250 réponses à ce sujet

[atamajakki]

I'm fighting to stop what could very well be the apocalypse. You give me a choice; do I want a handful of mercenaries, or access to the spy network of a major military power? Even with the knowledge that you are later betrayed, siding with the Qunari is the massively more practical choice.

[leaguer of one]

I'm fighting to stop what could very well be the apocalypse. You give me a choice; do I want a handful of mercenaries, or access to the spy network of a major military power? Even with the knowledge that you are later betrayed, siding with the Qunari is the massively more practical choice.

So....Pick a side which you can't really trust is some how better?

[DarkTl]

Seeing how easily Iron Bull can betray you even if the charges are alive  because you didn't finished his personal quest, I cannot trust him more than the Qun.

At least romance or high approvement don't allow Zevran to do the same thing. But no, Iron Bull wants his quest finished and nothing more.

[CoM Solaufein]

I saved his chargers in this game and have high approval. If he turns on me, I'm going to finish him and eat his spleen.

[leaguer of one]

I saved his chargers in this game and have high approval. If he turns on me, I'm going to finish him and eat his spleen.

Do it over...That's a glitch.

[TobiTobsen]

Seeing how easily Iron Bull can betray you even if the charges are alive  because you didn't finished his personal quest, I cannot trust him more than the Qun.

At least romance or high approvement don't allow Zevran to do the same thing. But no, Iron Bull wants his quest finished and nothing more.

 

Of course he "betrays" you (does his job) when you don't do his quest. He has no reason to break with the Qun, if you don't do it.

[DarkTl]

I don't think those Qunari guys from the dlc were following the Qun, they look like Tal Vashoth, since you can find a letter at their base sent to you by the true Qun which they have intercepted. Following the Qun =/= supporting any Tal Vashoth you can see before yourself, at least that's what Sten told us.

[Boost32]

I don't think those Qunari guys from the dlc were following the Qun, they look like Tal Vashoth, since you can find a letter at their base sent to you by the true Qun which they have intercepted. Following the Qun =/= supporting any Tal Vashoth you can see before yourself, at least that's what Sten told us.

You know they were lying, right?

[Jaron Oberyn]

What's the reason to let the Chargers die?

 

- A bull that betrays you?

- Possibility of an alliance with the qunari which is irrelevant anyways because hostilities between the two of you erupt anyways?

- A arguably bad staff schematic that you can now sync with the golden nug?

 

Idk it just feels like there isn't a reason to not make Bull Tal Vashoth, where previously there was. 

 

It feels like the connor/isolde/mages choice, where there is clearly a right choice. I like ambiguity. 

 

Maybe I'm missing something that other people are seeing. Do you honestly see yourself sacrificing the chargers in future playthroughs? 

 

How about the chance to kill james vega with horns, rather than turn him down when he asks to join? I find that to be a compelling reason, and boy did I enjoy cutting him down.

[PillarBiter]

I'm actually very happy with this outcome, from a cause-effect point of view.

 

Granted, I did pause my game for like, 5 minutes and stared at it in disbelief on my first playthrough, after which I completely DESTROYED bull.

 

BUT! I'm really happy that bioware had the guts to cut out a character like that. Same as anders. 

 

Thing is, metagaming may destroy the choice, but in itself, if you think about it... Why wouldn't you, as the inquisition, want a powerful ally like the Qunari? That's worth much more than one band. And srue, through metagaming you know it doesn't work out that way, but that's false knowledge. You should always look at your choice with the information you have at hand. And then I choose a Qunari alliance anytime.

[DarkTl]

You know they were lying, right?

You don't say...

That's not the point. I'm sure the Qun knows something and doesn't tells us, but that's not what I'm talking about.

 

There was no need AT ALL to do something about that letter, there wasn't something important inside. They simply wrote there that they are not planning to attack us and don't know what's going on. The fact that the letter was intercepted nevertheless means that Qunari from the dlc are not from the Qun, so they didn't know what will be inside and intercepted it just in case.

If there was a need to destroy the letter, they could burn it or something. But they actually opened it in order to read it.

[Boost32]

That's not the point. I'm sure the Qun knows something and doesn't tells us, but that's not what I'm talking about.

 

There was no need AT ALL to do something about that letter, there wasn't something important inside. They simply wrote there that they are not planning to attack us and don't know what's going on. The fact that the letter was intercepted nevertheless means that Qunari from the dlc are not from the Qun, so they didn't know what will be inside and intercepted it just in case.

That is exactly the point. They are lying, they approved the Dragon's Breath opperation, but Viddasa,la actions were found out, now they will say they disavowed her actions. 

