15 réponses à ce sujet

[berelinde]

This whole post is going to be riddled with Trespasser spoilers, so if you haven't played it and don't want to be spoiled, you might want to skip this thread and move along. It's also not entirely serious, so those with an aversion to ridiculous speculation might also want to give it a miss. I make absolutely no claim that anything presented here is fact, and write it solely with the purpose of amusement.

 

Andrasteism holds that the Maker abandoned his creation after magisters physically entered the Fade and attempted to reach the Golden City, but that implies that it happened after the creation of the Veil. But what if folks blamed the magisters for something they never did in the first place? What if the Golden City was already ruined when they arrived?

 

We've seen what happened to the great library that was destroyed when the Veil was created. I don't know about you, but it looked kinda Black City-like to me with its broken and blackened stone and ruined marvels. Could the same fate have befallen the Golden City? Solas himself said that the library was not the only casualty. It wouldn't be the first time Tevinter was blamed for the elves' downfall.

 

Taking that a step further, what if the Maker didn't abandon the world out of a desire to punish the magisters' hubris, but in disgust over the destruction of his house?

 

I'm imagining how that conversation must have gone...

 

Maker (arriving at the Golden City to find it a smoking ruin): "WTF, Solas, I specifically said 'No wild parties.'"

Solas: "It was the only way."

Maker: "So you said. Look, I've had about as much of this nonsense as I can stand. I'm out."

[Uirebhiril]

I'm wondering why there isn't more freaking out from companions and people in general about Solas saying he made the Veil but Chantry legends claims it was the Maker...? I think?

[Mr.House]

I'm wondering why there isn't more freaking out from companions and people in general about Solas saying he made the Veil but Chantry legends claims it was the Maker...? I think?

The companions DO though. Sera in particular.

[berelinde]

I'm wondering why there isn't more freaking out from companions and people in general about Solas saying he made the Veil but Chantry legends claims it was the Maker...? I think?

 

 

The companions DO though. Sera in particular.

I didn't get any comments on it, either. Maybe it depends on who you bring? I had Bull, Dorian, and Varric, and none of them said anything.

[Daerog]

The Maker abandoned the world long before the Second Sin.

 

The Maker made the Fade, and then the material world, then the people of the material world turned their back on the Maker and worshiped other gods and rejected his wisdom and guidance. That was the First Sin, and that is when the Maker became distant from creation.

 

Edit: So, the story of the Maker, creation, and such is still predating the elf gods... and the narrative can still fit with the new info.

 

Edit2: Okay, so Solas made the thing that the modern day calls the Veil. There was still a divide between the material and immaterial before that, it was just really weak and easily crossed. Solas made that border into a wall, a wall that can be strengthened or weakened, but that border is still there.

[GreyLycanTrope]

Only thing we know for certain is that magisters did enter the fade and got blighted as a result. Outside of that I'd take any story passed down for centuries with a degree of skeptecism. If the passed down elvish history is any indication going that far back there's bound to be errors or purposful omissions.

[Heimdall]

We know the city appeared Golden from the outside prior to the Magisters entering.

So clearly they did something, unleashed something, or created something.

The Fade and the material world were always two separate planes, so that doesn't contradict the Chantry creation myth. They just used to be more meshed, the Veil just made travel between them harder.

[SolNebula]

The more we go back in time the more elves are popping out. I get the feeling the human Andraste religion and the "Maker" were just a big lie.

[myahele]

Solas was certainly happy to be so close to the Black City

[MisterJB]

 

Solas rejects his divine status, tough, and claims to believe that Cassandra's powers were granted to her by whatever being created the world.

[Deebo305]

I didn't get any comments on it, either. Maybe it depends on who you bring? I had Bull, Dorian, and Varric, and none of them said anything.

Really? Dorian and Bull were freaking out in my playthrough. Dorian more so, as he EVERYTHING there in the library was rewriting history all together

[Daerog]

Humans were around during the old elf empire. They were given no mention during Trespasser, but they were established when the elf empire fell and the Tevinter Imperium was in a good, strong position to swoop in and conquer the survivors of the creation of the Veil.

 

Both sides have truth in what they passed down... but it is starting to seem, at least to me, that the Chant has more things right than anything else, even if the Chantry may be taking some things too literally in the Chant (like Maker making the Veil... sure he made the two places and the border between, but the Veil as a wall on that border was made by Solas).

 

Edit: After all, like the elf songs, it is a song that passes on lessons from history and such, but the elf songs are now known to be more about propaganda to hide truth, but no such evidence has cropped up for the Chant at this time.

[Heimdall]

Humans were around during the old elf empire. They were given no mention during Trespasser, but they were established when the elf empire fell and the Tevinter Imperium was in a good, strong position to swoop in and conquer the survivors of the creation of the Veil.

 

Both sides have truth in what they passed down... but it is starting to seem, at leas to me, that the Chant has more things right than anything else, even if the Chantry may be taking some things too literally in the Chant (like Maker making the Veil... sure he made the two places and the border between, but the Veil as a wall on that border was made by Solas).

We don't really have a timeline on that.

 

The elven empire was in shambles, but it still existed in some form after the Veil was created.  It didn't collapse entirely overnight.  By all accounts the elves withdrew from human contact shortly after their arrival, as I recall.

 

The Imperium just swept up the remnants when they were strong enough.

[Daerog]

We don't really have a timeline on that.

 

The elven empire was in shambles, but it still existed in some form after the Veil was created.  It didn't collapse entirely overnight.  By all accounts the elves withdrew from human contact shortly after their arrival, as I recall.

 

The Imperium just swept up the remnants when they were strong enough.

 

I guess that's true, but it just makes sense with Tevinter being on rise (which is a long time after humans arrive in Thedas) and receives all these visions and instructions from "Old Gods" during the time when ascended beings were manipulating people into worshipping them and such.

 

Solas puts a stop to the false gods, then there is less meddling of false gods within the Imperium and the High Priests no longer hear from their gods, like the ancient elves no longer hear from their gods. Chaos and confusion from the elves, leaves them open to be conquered.

 

That one ancient elf says how Tevinter did not conquer the elves, the elves did that to themselves. If the empire survived the creation of the Veil, then there must have been a second civil war to bring the elf empire down for Tevinter to sweep in... maybe... still, even if it was just a shadow of its former self, it took centuries for Tevinter to get to a position of great power, and for the elves to not recover within that time to combat a nation that is not as knowledgeable on magic is strange, it makes sense for Tevinter to take advantage right after such a catastrophic event like the Veil.

 

What is revealed in The Temple of Mythal and the Trespasser DLC makes it sound like Tevinter swept in after the civil war within the elf empire that was sparked by Solas ended with the creation of the Veil.

[myahele]

There's also the possibility that the Eluvian Network stopped functioning when the veil was put up.

 

Based on all the Elvhen Ruins we see that they're all pretty much all over the place and are self-contained. They don't have roads and all relied on the Eluvian for transportation.

 

I can imagine that, like the fall of the dwarven empire, each elvhen settlement became fairly isolated and might explain why Ruins in the Brecilian wilds shows sign of human cohabitation.