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Should BioWare not reveal characters sexual orientation before release?


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#326
Fixers0

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YESSS and these "Afraid of teh gay" guys are so hypocritical; I mean I just played ME1 last night and out of nowhere Liara hits on me; Ashley's done it, too... it was so weird and made me uncomfortable. Gay toggle wouldn't have fixed that, would it?! :P

 

If you would have botherd to read the original quoted post, you would have known that the author actually suggested to have the players decide sexual orientation during character creation, he didn't anything mention about a "gay toggle".

 

Reading really isn't that hard.

 

Personally I don't mind having gay guys hitting on the protagonist so long as I have to option of responding with one of the following:

 

-Rejecting their advances with forcefull language.

-Staying silent and giving them a stare of disbelief and disgust.

-Ignore them but harshly push them out of the way as I walk past them.

 

The same goes for female characters who hit on my character of course. 


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#327
KaiserShep

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If you would have botherd to read the original quoted post, you would have know that the author actually suggested to have the players decide sexual orientation during character creation, he didn't anything mention about a "gay toggle".

 

Reading really isn't that hard.

 

There's no meaningful difference, because if it were to only remove dialogue that allowed you to flirt with a certain character, that'd be one thing, but it affects the behavior of the other characters. 



#328
Fixers0

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There's no meaningful difference, because if it were to only remove dialogue that allowed you to flirt with a certain character, that'd be one thing, but it affects the behavior of the other characters. 

 

Please clarify, mind you I'm not in favour of such an option, but I don't see locking away romances on the request of the player as unreasonable.



#329
Panda

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I don't think there is need for feature that locks out romances, cause it's so easy to avoid romances in the game. And I think everyone should be able to handle NPC having crush on them, it's unlikely that that will even happen, but if it does simply don't flirt back and you are free from romance content.



#330
ColorTheSky

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Personally I don't mind having gay guys hitting on the protagonist so long as I have to option of responding with one of the following:

 

-Rejecting their advances with forcefull language.

-Staying silent and giving them a stare of disbelief and disgust.

-Ignore them but harshly push them out of the way as I walk past them.

 

The same goes for female characters who hit on my character of course. 

Yeah right.


  • maia0407, TheHedgeKnight et Puddi III aiment ceci

#331
Vegeta 77

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I would like to know in advance who my options are so i can plan that out and not waste my time on someone who might not be availible to me.

 

But i would like bioware if they tell us who the options are to announce the same day who all the choices are or not at all did not like how it was done with DAI.


  • CuriousArtemis, BraveVesperia et Panda aiment ceci

#332
CuriousArtemis

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I would like to know in advance who my options are so i can plan that out and not waste my time on someone who might not be availible to me.

 

But i would like bioware if they tell us who the options are to announce the same day who all the choices are or not at all did not like how it was done with DAI.

 

Agree, that was really painful, not to mention the haphazard and offhand ways they did it... finding out Cass and Cullen were straight via some silly forum chat on another website really sucked. (Then having to wait month after month to see what options were left)



#333
Panda

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Agree, that was really painful, not to mention the haphazard and offhand ways they did it... finding out Cass and Cullen were straight via some silly forum chat on another website really sucked. (Then having to wait month after month to see what options were left)

 

I guess that's quite normal with BW, info is all over place, twitter, blog post, subforum post, reddit post.. At least you can depend on fellow BSNers to bring the information here though so you can't have to look all over for it.



#334
Puddi III

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Personally I don't mind having gay guys hitting on the protagonist so long as I have to option of responding with one of the following:
 
-Rejecting their advances with forcefull language.
-Staying silent and giving them a stare of disbelief and disgust.
-Ignore them but harshly push them out of the way as I walk past them.
 
The same goes for female characters who hit on my character of course.


If I were the dev you would only be able to turn them down by pinching their butt playfully by way of condolence.
  • vertigomez, Fredward, BraveVesperia et 1 autre aiment ceci

#335
KaiserShep

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Please clarify, mind you I'm not in favour of such an option, but I don't see locking away romances on the request of the player as unreasonable.


The problem is that it's meant to lock away specific romances. If it was full-spectrum romance on/off, then ok. It wouldn't make sense, but ok. But it's supposed to remove romances considered undesirable.

#336
Amirit

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The problem is that it's meant to lock away specific romances. If it was full-spectrum romance on/off, then ok. It wouldn't make sense, but ok. But it's supposed to remove romances considered undesirable.

 
Now I have to ask - why is it a bad thing if the player locks away romances he is not interested in? Not that that feature ever will be in game - it's impossible, just why would it be bad?


