44 réponses à ce sujet

[Cheviot]

The way space travel works in the MEU doesn't give the Normandy any way to get very far from Earth. If they were traveling in standard FTL, any other ship can reach that planet the same way they did. If they were travelling by relay -- the graphics seem to imply this -- there's only one known garden world (Demeter) within range of the Charon Relay (Benning and the world orbiting Alpha Centauri don't have relays.) In any event, the Charon relay can't take a ship anyplace that can't be reached via standard FTL -- secondary relays don't have the range.

It's probable the planet is in an undiscovered system at some point between Relays, since the scene in question implies that the Normandy was torn out of the mass effect corridor while in transit.

[AlanC9]

It's probable the planet is in an undiscovered system at some point between Relays, since the scene in question implies that the Normandy was torn out of the mass effect corridor while in transit.

That would involve a massive lore violation, of course (not to mention massive luck to emerge anywhere near a system). So you still gotta add space magic to make it work. It also requires Normandy to have done a two-stage jump -- Charon-Arcturus, Arcturus-wherever.

[AlanC9]

I'd argue they already did that when no DLC was released confirming an IT interpretation of Mass Effect 3. The Extended Cut even seemed to subvert it, since it provided epilogues for all the choices, and neither Synthesis or Control results in mass extinction. In fact only choice that resulted in mass extinction in the Extended Cut, is the one where Shepard refuses to take any of the options presented.

Bioware also banned discussion of IT on these forums for awhile, which would be a bizarre reaction if IT was what the writers intended.

Well, yeah, but the IT fans found a way to rationalize around the EC.

I certainly didn't mean to suggest that Bio intended IT. Just that they don't want to burst the IT fans' bubble unless they really have to.

[Il Divo]

Well, yeah, but the IT fans found a way to rationalize around the EC.

I certainly didn't mean to suggest that Bio intended IT. Just that they don't want to burst the IT fans' bubble unless they really have to.

 

Out of curiosity, how did IT fans manage to circumvent the EC? I never read up on the details. ​

[Hexxagone]

Harbinger saying "serve us" before hitting Shepard with the beam, which was added in the EC. As well as the extended dialogue with the God Child pretty much confirming he is a reaper and he speaks in Harbingers voice if you choose the Refusal ending.

 

As well as the fact that there is no way for Shepard to survive Harbingers beam unless he was trying not to kill him, as it killed everyone else and cuts warships like butter.

 

and the God Child having the form of a human child that didn't exist at the time he was created, since synthetics cant read minds, Shepard was in a dreamlike sequence.

[Han Shot First]

Harbinger saying "serve us" before hitting Shepard with the beam, which was added in the EC. As well as the extended dialogue with the God Child pretty much confirming he is a reaper and he speaks in Harbingers voice if you choose the Refusal ending.

 

 

Harbinger makes a generic Reaper sound effect and doesn't say anything. The IT crowd were hearing what they wanted to hear, similar to the people who see Jesus' face in the random shapes and colors on the surface of a piece of toast.

 

 

As well as the fact that there is no way for Shepard to survive Harbingers beam unless he was trying not to kill him, as it killed everyone else and cuts warships like butter.

 

The Lazarus Project was much more far-fetched than Shepard not being killed by Harbinger's beam. I think it is quite a stretch to see the latter as somehow proving IT.

 

 

and the God Child having the form of a human child that didn't exist at the time he was created, since synthetics cant read minds, Shepard was in a dreamlike sequence.

 

Shepard and Anderson had been under the effects of indoctrination minutes before, during the confrontation with the Illusive Man. Since the Reapers had indoctrinated TIM, its likely that is how the Catalyst was aware of the child and his psychological significance to Shepard.

 

That doesn't necessarily prove the entire end sequence was a dream however. In fact the Extended Cut suggests it wasn't with the epilogues where the end choices are revealed to have real results, and only end in failure and mass extinction when Shepard refuses to take any of the options mentioned by the Catalyst.

[GalacticWolf5]

Harbinger saying "serve us" before hitting Shepard with the beam, which was added in the EC. As well as the extended dialogue with the God Child pretty much confirming he is a reaper and he speaks in Harbingers voice if you choose the Refusal ending.

