1659 réponses à ce sujet

[TheRevanchist]

Replace 'Inquisitor' with "Hawke' and 'Solas' with "Corypheus', and you have the exact same argument for why Hawke should have been the PC for DAI.

 

They can build a relationship between Solas and a new PC, just like they did with the Inquisitor did with Corypheus. The only reason people want the Inquisitor specifically is because Lavellan.

 

But not all of us played Lavellan.

 

I don't play Lavellan and never will, so not presume to know the motives of people who advocate this. For the record there is no relationship between The Inquisitor and Corypheus. That was an epic failure, he was treated like a complete joke and there was no interactions or rivalry of any kind. So trying to use that as an example is not smart.

[Vinitchz]

Just remember everyone.  In like three or four years we will all be back here complaining about how the DA4 hero should be the next main character in DA5!  I mean why would they change it?  The DA4 main character was SOOO good and his story is not DONE!!!!  you can all quote me on that.  You all know it will be relevant in a few years.

 

I actually took a print and saved it in "my important stuff" folder because I know it'll be true

[Tielis]

Replace 'Inquisitor' with "Hawke' and 'Solas' with "Corypheus', and you have the exact same argument for why Hawke should have been the PC for DAI.

 

They can build a relationship between Solas and a new PC, just like they did with the Inquisitor did with Corypheus. The only reason people want the Inquisitor specifically is because Lavellan.

 

But not all of us played Lavellan.

 

No, the reason I want this is because the DLC may have been the last DAI game, but it did not finish the story.

 

I do not want to move onto another story without the last one being finished.  Starting a new protagonist is exactly what that will do.  Like others have said, how would you have felt if DAO ended with Riordan saying that it's time to kill the Archdemon and then it abruptly ending, only to pick up in the next game years later with Hawke killing it.  Or how would you have felt if they just inserted Varric saying "the Warden killed the Archdemon and now..."  

 

It's just horrible, cheap, string-you-along-to-keep-you-buying bullshit and I'm tired of it.

[Heimdall]

Replace 'Inquisitor' with "Hawke' and 'Solas' with "Corypheus', and you have the exact same argument for why Hawke should have been the PC for DAI.
 
They can build a relationship between Solas and a new PC, just like they did with the Inquisitor did with Corypheus. The only reason people want the Inquisitor specifically is because Lavellan.
 
But not all of us played Lavellan.

Well, they didn't actually do a very good job building a relationship between the Inquisitor and Corypheus. He was generally a case of wasted potential.

There's a relationship even without Lavellan, even if that's the closest relationship. It's certainly a much more substantial relationship than the one between Hawke and Corypheus. More to the point, Trespasser set the Inquisitor up to try to stop Solas. Some just seem to feel the Inquisitor needs to be controlled by the player when they confront Solas. I disagree, but there it is.

[Heimdall]

No, the reason I want this is because the DLC may have been the last DAI game, but it did not finish the story.
 
I do not want to move onto another story without the last one being finished.  Starting a new protagonist is exactly what that will do.  Like others have said, how would you have felt if DAO ended with Riordan saying that it's time to kill the Archdemon and then it abruptly ending, only to pick up in the next game years later with Hawke killing it.  Or how would you have felt if they just inserted Varric saying "the Warden killed the Archdemon and now..."  
 
It's just horrible, cheap, string-you-along-to-keep-you-buying bullshit and I'm tired of it.

Having a new protagonist and tossing the Solas storyline with the Inquisitor are two separate things.

[TheRevanchist]

Well, they didn't actually do a very good job building a relationship between the Inquisitor and Corypheus. He was generally a case of wasted potential.

There's a relationship even without Lavellan, even if that's the closest relationship. It's certainly a much more substantial relationship than the one between Hawke and Corypheus. More to the point, Trespasser set the Inquisitor up to try to stop Solas. Some just seem to feel the Inquisitor needs to be controlled by the player when they confront Solas. I disagree, but there it is.

 

I only advocate that, because the Hawke cameo proves they most likely won't make a cameo NPC well enough to satisfy people.

[TheRevanchist]

I actually took a print and saved it in "my important stuff" folder because I know it'll be true

 

You won't find any posts in old BSN with me asking for Hawke or HoF back. Until this point I couldn't care less. 

[Tielis]

Having a new protagonist and tossing the Solas storyline with the Inquisitor are two separate things.

 

Really?  So you're okay with them just having a slide at the beginning of DA4 saying that you're an agent of the Inquisition and you have to do blah blah blah?  Talk about low expectations...

[Heimdall]

I only advocate that, because the Hawke cameo proves they most likely won't make a cameo NPC well enough to satisfy people.