They dont want a open war until they are ready, thatd why they sent the letter.

[Wulfram]

That is exactly the point. They are lying, they approved the Dragon's Breath opperation, but Viddasa,la actions were found out, now they will say they disavowed her actions. 
They dont want a open war until they are ready, thatd why they sent the letter.

Why did Viddasala intercept the message then?

[Sui Causa]

The qunari were ready to invade if Viddisala's plan succeeded. It didn't, so they disavowed her and washed their hands of it because they don't want an invasion, yet, without a severe upper hand. They were hoping to destroy the noble class and leave everyone else vulnerable to the invasion, it wasn't an off shoot splinter cell, they just failed and then decided to lie about it and salvage their "alliance" until the next time the Qun demands they break it.

It's an excellent outcome to remind those who thought they could beat the system and ally with the qunari that there is no way that would end well. Qunari are your friends until the qun demands differently. I just wish there was an option to send Sera with some bees as "ambassador" to tell them where they can shove their alliance.

I'd rather have one faithful Tal-Vashoth and his mercenary group than an alliance with people whose religion demands everyone else die or submit to them and is only biding their time until invasion happens.

We stand a much better chance reforming Tevinter and standing against the qun that way. I don't see that being very successful, either.

[TobiTobsen]

You don't say...

That's not the point. I'm sure the Qun knows something and doesn't tells us, but that's not what I'm talking about.

 

There was no need AT ALL to do something about that letter, there wasn't something important inside. They simply wrote there that they are not planning to attack us and don't know what's going on. The fact that the letter was intercepted nevertheless means that Qunari from the dlc are not from the Qun, so they didn't know what will be inside and intercepted it just in case.

 

Yeah... or they are doing the same stuff they and every goverment in our world are always doing when "spy ****" is hitting the fan. Pulling the "

plausible deniability" card.

 

Of course they have never given Viddasala the order to blow up half the leadership of Southern Thedas, thereby stopping Solas and preparing the South for an invasion in one single blow.

Who is this Viddasala anyway? I'm pretty sure the Triumvirate has never even heard of her, should you ask them.

[Boost32]

Why did Viddasala intercept the message then?

There are several Qunlat letters, without their translation we cant really know. But I speculate its because no one would like to be dicarded like that, she must have been furious because of that letter.

 

And another proof is that Hissrad turns on you. If they were really Tal-Vashot, he would have not attacked you.

[DarkTl]

That is exactly the point. They are lying, they approved the Dragon's Breath opperation, but Viddasa,la actions were found out, now they will say they disavowed her actions. 

They dont want a open war until they are ready, thatd why they sent the letter.

So it's ok in Qun, a strict military organization that demands major sacrifices when needed, to intercept and read letters from your commanding officers when you feel like it? I don't think so.

 

 

And another proof is that Hissrad turns on you. If they were really Tal-Vashot, he would have not attacked you.

I'm not sure what it can prove, aside from the fact that any Qunari cannot be trusted as long as we know nothing about the Qun.

 

Do you remember Tal-Vashoth from DA2? There logic was just as weird as the Qun logic.

[Boost32]

So it's ok in Qun, a strict military organization that demands major sacrifices when needed, to intercept and read letters from your commanding officers when you feel like it? I don't think so.

 

 

I'm not sure what it can prove, aside from the fact that any Qunari cannot be trusted as long as we know nothing about the Qun.

Where I said it was ok? And cant we cant know it was intercepted. There are several letter ins Qunlat with that letter, withouth them we cant really know what happened, but its clear, at the start, the Dragon's Breath had been sanctioned by the Qun.

 

How it doesnt prove? He keep saying how it was not sanctioned, but the moment Viddasala aks for his help he suddenly goes Tal-Vashoth?

And how about the Fact that the Qunari retreated to the North after Dragon's Breath was stopped?

[DarkTl]

And cant we cant know it was intercepted.

Actually, the codex says so.

 

Where I said it was ok?

She read the letter = she's not Qun. Even if she used to be.

 

How it doesnt prove? He keep saying how it was not sanctioned, but the moment Viddasala aks for his help he suddenly goes Tal-Vashoth?

She asked for his help, she didn't ordered him to. Even said "please". That's not how you give an order. I tend to believe that we don't know too much to understand what really happened.

 

I have two theories though. One is that Qun is not monolithic, and there are variuos fractions with different goals.

Another is that Qun understands alliances differently. They will help the Inquisition to fight against anyone except their own kind, even Tal-Vashoth.

 

And how about the Fact that the Qunari retreated to the North after Dragon's Breath was stopped?

