855 réponses à ce sujet

[Cyberpunk]

Dragon Age Inquisition and the Witcher 3 both made the same mistake, they tried to be like Skyrim. Don't be like Skyrim unless you want to completely sandbox things. But these 2 RPGS are great not because of their mindblowing gameplay but because of their very very good plots backed up by fairly good gameplay. 

[EmperorSahlertz]

Dragon Age Inquisition and the Witcher 3 both made the same mistake, they tried to be like Skyrim. Don't be like Skyrim unless you want to completely sandbox things. But these 2 RPGS are great not because of their mindblowing gameplay but because of their very very good plots backed up by fairly good gameplay. 

Except DA:I at best had a mediocre plot, which was completely butchered by miserable pacing.

[D_Schattenjager]

TW3 is not like Skyrim. Several side quests have a voice in the story.

[Elhanan]

Really don't need an empty sales talk, thank you. I've played the game more than enough since release day to know what's there, and if it is/was worth doing.

Simply trying to be polite when addressing inaccurate complaints. If one does not like Requisitions, side quests, Shards, etc, then they can be skipped, as there is plenty of ways to gain Power available to each Player. Combat involves far more than simply whittling away at inflated health bars, and DAI is not an Open World.

While this experience may have been painful, it was the Player's choices that are seemingly responsible; not the game design.

[Elhanan]

TW3 is not like Skyrim. Several side quests have a voice in the story.

As does DAI. Every area has side content that can be tied to the story. Thankfully, not every bit of side content was set with a cut-scene.

[Incantrix]

While I'm not opposed to the concept, and did find the scenery beautiful, what exactly about open world do you like? Or rather, what would your ideal DA open world be like? I would genuinely like to know, because I don't think I have enough experience with open world games to understand the benefits to them over more structured environments.

 

Its the exploration factor. You cannot get that same level of enjoyment in a linear structured environment.  I don't know how many times I've replayed this game going through the maps and finding something new. That is what keeps me coming back, DAO while fun, didn't keep me coming back. I made my one warden and discovered all I needed to see in the first play through. It was even worse in DA2. 

 

The formula they have now is perfect. They just need to improve upon it. Not discard it.

[vbibbi]

Its the exploration factor. You cannot get that same level of enjoyment in a linear structured environment.  I don't know how many times I've replayed this game going through the maps and finding something new. That is what keeps me coming back, DAO while fun, didn't keep me coming back. I made my one warden and discovered all I needed to see in the first play through. It was even worse in DA2. 

 

The formula they have now is perfect. They just need to improve upon it. Not discard it.

I don't want to discard the open world, that would probably set the next game's development behind by years. I think Bioware is going to keep the environmental structure of larger zones, which is fine. To do otherwise would be to indicate that the zones didn't work as well as they intended. They just need to fill those zones with quality material and flesh out the characters and quests. I would say that DAO offered replayabliity through the different origins, multi-path quest lines, both major quests and side quests, and DA2 offered it with diverging paths and dialogue tones.

[SharpWalkers]

Simply trying to be polite when addressing inaccurate complaints. If one does not like Requisitions, side quests, Shards, etc, then they can be skipped, as there is plenty of ways to gain Power available to each Player. Combat involves far more than simply whittling away at inflated health bars, and DAI is not an Open World.

While this experience may have been painful, it was the Player's choices that are seemingly responsible; not the game design.

Simply because there's various ways to gain power, doesn't mean the power system doesn't cripple the pacing of this game. Power requirement on unlocking regions, certain War Table missions, and main quests - unlocking one holds the others back. If a players wants to coast through the story, for example, they can't, you must collect power. Because of that it stifles replayability as well. Tell me one thing game gains by having the power system?

 

At the core it very much is whittling away at immense health bars. Whatever changes the amount of whittling one has to do doesn't negate that. It's not an inaccurate complaint - it is an tedious combat system. If you like it, good for you. 

 

"DA:I is not Open World" Which is literally what I said and wasn't the complaint.

