"Objective" and "universal" don't apply here, particularly universal. Cross-cultural interpretations of the ideal form of "beauty" differ wildly, both in modern terms and especially throughout the ages. There may be some small measure of universal constant, indeed, but it pales in comparison to the deviations.
I can't think of a single culture across all of human existence that didn't maintain base fundamentals like symmetry as an attractive trait.
People call women females and men males quite lot there, I included. It's not dehumanizing or anything else, it's just well words that fit? I personally find both words just gendered nouns and adjectives that are okay to use in english, I wouldn't really use them in my own language since I haven't seen them used like that, but it's something in english that I'm simply used of doing and it feels normal at least to me. There doesn't need to be any intentions behind word choice like that.
You have internalised the 15 cases. You are truly blessed.
I can't think of a single culture across all of human existence that didn't maintain base fundamentals like symmetry as an attractive trait.
Shhhh...we are on BSN.
Is it really that hard for people to understand that different people find different things attractive? Seriously, I thought that was common knowledge, sort of like how the sky is blue or that water is wet. And then of course there is the saying "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder." I'm really surprised right now. I see a lot of idiocy on this site, but this is a whole new level of ridiculous.
Is it really that hard for people to understand that different people find different things attractive? Seriously, I thought that was common knowledge, sort of like how the sky is blue or that water is wet. And then of course there is the saying "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder." I'm really surprised right now. I see a lot of idiocy on this site, but this is a whole new level of ridiculous.
So you believe there are no human universals when it comes to beauty or attraction?
So you believe there are no human universals when it comes to beauty or attraction?
Definitely no universals, since that is an all-encompassing word. There might be common elements, but even that doesn't get you very far when you consider how cultural standards of beauty are different in different places and have changed dramatically over time.
I'm not sure you read the first part of my post. Using men/male or women/female as adjectives is typically less (or not at all) degrading or dehumanizing, different than simply saying "males" or "females". For example, if I'm talking about gaming statistics, saying "male gamers make up such and such percentage" isn't the same as a sentence that says "males are jerks". One is a means of describing a general group of gamers, while the other is lumping people into a group based on their possible reproductive role with no indication on whether I mean male humans, male dogs, male koalas, etc. Generalizations can be used for good or ill, depending on what we're talking about. That's why my last sentence in the paragraph you quoted was about close reading and trying to understand what people are saying first. And yeah, using "males" and "females" instead of "men" and "women" (or any variation thereof) does gross me out, but I'm not going to get on someones case about it unless they're being disrespectful in other ways too. Context clues are great for that sort of thing.
Ahh, I'll apologize, I was tipsy and tired and it was 2am. I don't think I've ever said 'males' without being followed by 'of the species' in a term paper. I gotcha.
Interested. Why did he shout at her and did he have choices? The game is sounding better now that we kill scumbags. I'll buy if not disgusted.
Don't remember the specifics, but there were other choices. They may have been better. But generally Geralt is a good guy so I was a bit surprised at his reaction there.
Final Fantasy 14 released their info not too long ago and in Japan the male to female character ratio was even. In America there were way, way more males. And in Europe there were almost as many females as there were males in the US. If DA did something like this I bet the gender numbers would all be different.
Is it really that hard for people to understand that different people find different things attractive? Seriously, I thought that was common knowledge, sort of like how the sky is blue or that water is wet. And then of course there is the saying "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder." I'm really surprised right now. I see a lot of idiocy on this site, but this is a whole new level of ridiculous.
By that logic, there should be just as many straight males on the CDPR forums bitching about how Triss and Yenn are ugly.... attractiveness is relative, right?
...anyone care to check?
By that logic, there should be just as many straight males on the CDPR forums bitching about how Triss and Yenn are ugly.... attractiveness is relative, right?
...anyone care to check?
Those gosh dern males. Stay in your cages already!
... I thought we just had a post about why using terms like this is like borderline insulting.
Is it really that hard for people to understand that different people find different things attractive? Seriously, I thought that was common knowledge, sort of like how the sky is blue or that water is wet. And then of course there is the saying "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder." I'm really surprised right now. I see a lot of idiocy on this site, but this is a whole new level of ridiculous.
