1659 réponses à ce sujet

[leaguer of one]

Because throughout the game i played a "it's just a tool" Hawke. After the game finished i figured my Hawke was still indifferent to it. Just like a sword can be used to murder or protect, blood magic can too. It's a weapon, a tool. Used badly it hurts people, used well and it's an amazing gift.

 

Role-playing games allow for the player to input themselves into they characters the play. I do not find blood magic to be inherently evil, and my characters reflect that.

 

Bottom line is, my Hawke is indifferent because of 1 reason. I decided she was.

true, but it sound more that you just made a Hawke who just ignore the major dangers of blood magic by saying it just a tool. Sure, it's just a tool but it's a tool that can turn the dead in to Horrors that can destroy cities. Do you make your Hawke ignore that?

[leaguer of one]

Either way, those people are dead. Same effect.

 

And you can commit some pretty horrendous torture with knives if you want to. 

 

It's perfectly reasonable for some Hawkes to be against blood magic. It's also perfectly reasonable for them to view it as the tool it is. Don't blame the tool, blame the people who turned it into a weapon. Blood magic can also heal.

What?

 

Same effect? Sorry bu a knife will maim you and kill you and that's that. blood magic can kill and maim you, then turn your body into an undead horror which goes after other people to kill them and make their bodies in to undead horrors that does that to others.

 

that's not the same thing, that far from the same thing.

 

You're not turning a city into a magic version of left 4 dead with a knife. Sorry, but it make no sense for a Hawke to be fore blood magic knowing that.

[leaguer of one]

Because Hawke was their character, and they decided their Hawke's were pro-blood magic

Which is why I asked for motive. When roleplaying a character you give a motive and reason for the characters actions and reasoning.

[Smudjygirl]

true, but it sound more that you just made a Hawke who just ignore the major dangers of blood magic by saying it just a tool. Sure, it's just a tool but it's a tool that can turn the dead in to Horrors that can destroy cities. Do you make your Hawke ignore that?

 

Obviously not. She does not agree with that. But pretty much everything has a "good" and "bad" side. I made it so my Hawke didn't believe people should die for using blood magic, and that people shouldn't fear it. It has a purpose, a  purpose that can be and is frequently abused.

 

However, Solas at one point says blood magic is seen as bad because the Chantry forbade it, so criminals are usually the ones who use it. It's been portrayed as an "evil" thing because we are seeing it through the eyes of religious bigots who are afraid of ALL magic. Why should she agree with them? I personally agree with Solas.

[Abyss108]

Which is why I asked for motive. When roleplaying a character you give a motive and reason for the characters actions and reasoning.

 

Well I've given you a motive, and you just go "nope nope nope" because you don't agree with it. 

 

No one is saying you or your characters have to feel the same. But its been clearly explained why others might.

[leaguer of one]

Well I've given you a motive, and you just go "nope nope nope" because you don't agree with it. 

 

No one is saying you or your characters have to feel the same. But its been clearly explained why others might.

No you did not. Not one bit was that a motive.

[leaguer of one]

Obviously not. She does not agree with that. But pretty much everything has a "good" and "bad" side. I made it so my Hawke didn't believe people should die for using blood magic, and that people shouldn't fear it. It has a purpose, a  purpose that can be and is frequently abused.

 

However, Solas at one point says blood magic is seen as bad because the Chantry forbade it, so criminals are usually the ones who use it. It's been portrayed as an "evil" thing because we are seeing it through the eyes of religious bigots who are afraid of ALL magic. Why should she agree with them? I personally agree with Solas.

I'm not arguing that it's evil or that it has no purpose. But you can't say that it shouldn't be feared. In fact everything that happen in the tower showed that it should. and that one person miss using it for any reason would be disastrous  and should be be regulated.

 

That being said as much as i don't agree with your Hawke's motives, it still is a proper motive. I just a Hawke in denial of the dangers of blood magic. it's twisted but it works as a proper motivation.

[Abyss108]

No you did not. Not one bit was that a motive.

 

Yes it is. The motive is that Hawke can quite easily believe that tools should not be blamed for how people use them. 

 

Just because someone used it to hurt, doesn't mean that a different person shouldn't be able to use it to heal.

[CardButton]

No you did not. Not one bit was that a motive.

 Yeah, Abyss really did give a rather viable reason why a Hawke would still remain morally grey over the subject of Blood Magic.  

 

I can still commit horrific torture and pain to someone. I can still mutilate and kill. Or I could perform an operation to save someone's life.

 

Blood magic can do horrific things. It can also be used for healing. Why should its good uses be banned, just because it can also be used for evil? 

 

Should medicine be banned, just because you can make a mixture to kill someone with it?

 

If those mages didn't have access to blood magic, they just would have used other forms to murder people.

While my Hawke was never in this category (siding with the mages only because he didn't approve of the Right of Annulment), my Mage Warden was certainly of this same mentality. 

[Smudjygirl]

I'm not arguing that it's evil or that it has no purpose. But you can't say that it shouldn't be feared. In fact everything that happen in the tower showed that it should. and that one person miss using it for any reason would be disastrous  and should be be regulated.