Agree, that was really painful, not to mention the haphazard and offhand ways they did it... finding out Cass and Cullen were straight via some silly forum chat on another website really sucked. (Then having to wait month after month to see what options were left)



To be honest I though it was fun. Yes, pain too - when you see someone you hoped to romance is not available, but I prefer it that way to one finding out already in game. I had time to adjust and get used to idea.

#337
LinksOcarina

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All I know is, at this point if there are no homosexual romances people will be pissed. It's almost expected of BioWare now.



#338
LightningSamus

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You can avoid the information on their orientation but you have to stay away from anything Mass Effect related on the internet.

I never knew about Cortez and Traynor being same sex romances until i played ME3.

I did choose to check the DA: I romances and it doesn't bother me.

I don't judge based on race or sexuality so for me, i think it is alright to reveal.

Also the people who are so concerned will know who to avoid, i remember a guy on who i deleted from my friends list because of this in DA: O he ended up romancing Zevran and he complained.

I told him it was his own fault for flirting with him and then he got all homophobic and started preaching his religion so i deleted him.

So not revealing sexual orientation can also have people getting upset.

Those that judge a character only for their sexuality are just bigots so it won't matter to them.
  • Suketchi aime ceci

#339
LinksOcarina

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So something else I just thought of.

 

What happens if there is no homosexual romance? Would people be upset by this? 



#340
Fredward

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So something else I just thought of.

 

What happens if there is no homosexual romance? Would people be upset by this? 

 

Assuming they kept straight romances? Yes I'd be somewhat salty.


  • daveliam, Dirthamen, LiaraShepard et 1 autre aiment ceci

#341
Panda

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So something else I just thought of.

 

What happens if there is no homosexual romance? Would people be upset by this? 

 

What happens if there is no heterosexual romance?  Would people be upset by this?

 

Answer for both is yes.


  • daveliam et GGGenesis aiment ceci

#342
BraveVesperia

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Yeah, these. Especially if you're playing a character who's likely to get very few choices, if any (i.e. gay or lesbian), AND if you value romance in your game, if it's a big part of why you play, then it's helpful to those folks to know beforehand.

 

It's easy to say "I don't want to know" when going into the game pretty much every single romance you're interested in (with the exception of one gay or lesbian romance) is available to you.

Definitely! During my 'canon' femShep playthrough, I tried to romance Ashley in ME1, then Jack in ME2... then Ashley again in ME3. Apparently I never learn.  :P Even if they don't release them prior to the game, I'll be googling to find out who's available (hopefully spoiler-free). I don't want to miss out on a romance on my very first playthrough. It adds so much to the game and protag, imo.

 

I have high hopes that ME:A will go for something like the 2/2/2 approach though, so there should be multiple options this time.


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#343
daveliam

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All I know is, at this point if there are no homosexual romances people will be pissed. It's almost expected of BioWare now.

So something else I just thought of.

 

What happens if there is no homosexual romance? Would people be upset by this? 

 

I don't only expect homosexual romance options in Bioware games.  I expect them in any game that has romance options and allows you to customize a blank-slate PC.  I'm disappointed in games with romances with set PCs that don't include s/s options, but I understand why.  A set protagonist goes beyond the player's interests in many ways.  You are playing a pre-determined character and part of that could include the character's sexuality.  So, while I'm not a fan of those games, I understand why it happens.  But in games where you are creating a PC from scratch and being able to customize that character, I fully expect s/s options for romances.  It's silly to me to say that a PC can be any race, any gender, any class, etc, but they must be straight, particularly when there are romance options for both genders.  It's why I have never bought or played Bound by Flame.  I can completely customize my PC and there are multiple romance options of both genders, but the writers have decided that this one aspect of the character's identity is pre-determined.  No thank you.  Shame too, since it seemed like an enjoyable game otherwise.

 

So, on that note, yes I would be upset if they decided to go the "The PC can be whoever you want them to be.....provided that they are straight" approach again (like they did in BG2, KOTOR, ME1/2 (for males), and SWTOR).  If they are nixing romances altogether?  I'd be disappointed, but I'd deal with it.  If they decide that romances are in, but you have to be straight?  This will be the first Bioware game that I don't buy.  It was disappointing, but excusable 5-10 years ago.  Now, it's a deal breaker. 


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#344
Laughing_Man

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...It's why I have never bought or played Bound by Flame.

 

Trust me, you didn't miss anything.



#345
Shechinah

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...

 

I think they are trying to avoid this more in SWTOR since they've been adding options and I believe there is a chance that they'll introduce a non-heterosexual companion for "Knights of the Fallen Empire" especially since at least one confirmed companion is someone who were previously a bisexual non-companion romance, I think.



#346
GGGenesis

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Am gay. Don't care. When I got into DA:I and went in knowing who the gay options were I was, well, disappointed. Dorian seemed a little too dapper and in some ways the 'gay gentleman' trope and IB just made me roll my eyes. Until I played the darn game and found Dorian to be a pretty awesome character despite his surface level construction. Really, it wouldn't matter. It makes no difference either way.

