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[TweetyTheBird]

Resently I started a new playthrough and while switching between hunting for ram meet, fetching herbs and doing war table missions I could not help but think that the priorities about what the inquisitor should do in person are set very wrong.

 

On the first day at Skyhold he/she is granted an impressive blade together with all the power and responsibility of being a leader of the inquisition. One would imagine that such a great leader would delegate the less important tasks to his subordinates and take part personally in the strategically important events. Instead, we see just the opposite - the counsel members take care of the important missions while our inquisitor collects ram meat and chases hallas around.

 

I think that it would suit much better to the character if for example:

• In the mission "Stop War Between Nevarra and Tevinter" inquisitor has two choices - send Josephine (in which case the diplomat mission is attacked by enemies who do not want the peace talks to succeed, Josephine returns injured and peace fails) OR go personally (in which case diplomat mission is attacked and the inquisitor has the chance to defeat the enemy, save Josephine and then broker peace between nevarra and tevinter)
• In mission about collecting ram meat - ask cullen to send soldiers to collect it.

There are many similar examples in the game that somehow make the inquisitor and inquisition seem small. The intended epic impact is somehow lost and so is the strength of character of the inquisitor - he/she is reduced to a simple glorified errand boy/girl.

[Darkly Tranquil]

Yes, but so is pretty much every other RPG protagonist. The nature of questing inevitably leads to feeling like an errand boy/girl.

[Nefla]

Yeah one of my biggest gripes with the game is that this supposed important and powerful leader/religious figure is running around doing menial tasks and the grunts are the ones doing impactful and interesting missions via the war table.

[Deebo305]

So is every other MC ever

[TweetyTheBird]

I do not agree that every character is like that - for example, in Origins the role fits the character - he/she has to start from the very bottom after Ostagar, but still constantly chases the main goal - unite the allies against the Blight and the missions fit that goal. In DAII the main character is a poor immigrant at the beginning and is forced to run errands, but once he/she climbs up the social ladder the missions become more and more important.

Here, we are put at the top almost from the beginning and still we collect stuff manually all the time.

[SwobyJ]

Sort of.

 

DAI tries to justify this by having the context of an Inquisitor who instead of being literally sent on errands, instead decides to help out in an area or not. Its not his job, but instead extension of his personality.

 

When you get that ram meat, its because you're spending some time around the Crossroads, see people suffering, and know you can do something to help, increase the influence of the Inquisition (even if its only a little, you become known as someone in touch with the common man), etc.

 

Its not just because someone demands you to get ram meat and you must comply.

 

For the War Table, you most certainly do delegate. Your Inner Circle may do the bulk of the work (in a sense), but you're the delegater. The Inquisition could technically run without you, but it would not necessarily succeed without you. The point is that its the Inquisitor's decisions that make a success or failure, and that the Inquisitor may engage in activities that make himself known as a man of all of southern Thedas and not just the elite/Maker, not that the Inquisitor is a grunt or is a useless figurehead.

 

Shepard in Mass Effect was more the latter BTW. This isn't so bad in its own context - a hot war that has a galaxy needing a best-soldier-ever and fantastic figurehead or else it falls apart - but the Inquisitor is in some ways more than that. He doesn't just have to do the small stuff - he chooses to. He doesn't just act as an eventual figurehead (his time as purely the 'Herald' is only in weeks to short months) - he gets given the role but lets Thedas know he's a person to be counted on.

 

The Inquisitor relies on his allies to get things done, for sure. Some of the 'world saving' agency is out of our hands compared to DAO and ME1-3. But it is in fact - whether the message was received by the players or not - the intent that the Inquisitor through his small actions is implicitly being known more as someone that Thedas may not just worship or demonize, but instead ultimately understand as a person like any of them, doing what they can.

 

You may not intend on clearing some wolves in the Hinterlands, but its what you can decide to help out with.

You may not intend on having so much responsibility on Josephine, but its your decisions about her that may determine success or failure.

 

 

In terms of 'cullen getting ram meat' you can indeed do that sort of thing with the Resource based War Table orders. But the Inquisitor specifically doing it is during a time where he most likely has just landed in the Hinterlands and wants to gain some initial non-Temple of Sacred Ashes support from the people. Being THE person who brings that meat spreads word throughout the Hinterlands that you care about their survival and health, not just utility.

[JasonPogo]

Yes.

[correctamundo]

The fault is all on you if you're still collecting ram meat once you get to Skyhold.

[SwobyJ]

The fault is all on you if you're still collecting ram meat once you get to Skyhold.

 

Yeah I look at the level ranges and they tell me all I need to know.

