218 réponses à ce sujet

[KainD]

So if someone wants to play as their own gender is sexist? 

I guess those "80%" of men who played male are sexist too.

 

Wants to? Not really. Plays only exclussively - might be yah.

[Majestic Jazz]

Male / female gamer ratio doesn't automatically decide the ratiot of male / female characters played though. I am a male gamer and I play female characters 90% of the time.

And I am a male that plays with female characters. In fact, my first character in MEA will be female.

I just dont see why people make a big deal out of this. Will Fallout 4 suffer cause they are using a male in the marketing? Did GTA5 suffer cause all 3 main characters were male? Will Final Fantasy 15 suffer cause the 4 main guys are......guys? Will Halo 5 suffer?

[KainD]

And I am a male that plays with female characters. In fact, my first character in MEA will be female.

I just dont see why people make a big deal out of this. Will Fallout 4 suffer cause they are using a male in the marketing? Did GTA5 suffer cause all 3 main characters were male? Will Final Fantasy 15 suffer cause the 4 main guys are......guys? Will Halo 5 suffer?

 

Why does God allow so much suffering.. I mean no, not really, but diversity is cool. 

[liclic]

In both DA and ME universes, I usually play either gender almost half / half.... more male than female but still... Having trailers in both genders, then yields but otherwise, it doens't mind me. I'm just sad that in this new ME you will still play a human, I would rather have to play a character whose race has no real gender like Asari. At least the case of gender would be irrelevant...

[AlanC9]

>Women are half the total population of the world
>Says they're less represented

ye wat, mate?

Unless I read that wrong.

What does representation have to do with actual percentages of people?

[pdusen]

I have a hard time understanding why anyone cares at all one way or the other what appears in trailers. The trailer could consist of a cast of giant purple lizards and I still wouldn't care.

[KaiserShep]

Why does God allow so much suffering.. I mean no, not really, but diversity is cool.

If you were God, wouldn't you allow suffering? TV can't compete with good interactive media.

[agentdalecooper]

If women weren't interested because they couldn't play as a woman in the game, then those women are sexist. 

 

Yes, those women are sexist because they don't want to play as Troy Baker Protagonist #473.

[CronoDragoon]

However, a male still is the one being marketed on the box art. I expect MEA to be similar.

that's an old pic
 

[o Ventus]

Yes, those women are sexist because they don't want to play as Troy Baker Protagonist #473.

 

I guess if you ignore what that post says, I can see how you would come to that conclusion, yes.

[Panda]

"Alienate"

 

Please. If somebody is really so fickle that they would NOT buy the game just based on the lack of a female protagonist in the trailers, then that's their problem, not Bioware's, EA's, or anyone else's. That is the epitome of first world problems. Bioware isn't alienating anyone by having the male protagonist in their trailers. Anyone who is enough of a crybaby to leave wasn't a fan to begin with.

 

Yes, yes, people aren't allowed to feel what they feel and so on. The bottomline is that when it's clear that you aren't target demoraphic it can be alienating.

[Battlebloodmage]

I feel like the OP posted intentional flame bait threads to rile people up, considering he also made a thread about little to no pandering and if they want to pander, then don't pander to PC crowd and pander to the majority of playerbase. Another thread about sales of DAI and mocking it.

 

I feel like people taking this thread too serious for the purpose behind it.

[Lady Nuggins]

If women weren't interested because they couldn't play as a woman in the game, then those women are sexist. 

 

Nah, the vast majority of female gamers can and do play male characters. You have to, if you don't want to be limited in your options.

 

But since far fewer games do offer female protagonists as an option, female players do deliberately seek out games that will give them that option. When you're usually forced to play as another gender, it's not sexist to desire the option to play as your gender where you can find it.

[o Ventus]

Yes, yes, people aren't allowed to feel what they feel and so on. The bottomline is that when it's clear that you aren't target demoraphic it can be alienating.

 

Maybe I should just resort to putting words in peoples' mouths instead of actually responding to their points, so I can misrepresent what they say and make another point entirely.

 

Nobody said that people are not allowed to feel however they feel. I don't particularly care how they feel, how they feel doesn't affect me. I just think that it's sad and whiny to feel *alienated* by a lack of a specific type of marketing. Because that is sad and whiny.

 

Nah, the vast majority of female gamers can and do play male characters. You have to, if you don't want to be limited in your options.

 

But since far fewer games do offer female protagonists as an option, female players do deliberately seek out games that will give them that option. When you're usually forced to play as another gender, it's not sexist to desire the option to play as your gender where you can find it.

 

You do presume to speak for a rather large group of people, don't you? Saying that women gamers deliberately seek out games that give them gender options is vague and meaningless to the point of being a non sequitur, on top of being an assertion that cannot be proven. 

 

"Female players do deliberately seek out games that will give them that option."

 

Okay then, what about the female players who simply don't care and want to play a well designed game? Or do they not count because they don't fit the narrative?

 

Your post also has little or nothing at all to do with the post you responded to.

 

If women weren't interested because they couldn't play as a woman in the game, then those women are sexist.

 

Is a statement made in the context of marketing, not of the game itself. Nobody said anything about a woman playing the game and not having the option to play as a woman. He said that a woman who loses interest in a game because of said inability is sexist. And she would be. In no rational human being's head would a gender-locked protagonist be a negative when it's something that is not and never will be a core defining gameplay feature. Being male is not a character flaw.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I believe Bioware said in a tweet or something that when it is time to show the protagonist, they will show both male and female.

