How is "every class besides Mage is inviable" a "perfect start-as-level-one scenario"?
You know, there are one-armed people in real life who do a bunch of things. Also, there is such a thing as a mechanical arm. And Dagna.
Basically, the Inquisitor is pretty much at ground zero. S/he has to learn how to fight with the new arm (whatever it is), and s/he has to learn not to rely on the mark.
Sounds pretty much like a beginning character to me.
A new protagonist each game is not lame.
My Hero of Ferelden is retired to a cottage on the Waking Sea.
My Hawke is back in Kirkwall helping Varrric run the city.
My Inquisitor is retired from adventuring, and is gathering new allies to carry on the fight.
I don't need a Retired Badass to show up to remind my new character he's playing in the Big Leagues now. Their time is past. Now they can enjoy the fruits of their labors. Let someone else save the world.
Otherwise we risk watching our character get Sheparded.
Well, the theme of the conversation has sort of switched from "this would be bad" to "how can we tie up loose ends in a way that is satisfactory, while being able to enjoy a new experience with new characters"
Now, mostly, people just want the Inquisitor's last important story arc to be completed by them, and not the newest underdog.
That didn't stop us from being a Ferelden in the first game.If we are going to Tevinter, there is a good chance we won't be from there. Bioware has done that so the protagonist has reasons for being a fish out of water thus asking and doing things people who have been there wouldn't ask or do. With Shepard, we were a human so the new kids on the block. With Hawke, we were a Ferelden who was now living in the Free Marches. With the Inquisitor, we were not part of Ferelden or Orlesian culture. So really the Inquisitor would fit the bill rather well. If we are a new protagonist, we will be a foreigner againor if we are a native we'll be in a position where we don't know much about our home.
Here is my unwanted two cents. Upfront I love Inquisition, but I am aware of the one protagonist rule. That being said, rules are made to be broken.
I was ready for Trespasser to be the end, dissolve/continue the Inquisition, retire with your love interest, and life would go on down south and the new game would move up north with little codices referencing the Inquisition from time to time. They could have easily left Solas to be cryptic and not tell us his doomsday plans. He could have easily said he was going to save his people or something to that effect. Instead they chose to show the inner circle of the Inquisition back in Haven, where it all began, plotting to go to Tevinter. (am I the only one who got really excited seeing them back where it all began, ready to begin anew?)
As Cassandra said at the very beginning "We will close the breach, we will find those responsible, and we will restore order." This says to me the goal of the Inquisition is far from over.
Another issue that people mention is starting over from level one, well you just lost half your arm. Learning to use a prosthetic would certainly justify starting again at level 1. New companions are easily explained, keep Dorian who is already in Tevinter, the rest are busy with their own lives (Varric is viscount, Vivienne has the circle, ect.)
TheRevanchist makes really good points, especially about dealing with Solas's betrayal.
That didn't stop us from being a Ferelden in the first game.
All origins except the Human Noble were foreigners or in a position where they didn't know much like I said. The Darf Commoner and Noble have never left Orzammar, the City Elf has never left the Alienage, the Dalish Elf has never left their clan, and the Mage has never left the Circle.
All origins except the Human Noble were foreigners or in a position where they didn't know much like I said. The Darf Commoner and Noble have never left Orzammar, the City Elf has never left the Alienage, the Dalish Elf has never left their clan, and the Mage has never left the Circle.
Not to mention the whole Grey Warden thing.
Well, the theme of the conversation has sort of switched from "this would be bad" to "how can we tie up loose ends in a way that is satisfactory, while being able to enjoy a new experience with new characters"
Now, mostly, people just want the Inquisitor's last important story arc to be completed by them, and not the newest underdog.
Well, everyone in Thedas has a stake in that. The Inquisitor would just end up going the way of Obi-Wan Kenobi.
He had a personal stake in stopping Darth Vader, after all 
Well, everyone in Thedas has a stake in that. The Inquisitor would just end up going the way of Obi-Wan Kenobi.
He had a personal stake in stopping Darth Vader, after all
That...will make the whole story look pretty bad, and totally unacceptable for those romanced with Solas...
The high time for sending the inquisitor to his/her own grave or retirement has already passed...
Trespasser simply has decided too many things and it'd be self-hurting if the inquisitor is gonna be heavily ignored in the next one
From Red Jenny thing obviously the inquisitor can still fight...
Well, everyone in Thedas has a stake in that. The Inquisitor would just end up going the way of Obi-Wan Kenobi.