Hawke wasn't done well, but that doesn't mean a similar cameo wouldn't work in a specific situation. I really do think that's what Bioware was setting up for with the redeem or kill Solas choice.

[Smudjygirl]

Really?  So you're okay with them just having a slide at the beginning of DA4 saying that you're an agent of the Inquisition and you have to do blah blah blah?  Talk about low expectations...

 

Um, as much as i agree with your stance on this, there is no need to get personal. They don't see any problem with starting anew, and i would very much like to learn why. I guess some people see the Inquisitor's story as complete, while some of us do not.

[Vinitchz]

Having a new protagonist and tossing the Solas storyline with the Inquisitor are two separate things.

 

Finally someone said it, I still think that you can have a new protagonist and have the Inq and solas plot tied up without you controlling the inq, based in that last decision: "save solas from himself/ stop him at any cost", based on that your inq will decide how solas in handled, but it'll be the new protag that leads the way to that scenario and final confrotation 

[ArianaGBSA]

Replace 'Inquisitor' with "Hawke' and 'Solas' with "Corypheus', and you have the exact same argument for why Hawke should have been the PC for DAI.

 

They can build a relationship between Solas and a new PC, just like they did with the Inquisitor did with Corypheus. The only reason people want the Inquisitor specifically is because Lavellan.

 

But not all of us played Lavellan.

Was Corypheus a companion? Nope.
Have we met Corypheus from the beginning of the game? Nope.
Did we do a lot of quests and had a lot of chats with him? Nope.
So, well, yeah, it is completely absurd to compare.
But, yes, Hawke should have been DAI's PC (well not anymore, I can't picture anything but a Lavellan being the main character of DAI after Trespasser)

[TheRevanchist]

Hawke wasn't done well, but that doesn't mean a similar cameo wouldn't work in a specific situation. I really do think that's what Bioware was setting up for with the redeem or kill Solas choice.

 

I am perfectly content with having the Inquisitor take a Chess Master role, giving you orders and so forth. So long as it is done well, but that's the kicker isn't it? Bioware's writing quality isn't as consistent as it used to be. So I am sure you will understand if the concept does not fill me with much hope. Regardless no one has yet to provide a valid reason why enforcing this "only 1 game per character" rule is even good for this Franchise. There is nothing that says the same PC can't be reused aside from people insisting otherwise, because reasons. Someone can keep insisting "Thedas is the main character" but that does nothing to explain why we must limit our options to only 1 game per character. 

[Smudjygirl]

Was Corypheus a companion? Nope.
Have we met Corypheus from the beginning of the game? Nope.
Did we do a lot of quests and had a lot of chats with him? Nope.
So, well, yeah, it is completely absurd to compare.
But, yes, Hawke should have been DAI's PC (well not anymore, I can't picture anything but a Lavellan being the main character of DAI after Trespasser)

 

More than the characters, it's their story being incomplete that's the problem. If everything was resolved in their game, people would be happy to move on, but that isn't so. HoF not withstanding, anyway, since they were the first PC, a big and attached fanbase is to be expected.

[Heimdall]

Really?  So you're okay with them just having a slide at the beginning of DA4 saying that you're an agent of the Inquisition and you have to do blah blah blah?  Talk about low expectations...

No, and I wouldn't expect it to be that either.

More likely we would get recruited by Dorian (Who is in real time contact with the Inquisitor via the sending stone) at some point in the game and deployed as part of the Inquisitor's plan to fight Fen'Harel. We won't know Solas is responsible or that we're fighting his plans at first, and he won't be the only one we're fighting. I expect the game to dig into the lore on dragons and the old gods.

[Starwingz]

On the other hand, though, the same thing can be said for the opposing view. Really, my view is that the devs should do what is best for the story. That being said, the story can still be about Thedas AND feature a protag more than once (if needed). In some ways, and for some aspects of the story, some people feel that the ways new PC's are being brought in is somewhat unnecessary. And some of the stories are set up perfectly for one PC, only to be pushed onto another.

 

Exactly. The way this game is set up could work with new protagonists from time to time but not when you get new protagonists every single time. And stuff like this will only get worse in future as Bioware will need to take into account what are all these protagonists doing in the world with their 30+ possible LIs and all their associates.

 

New protagonists would only work in this game if there was total disconnection between events of the games with brand new casts. Imagine if next Elder Scrolls pulled Bioware style like we have now and made next game 2 years into future with lots of characters from Skyrim appearing. You can bet they would have same problems about incorporating Dragonborn into the world ESPECIALLY if he was heavily tied to the new plot. But they dont make themselves this problem and create games with 200+ year gaps unlike here.