As well as the fact that there is no way for Shepard to survive Harbingers beam unless he was trying not to kill him, as it killed everyone else and cuts warships like butter.

and the God Child having the form of a human child that didn't exist at the time he was created, since synthetics cant read minds, Shepard was in a dreamlike sequence.

It's never been confirmed that Harbinger says "serve us". And it's actually the same sound from other Reapers that appear earlier in the game.

...did you really think the Intelligence wasn't a Reaper? Wh-What? How? Why? It straight up says it's the collective consciousness of all Reapers. It controls the Reapers....

Reapers can access your mind. Indoctrination, what do you think it is?

[The Night Haunter]

Anyway, there are more than enough IT threads out there, no need to turn this one into another one as well (since they all go nowhere anyway).

[AlanC9]

Out of curiosity, how did IT fans manage to circumvent the EC? I never read up on the details. ​

The essential move is that the EC ending slides and narration are just more indoctrination. Except possibly Destroy; there were different flavors of IT, some of them thought that Destroy was fake too. (Obviously those have mostly died out by now.) Plus the fantasy about Harbinger's dialogue above.

I don't know where the fantasy that synthetics can't possibly read minds came from. A prothean beacon can beam information into an organic brain, and that's a much harder problem than reading information out.

[Hexxagone]

Reapers influence your actions by changing your brainwaves, they CANNOT read your mind. Or else Sovereign and the Reapers would have known that the signal to summon the Reapers was blocked in ME 1.

 

But yes this shouldn't turn into one of "those threads'

[Il Divo]

Reapers influence your actions by changing your brainwaves, they CANNOT read your mind. Or else Sovereign and the Reapers would have known that the signal to summon the Reapers was blocked in ME 1.

 

But yes this shouldn't turn into one of "those threads'

 

Wait, who actually knew about the signal in ME1? The only ones were the Protheans and Vigil and the Reapers had no access to either. ​

[Han Shot First]

Reapers influence your actions by changing your brainwaves, they CANNOT read your mind. 

 

That is incorrect. They in fact do exactly that in the books, where they read Grayson's mind. The book in question was written by Drew Karpyshyn, one of the game series' lead writers.

[AlanC9]

Reapers influence your actions by changing your brainwaves, they CANNOT read your mind. Or else Sovereign and the Reapers would have known that the signal to summon the Reapers was blocked in ME 1.

Huh? Whose mind was Sovereign supposed to read to learn that? If he had known there were prothean scientists crawling around on the Citadel he would have killed them before they did anything, and after they died there weren't any minds to read.

I wouldn't engage on this except that I've never heard this theory before.

[AresKeith]

Because they want it to so it can have some connection to the trilogy

[Hexxagone]

Do you realize how stupid that sounds? multiple cycles and races working on the Crucible and the mind reading Reapers never found out?

 

WTF

[ArabianIGoggles]

Do you realize how stupid that sounds? multiple cycles and races working on the Crucible and the mind reading Reapers never found out?

 

WTF

Wait are you serious?  The kid talks about this at the end of the game, and as said before, the reapers can most certainly read minds.  They use an adapted version of the Leviathan method of communication/indoctrination.  If you haven't yet, I'd highly recommend reading the books.  IMO the second one is the best, but they're all good.

[Il Divo]

Do you realize how stupid that sounds? multiple cycles and races working on the Crucible and the mind reading Reapers never found out?

 

WTF

 

Pretty sure the Catalyst also mentions that they've been aware of the Crucible plans since long before our cycle. That aside, what exactly would the Reapers have learned? And from whom? Been a while since I played ME3 but I don't recall the Crucible's exact specifications being spilled out to every single organic.

[N172]

The catalyst clearly said that without the cycles of destruction the following will happen:
- Destruction of all Organics by Synthetics ("Chaos")

According to him the only alternatives are
- Control by a Catalyst-alike entity
- Synthesis of all Organics and Synthetics

So, according to the catalyst and since we got the same (or even higher) level of tech, Andromeda has to have a "solution" or you get all organics killed by synthetics.
Since Bioware will most likely not do that, they'll end up proving the catalyst to be wrong, again.

[AlanC9]

That's fine. It's not like anyone ever wanted the Catalyst to be right.

[Vol_Tang_Clan]

Since Bioware will most likely not do that, they'll end up proving the catalyst to be wrong, again.

 

Good. Never trust crustaceans to write software. They should've just started a cult in Bikini Bottom and drink the poisonous jellyfish.