139 réponses à ce sujet

[Renessa]

Ancient elves of course, there are still a few of them in ancient ruins or maybe in Fade. Spirits are more like his friends.

 

And if by "messing" you mean "use as pawns", well, convenient pawns are convenient pawns. You may call him a filthy liar, but that's far away for madness.

 

I have to admit, though not a Psychopath, for me, Solas is defenitely mad.

 

To plan to destroy a big portion of the world so you can restore a distant past, I think, you have to be as mad as a hatter, really. I mean: "How are you going to deal with the Evanuris?" - "I had plans" (evasive look): Totally crazy.....

 

The question is, though, can we cure him from his madness.... (perhaps a few hits to the back of the head)

[Nixou]

I scored him at an 8 using that list, so, nope.  Not psychopathic.

 

I gave him a 20-25 myself.

[NoForgiveness]

He scored like a 5 for me. So no I wouldn't say he's a psychopath, evil or a lunatic or any other variation. In fact he is a really good guy who is just trying to save his world, same as the inquisitor.

[Reznore57]

He scored like a 5 for me. So no I wouldn't say he's a psychopath, evil or a lunatic or any other variation. In fact he is a really good guy who is just trying to save his world, same as the inquisitor.

 

Yes and that serial killer in DA2 killing women to rebuild something close to his dead wife was also a really misunderstood good guy.

[Drasanil]

The fact that Felassan changed his mind after spending time with modern elves IS EXACTLY the reason NOT to kill Felassan. Felassan gives us excellent insight into what reality is.

 

Actually pretty sure it IS EXACTLY the reason TO kill Felassan. His lack of conviction led to betrayal. If he was allowed to live Solas could only expect more of the same, killing him was the only sensible response. 

[Cobra's_back]

Actually pretty sure it IS EXACTLY the reason TO kill Felassan. His lack of conviction led to betrayal. If he was allowed to live Solas could only expect more of the same, killing him was the only sensible response. 

 

Betrayal only to a madman. Felassen was his one way ticket to sanity. If he was allowed to live and think they could have found a way to make things better for Elves in general. There is nothing sensible in Solas. 

[Drasanil]

Betrayal only to a madman. Felassen was his one way ticket to sanity. If he was allowed to live and think they could have found a way to make things better for Elves in general. There is nothing sensible in Solas. 

 

Solas is quite rational, or at least appears to be, and is fully cognisant of what he is doing and what the likely consequences are. Having different priorities doesn't make him insane. 

 

That aside, killing someone for committing treason, especially when they have the potential to be an ongoing threat is a perfectly sensible action take in those circumstances.

[Dancing_Dolphin]

I'm not really sure how mental illness would manifest in someone who has lived for so long, but I'm certain he is not a psychopath. But considering the loss he has suffered and is directly responsible for, he is probably not entirely healthy from a mental and emotional standpoint. It's almost like he is afraid to slow down for too long for fear of being crushed by the mountain of despair he carries around...and now he is going to make another huge mistake.

[QueenCrow]

I believe it was genuine. I say this, because I recall a cutscene where he says that the Inquisitor has surprised him, he's seen a wisdom in her that he never expected, and no matter what.. he respects her.

 

My opinion is this, and I hate to use it as a comparison but I really can't think of a better one: we have psychopaths, and we have extremist/zealots.. there is a large difference. Extremist/zealots are usually brainwashed, relate to whatever cause they are pushing for on some emotional level, and therefore will do whatever it takes to achieve that cause. And by that, I am referring to terrorists... People who believe that blowing themselves and other people up in a "sacrifice" and have convinced themselves it's the right thing.

 

I'm not comparing him to a terrorist.. it's more to do with the mindset. I don't condone what he's doing, but I find it interesting to find out the "why", what's driving him.. and there has got to be more to it. He clearly has knowledge that many people, including the Inquisitor and the rest of Thedas, do not. Whatever that knowledge is.. is driving him.

 

You know, I honestly want to believe that his respect was genuine.  I wanted to believe what he said - "Ar lath, ma vhenan", "The Dalish did something right when they made you." , "You show a subtle wisdom...", "rare and marvelous spirit".  It's really difficult for me to reconcile the idea that he was genuine then while he saying something to the effect of "While you were fighting to save the world from the breach and restore order, I was only using you to get my orb back so that I can burn the people you fought to save in the chaos I have planned."  

 

I feel the same about the killing of Felassan - if he was indeed killed by Solas - it's hard for me to reconcile helping the People ("the People need me") by killing them.  There's something broken in that stream of logic for me.  It's hard to free people from slavery when you demand their absolute obedience, that they surrender their will to your purpose, on pain of death.