He had a personal stake in stopping Darth Vader, after all
People keep coming back to the Obi Wan thing. I'd like to clarify that Luke was Vader's son by BIRTH and therefore had just as big a stake from the get go as Obi Wan. That was seeded from the very beginning. The new protagonist would not be Solas's child and is not the Inquisitor's child should they have not taken a love interest or had a same sex love interest. There's nothing seeded there. They'd have to make up a connection that isn't there for the new protag, in which case it'd be hamfisted and goofy.
There is no reason for a new protag to take up this fight. Let them have their own story.
That...will make the whole story look pretty bad, and totally unacceptable for those romanced with Solas...
The high time for sending the inquisitor to his/her own grave or retirement has already passed...
Trespasser simply has decided too many things and it'd be self-hurting if the inquisitor is gonna be heavily ignored in the next one
From Red Jenny thing obviously the inquisitor can still fight...
I suspect the Inquisitor will have a role. Just not an active one. His/her role (assuming actual screen time, and not simply though intermediaries) will likely be that of an adviser. Someone to tell the next protagonist about Solas, the Mark, the coming threat. Maybe even be a questgiver.
But an actual combat role? No. We shouldn't ask for that. Look what happened to Hawke.
But it was an option, one that added to the civil war plot line for roleplayers. There's no reason they couldn't do the same again. There are ways to communicate the basics of Tevinter without having the PC asking stupid questions.All origins except the Human Noble were foreigners or in a position where they didn't know much like I said. The Darf Commoner and Noble have never left Orzammar, the City Elf has never left the Alienage, the Dalish Elf has never left their clan, and the Mage has never left the Circle.
I suspect the Inquisitor will have a role. Just not an active one. His/her role (assuming actual screen time, and not simply though intermediaries) will likely be that of an adviser. Someone to tell the next protagonist about Solas, the Mark, the coming threat. Maybe even be a questgiver.
But an actual combat role? No. We shouldn't ask for that. Look what happened to Hawke.
I don't know about you, but my Inquisitor didn't seem phased in the slightest by losing her arm. Nor did she say her adventuring days were over or that she was retiring and would advise everyone on their next moves from a high chair. She ended the game more driven than ever. She would live well, and hunt for Solas actively.
People keep coming back to the Obi Wan thing. I'd like to clarify that Luke was Vader's son by BIRTH and therefore had just as big a stake from the get go as Obi Wan. That was seeded from the very beginning. The new protagonist would not be Solas's child and is not the Inquisitor's child should they have not taken a love interest or had a same sex love interest. There's nothing seeded there. They'd have to make up a connection that isn't there for the new protag, in which case it'd be hamfisted and goofy.
There is no reason for a new protag to take up this fight. Let them have their own story.
And Kenobi was a friend and mentor to Anakin. Who ended up on opposite sides of a conflict. Luke's role is irrelevant in this comparison (particularly since as of Episode IV, Luke's true parentage hadn't been established yet)
There's every reason for a new protagonist to take up this fight. Corypheus was the Inquisitor's nemesis. Job done. The next threat will (apparantly) rise up in Tevinter. Maybe Solas will be involved, maybe not. But in any case. Another story in another nation with another protagonist.
I don't know about you, but my Inquisitor didn't seem phased in the slightest by losing her arm. Nor did she say her adventuring days were over or that she was retiring and would advise everyone on their next moves. She ended the game more driven than ever. She would live well, and hunt for Solas actively.
Funny thing, my Inquisitor did expressly state "My adventuring days are over" to the Exalted Council.
Now there's an assumption. Give me a reason that the new protagonist's reason for fighting Solas must be "hamfisted and goofy".People keep coming back to the Obi Wan thing. I'd like to clarify that Luke was Vader's son by BIRTH and therefore had just as big a stake from the get go as Obi Wan. That was seeded from the very beginning. The new protagonist would not be Solas's child and is not the Inquisitor's child should they have not taken a love interest or had a same sex love interest. There's nothing seeded there. They'd have to make up a connection that isn't there for the new protag, in which case it'd be hamfisted and goofy.
There is no reason for a new protag to take up this fight. Let them have their own story.
I like the new protagonist approach because I like to experience new stories and meet new people, but I understand those that want the Inquisitor to be the PC on DA4 because of Solas. Personally I don't, because I'm not a great fan of the Inquisitor but I also really don't like the idea of dealing with Solas with a new PC that has no connection to him whatsoever. I just really wanted everything to do with the Inquisition to be left behind along with the south of Thedas.
I think a new protagonist every game would work fine if only they would just stop putting villains in the new games that have a connection with the previous heroes (Corypheus and Hawke and now the Inquisitor and Solas). Why can't we just start over? New protagonist, new story, new villain. Sigh... I have no idea how they are going to deal with this to be honest. It makes no sense to me for a new PC to go after Solas and eventually deal with him while the Inquisitor is doing God knows what. But I don't want to play as the Inquisitor again either so I think I'll end up dissatisfied no matter what. We'll see.
