Funny that you admit to knowing absolutely nothing about the series or the women in it but have passed several paragraphs worth of judgements based solely on how the women look and dress. I thought passing judgement on women based on how they look was something we're not supposed to be doing. *shrug*
I believe zestalyn was judging fictional characters based on how they look, not actual women. Is that also something we're not supposed to do?
Only if you believe in practicing what you preach. Although I have no idea if she thinks it's not okay to judge women by their clothing. I could have been jumping the gun on that.
Character is being designed, they have no free will to decide what they wear.
I don't see the connection between the two types of judgement. We can judge Miranda's catsuit or Samara's dopey cleavage-bearing outfit, can't we? These aren't actual outfits worn by actual women, they're products of Bio's character design process, and surely we're allowed to judge that.
(Though I don't actually have much of a problem with the catsuit; the ass shots are another matter,)
I just see it as being a bit hypocritical to claim that women shouldn't be judged based on looks alone then turn around and judge female characters based on looks alone. I can understand judging the scenes, personality of the character, and even the clothes themselves but to render the character irrelevant, dismiss her, and express outright hatred (something I've read in other places) based on nothing other than her appearance is what I don't understand. Sounds too much like **** shaming and generalizing women. Something I notice is not done to male characters.
And yeah, I think Quiet's outfit is a mess, especially those tore up stockings. But I don't agree with using her as the definition of MGS female characters anymore than Isabella rendering women like Cassandra and Aveline moot.
But I can concede to the opinion that it's fine to judge fictional women and remember it when people call Cassandra a man or claim that how these fictional women are depicted somehow is a reflection on real women.
waiiiiiiiit so wait..this girl Quiet is forced to both wear a bikini and not talk? Lmao talk about the perfect female character
Scuse my ignorance, I truly don't know much about MGS. I always stayed cleared of it b/c the games first came out when i was really young, like bed time curfew young, and the only message I was imprinted with from whatever marketing it had back in the day was that it was clearly a sausage fest piece of entertainment given the amount of tasteless & unrealistic amount of cleavage that came with its image. And I grew up as a tomboy who was used to making compromises for "boyish" hobbies, and even then, I couldn't take those games seriously enough to ever be curious about it later on.
So charmed to see that it hasn't changed in that respect. Personally, it's silliness like that that sometimes make it a wee bit embarrassing to show a public interest in video games (atleast for me, since most of my friends/network are non-gamers, and female to boot) I'm of the opinion that it's poster children like Quiet that contribute to making this hobby seem like its designed for tasteless hopelessly sex-deprived perverted creepy basement dwellers and therefore induce lay people to crinkle their noses when they think of "gamers". MGS strikes me as the kind of game that can initially appear mature and contemporary with all of the grit it can throw in, but quickly comes off childishonce they shoehorn someone like Quiet in.
Rage on me all you want for talking down a popular franchise I know little about, I am sorry for that. But don't blame me for simply explaining the kind impression a game like MGS sends to me with their character "designs". That's what I'm talking about. Maybe link that together with the general scorn, mockery, & lack of appreciation the rest of society has for the gaming world and put two and two together. You don't need to be any sort of prude to have the opinion that some aesthetics have the feeble and primitive mark of a desperate 13 year old boy and are easy to make fun of and down upon.
You just proved my point. A female character being quiet and not polemic.....rare indeed. 
Interesting enough if said female character also has a good sense of humor in being able to recognize jokes (and not take them personally) when they are made, it would be indeed a first among female protagonists in gaming.
Seriously though I don't bother defending MGS5 from those who didn't even find a couple of hours to play the damn game and discover how the game actually IS. If you want to start a political debate sorry but I'm going to decline that
Funny that you admit to knowing absolutely nothing about the series or the women in it but have passed several paragraphs worth of judgements based solely on how the women look and dress. I thought passing judgement on women based on how they look was something we're not supposed to be doing. *shrug*
Quoted for truth. I sense a great hypocrisy here.
You're confusing the game's main plot with Kojima's message since the Wiseman's Council are the series main antagonsists while the underlying theme was about the perception history/information, and it's effect on the present.
Sure.
Which is anti-Semitic conspiracy theory garbage.
Which is anti-Semitic conspiracy theory garbage.
Anti-Semitic? LMAO....so you're telling me all the antagonist of MGS games were jewish? Please.....not liking a game is fine...pulling these excuses out of you ass is though ridiculous
I just see it as being a bit hypocritical to claim that women shouldn't be judged based on looks alone then turn around and judge female characters based on looks alone. I can understand judging the scenes, personality of the character, and even the clothes themselves but to render the character irrelevant, dismiss her, and express outright hatred (something I've read in other places) based on nothing other than her appearance is what I don't understand. Sounds too much like **** shaming and generalizing women. Something I notice is not done to male characters.