 

That being said as much as i don't agree with your Hawke's motives, it still is a proper motive. I just a Hawke in denial of the dangers of blood magic. it's twisted but it works as a proper motivation.

 

It's really nice you got into the lore, but don't devalue what other people have decided. We have been told two things. 1) Blood magic is inherently evil and 2) Blood magic is not inherently evil. I lean more on the side of 2, you clearly believe that 1 is more accurate.

 

I do not think it should be feared. Just like guns and bombs shouldn't be feared. The crazy people that use them? Yeah, they should be...because they can choose not to use them. She wasn't afraid of Merrill, she thought she was silly, but she wasn't afraid. What Orsino did would likely have frightened her. But you know what i think is much worse than blood magic? Those who use the fear of it to justify killing countless innocents "just in case". We are two opposite ends of the coin, but you are just as entitled to your opinion as i am to mine. I'm not telling you i think you're in denial to the good parts of blood magic, so don't accuse me of being blind to its bad parts.

 

--Just to note, i didn't take this as personally as it sounded like in this post

[leaguer of one]

Yes it is. The motive is that Hawke can quite easily believe that tools should not be blamed for how people use them. 

 

Just because someone used it to hurt, doesn't mean that a different person shouldn't be able to use it to heal.

You did not say that. You just said it was no different then a knife.

 

Now you given a proper motivation. But....no one is blaming bloog magic for what happened in da2. They blame the mages that used them horribly.Which is what find the wardens doing in DAI. 

That still means the use of blood magic should be regulated in some way to make sure the wrong person does not use it.

 

But do not the Hawke in dai was upset at the misuse of blood magic, not just it's use.

[leaguer of one]

 Yeah, Abyss really did give a rather viable reason why a Hawke would still remain morally grey over the subject of Blood Magic.  

 

 

All he said it was no different then a knife. That's it. that not a proper motivation based on what blood magic an do.

[leaguer of one]

It's really nice you got into the lore, but don't devalue what other people have decided. We have been told two things. 1) Blood magic is inherently evil and 2) Blood magic is not inherently evil. I lean more on the side of 2, you clearly believe that 1 is more accurate.

 

I do not think it should be feared. Just like guns and bombs shouldn't be feared. The crazy people that use them? Yeah, they should be...because they can choose not to use them. She wasn't afraid of Merrill, she thought she was silly, but she wasn't afraid. What Orsino did would likely have frightened her. But you know what i think is much worse than blood magic? Those who use the fear of it to justify killing countless innocents "just in case". We are two opposite ends of the coin, but you are just as entitled to your opinion as i am to mine. I'm not telling you i think you're in denial to the good parts of blood magic, so don't accuse me of being blind to its bad parts.

Sure they should not be fear by it self. but is still should be stated and taught that it is inherently dangerous and made sue not to get in the hand of people who his use it.

Which is the opposite that happened in the mage tower, and what happen with the wardens. Remember, Hawke can be angry at it's misuse not that it was used.

 

You can't argue ageist regulation it in some way.

[Abyss108]

It's perfectly reasonable for some Hawkes to be against blood magic. It's also perfectly reasonable for them to view it as the tool it is. Don't blame the tool, blame the people who turned it into a weapon. Blood magic can also heal.

 

 

Blood magic can do horrific things. It can also be used for healing. Why should its good uses be banned, just because it can also be used for evil? 

 

 

 

All he said it was no different then a knife. That's it. that not a proper motivation based on what blood magic an do.

 

Look at my above quotes for two other places where I said exactly the same thing about it being a tool.

 

Also, I'm a she.

[Nefla]

It's nitpicky details like this discussion that make people want to control the Inquisitor if they are going to have a part, as we assume they will.

 

Personally i played a Hawke who was apathetic to blood magic, but her coming to the conclusion "it's really bad" didn't bother me that much. Had i played a "blood magic is awesome" Hawke i would have been bothered. This may seem to be a small issue that people shouldn't focus on, but clearly the opinion Hawke had on blood magic was a big part of how people role-played them.

Not just blood magic, Hawke's reasoning for choosing mages or templars was assumed as well. Hawke sides with the templars because "too many were using blood magic " rather than "Anders forced our hand and I'm trying to mitigate the damage and save any mage who surrenders peacefully. Also I would never fight my brother who is a templar."

[Smudjygirl]

Sure they should not be fear by it self. but is still should be stated and taught that it is inherently dangerous and made sue not to get in the hand of people who his use it.

Which is the opposite that happened in the mage tower, and what happen with the wardens. Remember, Hawke can be angry at it's misuse not that it was used.

 

You can't argue ageist regulation it in some way.

 

You keep using the tower as an example, but i don't blame blood magic for what happened there. In the Circles, pretty much all of the, the Templars can do whatever the hell they want to the mages is no repercussions. They can rape them, murder them, torture them and people won't question it AT ALL. The evil in the tower was the abuse of the mages, they became desperate and did something stupid. I stand with the blood mages on that one, most were people who wanted to escape the abuse and oppression forced on them because of who they are. Uldred was a monster, yes, but most of them were not.

