337 réponses à ce sujet

[Estel Lavellan]

I can't see how Solas is bringing back a better world.  He wants to bring back a ridiculously decadent civilization ruled by tyrannical 'god' aholes that enslaved a large portion of their people.

 

Even if Lavellan or any other elf survived Solas' 'Veil-be-gone' extravaganza they'd just end up as slaves in this new world. 

 

...Have you seen what the Crossroads are like? The eluvians? Every example of old elven magic seen in the game? It's practically an ultra-civilized civilization where the limits of mortal ability are pushed to their furthest. And Solas being Solas, I don't believe he'll not have a plan to deal with the Evanuris when the veil's torn down.

[Uirebhiril]

No. Corypheus's future looks like Redcliffe. Solas's future looks like the Crossroads. Their goals might intersect a bit, but their visions are wildly different. With Corypheus, everyone but Corypheus loses. With Solas, the elves win, and Lavellan will also be a beneficiary.

 

He does say that for his people to rise, yours must die. Even to elf Inquisitors and romanced Lavellans. He might be talking as grim as he can about the situation, for whatever reason... but he's not specifically looking to help the modern elves if you go by that line alone.

 

My Lavellan will do her damndest to redeem him if she can, but I'm not going to diminish Solas as a character and antagonist by trying to defend what he's doing or what he looks like at this point in time. From where we stand now, he's nuts and has bad plans for the world, but ultimately I don't think the actual picture is so clear-cut. Nothing is black and white with Solas.

[Estel Lavellan]

I have a Lavellan who would join him in a heartbeat, even if it means she dies.  She both hates shem and loves Solas that much.

 

But the short answer is that it would be the end of the story.  Though I would have been amused if they had added that choice and then either flashed a GAME OVER screen or an apocalyptic one.

 

Well see my third point. By the time you get to make that choice, you're literally 5 minutes away from the game's conclusion. It doesn't even have to be a game over screen - just let it be the inquisitor's ending.

[Cobra's_back]

No. Corypheus's future looks like Redcliffe. Solas's future looks like the Crossroads. Their goals might intersect a bit, but their visions are wildly different. With Corypheus, everyone but Corypheus loses. With Solas, the elves win, and Lavellan will also be a beneficiary.

 

That is not what he said. He stated she dies. Modern Elves are not his people. Ancient Elves and spirits are his concern. He clearly states Lavellan will die.

[Estel Lavellan]

He does say that for his people to rise, yours must die. Even to elf Inquisitors and romanced Lavellans. He might be talking as grim as he can about the situation, for whatever reason... but he's not specifically looking to help the modern elves if you go by that line alone.

 

My Lavellan will do her damndest to redeem him if she can, but I'm not going to diminish Solas as a character and antagonist by trying to defend what he's doing or what he looks like at this point in time. From where we stand now, he's nuts and has bad plans for the world, but ultimately I don't think the actual picture is so clear-cut. Nothing is black and white with Solas.

 

I suspect the 'yours' refer to Southern Thedas, and not elves. Just like the 'your inquisition' leaving no choice on whether Lavellan truly considers the inquisition to be 'hers'.

[Wulfram]

No. Corypheus's future looks like Redcliffe. Solas's future looks like the Crossroads. Their goals might intersect a bit, but their visions are wildly different. With Corypheus, everyone but Corypheus loses. With Solas, the elves win, and Lavellan will also be a beneficiary.

The Crossroads are littered with Solas' victims, just as Redcliffe was littered with Corypheus'.

Redcliffe is not the future Corypheus seeks to build. Corypheus is still thwarted, he lacks the anchor. More, Corypheus sought to restore old Tevinter, just as Solas seeks to restore Elvhenan. Civilisations that are perhaps not so different, at least if the Dread Wolf's own account is to be trusted.

And Lavellan would be no beneficiary, nor any other modern, mortal elves.

[myahele]

He care more about the People than he does a love-struck shem that's less special than Sera (Andruil's vessel)

[Abyss108]

You can't join him, because he's going to kill you and everyone you love?

[Estel Lavellan]

That is not what he said. He stated she dies. Modern Elves are not his people. Ancient Elves and spirits are his concern. He clearly states Lavellan will die.

 

Please provide me with the relevant quote where he 'clearly states that the modern elves and Lavellan will die'. Plus if everyone dies, it's just going to be ridiculous - as far as we know the only elves who have been locked away are the Evanuris. To tear down the veil and kill everyone only for a bunch of villains to return makes no sense. And if everyone will die, then will new elves somehow be born from the void? The world restarts and suddenly elves (who'd come from nowhere) would have become the master race once again? I don't think so. If cutting elves from the Fade is what saps their immortality and makes their most advanced technology fail, then the most logical guess would be that the return of the Fade would simply return immortality and enable the elves to recreate their lost civilization again. 