Not to mention that BioWare didn't set out to make the perfect and universally hawt sex-dolls but rather created characters and made them look like real people with real quirks. Cassandra is a lot more universally attractive than say Iron Bull, Solas, or Blackwall but hardly anyone complains about their looks and it's certainly nowhere near the level of hate that Cassandra gets for having short hair, an angular jaw, and being modestly dressed. Male characters are allowed to have their looks reflect their character and are allowed a great deal of variety. Female characters are so often crammed into the tiny box of sexy, hot, seductive, and model gorgeous. That's the reason I end up playing way more male characters than female ones even though I'm a woman in real life. I can't identify with being a gorgeous doll who's main value is being beautiful and sexy. BioWare games are way better in this regard than most, but it's still skewed.
I speculate you are female according to your posts. I'm sorry if I'm wrong. I just want to say there are many straight guys who find Cassandra attractive. So just speak for youself, don't speak for others by the name of science.Not according to science but hey, it's all about the feels. I like Cassandra but she is not an attractive woman by heterosexual male standards.
By that logic, there should be just as many straight males on the CDPR forums bitching about how Triss and Yenn are ugly.... attractiveness is relative, right?
...anyone care to check?
You missed my point, and I have yet another headache, so I'm not going to re-explain everything right now. Someone else can though, or you can try re-reading the last few pages more carefully.
Not to mention that BioWare didn't set out to make the perfect and universally hawt sex-dolls but rather created characters and made them look like real people with real quirks. Cassandra is a lot more universally attractive than say Iron Bull, Solas, or Blackwall but hardly anyone complains about their looks and it's certainly nowhere near the level of hate that Cassandra gets for having short hair, an angular jaw, and being modestly dressed. Male characters are allowed to have their looks reflect their character and are allowed a great deal of variety. Female characters are so often crammed into the tiny box of sexy, hot, seductive, and model gorgeous. That's the reason I end up playing way more male characters than female ones even though I'm a woman in real life. I can't identify with being a gorgeous doll who's main value is being beautiful and sexy. BioWare games are way better in this regard than most, but it's still skewed.
As for the first part, I couldn't agree more. It's a terrible double-standard. I have not seen one single person who likes male romance options and complained they were ugly in some way. Not one. Not even for Garrus 
And yet, people complain about Cassandra or even Josephine not fitting their arbitrary definitions of "feminine". I wasn't on the forums when DA2 came out, but did people complain this much about Merrill having short hair (which didn't look as nice as Cassandra's, in my opinion)?
For the second part, I agree, though I would never, ever play as a male if I didn't have to. I am really sick of our our characters (and NPCs) looking like the "ideal" men or women. It's not so bad for the males characters though, because their built bodies make sense. For females, if you're only going to make one body, make is realistic! Make it toned like the male body, not some supermodel. I hate it and to be honest, I find it insulting. I can't possibly identify with being a male character in these games, but I also don't want to constantly feel bad about myself when I'm looking at my female ones. In some ways I always will, because they're awesome characters, but I at least don't want to feel like I'm worth less because I don't look like some "perfect" woman that almost only exists in a virtual world. And I know I'm not the only one who feels that way.
Adding 3 different body types would help immensely in this regard, as well as for role-play value and for character and NPC diversity. It's jarring to see two Inquisitors with very unique faces atop the same supermodel body, especially when everyone had to wear the Skyhold outfit. And it's pretty odd to see a bunch of NPCs standing around with the same body too. So I think this would be a great investment. But either way, please Bioware, in the next game, go for realism instead of "cuz sexy". You do better than almost any studio out there, but you still have things to improve upon.
You missed my point, and I have yet another headache, so I'm not going to re-explain everything right now. Someone else can though, or you can try re-reading the last few pages more carefully.
As for the first part, I couldn't agree more. It's a terrible double-standard. I have not seen one single person who likes male romance options and complained they were ugly in some way. Not one. Not even for Garrus
For the second part, I agree, though I would never, ever play as a male if I didn't have to. I am really sick of our our characters (and NPCs) looking like the "ideal" men or women. It's not so bad for the males characters though, because they're built bodies make sense. For females, if you're only going to make one body, make is realistic! Make it toned like the male body, not some supermodel. I hate it and to be honest, I find it insulting. I can't possibly identify with being a male character in these games, but I also don't want to constantly feel bad about myself when I'm looking at my female ones. In some ways I always will, because they're awesome characters, but I at least don't want to feel like I'm worth less because I don't look like some "perfect" woman that almost only exists in a virtual world. And I know I'm not the only one who feels that way.