I don't understand that one, perhaps I missed something in the game

 

 

Basically, I can change my Iron Bull canon anytime in keep (it's a matter of one second), but there are too many things that are not clear. I won't do it just to save him, I'd rather save half of Denerim at the war table thanks to the alliance with the Qun.

[Boost32]

Actually, the codex says so.
 

She read the letter = she's not Qun. Even if she used to be.
 

She asked for his help, she didn't ordered him to. Even said "please". That's not how you give an order. I tend to believe that we don't know too much to understand what really happened.
 
I have two theories though. One is that Qun is not monolithic, and there are variuos fractions with different goals.
Another is that Qun understands alliances differently. They will help the Inquisition to fight against anyone except their own kind, even Tal-Vashoth.
 

I don't understand that one, perhaps I missed something in the game
 
 
Basically, I can change my Iron Bull canon anytime in keep (it's a matter of one second), but there are too many things that are not clear. I won't do it just to save him, I'd rather save half of Denerim at the war table thanks to the alliance with the Qun.

Actually the codex doesnt say so: http://dragonage.wik...ers_and_Replies

It doesnt matter if she is not with the Qun now, its clear they sanctioned it and after Viddasala was discovered they said they never gave the Order.

The Epilogue says after the Dragon's Breath failed, the Qunari retreated to the North.

If the second part was true then Hissrad wouldnt have turned on the Inquisitor.

[robertthebard]

You don't say...
That's not the point. I'm sure the Qun knows something and doesn't tells us, but that's not what I'm talking about.
 
There was no need AT ALL to do something about that letter, there wasn't something important inside. They simply wrote there that they are not planning to attack us and don't know what's going on. The fact that the letter was intercepted nevertheless means that Qunari from the dlc are not from the Qun, so they didn't know what will be inside and intercepted it just in case.
If there was a need to destroy the letter, they could burn it or something. But they actually opened it in order to read it.

The bolded part in this post is exactly why I would never attempt to enter an alliance with the Qun. I'm not only sure they'd do it, I have historical references and a first hand account of what happened in Kirkwall and the aftermath to go on. I have party banter about the Qun from several perspectives to go on as well. What I find ironic is "but Bull betrayed me". He really didn't, he was never loyal to you in the first place. If you don't break him from the Qun, he is Qunari, and Hissrad also means "Liar". Gatt lets us know that before Bull ever leaves the party during his mission.

However, one thing's for sure: I'll never here "Good talking to you boss" the same way again...

[The Baconer]

They know where the Darvaarad is. If these are truly the actions of a splinter/Tal-Vashoth faction, then it's time to bring down the hammer yes? 

 

Yet, of course they didn't. Any accusations of rogue actions are just a smoke screen.

[DarkTl]

Actually the codex doesnt say so: http://dragonage.wik...ers_and_Replies

So exactly where it says that she got the letter legitimately? It was sent not to her.

 

It doesnt matter if she is not with the Qun now, its clear they sanctioned it and after Viddasala was discovered they said they never gave the Order.

It does matter. A follower of the Qun should not support her any longer. Unless there is more than we know, or rather than they told us before.

 

The Epilogue says after the Dragon's Breath failed, the Qunari retreated to the North.

Are you talking about those Qunari who tried to organize the Dragon's Breath?

 

 If you don't break him from the Qun, he is Qunari, and Hissrad also means "Liar". Gatt lets us know that before Bull ever leaves the party during his mission.

What makes you think that he will stop to be "Liar" outside of the Qun? He might not attack you on sight, but he unlikely will be as predictable as non-Qun companions.

We met some Tal-Vashoth in DA2. Most of them are not very friendly, or logical.

 

 

 If these are truly the actions of a splinter/Tal-Vashoth faction, then it's time to bring down the hammer yes?

You propose to revive and kill them again, after Solas wrecked them all? That's a bit harsh, even for Qunari.

[Lazengan]

I meta'd it

 

The moment I started my play through even without any spoilers, I knew the main villain was going to die regardless of any "choices" I made. Such is the nature of plot based video games. 

 

Why sacrifice people for an alliance that was going to be redundant in killing Corypheus anyway. 

 

Trespasser DLC only affirmed my actions. 

[KaiserShep]

They know where the Darvaarad is. If these are truly the actions of a splinter/Tal-Vashoth faction, then it's time to bring down the hammer yes? 
 
Yet, of course they didn't. Any accusations of rogue actions are just a smoke screen.

Pretty much. Never take the oxmen at their word. They're all Hissrad as far as I'm concerned.