[Cobra's_back]

I get what people mean by asking this question, and it's not just a "suicidal Lavellan" thing. Who here remembers being able to go all Dark Side in KotOR? Yeah, same thing. Some people want to see it, want to experience what the game will show that way. Just like people would complain that their Shepard couldn't join Cerberus. I mean, why the hell would you? But if that's how a particular character would roll, it's a fair thing to ask.

 

Meanwhile Solas doesn't even want to be doing what he appears to believe he should, so why would he bring anyone else along for that? He tells you as much. And if there's a chance to have the Inquisitor show up in another game to deal with Solas, either with redemption or force, they couldn't have the chance that any one in particular would run off with him.

 

I'm pretty sure the writer makes it clear that you are not one of them. Being a modern elf excludes you from god like qualities. 

 

Now if they change this, then the player should see the full extent of their actions like millions of women and children dying. They should also see all their friends die. If they survive, they need to be part of a Totalitarian civilization ruled by god like mages. Making it look rosy is not real.

[DuskWanderer]

Because even a Dalish Inquisitor is not people to Solas. Solas is basically the elven form of qunari, and you are bas regardless of your ears. 

[Estel Lavellan]

You can't join him, because he's going to kill you and everyone you love?

 

 

And must the inquisitor be a person necessarily concerned with her own life and the lives of a few significant others more than the restoration of her people? Last I checked, the Inquisitor could have been a person who sees the big picture. My Lavellan did sacrifice the chargers for an alliance, and there's again that canonical line? 'I would gladly give my life to restore the People. You know that.' 

[renfrees]

I suspect the 'yours' refer to Southern Thedas, and not elves. Just like the 'your inquisition' leaving no choice on whether Lavellan truly considers the inquisition to be 'hers'.

Or some people are willfully blind and hear only what they want to hear. I hate to break it to you, but in this particular regard Solas is similar to Anders - both won't place you above their goals. Whether a friend, rival or lover, if you have to die among all other people for his civilization to be reborn - that's unfortunate but neccessary for the greater good. Don't worry, he will remember you fondly.

[ModernAcademic]

My Dalish Inq hates what he is about to do and will try to stop him.

 

What right does an old creature who is a misfit in this new world have to decide the fate of millions?

 

 

Power entitles Solas to NOTHING. While he was asleep, he would gladly sacrifice the Dalish clans for the chance to restore the Ancient Elven Empire. The very fact that he had ZERO care for Thedas and risked letting a Magister take possession of his orb in order to destroy the world already infuriates my Inq to no end.

 

He knows next to nothing about the woes and troubles of modern day elves. He doesn't care about the fate of other races. He despises those who sacrifice everything -their health, their lives - to have a chance to save millions, even if their solution is less than perfect (the Wardens). He treats Dalish culture as trash, caring nothing for as to how the People managed to survive all those millenia being trodden on, without guidance.

 

He is condescending, self-serving and arrogant.

 

His attitude toward Varric and Sera, who turned their backs on tradition because it was outdated - dwarf and elven tradition only fomented hatred and prejudice amongst their own people, with their caste system and pressure to be a Paragon, to remember the old elven gods, to hate humans on principle and other crap - and embraced the chance to build a new future for themselves in their own terms is a screaming evidence of his indifference to the fate of the present day elves. And the rest of the many peoples of Thedas, for that matter.

 

What kind of leadership can a creature like that provide? For the Dalish? For ANYONE?

 

The Dalish are better off by themselves. My Inq believes the clans must learn about the truth concerning the Evanuris, unite under a banner and form a nation once again. Preferably in Ferelden, far away from the Magisters of the Imperium and the prejudiced aristocracy of the Empire.

[Estel Lavellan]

Alright, can anyone come forward with solid proof that a. Solas does not mean all elves when he speaks of 'Restoring the People' and b. Restoring the world will kill the inquisitor and all modern elves along with everyone else?

 

Also, why does everyone assume that when Solas speaks of 'ending your world', he speaks it literally? Like a kaboom that destroys the entire earth? Couldn't it simply be the collapse of civilization due to the Fade and the real world merging?

[Estel Lavellan]

What I found peculiar about that, is if you ask him why our people have to die, he says he can't tell you, then he mentions everything burning in the raw chaos. Interesting thing to note is, he is also surprised when we enter the raw Fade and survive. Either he thinks the Fade will kill everyone but those powerful enough to survive (even spirits are afraid Cole said), or what I fear it might actually be is, he is going to kill everyone himself except those like Abelas and start over like a frickin' Sims game.

 

Just because both terms use the world 'raw' doesn't mean raw chaos necessarily refers to the raw fade. I suspect 'raw chaos' refers to societal breakdown as a result of the Veil being lifted more than anything else.

