162 réponses à ce sujet

[spinachdiaper]

There are too many FPS games today, in the next two months you have CoD BO3, Halo 5,  SW Battlefront, and next year DOOM. A Mass Effect FPS just wouldn't stand out for many who are into FPS games while also alienating established Mass Effect fans who want more RPG rather than a generic FPS in Mass Effect's clothing.

[Fidite Nemini]

Great news

 

Third-person, over the shoulder works best for Mass Effect. When something is working good why attempt to change or fix it?

 

Why aren't we still just walking? I mean, legs work perfectly fine for travelling, don't they?

 

Just because TP is how ME has always been so far, doesn't mean it's the one and only way to do it. The difference between FP and TP gameplay is a lot more significant than just perspective, so the developers assessment that it's expensive is true, they'd have to rework the entire combat gameplay, plus work out a different way to make the transitions between the cinematic dialogue appear fluently (or completely rework the dialogue presentation too).

 

Though I'd only agree with the risky assessment as far as that I don't know if BioWare has the experience to make those things work, because I don't see any reasons why an FP couldn't be a suitable basis for a game like Mass Effect compared to being TP.

 

More than any other aspect, I'd like to how a fps game could catch the interactive atmospere without playing every conversation like a railroaded cutscene (not that the latest ME game didn't already show that same tendency on occasions) and still maintaining an immersive experience in FP perspective.

Needlessly to say, the combat gameplay in FP could be very interesting with a different flavour than the usual cover-based staple ME has used so far (with there no looking over your shoulder from third person point of view and instead necessitating a direct line of sight it would change up gameplay significantly if it played to the strenghts of the first person view)!

[Cyonan]

Why aren't we still just walking? I mean, legs work perfectly fine for travelling, don't they?

 

Just because TPS is how ME has always been so far, doesn't mean it's the one and only way to do it. The difference between FPS and TPS gameplay is a lot more significant than just perspective, so the developers assessment that it's expensive is true, they'd have to rework the entire combat gameplay, plus work out a different way to make the transitions between the cinematic dialogue appear fluently (or completely rework the dialogue presentation too).

 

Though I'd only agree with the risky assessment as far as that I don't know if BioWare has the experience to make those things work, because I don't see any reasons why an FPS couldn't be a suitable basis for a game like Mass Effect compared to being TPS.

 

More than any other aspect, I'd like to how a fps game could catch the interactive atmospere without playing every conversation like a railroaded cutscene (not that the latest ME game didn't already show that same tendency on occasions) and still maintaining an immersive experience in FPS perspective.

Needlessly to say, the combat gameplay in FPS could be very interesting with a different flavour than the usual cover-based staple ME has used so far (with there no looking over your shoulder from third person point of view and instead necessitating a direct line of sight it would change up gameplay significantly if it played to the strenghts of the first person view)!

 

Comparing TPS vs FPS to vehicles vs walking feels like it's implying that FPS is overall the superior method, which is not true.

 

TPS and FPS are more like different flavours of ice cream. Mint ice cream works perfectly fine and while there is no reason that chocolate wouldn't work, there is also no real reason to take away the Mint flavour that drew people in and replace it with something new because both mint and TPS have their own upsides that the other does not have.

 

If BioWare wants to play around with FPS and the strengths it has, they should do so in a new IP. Not the next major installment of the franchise that has always used TPS combat.

[mickey111]

if mass effect went FPS how would squad commands work? The squad mates are already barely manageable in real time.

[dragonflight288]

I'm fine with the third-person shooter.

 

In my opinion, it works better for biotics and tech abilities than a FP would.

 

If ME was STRICTLY a shooter game, I think first-person wouldn't be that big a deal, but third person is what Bioware has excelled at for over a decade. 

 

If it ain't broke, don't fix it. 

[Sylvius the Mad]

Nnnnnnno, sorry, I don't see why it'd be risky to have it as an alternate firing mode.

Options are expensive.  Changes are risky.

 

They could add it as an additional feature - that would be expensive.

 

They could instead replace the third-person perspective - that would be risky.

[Sylvius the Mad]

As long as I can still activate powers (for myself and my squadmates) and aim while paused, it doesn't make much difference to me.

 

But I do generally prefer 3rd person.  I played FO3 and Skyrim primarily in 3rd person.

[Cyonan]

As long as I can still activate powers (for myself and my squadmates) and aim while paused, it doesn't make much difference to me.

 

But I do generally prefer 3rd person.  I played FO3 and Skyrim primarily in 3rd person.

 

If only Bethesda cared about 3rd person combat in their games, cause I'd probably rather play Skyrim like that.