 

On the general topic, it would be great if we could so some kind of Dragon Age Ancients Behaving Badly.  On that documentaryesque show they sum up each ancient by rating them on a personality scale (because these personality disorders and pathologies are all on a spectrum of severity and malignancy).  The graph they use has a Y-axis that is psychopathic murderer on one end and goal-driven killer on the other.  The x-axis is used to rate other personality pathologies.  They explore the actions and psychological implications therein of people like Caligula, Nero, Cleopatra, and Attila the Hun.  That'd be fun to do for Corypheus, Solas, and any of our other DA ancients who behave badly.  I suppose that's kind of what we're attempting in this thread.  Good thread, btw!

[NoForgiveness]

Yes and that serial killer in DA2 killing women to rebuild something close to his dead wife was also a really misunderstood good guy.

Mmhm. The inquisitor is like a nug. Hoping around the place and cleaning up scum. See? I can make nonsensical comparisons too!

[Reznore57]

Mmhm. The inquisitor is like a nug. Hoping around the place and cleaning up scum. See? I can make nonsensical comparisons too!

 

That's not nonsensical.

The Killer in DA2 lost his wife and he can't deal with it.

Solas lost his empire and people and he can't deal with it.

Instead of mourning and letting go , they both decided well I'm now going to kill people to bring back what was lost.

In both cases the killing is just a necessary evil to get what they want , because what they want is all that matters.

[sylvanaerie]

A few bricks shy of an outhouse, yea.  Psychopath, I don't think so.  

 

If anything I pity him.  Imagine waking up to a world where you pushed the shiny red button and destroyed everything.  You are all alone, cut off from the life you knew.  All around you, the world is lifeless and void of what you knew.  Slowly you begin to find signs of life where you didn't expect it, but life so unbelievably primitive that it doesn't feel real.  I imagine this is some of what he's experiencing when first awakened.  He compounds his mistake giving his orb to Corypheus.  Then takes responsibility and tries to fix the error.  He doesn't like making anyone suffer for his mistakes and gains approval whenever the Inquisitor helps people around him, slowly realizing that they are people.  He frees you of the mark as much because it's killing you as to get his power back.  

 

Now this is 'friended' Solas.  I am unsure what changes exist for romanced or 'enemy' Solas.  

To me these are not the acts of a psychopath.  I would imagine a psychopath to be someone more delusional or lacking in empathy (like Norman Bates or Hannibal Lector).

 

Even if he does want to restore his world (and send the modern one crashing around everyone's ears), he wants the Inquisitor to prove him wrong.  Even "I hate you" Solas has a moment when confronted where you can see it on his face, he wants you to prove him wrong. Of course, I've not played Trespasser yet, I and I can't antagonize him enough to reach that point, so I had to see it online, but even the clip I saw showed his remorse/regret if only for a moment.  Then a distancing for himself as in that version he says 'it might' not that 'it will' destroy the current world.  He still wants be talked out of it, but the inquisitor in question wouldn't even listen/talk to him.

 

I don't hate him or want him dead, I'd like the chance to redeem him and turn him from his path, show him another way.  But if push came to shove, and the only option to change his mind involves a few not so gentle raps to the noggin, I'll go that path too.

[Nixou]

Mmhm. The inquisitor is like a nug. Hoping around the place and cleaning up scum. See? I can make nonsensical comparisons too!

 

Of course he is! That's where Leliana got the idea of weaponizing her nugs in the first place

[dragondreamer]

That's not nonsensical.

The Killer in DA2 lost his wife and he can't deal with it.

Solas lost his empire and people and he can't deal with it.

Instead of mourning and letting go , they both decided well I'm now going to kill people to bring back what was lost.

In both cases the killing is just a necessary evil to get what they want , because what they want is all that matters.

 

It doesn't really fit, because he's actually losing the people closest to him to fix his mistake.  He actually won't allow himself to be selfish.  He's willing to let his friends and his lover die.  Felassan, who is heavily implied to be an ancient elf, and therefore one of Solas' oldest friends is sacrificed.  Mythal, who was clearly someone very important to Solas, is also sacrificed.  He's still trying to save his people, but he's unwilling to let go of his own guilt and seek alternatives.  Maybe he honestly believes there is no other way to change things.  He doesn't really excuse his actions either, he knows he'll have to become a monster.  He repeatedly tries to push Lavellan away for this very reason.  It isn't right, but he's more complex than him simply being crazy or sociopathic.

[NoForgiveness]

That's not nonsensical.
The Killer in DA2 lost his wife and he can't deal with it.
Solas lost his empire and people and he can't deal with it.
Instead of mourning and letting go , they both decided well I'm now going to kill people to bring back what was lost.
In both cases the killing is just a necessary evil to get what they want , because what they want is all that matters.

No that guy is bringing a dead person back with literal pieces of other dead people. I mean, he's thinking that pieces of meat in the shape of his wife will literally be his wife.

What Solas is trying to do is more like mercy killing. The people of the world have devolved. They've become wrong.

Just because they both want something they lost doesn't mean they're at all alike.

[Boost32]

They are both insane muderers.