 

Initial Hinterlands activities should, by 'best canon' (whatever that is), not happen post-Skyhold.

 

Maybe the farm and lyrium smuggling stuff.

 

Almost certainly the dragon stuff.

 

Pre-Skyhold you can also go to Storm Coast or not (depends if you care about its story and Iron Bull at that point), maybe try Fallow Mire, and maybe maybe try Forbidden Oasis (but I consider that the most optional zone at that point).

 

Pre and Post Skyhold have somewhat different contexts between being a helpful Herald and authoritative Inquisitor.

[LightningPoodle]

After getting to Skyhold and becoming the Inquisitor, those quests really should have ceased, or at least became few and far between. Before becoming the Inquisitor, fair enough. The organisation has barely found its feet. It needs to build up that good grace. Afterwards though... the Inquisitor really should have had a lot more important matters to deal with, instead of gathering things that really anyone could do. You don't need a special mark on your hand to go up that hill and get that book.

[SwobyJ]

After getting to Skyhold and becoming the Inquisitor, those quests really should have ceased, or at least became few and far between. Before becoming the Inquisitor, fair enough. The organisation has barely found its feet. It needs to build up that good grace. Afterwards though... the Inquisitor really should have had a lot more important matters to deal with, instead of gathering things that really anyone could do. You don't need a special mark on your hand to go up that hill and get that book.

 

I didn't fine it a big deal because:

1)Hinterlands is the closest zone to Skyhold.

2)This fight is over the course of at least months. Frankly, I'm going to be checking up on the Hinterlands from time to time.

 

There's not actually frequent breakthroughs about Corypheus. This isn't a Blight posing immediate existential threat (just an eventual threat that may be worse than a Blight, but again, eventual). Sometimes I just want to help out and make sure that the closest Ferelden region is okay, as I pass through it..

 

Sure it doesn't fit as well, but I'm personally okay with Bioware approach. I wouldn't have even minded if the Templar/Mage camps stayed as long as they got changed to a post-Skyhold context.

 

 

The Inquisitor actually doesn't always have the most important matters to attend to all the time. This is how he can go shopping in Val Royeaux and play pranks on people with Sera.

[Poledo]

The choice is yours. You're talking about filler content versus following the main story. Close some rifts, make camps, claim a keep or two and you have all the power you need for the whole game. The rest is really your choice to play the Inky as a gopher.

 

It does make a lot of sense in the early parts of the game because you are working to build the name of the inquisition and it's reputation. I suppose you can apply that to some of the later game things as well. You're a leader who gets involved where they can and delegates (missions) when needed.

[Mr.House]

No different then the Warden Commander in DA:A being a errand boy/girl, unless collecting silk carpets is somehow fighting the darkspawn.

 

The PC being the errand girl./boy is the norm of CRPGs, no matter the game.

[The Hierophant]

My only issue is that the majority of the wartable missions seemed far more interesting than the playable sidesquests that we were offered.

[Majestic Jazz]

Resently I started a new playthrough and while switching between hunting for ram meet, fetching herbs and doing war table missions I could not help but think that the priorities about what the inquisitor should do in person are set very wrong.

 

On the first day at Skyhold he/she is granted an impressive blade together with all the power and responsibility of being a leader of the inquisition. One would imagine that such a great leader would delegate the less important tasks to his subordinates and take part personally in the strategically important events. Instead, we see just the opposite - the counsel members take care of the important missions while our inquisitor collects ram meat and chases hallas around.

 

I think that it would suit much better to the character if for example:

• In the mission "Stop War Between Nevarra and Tevinter" inquisitor has two choices - send Josephine (in which case the diplomat mission is attacked by enemies who do not want the peace talks to succeed, Josephine returns injured and peace fails) OR go personally (in which case diplomat mission is attacked and the inquisitor has the chance to defeat the enemy, save Josephine and then broker peace between nevarra and tevinter)
• In mission about collecting ram meat - ask cullen to send soldiers to collect it.

There are many similar examples in the game that somehow make the inquisitor and inquisition seem small. The intended epic impact is somehow lost and so is the strength of character of the inquisitor - he/she is reduced to a simple glorified errand boy/girl.

 

Yeah one of my biggest gripes with the game is that this supposed important and powerful leader/religious figure is running around doing menial tasks and the grunts are the ones doing impactful and interesting missions via the war table.

 

But but but.....DAI is Bioware's most successful launch ever and was 2014 GOTY!!!!!!

[thats1evildude]

Yeah, I finished the ram meat quest on my way to other quests in the Hinterlands on my first trip.

[Mr.House]

My only issue is that the majority of the wartable missions seemed far more interesting than the playable sidesquests that we were offered.

