58 réponses à ce sujet

[ArianaGBSA]

So we know that Solas want to bring down the veil.  And doing so will destroy the current world.  BUT after that will the other races be able to survive?  Or will it just be the elves that Solas keeps around?

Hope only immortal magic elves survive no point in changing the world if not for better. I'm pro Solas because I believe that with magic and no tyrants world will be better for all the new generations, so it is ok to sacrifice one generation of poverty and slavery in favor of a wonderful magic world without poverty and slavery forever.

[Almostfaceman]

Hope only immortal magic elves survive no point in changing the world if not for better. I'm pro Solas because I believe that with magic and no tyrants world will be better for all the new generations, so it is ok to sacrifice one generation of poverty and slavery in favor of a wonderful magic world without poverty and slavery forever.

 

I'm pro dropping of the Veil, but only if a way could be found to do so with much less in the way of casualties. 

 

Pre-Veil, there were tyrants and slavery so no, the world is still a flawed place. There will always be booger-heads to fight even with the world of Thedas returned to its natural state. 

[azarhal]

Is there anyone in Thedas whose plans go as intended?

 

Does Cassandra count? In the first conversation you can have with her in Haven (near the trainees) you can ask what the plan is and she says (paraphrasing):  deal with the Chantry, fix the breach, find persons responsible and deal with them.

 

That's the game main storyline...

[ArianaGBSA]

I'm pro dropping of the Veil, but only if a way could be found to do so with much less in the way of casualties. 

 

Pre-Veil, there were tyrants and slavery so no, the world is still a flawed place. There will always be booger-heads to fight even with the world of Thedas returned to its natural state. 

Yes and no. Problems will still exist but I was refering specifically to the Evanuris, the "gods", uber powered tyrants. Normal tyrants like those we have in Thedas in Dragon Age that can't fight Titans or create floating islands are ok people can just fight them and stuff.

[Yaroub]

Stop gettin' mein hopes up, m8.

 

Fair enough...but still could happen, it's the rational response, no?

[Ilwerin]

I think that so many people will die just because they will not be able to understand and grasp the new world without the Veil. And they will simply go insane when their unchanging, solid world become everchanging, where memory or feeling has the same "physical value" as tree or building. As Solas saw this world like full of tranquils after his slumber, the very opposite could destroy minds of modern people, especially non mages (and dwarves?). That will create chaos. 

After all - the same effect had the Breach on spirits while they were cast out of the Fade into "our" solid world.

 

What I find interesting is Solas´claim, that he is not a monster and wants people to die in comfort. Which could suggest, that their death will be very fast...

Thus he wants to stop qunari, probably free elven slaves in Tevinter (I would be very disappointed if he won´t try to free them while we have few years to the end of the world)... and of course - another Blight will not add to "comfort".

 

As for spirits and "demons". This should be interesting... I think tearing the Veil will have the same "madding" effect on them as well. As Cole said in Trespasser: "The spirits have fled, flying, fluttering, fast to the farthest Fade. They´re afraid of the Veil tearing again." So - we have not only modern people, we have also modern spirits, while the ancient ones could die similarly like those elvhen marvels tied to "both dimensions" were destroyed. Meaning - they don´t want to lose "their" world - Fade - as well and could join us - on some level - in our efforts to stop Solas.

 

The existence of human pre-Veil is interesting... but we have no evidence, have we? I think they came later..

And as for the dwarves, they could exist before - I haven´t played Descent yet, but this Cole´s line from Trespasser haunts my sleep is it about dwarves / titans? "They made bodies from the earth, and the earth was afraid. It fought back, but they made it forget." So my question - WHO made them - elves? As labor power in underground... And how earth fought back - blight?

[Gervaise]

The problem about backing Solas' horrific plan is that there is no guarantee that it will not end as it did before; with powerful mage tyrants ruling the world and speeding it to its destruction, which he claims is the reason the evanuris had to be stopped before.    Essentially what both worlds have shown, with and without the Veil, is that those who are the strongest and most powerful tend to end up lording over those who are not so powerful, spirits included.