[Elhanan]

Simply because there's various ways to gain power, doesn't mean the power system doesn't cripple the pacing of this game. Power requirement on unlocking regions, certain War Table missions, and main quests - unlocking one holds the others back. If a players wants to coast through the story, for example, they can't, you must collect power. Because of that it stifles replayability as well. Tell me one thing game gains by having the power system?
 
At the core it very much is whittling away at immense health bars. Whatever changes the amount of whittling one has to do doesn't negate that. It's not an inaccurate complaint - it is an tedious combat system. If you like it, good for you. 
 
"DA:I is not Open World" Which is literally what I said and wasn't the complaint.

Power does not cripple gameplay. If one wishes to coast through the story, only min amounts of Power are required. This can be done in a number of ways. Power helps contain the linearity needed to keep the MQ thread intact.

Drop a Static Cage on some foes, and add an Energy barrage from another member of the party, and some foes vanish almost as quickly as they appear. Vary staves for different Elemental resistances to speed combat. Use the Tac-Cam to glean vulnerabilities about enemies before engaging them in combat. Or one may plink away as some seem to do; not recommended.

[SharpWalkers]

Power does not cripple gameplay. If one wishes to coast through the story, only min amounts of Power are required. This can be done in a number of ways. Power helps contain the linearity needed to keep the MQ thread intact.

 

Minimum amounts of power, like 20 for Here Lies the Abyss (+8 for Hissing Wastes), 30 for Wicked Eyes and Wicked Hearts, and 40 for What Pride Had Wrought.

"Power helps contain the linearity needed to keep the MQ thread intact."  Really...? Gee, I wonder how all those numerous other non-linear game managed without such a system.

 

Drop a Static Cage on some foes, and add an Energy barrage from another member of the party, and some foes vanish almost as quickly as they appear. Vary staves for different Elemental resistances to speed combat. Use the Tac-Cam to glean vulnerabilities about enemies before engaging them in combat. Or one may plink away as some seem to do; not recommended.

 

 

*Repeat what I said about combat in previous post*

You know you are practically confirming what I said right? That even to people who want to delve into it, this combat system isn't challenging.

[Nefla]

Its the exploration factor. You cannot get that same level of enjoyment in a linear structured environment.  I don't know how many times I've replayed this game going through the maps and finding something new. That is what keeps me coming back, DAO while fun, didn't keep me coming back. I made my one warden and discovered all I needed to see in the first play through. It was even worse in DA2. 

 

The formula they have now is perfect. They just need to improve upon it. Not discard it.

Interesting, I felt the opposite! I must have played DA:O 30 times trying every race, origin, choice, dialogue option and so on. The "exploration" part of DA:I was the worst part for me. None of the things out in the world were fun and interesting to me. If I could have completely skipped everything except the main plot and companion quests I would have. I wonder if PC players have mods that get rid of the power system?

[Ariella]

You don't rent any media any more, since it is easier to just buy the dvd/bluray, or the game itself, get it on Netflix, or just downright steal it off of the internet. Rental media is a dying business, and good riddance.

Really, because it seems to be doing well here.

Really don't need an empty sales talk, thank you. I've played the game more than enough since release day to know what's there, and if it is/was worth doing.

Fine, but if you start talking about it, expect someone else to answer with their opinion. And it would be nice not to imply that what was said was just 'sales talk' ie invalid.

[IanPolaris]

Actually the entire power mechanic is very poorly done in DAI.  The brutal fact is that power really restricts your gameplay once and onely once:  you are forced to go to the Hinterlands.  However, the natural instinct is to complete the massive number of quests you are assaulted with almost the moment you enter the Hinterlands.....and YOU CAN!  What's more, if you do, you'll leave the Hinterlands several hours later, probably nearing level 10, and with about 40 power....easily enough power so that power is NEVER an issue for the rest of the game. 

 

Once that happens, you grossly outlevel and thanks to a flawed crafting system, out-gear pretty much any map you want to play.  At that point the game is essentially over.

[Ariella]

Interesting, I felt the opposite! I must have played DA:O 30 times trying every race, origin, choice, dialogue option and so on. The "exploration" part of DA:I was the worst part for me. None of the things out in the world were fun and interesting to me. If I could have completely skipped everything except the main plot and companion quests I would have. I wonder if PC players have mods that get rid of the power system?