[Uirebhiril]

Solas hasn't murdered yet, at least no more so than the rest of the cast in the game. Whatever consequence of lifting the Veil to begin with was probably not known before he put it up, so we can leave that aside for now. If he can be stopped, or redeemed, or find another way to go about doing whatever he's doing that won't result in mass chaos and death, he won't be a murderer at all. He's just sitting in the "potential mass murderer" category at the moment. Horrifying to think of, but hey, without conflict you have no story. Someone's got to be the idiot/bad guy/person making some very poor choices for the next game.

 

That said, as someone who has had experience with a literal diagnosed psychopathic person in their extended family sphere, Solas does not in any way conform to that. Let us all be grateful. That s*it isn't funny.

[Boost32]

Ofc he has mudered someone and the Breach is his responsability.

Even if you redeem him, do you believe no one will die because of his action before his redemption?

[Reznore57]

Solas hasn't murdered yet, at least no more so than the rest of the cast in the game. Whatever consequence of lifting the Veil to begin with was probably not known before he put it up, so we can leave that aside for now. If he can be stopped, or redeemed, or find another way to go about doing whatever he's doing that won't result in mass chaos and death, he won't be a murderer at all. He's just sitting in the "potential mass murderer" category at the moment. Horrifying to think of, but hey, without conflict you have no story. Someone's got to be the idiot/bad guy/person making some very poor choices for the next game.

 

That said, as someone who has had experience with a literal diagnosed psychopathic person in their extended family sphere, Solas does not in any way conform to that. Let us all be grateful. That s*it isn't funny.

 

He's sort of responsible for the Boom at Haven.

He wanted his ball of doom to explode and was following Cory around , he was nearby spying when it happened.

He didn't do anything to stop , didn't warn anyone when he saw Cory going into a area with a huge gathering of people.

 

He deserves to be punished for this one.

[Uirebhiril]

He's sort of responsible for the Boom at Haven.

He wanted his ball of doom to explode and was following Cory around , he was nearby spying when it happened.

 

That's a fair enough point. Maybe he didn't realize it was going to go boom in quite that way with as much collateral damage, but one can argue he didn't see that it mattered at the time. Which... doesn't make it any better, of course.

 

I'm not inclined to "defend" Solas at all costs. He knows what he did, and knows what he will do. He's taking responsibility for it, and for as horrific as it is that's something he has to own up to whenever and however he does. Even he points out that he takes no pleasure in killing. The mooks you murder in the Emerald Graves or the Hinterlands had lives and loves too. They had families. Just because they were trying to stick a knife in your ribs doesn't take away from the horror of killing another person. They thought they were doing the right thing, or just trying to survive too. I'm just not going to try and box up a person and their motivations so I feel better about either loving or hating them. I'd rather take them as the whole of their character and appreciate them for what they add to the story.

 

But the trying to list Solas as a psychopath? Nah. Nowhere close.

[Cobra's_back]

Solas is quite rational, or at least appears to be, and is fully cognisant of what he is doing and what the likely consequences are. Having different priorities doesn't make him insane. 

 

That aside, killing someone for committing treason, especially when they have the potential to be an ongoing threat is a perfectly sensible action take in those circumstances.

 

Treason? Is Solas a GOD or a king? What happened to a justice system? Why is it treason to disagree with all knowing Solas? Solas the guy who complains about abuse of power?

 

Kinda having trouble with his claim of "humble free will " on one hand, and his dictator ruling on the other. Are there two people inside of Solas?

 

 

Solas rational? He hasn't proved it at all.

 

IF he installed the veil because the fake gods were going to destroy the world, then restoring the veil brings back the fake gods. What logical plan has he introduced to stop a repeat of history? 

 

He stated he had a plan. Is it better than the Cory plan?

 

He just looks like he is lying to himself which is a sign of crazy. I just love the part where he states he is NOT a monster. He is going to kill the inquisitor and destroy the world but wants the inquisitor to feel comfort before it happens. Mass murder = Monster to the people murdered.

 

 

So far there is no logic to his madness.

[actionhero112]

I see the Juvenile Deliquency.

 

He all but admitted to peeing magic when he was young.

[Qun00]

He is a highly functional sociopath.

[Drasanil]

Treason? Is Solas a GOD or a king? What happened to a justice system? Why is it treason to disagree with all knowing Solas? Solas the guy who complains about abuse of power?

 

Leader, Commander, General, head honcho. Point is he had a mission, Felassan signed up for it and then later betrayed the cause. That is treason. Given he was ultimately answerable to Solas on the matter, I see no problem with Solas adjudicating the matter. Solas was the appropriate judiciary, that you happen not like him or his goals and sympathised with the defendant is irrelevant. 

 

Kinda having trouble with his claim of "humble free will " on one hand, and his dictator ruling on the other. Are there two people inside of Solas?

 

You can have free will and choose to make bindings commitments which you would then be expected to follow through on. (Desertion is still a crime in volunteer armies.) How is this even hard to understand? 

[Asdrubael Vect]

Nope he and others just "play with toys" in a their toy world what is obey by every their wish and they can create or destroy everything because they can

 

All Thedas belong to Elgarnan, he's wish is a law