broken by itself. 

 

Necromancer previous this patch was severely underpowered due to misleading ability damage. In fact, as many of these posts in the thread ascertain, the class was barely playable, due to two of it's abilities being largely irrelevant. Heal on hit reviving isn't even something unique to the necromancer and can be replicated by multiple classes. It's not even powerful, unless you plan on dying a ton.

 

This doesn't stop you from using spirit blade like you have been, it's just a nerf for you and your playstyle. It was unhealthy for the game to have that much utility and damage in one class.

 

Do I have to explain why spirit blade was so good again? 

 

- Bonus Damage to guard and barrier was through the roof

- Unresisted elemental type

- AoE

- Reduced cooldowns by 1 everytime you hit

- Steroid applied to rune damage which then scaled with crit

- Generated protective shield which increased with # of mooks hit

 

I mean it was really staggering. It got a deserving nerf, but also a compensatory buff to a certain playstyle. That playstyle was not yours. 

Right. Arguably, KE is still OP, even if you don't change your playstyle. It's just less OP.

[Aulis Vaara]

...

The staff combo is heat-seeking and ranged. Spirit Blade is not, you can actually miss with your Spirit Blade, or your enemy can run away. Was it powerful? Yes, but that was the point, because you have to get your squishy wizard into the thick of it. You had to close the distance first, then, you had to actually be able to sustain the combo (something that often enough fails) and the area of effect is no more or less powerful than that of any other AoE spell, except that it's trickier to pull off.

If anything is broken about the Knight-Enchanter, it's that is has both auto-generated barrier AND a spell that can negate any damage.

[Felis Menari]

Right. Arguably, KE is still OP, even if you don't change your playstyle. It's just less OP.

Sure, but the melee mage, in a way, is dead. And melee mage is exactly what the KE/AW was at launch. Now...not so much. Now we have to deal with this somewhat cumbersome mechanic to make it work. Due to the nature of how charges are built up, one absolutely must spec into Chain Lightning and Energy Barrage in order to effectively support Spirit Blade.

One ability, needs several to function effectively, since it no longer can on its own. That is extraordinarily lame. It would have been far better for charges to be built up by damage dealt, so that any skill that isn't multi-hit would still be effective for boosting Spirit Blade. That, or assign different skills different charge generation values so it doesn't get out of hand like it could if based off of damage dealt.

[PapaCharlie9]

Sure, but the melee mage, in a way, is dead. 

No, you can still spam SB all you want. You can still do more melee than magic if you want. You just end up being a less effective melee warrior than ... well, a warrior. As it should be.

[Bigdawg13]

All three KE spells require close melee range. So no, the melee mage is still very much alive.

BTW this thread has officially derailed into a KE whine fest. We should line up on opposite sides and throw outrageous claims about exaggerated game mechanics at each other.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

All three KE spells require close melee range. So no, the melee mage is still very much alive.

BTW this thread has officially derailed into a KE whine fest. We should line up on opposite sides and throw outrageous claims about exaggerated game mechanics at each other.

 

You cannot expect much from mages who pick a Chantry sanctioned specialization. Chantry mages always love their complaining.

 

 

Anyway, about Necromancer, are you sure about Spirit Mark being able to affect multiple enemies ? I mean, the ability now is decent with 175% spirit DPS but I have been hearing rumors that it does allow you to have multiple pets now.

 

Btw, Walking Bomb is a beast in single player now. It was always a really good ability in multiplayer, which is why I adore Sidony. Now its the same as it is in single player.

[AnUnculturedLittlePotato]

All three KE spells require close melee range. So no, the melee mage is still very much alive.

BTW this thread has officially derailed into a KE whine fest. We should line up on opposite sides and throw outrageous claims about exaggerated game mechanics at each other.

Like that one high school exercise about bullying like every kid in the US goes through? About crossing the line or whatever?
Except less sarcastic understanding and more literal mud slinging?

[Bigdawg13]

Sometimes I can recast spirit mark without dismissing a pet. It results in multiple pets. Might be a proc of some sort like a crit or mana surge...not sure.

[Aulis Vaara]

All three KE spells require close melee range. So no, the melee mage is still very much alive.

BTW this thread has officially derailed into a KE whine fest. We should line up on opposite sides and throw outrageous claims about exaggerated game mechanics at each other.

You mean people complain when things stop being fun for them? Who'd have thunk it! Please, complain about how entitled gamers are these days, we haven't had one of those in a while.