[Xaijin]

What does representation have to do with actual percentages of people?

Because as you yourself love to point out on BW's behalf, they're wasting all those monetary resources on as you call it, "a marginal feature".

[Massa FX]

I'm a woman that will solely play the female protagonist. It's why I love BW games. 

 

It'd be a nice thing if BW had equal representation of the female PC, but for me... it's not necessary. I realize that trailers are not cheap, and I'd rather they spend money paying talented developers to make a phenomenal single player experience for my female player character.

[AlanC9]

Because as you yourself love to point out on BW's behalf, they're wasting all those monetary resources on as you call it, "a marginal feature".

Sure, but that just means that representation might not be worth it, financially. Which is OK if you can actually make that case.

Doesn't have much to do with whether or not women actually are being represented.

[Panda]

Why people who claim not to care have such strong negative reaction about trailers including female protagonist?

[Pasquale1234]

That's called "laziness." If you're actually interested, you would, at least, take some time to research on the product and on the company's products.

As a typical consumer, I see hundreds (if not thousands) of marketing messages on a weekly basis. The vast majority are instantly ignored. In order for me to be willing to do any further research to see if a product might be worth a purchase, the initial message needs to do something to attract my attention, and make me care enough about it to make the effort.

I'm not keen on playing a set protag, so a game with a CC that allows me to play a female character is a lot more likely to make it to the short list. Yeah, I know, I might miss a lot of great games - but I don't have time to play them all, anyway.

There have been several times I've wondered whether a game had a particular feature, and was unable to find out from the marketing literature. They tend to be much more focused on hype or trying to set some hook than actually telling potential consumers what sorts of features to expect.

[Former_Fiend]

The problem with video game marketing is they tend to model it off of marketing for movies, when the two media are very, inherently different- one being a purely linear, non-interactive narrative visual experience and the other being an interactive, potentially non-linear experience.

[AlanC9]

What would good game marketing look like?

[Panda]

What would good game marketing look like?

 

Trailer-wise or whole marketing?

 

Trailer-wise showing what the game is about, give some idea how we are going to play the game (even if it's not gameplay trailer) and who our protagonist is. Trailer is supposed to make people interested of the game and I think overall trailers of games with set protagonist do this quite well, but somehow games with non-set protagonist still seem to like make trailers look like game has set protagonist even if it doesn't which is confusing and then you have to do research yourself to find out who are you playing as. To me if player has to do own research of the game's major features then the marketing has already failed.

 

It's just that games with set protagonist are very different from those who don't have set protagonist. Set protagonist is someone's elses character, character that you might not like at all or might love more than your own creations, but overall character you can't change. When games with non-set protagonist allows you to truly roleplay, to either play as yourself or make your own character just like you want it. Since the difference is big it should be shown.

 

What becomes to different genders, well I think it would be best to show both in trailers and gameplay. Fallout 4 did somewhat poorly on this based on E3 presentation, although it was long and full of interesting stuff, I have still no idea on how the female character moves, talks and looks like with armors on. All we got about female character was brief, maybe 30 sec long CC clip so I'm not sure even how female character I'd made would even look. It seems like I have to wait for players youtube videos until I'll see how female character actually is in the game.

 

EDIT: I seem to be bit exeggerating in Fallout's favor.. the whole press conference in E3 was 30 min long and 10 sec on it was about female protagonist. Female protagonist didn't appear in the actual trailer.

[Seboist]

This point every time - who cares how many people use a particular option, the more options the better. 

 

Options cost money, money which, would've been better spent on tangible assets like maps, more enemies,etc, than being wasted on creating the female clone of the same moron that compares the genophage to the first contact war that only a vocal minority of players uses.

[Lonely Heart Poet]

I almost never touched the Mass Effect series because of the games front cover and the information in the boxes. I was absolutely more curious about the Dragon Age and the Elder Scroll series, because:

- There was no white guy holding a gun with a sexy female. There was simply, something else.

How wrong I was about the Mass Effect series in those times. My (female) friend still bought the third game and I became curious when she was making her first female space lady. Sometimes, just sometimes, you need a little familiar kick.

I was in such an awe when I started to search information about this series from the mighty interweb. I started the series from the beginning and was pleased.
I had expected Mass Effect games to be a shooter game once again. Trailer of the first Mass Effect didn't help me neither. How wrong I was.
HOW WRONG I WAS. Mass Effect trilogy is the best thing in gaming for me. But the trailers and the covers did not give a hint how sophisticated those games were. Without my friend I would still play Fable goddamit.

It is no surprise that female players still all over the world continue to play city building games. The marketing is usually bad, very bad. I love the GTA games also, I loved to blay as CJ in the GTA:SA. Damn those games are smartly written, I love them, but I still miss even a one playable female character. She can be crazy, have a ****** in her brain or whatever - the male characters are also very unstable - but give us a chance. Those new Final Fantasies with a leading female character gave me hope before I tried to play the games...

A fair chance. A good marketing campaign that not only shows that there is a possibility to play both genders but also gives a good look what the game is really about. In Mass Effect series the focus in marketing was in the male Shepard and that is the biggest reasons why girls are still missing the greatest game gem of all times.