And yeah, I think Quiet's outfit is a mess, especially those tore up stockings. But I don't agree with using her as the definition of MGS female characters anymore than Isabella rendering women like Cassandra and Aveline moot.
But I can concede to the opinion that it's fine to judge fictional women and remember it when people call Cassandra a man or claim that how these fictional women are depicted somehow is a reflection on real women.
Actually, I'm inviting him into the conversation, if he wants in. I found his comment well-phrased and worth reading.
I very much appreciate the formal invite, but for the moment I will stick to lurking, I think.
Anti-Semitic? LMAO....so you're telling me all the antagonist of MGS games were jewish? Please.....not liking a game is fine...pulling these excuses out of you ass is though ridiculous
I... don't think that's what s/he was saying.
Funny that you admit to knowing absolutely nothing about the series or the women in it but have passed several paragraphs worth of judgements based solely on how the women look and dress. I thought passing judgement on women based on how they look was something we're not supposed to be doing. *shrug*
Please, its one thing to judge an individual woman for her personal choice in clothing, but another thing to judge how a dev group lead by a dude (and probably consists mostly of dudes) decides to present female characters in a way that look embarrassingly basic and fanservicey.
I'll concede if you show me that the ladies were created by a woman who actually believed in their designs from an artistic point of view. Otherwise, it's fair game for me to assume that a dev group designed these characters' looks with less realism in mind and more gratuitous sexualization ala Dead or Alive which ultimately further perpetuates some of the same ole bogus the gaming industry has always been guilty of.
Quoted for truth. I sense a great hypocrisy here.
What makes you people think judging what a free woman someone chooses to wear while walking down the street and judging what a man dresses a woman in for something commercial like a magazine cover or what have you are the same thing?
If people wanted to make fun of Mass Effect (which I love obviously) because chicks like Miranda or Jack look ridiculous from both an artistic and technical point of view, I'll hand it to 'em, whatever. First impressions are everything especially when it comes to commercial things, and silly gratuitous designs do no favors in advancing the gaming world's artistic maturity. That's all I have to say about this
Anti-Semitic? LMAO....so you're telling me all the antagonist of MGS games were jewish? Please.....not liking a game is fine...pulling these excuses out of you ass is though ridiculous
The Wiseman council is an old anti-semitic conspiracy theory about the Jews secretly running the world BS. The fact that Kojima put that crap in the game is at troubling.
When it comes to fictional characters, I just judge the artist.
That's fair.
Okay now MGSV is anti-Semitic.....yeah.
"The key is to strike a power chord between followers looking great and cosplay-able and player agency. Plans: I has them." -Mike Laidlaw
Spoiler
It´s okay tho, she´s a pirat.
The Wiseman council is an old anti-semitic conspiracy theory about the Jews secretly running the world BS. The fact that Kojima put that crap in the game is at troubling.
Pretty good. -2 points for visible panties, though. Seriously, girl, would it kill you to put on a thong?
Spoiler
Does Kojima actually bring in that they're Jews? Or is he just stealing the trope?
No, he doesn't say they're Jews, or even implies it. If anything, it's closer to a more inclusive Bilderberg Group (if it was as powerful as the conspiracy theorists would have us believe.)
It would certainly be interested to see exactly how Kojima would handle himself in the Mass Effect writing team and how he would cope with the limitations and the demands of the studio.
Huh, I don't recall any SJW pandering in the Mass Effect series. Care to elaborate?at least if kojima made an ME game it wouldnt be a panderfest for SJW's.
I wish he would work on Mass Effect, guy knows stuff
Huh, I don't recall any SJW pandering in the Mass Effect series. Care to elaborate?
Pandering = barebones inclusivity and/or mere acknowledgement.
The Wiseman council is an old anti-semitic conspiracy theory about the Jews secretly running the world BS. The fact that Kojima put that crap in the game is at troubling.
No it's not. That's just one of the Patriots' monikers that the in universe conspiracy theorists call them by. Seriously they're also referred to as the Illuminati too.
Huh, I don't recall any SJW pandering in the Mass Effect series. Care to elaborate?
Both gay romances in ME3, as well as making bi when he wasnt in the previous ones.
I dont have a problem with gay characters in games, Dorian was actually one of the better characters in DAI. Traynor at least had some character, but Cortez's entire character was "HEY LOOK AT ME I HAD A HUSBAND AND HES DEAD! DID I MENTION HE WAS MY HUSBAND?!?!?!?!" They were pandering to the LGBT community pretty hard.
Retour en haut