 

Now what I DO have a problem with is how Kotaku and Polygon report on LGBT characters in upcoming games. I can just see the headlines of "We finally have a gay Garrus! Sing Bioware your praises!" which make me groan and bristle. There have been MANY LGBT characters in games for EONS, no one made a big fuss about it. It's great to see more of them sure and not have to speculate on coded gay characters like Sephiroth and trans or gender queer characters like Kuja, but I have issue with these 'game news' people acting like we only now have LGBT characters and we only now have female protags. No, we just have a wider medium to discuss games now. 

 

If anyone actually cares about sexuality in games, go look up gaygamer. I've helped write a thing or two so I may be biased, but overall, the flavour of queerness there is much less "YAY GAY CHARACTERS! LOOK AT HOW PROGRESSIVE GAMES ARE! TAKE THAT GAMERGATE!" and more "Woah, more hot dudes and dudettes who happen to be queer with complicated and interesting stories. Nice!". My biggest issue with releasing sexuality before the game is released is because I know how the reporting will go down and for the people who don't care/are on the fence about queer issues, it may turn them off rather than play a game that will make them more open minded. In fact, it might even bring out the anti-queer in them. Heck, if a gay person can get put off at the way Kotaku and Polygon word, structure and celebrate queer characters, imagine someone who doesn't care. While I understand they are trying to appeal to a minority audience, it feels almost click-baity and like it's capitalising on queer issues. It really detracts from what is important in a game when these 'journalists' turn queer issues into a PC movement. 

A good example is David Gaider saying in an interview with Polygon that Dorian is a guy who happens to be gay, but he's also a million other things which are just as important if not moreso and the unfortunate thing is is that despite that, Dorian will only be seen as just a gay character because he's gay even though a straight character won't be seen as just a straight character. So Polygon spend the entire article talking about Dorian's queerness and how queer characters are hard to write because they are queer completely missing what Gaider, a gay man, is actually saying. 

TL;DR, No might be the best option because game news media doesn't know what it's talking about when it comes to queer characters. 


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#347
General TSAR

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Don't reveal sexual orientation until the game drops. I want to witness the heartbreak.  ^_^

 

 

If you don't want to be flirted with, grin and bear it because it will happen.

As long as we have the option of telling them to ****** off. :)



#348
LinksOcarina

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I don't only expect homosexual romance options in Bioware games.  I expect them in any game that has romance options and allows you to customize a blank-slate PC.  I'm disappointed in games with romances with set PCs that don't include s/s options, but I understand why.  A set protagonist goes beyond the player's interests in many ways.  You are playing a pre-determined character and part of that could include the character's sexuality.  So, while I'm not a fan of those games, I understand why it happens.  But in games where you are creating a PC from scratch and being able to customize that character, I fully expect s/s options for romances.  It's silly to me to say that a PC can be any race, any gender, any class, etc, but they must be straight, particularly when there are romance options for both genders.  It's why I have never bought or played Bound by Flame.  I can completely customize my PC and there are multiple romance options of both genders, but the writers have decided that this one aspect of the character's identity is pre-determined.  No thank you.  Shame too, since it seemed like an enjoyable game otherwise.

 

So, on that note, yes I would be upset if they decided to go the "The PC can be whoever you want them to be.....provided that they are straight" approach again (like they did in BG2, KOTOR, ME1/2 (for males), and SWTOR).  If they are nixing romances altogether?  I'd be disappointed, but I'd deal with it.  If they decide that romances are in, but you have to be straight?  This will be the first Bioware game that I don't buy.  It was disappointing, but excusable 5-10 years ago.  Now, it's a deal breaker. 

 

So now a simple question then.

 

Does it make sense to have homosexual characters in every game if the script calls for it?

 

I remember when people complained about Dragon Age II for not having actual sexuality in the game, but instead making everything player centric; but now the problem with that is you need to be inclusive, and it can be dangerously close to tokenism if it's not done properly.

 

Inquisition did well with it, as did Mass Effect 3, but as time goes on that risk, and accusations to it, can increase and it can come off as contrived. That worries me even more. 



#349
Laughing_Man

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I think they are trying to avoid this more in SWTOR since they've been adding options and I believe there is a chance that they'll introduce a non-heterosexual companion for "Knights of the Fallen Empire" especially since at least one confirmed companion is someone who were previously a bisexual non-companion romance, I think.

 

Ah. If only SWTOR was a single player RPG.

 

Knights of the Fallen Empire looks interesting. Unfortunately not interesting enough for me to swallow with it the annoying MMO BS.



#350
General TSAR

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No wonder DG wants less romance.

For real? What a hero.