Now there's an assumption. Give me a reason that the new protagonist's reason for fighting Solas must be "hamfisted and goofy".
All connections have to start from nothing, they get built up to something after. Viewers didn't know Luke was Vader's son in the first film, but even so would anyone argue that Luke has no reason to fight Vader and the Empire at the start of The Empire Strikes Back?
I think they would have argued against Luke if there was a previous movie that spent 150 hours building up a different connection to a completely different character who specifically stated they would be the ones to fight Vader...
Funny thing, my Inquisitor did expressly state "My adventuring days are over" to the Exalted Council.
Even funnier, my inquisitor stated some stuff about putting down their swords like the Inquisition of old and going home, yet the crew is back together in Haven plotting against Solas and headed to Tevinter. Never trust what people say in Orlais.
And Kenobi was a friend and mentor to Anakin. Who ended up on opposite sides of a conflict. Luke's role is irrelevant in this comparison (particularly since as of Episode IV, Luke's true parentage hadn't been established yet)
There's every reason for a new protagonist to take up this fight. Corypheus was the Inquisitor's nemesis. Job done. The next threat will (apparantly) rise up in Tevinter. Maybe Solas will be involved, maybe not. But in any case. Another story in another nation with another protagonist.
Luke is not irrelevant to this comparison! He's the series' protagonist. We didn't have all of Obi-wan's backstory in the original trilogy. The story was central to Luke and if you watch the original episode 4 there are hints that he is Vader's kid from the get go. That was the central conceit of that trilogy. Obi-wan was the old mentor / Gandalf trope. It opened and closed around that. Episodes 1-3 revolve around Vader's downfall from good to bad. Obi-wan is affected just as much as everyone but he wasn't the central figure of the plot. He doesn't arc like Anakin does. Nor did he arc like Luke. Anyway, let's stop debating on Star Wars.
Main characters always need to arc, especially in a hero's journey plot. Inquisitor arcs. Anakin arcs. Luke arcs.
There is no reason except the ones you guys are head canon'ing for a new protagonist to take up this fight over an active Inquisitor. If yours retired then sure, I didn't have that ending. My ending was a 100% kicking off point. Maybe Bioware actually plans to let us choose a new protag if our inq quit or in my case, let me continue. Which is fascinating.
Also, Cory was the Inquisitor's nemesis only through manipulation by Solas. Solas woke up and put events into motion -- events that involved the Inquisitor and Cory. He saw an opportunity and took it. This was clearly stated in Trespasser. All events loop and spin back around Solas. That's what made the betrayal so deep. That's why the advocation lingers so strongly for the Inquisitor to wrap up this story. Not all of us had a "kick our feet up and retire" ending.
Pretty sure people would stop asking to stop playing past protags if the devs didn't insist on bringing back old enemies and allies. Bringing one back but not the other is just...why? Just give us new baddies and friends and kill off the old/let them fade off screen ffs.
We didn't have all of Obi-wans backstory in the original trilogy so let's stop debating on Star Wars. The story was central to Luke and if you watch the original episode 4 there are hints that he is Vader's kid from the get go. That was the central conceit of that trilogy. Obi-wan was the old mentor / Gandalf trope. It opened and closed around that.
There is no reason except the ones you guys are head canon'ing for a new protagonist to take up this fight over an active Inquisitor. If yours retired then sure, I didn't have that ending. My ending was a 100% kicking off point. Maybe Bioware actually plans to let us choose a new protag if our inq quit or in my case, let me continue.
Also, Cory was the Inquisitor's nemesis only through manipulation by Solas. This was clearly stated in Trespasser. All events loop and spin back around Solas. That's what made the betrayal so deep.
And Urthemiel was the HoF's nemesis only through the manipulation of the Architect. And Meredith was Hawke's nemesis by Bartrand's manipulation. What's the point?
Even an Inquisitor in top fighting shape is not going to stand much of a chance against Solas. This was clearly explained in the epilogue. Solas was deep in the inner workings of the Inquisition. He knows the Inquisitor and how he/she thinks. He knows how the Inquisition works, how all the advisers think and act. He was manipulating them from the start to fix the mess he ultimately caused. In comparison, they know nothing about his organization, or even about Solas, except what he let them learn.
That's the very reason they're looking to Tevinter. New blood. People Solas doesn't know and can't anticipate. Solas will be wathcing for the Inquisitor (heck, teh Inquisitor might even become a deliberate distraction, but not for this stranger.