War table, closing rifts, certain side quests and main quests where the only time Quizy lived up to her title in the base game imo.

[D_Schattenjager]

Yeah one of my biggest gripes with the game is that this supposed important and powerful leader/religious figure is running around doing menial tasks and the grunts are the ones doing impactful and interesting missions via the war table.

 I think you do have recurring quests at War table for collection once you become the Inq. You don't have to gather anything if you don't want to ...

I think its quite realistically shown ... 

[Mr.House]

 I think you do have recurring quests at War table for collection once you become the Inq. You don't have to gather anything if you don't want to ...

I think its quite realistically shown ... 

The problem is the side quests. There should have been more fort takes, more quests like the crestwood rift in the lake ect.

 

I have no big issue with hinterlands and Stormcoat per say since this happens before Skyhold (it just could have been better), but it's when the zones post Haven really just have the same old fetch X that littered the game. The war table not only had far more interesting stuff, but it also had failures and branches, stuff that lacks in the zones themselves.

[Darkly Tranquil]

The problem is the side quests. There should have been more fort takes, more quests like the crestwood rift in the lake ect.
 
I have no big issue with hinterlands and Stormcoat per say since this happens before Skyhold (it just could have been better), but it's when the zones post Haven really just have the same old fetch X that littered the game. The war table not only had far more interesting stuff, but it also had failures and branches, stuff that lacks in the zones themselves.

Agree with this. Each zone needed a stronger and more connected narrative to justify fully exploring it. Crestwood was good because it had a whole sub-plot of its own going on that was well presented. But in some of the other zones, the story is disjointed and hard to follow or there simply isn't one to speak of. Though I'm loathe to suggest going down the MMO path, WoW's method of using quest chains to guide the player around a zone while telling a story could be an effective template for zone design. As it stands, DAI's quests were too disconnected from each other and rarely amounted to any kind of narrative.

[Mr.House]

Agree with this. Each zone needed a stronger and more connected narrative to justify fully exploring it. Crestwood was good because it had a whole sub-plot of its own going on that was well presented. But in some of the other zones, the story is disjointed and hard to follow or there simply isn't one to speak of. Though I'm loathe to suggest going down the MMO path, WoW's method of using quest chains to guide the player around a zone while telling a story could be an effective template for zone design. As it stands, DAI's quests were too disconnected from each other and rarely amounted to any kind of narrative.

TOR did a better job then DAI too. each planet had a main planet quest line that was lengthy and had lots of choices and different outcomes. Crestwood was very close to a typical TOR planet questline, DAI needed more of that.

[Lukas Trevelyan]

I like how Mother Giselle discusses the matter when you complain to her about "trivialities" when there is a war going on.

[correctamundo]

The problem is the side quests. There should have been more fort takes, more quests like the crestwood rift in the lake ect.

 

I have no big issue with hinterlands and Stormcoat per say since this happens before Skyhold (it just could have been better), but it's when the zones post Haven really just have the same old fetch X that littered the game. The war table not only had far more interesting stuff, but it also had failures and branches, stuff that lacks in the zones themselves.

 

Well post IYHSB you open up Crestwood, the western approach, the exalted plains, the emerald graves, Emprise du Lion and the hissing wastes.

 

Crestwood - the keep, still waters etc.

 

Western approach - It is as Crestwood tied to the the Abyss quest line but in addition there is the assault on Griffon wing keep, Still ruins and a darkspawn dungeon. Draconology does involve a fair amount of fetching but there isn't really a lack of Crestwood type quests.

 

Exalted plains  - Eastern ramparts, Western ramparts, Victory rise are the bigger forts on the plains. The entry into Fort Revasan is beset by an arcane horror, it is a small thing for the IQ but for Duke Gaspard's forces it is major. The riverside garrison is an interesting take on the rifts. Then there is of course the Citadelle du Corbeau.

 

Emerald graves - Argons lodge, Villa Maurel and the Veridium mines as part of the Freemen of the dales questline. Then there is of course the knights tomb and Chateau D'Onterre.

 

Emprise du Lion - Take back the Lion and claim Suledin keep. This is really the big thing in Emprise but there is also Valeskas watch, rumours of the Sulevin and last but not least breeding grounds.

 

The Hissing wastes - Sand and ruin with the last stronghold of the Venatori and the Tomb of Fairel. The wastes is full of space however, no less than seven camps, but you are warned by Harding.

 

So I really don't see the lack of fort takes or special quest like the big Crestwood rift.

[bon]

but op when you came first in hinterland you just an agent of inquisition, so yes you are errand boy.