I doubt pc players have mids for that, and Origins is just horrible, imo, when it comes to enviroments, considering none of them are organic. The Brecilian Forest is by far the worst offender. Made up of four separate areas, windy paths and far too much zoning. Ozammar had much the same problem.

Between that and the dun color palette, playing DAO has become a chore.

And for those who are complaining that Bioware copied Skyrim... The community ASKED for that. In fact there was screaming about how much better Skyrim was at the time.

[Nefla]

I doubt pc players have mids for that, and Origins is just horrible, imo, when it comes to enviroments, considering none of them are organic. The Brecilian Forest is by far the worst offender. Made up of four separate areas, windy paths and far too much zoning. Ozammar had much the same problem.

Between that and the dun color palette, playing DAO has become a chore.

And for those who are complaining that Bioware copied Skyrim... The community ASKED for that. In fact there was screaming about how much better Skyrim was at the time.

It all depends on what you like in a game. For me, the visuals and combat are at the bottom of the list. I love Skyrim though. I don't think DA:I's world came anywhere close.

[EmperorSahlertz]

Really, because it seems to be doing well here.

Unless you mean subscription models, and not rentals, then I have a hard time imagining it. All rental media has taken a nosedive in the last decade, mainly attributed to the ease of access to the same media through the internet and subscription services (and the fact that you can just pirate it).

[Ariella]

It all depends on what you like in a game. For me, the visuals and combat are at the bottom of the list. I love Skyrim though. I don't think DA:I's world came anywhere close.

 

I don't see how anyone would like a non organic area that they have to keep zoning through. In the Hinterlands there are three areas that zone you into a sub areas, all are small and directly plot related and inside.

 

Brecilian Forest was four outdoor sub areas connected by area transitions. I don't understand why anyone would want to go through extra area transitions, as it's a waste of time.

[Ariella]

Unless you mean subscription models, and not rentals, then I have a hard time imagining it. All rental media has taken a nosedive in the last decade, mainly attributed to the ease of access to the same media through the internet and subscription services (and the fact that you can just pirate it).

 

Nope, we actually have rental stores still, and all the libraries around here offer rental on both movies and games. Plus BN offers rental for movies on Nook, Xbox Live does too.

[Elhanan]

Minimum amounts of power, like 20 for Here Lies the Abyss (+8 for Hissing Wastes), 30 for Wicked Eyes and Wicked Hearts, and 40 for What Pride Had Wrought.
"Power helps contain the linearity needed to keep the MQ thread intact."  Really...? Gee, I wonder how all those numerous other non-linear game managed without such a system. 
 
 
*Repeat what I said about combat in previous post*
You know you are practically confirming what I said right? That even to people who want to delve into it, this combat system isn't challenging.

If you mean other non-linear games that can break if one does something out of order, or if one kills the wrong NPC, then Power does seem to have a purpose.

And I said some enemies. Some others can have Barrier or Guard, special abilities, resistances, and varied other defenses which may make for a tougher combat. Personally find that Gurd Harofsen from JoH is one of the most challenging and enjoyable encounters in the entire series. But keep plinking away if that is all one can imagine.

[Nefla]

I don't see how anyone would like a non organic area that they have to keep zoning through. In the Hinterlands there are three areas that zone you into a sub areas, all are small and directly plot related and inside.

 

Brecilian Forest was four outdoor sub areas connected by area transitions. I don't understand why anyone would want to go through extra area transitions, as it's a waste of time.

It's not a want but rather a "I don't care either way." The pretty maps don't make up for what was to me a poor, and disjointed story, a weak and generic antagonist, tedious and excessive combat, companions with minimal ties or involvement to the plot, weak and forgettable NPCs, side quests that aren't fun, etc...It's like having a cake that's so stale it's rock hard, having the icing made with salt instead of sugar, but praising it for having sprinkles. 

