121 réponses à ce sujet

[Maria Caliban]

I'm sorry to hear that, Xilizhra.

[caradoc2000]

I still think Otranto is an engaging character.

Obviously he is. He is trying to get engaged to Josephine after all...

[Nixou]

I'll admit I did find it a little strange that she went from totally oblivious / "I know there's NO way you could possibly feel ~that way~ about me, what a totally ridiculous notion, silly Leliana and her silly ideas" to... suddenly making out with you. >____>

But I figured it was supposed to be a cutesy character quirk or something, so eh.

 

It is a quirk of her character: the intent with her romance was to make her attracted to the Inquisitor from the get go and then go through phases with him/her

 

• There's no way s/he's really attracted to me as well, so I'll ignore what seems to be signals s/he's sending me which are totally-not-signals
• There's no way s/he's really attracted to me as well, but now that Leliana is meddling, I'd better burst the abscess before things get really uncomfortable
• Wait! S/he's really attracted to me as well? Jackpot!

[wright1978]

Agree with the OP, it is extremely poor.

[Qunquistador]

 

1. Josephine's attraction is based on nothing.

 

 

 If you can't tell why Josephine was attracted to your Inquisitor, then maybe you're playing the game wrong?

 

 

However, Josephine's romance appears to be built to emphasize every possible flaw of both the approval-less system and the flirtation-gate system. It's true that Josephine does sometimes respond positively to your flirts (other times, completely ignoring them in a manner that seems wholly OOC for someone so socially adept), but all of this is completely obviated when Leliana tells you that Josephine is oblivious to your romantic interest, and has given minimal if any signs of feeling any herself. Once the conversation where you actually start your relationship appears, the artificiality of the entire arrangement comes to a head when Josephine's response to your just stating outright that you're romantically interested in her is, paraphrased, "You've only known me a couple of months, this makes no sense." Then, once you compliment her, she's suddenly willing to get romantic (or rather, "would not object to" doing so) without giving any indication whatsoever of why she wants to do so with you. Furthermore, Josephine never says, in the entire romance, why she actually likes you. It's definitely not because of philosophical agreement, as you can completely disregard her wishes in her personal quest by having Leliana attack the House of Repose vault, and that only gets worse when you consider...

 

 

So you're annoyed you didn't get sign posts that read exactly what a NPC liked about you? I don't think everything needs to spelled out that way.

 

There are clearly things that the Inquisitor can do and say that would make them endearing to her. Does Josephine need to say I like you because you saved me from assassins, did stuff for my family, and listen to me talk about stuff no one else wants to listen to me talk about?  

 

And is it so odd that rather than assume that her boss's compliments (mildly inappropriate, now that I think about it  ) are serious, she chalks it up them being nice and a bit flirty? Josephine's character is all about standards and procedures. Her reaction...or lack thereof makes sense to me.

[Qunquistador]

While I absolutely adore Josephine, I agree that her romance in itself is a bit... peculiar.

 

---

 

Inquisitor: Josephine, I am romantically attracted to you.

 

Josephine: ???¿?? You are?¿¿¿???? 

 

--- 

Inquisitor: Josephine, I love you!

 

Josephine: ???? You do??¿?? 

 

 That's why I like her and her romance, she's self-assured in pretty much every way, but romantically she's a bit of a ditz. If the Inquisitor doesn't spell things out and take the lead, literally nothing will happen. 

 

 

Eta: Looking back on it, pretty sure she says "you do?!?" both times, which makes this even funnier. Even when you ask her to dance, she kind of gives you low key skeptical look like

 

Even if you're in a relationship, she doesn't seem to know what to expect.

Modifié par Qunquistador, 16 septembre 2015 - 07:55 .

[Xilizhra]

I'm surprised you didn't make this about Sera

Regardless of any issues with Sera's character, her romance is excellent.

[Fiery Phoenix]

"Worst one I've ever played" is a bit of a stretch, don't you think, Xil?

[Xilizhra]

"Worst one I've ever played" is a bit of a stretch, don't you think, Xil?

No. The other ones I've played are ME1's Liara, DAO's Leliana, ME2's Kelly and LotSB Liara, DA2's Merrill, ME3's Liara, and most of DAI's Sera, and Josephine is indeed worse than all of those.

[Milan92]

I'm a not a fan of her romance either. 

 

Its not bad per se, but its just really boring. Also the aftermath of the dualing scene made me cringe because of all the cheese.

[Ieldra]

Perhaps "Worst I ever played" would be a bit exaggerated, but it didn't work for me either. I didn't know exactly why since like you, I like Josephine as a character, but now you've pointed out the flaws. Thanks.

[Deanna]

Classic case of over thinking it lol...

[Xilizhra]

Perhaps "Worst I ever played" would be a bit exaggerated, but it didn't work for me either. I didn't know exactly why since like you, I like Josephine as a character, but now you've pointed out the flaws. Thanks.

My pleasure.

 

 

Classic case of over thinking it lol...

Not really. I was bugged whenever I played the romance, and I was extremely vocal (in private) in my disgust at the ending, but it took me a bit longer to articulate everything, and then I didn't post it until I came back to the forum.

[Arlee]

I agree with the OP about Josie's romance

 

As for the comparison between her being against the duel and Dorian not wanting you to get the amulet I understand the parallel but the two cases differ in a very important way. With Dorian he doesn't want you to get the amulet because he's concerned about people thinking he's using you and a bit that he doesn't want to personally feel indebted, it's basically a point of pride. On the other hand Josie is opposed to the whole concept of the duel because she prefers for things to be handled diplomatically and after her brief stint as a bard she was much more for non-violence. So dueling to win her feels like a betrayal of her core principles which to me feels like a much bigger deal than Dorian's amulet.