 

Tevinter is a wonderful case in point since they demonstrate that after the fall of the elven tyrants, another mage empire emerged from its corpse, using what it could scavenge to advance its own agenda.     The way to make a better world is to try and change people's thinking rather than simply the magical environment.  Strangely enough, if the teaching outlined in the Chant is genuine, then that is what Andraste was trying to do:

 

"Magic was made to serve man, never to rule over him.  Foul and corrupt are they who have taken his gift and used it against his children........Those who bring harm without provocation to the least of His children are hated and accursed by the Maker," etc.   Sadly those who claim to follow the Chant only pay lip service to these ideals.

 

There is an interesting exchange in Asunder where Justinia is arguing with Lord Seeker Lambert about improving the lot of mages.   Lambert argues thus: "And what price would you have us pay for such idealism, Most Holy?"    Her reply: "Idealism is our stock-in-trade, Lambert.   A religion without ideals is tyranny."

 

This is the problem with Solas' plan.   Even if you could justify killing millions of innocent souls to put Thedas back the way it was (which I don't), it will mean nothing without some sort of leadership and moral framework to govern by.      I'm also rather worried by his rather vague assurance that he "has plans" to deal with the freed evanruis, when he admits that previously banishing them was the least worse option.

 

As for who will survive, well if it really does burn "in the fires of chaos" then I doubt anyone will be left standing, except spirits.   I have a nasty suspicion that this is actually part of Solas' solution.   Mind you, from Cole's words it would seem that the spirits aren't enthusiastic about the Veil coming down either.    The trouble is Solas' twin companions of "Wisdom" and "Purpose" have now been reduced to just purpose.   Mind you, apparently wisdom was present when he had his original idea of giving his orb to Corypheus, so it would seem that "Purpose" has always had the dominant role in this thinking.

[Dai Grepher]

I think Solas was just implying that bringing down the Veil will cause reality to become like the Crossroads or outright like the Fade, where thought shapes reality. Obviously, civilization cannot function that way. Only those who are accustomed to the Fade will be able to "fly" when the world inevitably plummets into the abyss (as Flemeth put it). So he isn't saying the real world will cease to exist. He's saying it will cease to be real. It will become easily changed through thought, like it was in the ancient elvhen empire. As a result, the nations and kingdoms will not be able to hold together. It will be chaos.

 

Of course, Solas is forgetting that his plans always turn out like crap because of things he didn't plan on. For example. He's focused on the false gods of the elvhen... and he's forgetting all about the two (perhaps three) false gods of Tevinter that still exist, just aching for the chance to fly free in the Fade as they used to. They will definately screw up Solas' plans for rebuilding the empire. The old gods will likely save large groups of humans who appear able to survive in the new world, and they will teach them how to become strong enough to oppose the "evil" Dread Wolf who destroyed everything. Also the Forbidden Ones, especially Xebenkeck who has an axe to grind against the evanuris, will attack the new elvhen empire. Let's also not forget about the titans, one of which was disturbed when it was just the Breach that opened hundreds of miles away. There's also Mythal, whose motives are unclear at this point. And of course there's the fact that the elves can't even get along with each other. So yeah, Solas is in for the Maker's level of disappointment.

 

But don't worry, there is still one person who will rise up and stand against the chaos. One person who will save the world we know and stop Solas' plans dead in its tracks. And that person is...

 

Spoiler

The Hero of Ferelden.

 

Spoiler

Or the Orlesian Warden-Commander.

[Ilwerin]

But don't worry, there is still one person who will rise up and stand against the chaos. One person who will save the world we know and stop Solas' plans dead in its tracks. And that person is...

 

Spoiler

The Hero of Ferelden.

 

Spoiler

Or the Orlesian Warden-Commander.

 

I deeply hope, please...not him/her... and hope never dies

 

 

I have to go back to the existence of humans pre-Veil - I forgot one evidence, when Andruil "..grew tired of hunting mortal man and beasts..." So there have to be some... probably Avvar like humans.