[Elhanan]

Actually the entire power mechanic is very poorly done in DAI.  The brutal fact is that power really restricts your gameplay once and onely once:  you are forced to go to the Hinterlands.  However, the natural instinct is to complete the massive number of quests you are assaulted with almost the moment you enter the Hinterlands.....and YOU CAN!  What's more, if you do, you'll leave the Hinterlands several hours later, probably nearing level 10, and with about 40 power....easily enough power so that power is NEVER an issue for the rest of the game. 
 
Once that happens, you grossly outlevel and thanks to a flawed crafting system, out-gear pretty much any map you want to play.  At that point the game is essentially over.

Yet if one takes the time to read the Journal and listen to the NPC's, there are suggestions to leave the Hinterlands for other regions. And you can!

As for Power, lots of ways to choose how to obtain it; skip requisitions and purchase Influence tomes myself, along with performing side content of choice. As for leveling, Trials can further tailor the experience for each Player.

[Ariella]

It's not a want but rather a "I don't care either way." The pretty maps don't make up for what was to me a poor, and disjointed story, a weak and generic antagonist, tedious and excessive combat, companions with minimal ties or involvement to the plot, weak and forgettable NPCs, side quests that aren't fun, etc...It's like having a cake that's so stale it's rock hard, having the icing made with salt instead of sugar, but praising it for having sprinkles.

Funny since I'd consider the entire Brecilian Forest a poor, disjoined, weak story, with annoying combat, lousy pathing.

*shrug*

That's fine, but DAI still isn't a failure. It never will be a failure. Because it did exactly what EA expected it to do. It made money. In fact, it did better than expectations.

We can ****** and moan back and forth about what's wrong with the game. We can even get pretentious about it, but nothing changes that one little fact.

[IanPolaris]

Yet if one takes the time to read the Journal and listen to the NPC's, there are suggestions to leave the Hinterlands for other regions. And you can!

As for Power, lots of ways to choose how to obtain it; skip requisitions and purchase Influence tomes myself, along with performing side content of choice. As for leveling, Trials can further tailor the experience for each Player.

 

Yet if one takes the time to read the Journal and listen to the NPC's, there are suggestions to leave the Hinterlands for other regions. And you can!

As for Power, lots of ways to choose how to obtain it; skip requisitions and purchase Influence tomes myself, along with performing side content of choice. As for leveling, Trials can further tailor the experience for each Player.

 

Not good enough.  Blaming the player for bad game design is a non-starter for me, and the power system is badly designed.  If the game is played 'normally' (as most new players will), the power system doesn't work.

 

Edit PS:  Think about this from an RP Pov.  Are you seriously suggesting that most decent people would let innocent refugees freeze and starve while you go away to meet with some stuck-up Chantry Sisters who hate your guts anyway?  I think not.  You put out the fires around you NOW and then worry about the aftermath later....it doesn't matter why you went there originally, letting people die and leaving your tasks undone is simply not something most heroically aligned players should reasonably be expected to do. 

 

PPS:  Blaming the player for what amounts to bad game design and structure is a complete non-starter with me.

[EmperorSahlertz]

Yet if one takes the time to read the Journal and listen to the NPC's, there are suggestions to leave the Hinterlands for other regions. And you can!

As for Power, lots of ways to choose how to obtain it; skip requisitions and purchase Influence tomes myself, along with performing side content of choice. As for leveling, Trials can further tailor the experience for each Player.

So the game should only be remotely good, if you are willing to fork an additional 10€ out for the DLC?

 

And you don't get nearly enough money to buy tomes, without doing sidequests or soulcrushing farming. So no matter how you play the game, you will at some point be forced to go waste time doing tedious, mindnumbingly boring sidequests, which holds zero bearing to the main quests, just so that you can gather enough "power" to continue the already slow main quest.

[EmperorSahlertz]

That's fine, but DAI still isn't a failure. It never will be a failure. Because it did exactly what EA expected it to do. It made money. In fact, it did better than expectations.

We can ****** and moan back and forth about what's wrong with the game. We can even get pretentious about it, but nothing changes that one little fact.

Making money, is not the only criteria for being a success you know. EA had high hopes, beyond just making money, for DA:I, and it failed to deliver.