[Lady Elsa]

Hmm, I did think it odd that the two advisor romances were not based on approval at all. (or that there wasn't some sort of approval system for them)  I mean I could play a cruel/violent/power hungry assquisitor but as long as I flirted and did their personal quests they would be automatically in love? Its not a big deal since its not something I would do but in general I prefer LI/npc's to have as much autonomy as possible. I like when they can disagree with the PC/ break up or even leave based on your actions. I think Sera's romance was well handled in this regard. The fact that she would not let herself be changed/influenced by romance with the PC was refreshing even if not liked by everyone. 

[Arlee]

Hmm, I did think it odd that the two advisor romances were not based on approval at all. (or that there wasn't some sort of approval system for them)  I mean I could play a cruel/violent/power hungry assquisitor but as long as I flirted and did their personal quests they would be automatically in love? Its not a big deal since its not something I would do but in general I prefer LI/npc's to have as much autonomy as possible. I like when they can disagree with the PC/ break up or even leave based on your actions. I think Sera's romance was well handled in this regard. The fact that she would not let herself be changed/influenced by romance with the PC was refreshing even if not liked by everyone. 

 

There is a thing you could do to cause Cullen to break-up with you, so at least there is that. I'm not sure if there is anything similar for Josie though. Dorian also has a couple of points where he would break up with you depending on choices you make, which is great

[Iakus]

Josephine's romance is probably not for everybody.  She may be an adept politician and diplomat, but she's supposed to be something of an innocent in matters of the heart.  She has never really been in love before.  

 

ANd the duel was likely meant as a deconstruction of the whole "duel for the fair maiden" While maybe the duel itself could have been handled better, the concept behind it is kinda sweet.  The more so that Josephine personally intervenes to settle matters.

[Arshei]

Short version = You don't like her because she hasn't sex scene.

[jtav]

I'm doing it now and enjoying it quite a bit as a slightly tongue in cheek but ultimately sincere homage to old swashbucklers. Duels, twirling the LI, literal one foot on the floor. And the scenes in her quarters are very sweet. I believe she and my Cadash will be quite happy.

[Arlee]

Short version = You don't like her because she hasn't sex scene.

 

Might be true of some people but I don't dislike the Solas romance (which also has no sex) so no, your oversimplification isn't actually a statement of fact.

[ComedicSociopathy]

Might be true of some people but I don't dislike the Solas romance (which also has no sex) so no, your oversimplification isn't actually a statement of fact.

 

There seems to be something of a double standard when it comes to Josie's and Solas's romances. From what I've seen from the Solasmancers they couldn't give a fig less about whenever they got to shag Solas or not, but for Josie it's a big deal. 

 

Weird. 

[Xilizhra]

There seems to be something of a double standard when it comes to Josie's and Solas's romances. From what I've seen from the Solasmancers they couldn't give a fig less about whenever they got to shag Solas or not, but for Josie it's a big deal. 

 

Weird. 

It's possible because Solas' otherworldliness makes him seem like a fundamentally less sexual being? I'm not attracted to men and couldn't say directly, but that would be my guess.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Might be true of some people but I don't dislike the Solas romance (which also has no sex) so no, your oversimplification isn't actually a statement of fact.

I think they were referring to just the OP, who has complained numerous times specifically about the lack of a sex scene in the Josephine thread. 

[WildOrchid]

Personally, I'm sort of fan of angst when it comes to DA romances. Adds some much needed conflict to the romance and can create stakes that make the eventually resolution more powerful. Which is why I was hoping that the whole secret lovers trope that happens before the duel (which is really, really stupid, but I guess can also be fun in how cheesy it is) would be expanded upon in the romance arc.

 

But, hey, sometimes people just want an adorable fairy tale romance that isn't focused on overt sexuality. Nothing wrong with that and Bioware providing that with Josie is awesome. 

 

That's why I enjoyed Sera's romance by far and that Josie's romance bored me to tears, I was actually considering deleting my elf pt but eh.

Plus I felt she had less cutscenes compared to Sera.

 

The duel was good but short. Like it... just happened.

 

 

Edit: dem typos

[Arlee]

There seems to be something of a double standard when it comes to Josie's and Solas's romances. From what I've seen from the Solasmancers they couldn't give a fig less about whenever they got to shag Solas or not, but for Josie it's a big deal. 

 

Weird. 

 

I don't doubt there are some people who legit feel that way, but I don't think that's likely the case for most people. I feel like the idea the duel and her suddenly being ok with it because you said you loved her is a valid criticism (of course that's one thing which bothered me about it so I'm a bit biased there ). There's actually something similar in the Dorian romance which I think illustrates the point I want to make very well, but ima spoiler it in case some people haven't gotten to him yet.

 

Spoiler

In the quest to get Dorian his amulet back the Inquister has the option to kill the merchant, however if you do this Dorian will break-up with full stop. No throwing out an "I love you" to change his mind or anything, he's done with you even if you had a really high approval with him otherwise. And this is a very good thing. Killing the merchant because you can goes against who Dorian is at his core and this sort of thing just shouldn't be overlooked. In fact I was mad originally when I thought he didn't break it off if you murdered the dude. In a similar way the whole duel thing feels like it goes totally against who Josie is and the fact the issue is hand waved away with an "I love you" really just grates on me.