[DuskWanderer]

Alright, can anyone come forward with solid proof that (a) Solas does not mean all elves when he speaks of 'Restoring the People' and ( Restoring the world will kill the inquisitor and all modern elves along with everyone else?

 

Also, why does everyone assume that when Solas speaks of 'ending your world', he speaks it literally? Like a kaboom that destroys the entire earth? Couldn't it simply be the collapse of civilization due to the Fade and the real world merging?

 

The Fade is shaped by intent, and Solas has greater command of it. He also literally says "In the ashes of your world." 

[Uirebhiril]

Please provide me with the relevant quote where he 'clearly states that the modern elves and Lavellan will die'. Plus if everyone dies, it's just going to be ridiculous - as far as we know the only elves who have been locked away are the Evanuris.

 

There are clearly still ancient elves in the world. Abelas, for example, and the sentinels in the temple. Solas even says there that his people yet linger. If Solas intends to do time travel magic, that's all a moot point anyway. If he intends to just move forward, there are still some "real" elves around.

[Qun00]

People say this about every single villain in every single game and it isn't always a good idea. Like this one.

No amount of dedication to being elfy will change Solas' mind. Only the ancient elves qualify as his people.

Those elves going after him in the epilogue? He'll tell them to go back the way they came, at best.

[myahele]

Whether he like of hates you Solas says that the Inquisitor disappearing now would lead to chaos in the world. 

 

Solas want as much peace in the world before he destroys it

[Abyss108]

And must the inquisitor be a person necessarily concerned with her own life and the lives of a few significant others more than the restoration of her people? Last I checked, the Inquisitor could have been a person who sees the big picture. My Lavellan did sacrifice the chargers for an alliance, and there's again that canonical line? 'I would gladly give my life to restore the People. You know that.' 

 

Fair enough! 

 

Btw, Where's that line said? I don't remember hearing it...

[Estel Lavellan]

My Dalish Inq hates what he is about to do and will try to stop him.

 

What right does an old creature who is a misfit in this new world have to decide the fate of millions?

 

 

Power entitles Solas to NOTHING. While he was asleep, he would gladly sacrifice the Dalish clans for the chance to restore the Ancient Elven Empire. The very fact that he had ZERO care for Thedas and risked letting a Magister take possession of his orb in order to destroy the world already infuriates my Inq to no end.

 

He knows next to nothing about the woes and troubles of modern day elves. He doesn't care about the fate of other races. He despises those who sacrifice everything -their health, their lives - to have a chance to save millions, even if their solution is less than perfect (the Wardens). He treats Dalish culture as trash, caring nothing for as to how the People managed to survive all those millenia being trodden on, without guidance.

 

He is condescending, self-serving and arrogant.

 

His attittude toward Varric and Sera, who turned their backs on tradition because it was outdated - dwarf and elven tradition only fomented hatred and prejudice amongst their own people, with their caste system and pressure to be a Paragon, to remember the old elven gods, to hate humans on principle and other crap - and embraced the chance to build a new future for themselves in their own terms is a screaming evidence of his indifference to the fate of the present day elves. And the rest of the many peoples of Thedas, for that matter.

 

What kind of leadership can a creature like that provide? For the Dalish? For ANYONE?

 

The Dalish are better off by themselves. My Inq believes the clans must learn about the truth concerning the Evanuris, unite under a banner and form a nation once again. Preferably in Ferelden, far away from the Magisters of the Imperium and the prejudiced aristocracy of the Empire.

 

 

First, if you'd listened to the Dalish clans prattle on about their lost civilization, it's clear that the highest objective of the Dalish is to restore what was, not to take what scraps they have and create a broken nation based on historical breadcrumbs. The defining aspect of the Dalish is that they're not remnants of a lost civilization that only wants to settle into a peaceful life; they're essentially elf-cults dedicated above all others to picking up the pieces of lost elven civilization. So your vision is actually invalid for any Dalish clan.

 

Secondly, do you not hear Solas saying that the works of the ancient elven empire is intrinsically tied to the Fade? That means without the Fade's return, the Dalish could not recreate their empire even with all the knowledge in this world, because they're physically diminished, physically unable to harness the advancements of the elven civilization. Even if the Dalish forms an empire and conquers all of Thedas, they'll still just be a better-informed, more powerful Dalish clan, and not Elvehnan. They want Elvehnan.

 

And as for your comments regarding Solas...well, I suppose your inquisitor thinks as your inquisitor does. But you did not make a point by ranting on how you feel about Solas.

[Qun00]

And must the inquisitor be a person necessarily concerned with her own life and the lives of a few significant others more than the restoration of her people? Last I checked, the Inquisitor could have been a person who sees the big picture. My Lavellan did sacrifice the chargers for an alliance, and there's again that canonical line? 'I would gladly give my life to restore the People. You know that.'

Heh, "just a few".