Heck , it's how Lord of the Rings worked. Aragorn and Gandalf, two well-known enemies of Sauron causing a ruckus while Frodo and Sam slip into Mordor.
I love making new characters in a new and improved CC, then sending them off into a new DA saga. It's an essential DA dynamic. It's what separates DA from games (even Bioware games) that use a set protagonist. I'd rather that not be taken away. DA doesn't need to shed its unique function to be a great game. Every new saga is a new jumble, and it's great that way. Clean slates and all that. Plus there's that feeling like you're a nobody again working your way as an unknown paving their way into the unknown- rather than just being a celebrity making a reappearance.
I agree strongly with everyone who gets disappointed at the idea of starting Lvl1 with the character with which we've just gotten to Lvl27, now starting without any of that uberequipment we'd worked so hard for. Disheartening to me. They could, of course, pull a BG2 arse-pull: we were just "kidnapped," stripped of our gear, and, in a DA4 Inquisitor's case, blasted with an experience-removal magic... But in that case, why not just start a new character instead? You're already at square one again anyway. To those who say, "Yeah, but what about Varric?," I reply, "Exactly." It's just as jarring to see all those real life hours I'd spent with Varric flushed away as it would be with a gutted Inquisitor. They could make a DA4 like NWN1's HotU where it's a high-level adventure, but if we have to nullify all our character development from earlier games, I only want to start a new character.
Plus I have no interest in playing my same Inquisitor(s) all over again in a completely different saga. They will have had their story, just as did my Hawke and my Wardens. Why again with an Inquisitor? It's Dragon Age, not Inquisitor Age or Blight Age or Kirkwall Age. Perfectly fine letting my characters pass fondly on with the game they were created in. I loved playing my HoFs, would even like playing another Warden, but not another Hero of Ferelden Warden. (It's bad enough that we were an instant celebrity in DAI.) It's immersive to me that all my previous characters contributed some pivotal world-historic role that is now just lore as they pass the baton. I specifically want to play a character that can look back on my old dwarf DW rogue and say, "I want to be like that dwarf Inquisitor," and ends up living their own story and paving their own role in history.
The only counterargument in this discussion I can at least empathize with is that there should be a greater number of years pass before our new protagonist shows up. 200yrs is a tad long, particularly when events for DA4 have been setup by the end of DA3 (DLC). And frankly I'd miss seeing the reappearance of old characters, miss appreciating how they'd given Leliana a huge boost to her integrity as a character, for example. The reappearances are yet another iconic DA quirk that makes DA special. But, OK, if things happen right away, it begs the question of why wouldn't the Inquisitor/ Champion/ HoF be involved, yes? In this case though, it's not as if the writers are at an impasse. It's not so difficult to come up with a storyline- not feeling contrived at all- of why the Inquisitor was prevented from getting involved. Perhaps the Inquisitor was forced to call on some nobody who Solas didn't know- or someone with a particular background- or someone who just happened to be at the right place, right time. Or a story like Frodo and Sam happening concurrently with the rest of the Fellowship's efforts. Or perhaps the means to defeating the DA4 antagonist will be beyond the reach or power of the Inquisitor- such as happening in a more geographically remote region of Thedas that "southerners" don't even know about yet (since Thedas isn't fully explored). Or the story could start up after some events that the narrator spells out generally- the Inquisitor and Inner Circle went and did this, then that happened, and now we're here... with a new protagonist. And that type of story would require no BG2 arse-pull of a plot... and no returning Herald protagonist.
As to bringing back characters from earlier DA's, I applaud their handling of the HoF and Hawke in DAI... except for having to CC my Hawke. I just clicked "OK" because it was a bit too metagame recreating my DA2 character. (I wouldn't even be able to reproduce the same morph if I were to try on DA2's CC.) Integrate them as big players only indirectly involved, I say, and just build solid narrative reasons why a new hero is needed- or fated by prophecy or whatever. For instance, how could Kirkwall's Champion or Ferelden's hero win DAI if they didn't have the Herald's green-glowing-hand thingy? There's no insult to the audience in the least, just a new game with a new dynamic requiring a new protagonist. Belaboring the Inquisition plot further is neither required nor appealing.
Even an Inquisitor in top fighting shape is not going to stand much of a chance against Solas. This was clearly explained in the epilogue.
And a nobody Tevinter citizen has a better chance simply because Solas doesn't know their name? Why? Is he or she the chosen one / Shepard / Jesus? And what? My world saving Lavellan rogue is useless and basically an old advisor now because she lost a limb?
It was clearly explained in the epilogue that they'd need new people, not put the Inquisitor on the bench. That's up for debate.
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