Adding a 3 different body types would help immensely in this regard, as well as for role-play value and for character and NPC diversity. It's jarring to see two Inquisitors with very unique faces atop the same supermodel body, especially when everyone had to wear the Skyhold outfit. And it's pretty odd to see a bunch of NPCs standing around with the same body too. So I think this would be a great investment. But either way, please Bioware, in the next game, go for realism instead of "cuz sexy". You do better than almost any studio out there, but you still have things to improve upon.
I agree about the female body, I don't understand why BioWare makes our male and female protagonist do the same activities, have the same role in combat, and yet the male is muscular and the female isn't even toned. Even the female Qunari are like an average retail or factory worker at best as far as muscles but the male Qunari are huge and beefy. The human and elf women have twig arms, no muscle definition and unusually large breasts (especially for the elf's extremely slender frame). That horrible broken spine "sexy sashay" female inquisitors run with is another reason I don't like playing with them. Society, game companies, and even other gamers (quite loudly on the BSN) tell you over and over that if you're not a gorgeous, perfect, demure, slender, sexy seductress then you're a man and I'm sure not any of the things I just listed so I identify more with a male character.
I agree about the female body, I don't understand why BioWare makes our male and female protagonist do the same activities, have the same role in combat, and yet the male is muscular and the female isn't even toned. Even the female Qunari are like an average retail or factory worker at best as far as muscles but the male Qunari are huge and beefy. The human and elf women have twig arms, no muscle definition and unusually large breasts (especially for the elf's extremely slender frame). That horrible broken spine "sexy sashay" female inquisitors run with is another reason I don't like playing with them. Society, game companies, and even other gamers (quite loudly on the BSN) tell you over and over that if you're not a gorgeous, perfect, demure, slender, sexy seductress then you're a man and I'm sure not any of the things I just listed so I identify more with a male character.
Yes, exactly! The bolded part is a great summary of my thoughts. I didn't notice the elves having large breasts though. In fact, I've mistaken male elven Inquisitors as female because you can see their breasts with the Skyhold outfit on
Another weird part about the body types is how drastically certain outfits actually change your body type. Sometimes your breasts will change, sometimes your arms, sometimes your waist and torso (though usually not your legs for whatever reason). Inquisitor Ameridan's armour looks pretty cool, but I just can't wear it. It makes my human Inquisitor look like a qunari with a human-sized head. It's really bizarre. Part of the reason (but not the only one) I wanted to wear armour most of the time was because I thought it made my Inquisitor look a lot more realistic. Less ridiculously curvy, bigger arms, etc. Oh, and don't get me started on the absolutely ridiculous and unrealistic hip-sway 
Seriously, that's not something inherent to females. No one does that unless they're trying really, really hard.
Edit: And Nefla, don't let stupid companies or media tell you who you should be, and don't let them tell you what you're worth. You're worth plenty 
Oh people definitely complained about the male LIs looks. (particularly Grandpa Blackwall, Small head Iron Bull and Nosferatu Solas. )
But it was nowhere near the amount of Cass/Josephine threads.
You missed my point, and I have yet another headache, so I'm not going to re-explain everything right now. Someone else can though, or you can try re-reading the last few pages more carefully.
"I don't have a counter to your statement" Gotcha.
That's fine, go back to dismissing other people aesthetic sensibilities while simultaneously asking Bioware to take your's into account.
Nuff said
Congratulations, you have contributed a total of nothing to the discussion. these statistics mean nothing outside of themselves.
And I am a male that mostly plays female characters. What does that mean?I'm a woman and play mostly male characters, what does that mean?
My first character is usually male (though not always), but most of my characters are female.
Heck, I think Bioware's own data showed that the majority don't even finish the game.
As it should be. Our stories don't necessarily end when theirs does.
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