 

If you were raped, abused, saw people murdered for no reason and taught that everybody, Maker included, hated you. You'd think "well screw you too" and use what ever means you can to free yourself. Of course it should be regulated, but so should everything

[Reznore57]

It doesn't matter if blood magic is evilz or not , really.

The point is Hawke used to be a playable character and you could choose his view about blood magic , he could hate it , he could approve or perhaps he didn't give a damn.

In DAI the fact is you can't play Hawke anymore and the player is not the one choosing Hawke's opinions.

I didn't like it at all.

 

So I hope we'll never see a case like Hawke again , I don't want to see my Inqui if they are a npc.

[Nefla]

I'd rather the inquisitor die offscreen before the game starts than come back as an NPC.

[leaguer of one]

You keep using the tower as an example, but i don't blame blood magic for what happened there. In the Circles, pretty much all of the, the Templars can do whatever the hell they want to the mages is no repercussions. They can rape them, murder them, torture them and people won't question it AT ALL. The evil in the tower was the abuse of the mages, they became desperate and did something stupid. I stand with the blood mages on that one, most were people who wanted to escape the abuse and oppression forced on them because of who they are. Uldred was a monster, yes, but most of them were not.

 

If you were raped, abused, saw people murdered for no reason and taught that everybody, Maker included, hated you. You'd think "well screw you too" and use what ever means you can to free yourself. Of course it should be regulated, but so should everything

I'm not blaming blood magic, I'm blaming the mages. I'm just saying keep blood magic out of the hands of the ones who don't understand how dangerous it is and the one that do and misuse it.

 

Nothing justifies making a spell that can kill off a city. If a cop mistreated you it does not mean you have to destroy a town to get justice back. Sorry, if you are going to get justice done or protect yourself, do it it the way that doe not drag down anyone innocent or not involved with it.

 

The fact that they did use blood magic that can destroy a city means that blood magic needs to be regulated in some way.

[Former_Fiend]

Perhaps it's just the ultimate demonstration of my pessimism, but I'm not convinced the result would have been better if Hawke's responses were controllable. 

 

Option A: I hate blood magic!

 

Option B: I really hate blood magic!

 

Option C: The wardens are idiots for using blood magic!

 

And in the same vein, the Inquisitor;

 

Option A: Solas was my friend!

 

Option B: Solas was my best friend!

 

Option C: I'm going to kill Solas for betraying our friendship!

 

Special: Solas was the love of my life!

[leaguer of one]

Look at my above quotes for two other places where I said exactly the same thing about it being a tool.

 

 

You also said it was no different from a knife.... Just saying.

[leaguer of one]

Perhaps it's just the ultimate demonstration of my pessimism, but I'm not convinced the result would have been better if Hawke's responses were controllable. 

 

Option A: I hate blood magic!

 

Option B: I really hate blood magic!

 

Option C: The wardens are idiots for using blood magic!

 

And in the same vein, the Inquisitor;

 

Option A: Solas was my friend!

 

Option B: Solas was my best friend!

 

Option C: I'm going to kill Solas for betraying our friendship!

 

Special: Solas was the love of my life!

Thank you for getting my point.

[Abyss108]

You also said it was no different from a knife.... Just saying.

 

I compared the two. And also included the explanation in the posts for the motive. To which you replied that I never gave a motive and the knife part was "all I said".

 

If you are going to pretend half my posts don't exist because you don't like the first sentence, I don't think this conversation is going to go anywhere.

[Nefla]

Perhaps it's just the ultimate demonstration of my pessimism, but I'm not convinced the result would have been better if Hawke's responses were controllable. 

 

Option A: I hate blood magic!

 

Option B: I really hate blood magic!

 

Option C: The wardens are idiots for using blood magic!

 

And in the same vein, the Inquisitor;

 

Option A: Solas was my friend!

 

Option B: Solas was my best friend!

 

Option C: I'm going to kill Solas for betraying our friendship!

 

Special: Solas was the love of my life!

If the writing is that bad, it will be that bad no matter who you're playing.

 

Option A: I will save the world even though I'm a random peasant because it needs saving!

Option B: I will save the world because I'm a random peasant because it needs saving and no one will see it coming!

Option C: It sucks that I have to save the world, I am a random peasant after all but it needs saving!

 

(PS, the inquisitor never has to express friendship for Solas)

[CardButton]

Perhaps it's just the ultimate demonstration of my pessimism, but I'm not convinced the result would have been better if Hawke's responses were controllable. 

 

Option A: I hate blood magic!

 

Option B: I really hate blood magic!

 

Option C: The wardens are idiots for using blood magic!

 

And in the same vein, the Inquisitor;

 

Option A: Solas was my friend!

 

Option B: Solas was my best friend!

 

Option C: I'm going to kill Solas for betraying our friendship!

 

Special: Solas was the love of my life!

Lol well it might just be your Pessimism, but you did forget one fun option with Solas!