[TeaLulu]

People who are saying that Hawke should have been the Protag due to the Corypheus argument make a VERY good point.

 

The fact of the matter is, the current Inquisitor has all this emotion and connection to the new apparent Antag, Solas. It would be a COMPLETE waste to have a new Protag and just throw all that drama down the drain, or reduce it down into a single reunion cutscene where the Inquisitor dies at the end.

 

There needs to be either a choice of maintaining the Inquisitor, or making a new character. If they throw the Quizzy down a well I'll be real mad, Lavellan or not.

[Smudjygirl]

Exactly. The way this game is set up could work with new protagonists from time to time but not when you get new protagonists every single time. And stuff like this will only get worse in future as Bioware will need to take into account what are all these protagonists doing in the world with their 30+ possible LIs and all their associates.

 

New protagonists would only work in this game if there was total disconnection between events of the games with brand new casts. Imagine if next Elder Scrolls pulled Bioware style like we have now and made next game 2 years into future with lots of characters from Skyrim appearing. You can bet they would have same problems about incorporating Dragonborn into the world ESPECIALLY if he was heavily tied to the new plot. But they dont make themselves this problem and create games with 200+ year gaps unlike here.

 

I don't think total disconnect is necessary. Say, for example, the HoF stayed as the Warden Commander instead of disappearing, or Stays with their loves. The only loose end there would be Morrigan, but the Warden is not actually involved her plans, they just want to be with her. Like, if Hawke is alive, they can end up helping Varric so we KNOW where they are, and with Cory gone their story is done. If they cross their T and dot their i's , i think people would be less irritated with new characters, even if they are attached to their PC, because their story would be done and there would be no need of them. Solas is so involved with the Inquisitor, it's another loose end that people wanted resolved by the person who loves or hates him, rather than them being a background force

[BansheeOwnage]

How is it backwards? Solas knows the Inquisitor intimately. He knows what drives him, what moves him. Know thy enemy is the most important thing in warfare. Anything the Inquisitor might know about Solas can be shared with someone else. 

I don't see how that makes a difference. The Inquisitor giving orders or telling someone else how to give orders is the same thing.

 

Because knowing one's opponent mean you can anticipate what they might do in any given situation. Solas knows how the Inquisitor thinks, and unless you're going to seriously meta game it means he can check you easily.

Well, because the IQ says straight out he or she is done. And the fact you can disband the Inquision among other things. The IQ's task was to seal thr Breach and stop Corypheus.

Exalted Marches probably wasn't going to set up Hawke as IQ. Or at least as IQ to deal with the mage templar war. It's in the name, in point of fact. Justinia was considering sending an Exalted March to Kirkwall. We have no real proof that Hawke would have become the Shepard of the series.

And just because they have a new lead writer doesn't mean they're going to move away from the basic concept for the series.

Wow, I don't usually get like this, but you are one of the most frustrating people I've seen on here. You're one of those people who dismiss what I say when I admit I don't have proof, and you dismiss it with no proof as well. I never claimed I knew facts, I was just sharing the impression I got. Besides, Cassandra says she wanted to have Hawke be the Inquisitor, so that means something at least.

 

Anyway. The argument that Solas knows how you think doesn't hold any water for me. Not just because Solas says that unlike most people, you aren't predictable, but mostly because the Inquisitor goes up against him no matter what, and from a leading position. People say they'll be a chessmaster with someone else being a doer, but that doesn't make any sense if Solas can predict them. That's why I think it's backwards. The Inquisitor acting, or the Inquisitor acting through someone else results in the same thing for Solas to counter.

 

Your Inquisitor might say they're done (adventuring, not leading, because you have to fight Solas), but mine might say they're going to go save the world again. And no matter what you choose to say, whether you "disband" or not, you have to counter Solas. It's not a choice, so the Inquisitor is definitely not done. There is no ending where you are done, so your argument doesn't work.

 

Ugh. Again, you're saying useless things. Of course having a new lead writer doesn't mean they'll change their minds. It doesn't mean anything for sure. But it makes it a lot more likely. I've already seen how different Trespasser was under new guidance compared to previous material, and I hope that continues.

[Jaderail]

Normally, as with the Dragon Age fashion, I would say I wouldn't mind a new protagonist. 

 

In this case, however, the story has pretty much been wrapped around the Inquisitor. The Inquisitor is probably the most important facet in either destroying or attempting to redeem Solas. It would be a bit of a shame to drop the story into someone elses lap at this point because it feels like the story kind of revolves around the Inquisitor and if I were to play a different character when I feel my Inquisitor was best suited for that particular position, it wouldn't feel right. 

[Tielis]

Exactly. The way this game is set up could work with new protagonists from time to time but not when you get new protagonists every single time. And stuff like this will only get worse in future as Bioware will need to take into account what are all these protagonists doing in the world with their 30+ possible LIs and all their associates.

 

New protagonists would only work in this game if there was total disconnection between events of the games with brand new casts. Imagine if next Elder Scrolls pulled Bioware style like we have now and made next game 2 years into future with lots of characters from Skyrim appearing. You can bet they would have same problems about incorporating Dragonborn into the world ESPECIALLY if he was heavily tied to the new plot. But they dont make themselves this problem and create games with 200+ year gaps unlike here.

 

This is why ideally I think they should make an Awakening-style "interim" game to tie up what happens with Solas in the short term, and then skip to the next Age, whether it is 100 or 500 or 1000 years later.  Clean slate, with past characters only coming up in history codices.

 

Personally I want to play a post-apocalyptic Thedas where Solas succeeded, but I realize that I am in the minority on that.  

[BansheeOwnage]

Why? Why does it have to be the Inquisitor? Why did the Mage-Templar war and Corypheus plots be handed to some newbie when you have Hawke?

And the warning label was printed on the box. New PC for each game. They've been saying it for a rather long time now.

 

Are you not reading anything anyone is saying? Because the Inquisitor has a personal connection and personal motive to stop him. Doing it with someone else would be unsatisfying. It's not that complicated. And just because the Inquisitor handled Corypheus and the mage-templar war doesn't mean it's automatically better than if Hawke did. Just like if they have a new person deal with Solas. It might be work, but it will be a missed opportunity.

 

Great. Do I really have to list all the times Bioware has either trolled, mislead, outright lied, or simply changed their minds about things? Take everything they say with a bucket of salt.

[Kimarous]

I'm not going to make an argument against the "it's personal / Inquisitor vs Solas" mentality that people have, but I am going to say "BAG OF SPILLING SUCKS!" Seriously, didn't it annoy anyone else how every time you played a Mass Effect game, Shepard lost EVERYTHING and had to restart from basically scratch? The save transfer bonuses weren't nearly enough to compensate for all the resources and abilities you should have had.

 

Also, there comes in that whole issue of the missing arm. Things I can't do when my left forearm is missing:

- use a shield

- wield two-handed weapons

- utilize a second dagger without looking like a complete tool

- carry a bow (and no, "optional Red Jenny prosthetic" doesn't count)

 

So unless the protagonist gets a unique class that compensates for an absent hand, I really don't see "still playing the Inquisitor" as a viable gameplay option.

[Tielis]

I'm not going to make an argument against the "it's personal / Inquisitor vs Solas" mentality that people have, but I am going to say "BAG OF SPILLING SUCKS!" Seriously, didn't it annoy anyone else how every time you played a Mass Effect game, Shepard lost EVERYTHING and had to restart from basically scratch? The save transfer bonuses weren't nearly enough to compensate for all the resources and abilities you should have had.

 

Also, there comes in that whole issue of the missing arm. Things I can't do when my left forearm is missing:

- use a shield

- wield two-handed weapons

- utilize a second dagger without looking like a complete tool

- carry a bow (and no, "optional Red Jenny prosthetic" doesn't count)

 

So unless the protagonist gets a unique class that compensates for an absent hand, I really don't see "still playing the Inquisitor" as a viable gameplay option.

 

You realize that you just outlined the perfect start-as-level-one scenario, right?

[TheRevanchist]

I'm not going to make an argument against the "it's personal / Inquisitor vs Solas" mentality that people have, but I am going to say "BAG OF SPILLING SUCKS!" Seriously, didn't it annoy anyone else how every time you played a Mass Effect game, Shepard lost EVERYTHING and had to restart from basically scratch? The save transfer bonuses weren't nearly enough to compensate for all the resources and abilities you should have had.

 

Also, there comes in that whole issue of the missing arm. Things I can't do when my left forearm is missing:

- use a shield

- wield two-handed weapons

- utilize a second dagger without looking like a complete tool

- carry a bow (and no, "optional Red Jenny prosthetic" doesn't count)

 

So unless the protagonist gets a unique class that compensates for an absent hand, I really don't see "still playing the Inquisitor" as a viable gameplay option.

 

ME2 Shepard imported into 3 at Level 30, the previous games level cap, and had many Talent points already allocated. So no Shepard did not restart every game. Technically he only restarted once.