 

but it's pretty clear from FO3/Skyrim that they put 10 times more effort into first person. Even the animations of 3rd person are just embarrassing for a AAA game.

[Sylvius the Mad]

If only Bethesda cared about 3rd person combat in their games, cause I'd probably rather play Skyrim like that.

 

but it's pretty clear from FO3/Skyrim that they put 10 times more effort into first person. Even the animations of 3rd person are just embarrassing for a AAA game.

it worked well in FO3 because of VATS.

 

Skyrim's lack of VATS significantly harms the game, I think, but the 3rd person only really made archery difficult.  The rest of combat was of combat didn't seem much different.

[AlanC9]

I've heard a substantial number of people prefer 3rd person for melee combat in Skyrim. Come to think of it, most players switched to 3rd person for Jedi Knight lightsaber battles.

[Killroy]

Who would the first-person shift be for? That huge demo of CoD and Battlefield players that are looking to jump ship to an inferior shooter? That other huge demo of sci-fi RPG shooter fans that just can't do third-person combat? 

[Examurai]

I could never play Skyrim or FO3 in third person. It didn't feel right but also the animations felt pretty clunky in comparison as well.

[Zekka]

I find that Bioware are more open about Dev costs than other developers that I follow. I wonder why.

 

 

 

I've heard a substantial number of people prefer 3rd person for melee combat in Skyrim. Come to think of it, most players switched to 3rd person for Jedi Knight lightsaber battles.

I've never heard this. I don't know anyone who thinks 3rd person in a Bethesda game is done well.

 

 

 

 

If only Bethesda cared about 3rd person combat in their games, cause I'd probably rather play Skyrim like that.

 

but it's pretty clear from FO3/Skyrim that they put 10 times more effort into first person. Even the animations of 3rd person are just embarrassing for a AAA game.

I still find it a problem that their first person mechanics still aren't done well after they've used it for decades.

[Cyonan]

it worked well in FO3 because of VATS.

 

Skyrim's lack of VATS significantly harms the game, I think, but the 3rd person only really made archery difficult.  The rest of combat was of combat didn't seem much different.

 

I wouldn't say it was any more difficult for me to play in 3rd person, it just didn't didn't feel right. Like it wasn't actually finished.

 

A pretty big part of it is that the 3rd person animations are just laughably bad for a AAA game.

[Sylvius the Mad]

I wouldn't say it was any more difficult for me to play in 3rd person, it just didn't didn't feel right. Like it wasn't actually finished.

 

A pretty big part of it is that the 3rd person animations are just laughably bad for a AAA game.

I care about the animations only insofar as they have gameplay relevance.  Beyond that they're just window dressing.

 

Like cutscenes, animation is filler.

 

I also reject the AAA designation.  If it's a meaningful label (which I don't concede), it appears to be based on criteria about which I am indifferent.

[Remix-General Aetius]

what's the difference? Isn't changing perspective just a simple matter of zooming the camera in or out? Why is this too difficult and expensive?

 

take the activator outta your hair and maybe you can learn something.

[Cyonan]

I care about the animations only insofar as they have gameplay relevance.  Beyond that they're just window dressing.

 

Like cutscenes, animation is filler.

 

I also reject the AAA designation.  If it's a meaningful label (which I don't concede), it appears to be based on criteria about which I am indifferent.

 

The only real thing AAA means is that it's got a higher budget and it probably costs more money, so I expect that it's going to have a higher production value over a $15-20 game because of that.

 

For me animation and sound play a pretty big part in the feel of combat being good. That's most of what I'm actually talking about when I mention gunplay in games like Mass Effect and Fallout. The guns should sound good and the animation should give off the impression of actually firing a proper weapon even if it's not 100% realistic.

 

Of course, even first person Skyrim wasn't amazing at animation work. The combat in that game doesn't feel that great in either perspective.

[Anacronian Stryx]

I kind of love it...people are suddenly upset about something they didn't want, or know they wanted, over semantics. I guess we need to wait longer for this idea to come about.

 

If you had First person view in the vehicles as well i would have played the hell out of this.

[Fidite Nemini]

Comparing TPS vs FPS to vehicles vs walking feels like it's implying that FPS is overall the superior method, which is not true.

 

TPS and FPS are more like different flavours of ice cream. Mint ice cream works perfectly fine and while there is no reason that chocolate wouldn't work, there is also no real reason to take away the Mint flavour that drew people in and replace it with something new because both mint and TPS have their own upsides that the other does not have.

 

If BioWare wants to play around with FPS and the strengths it has, they should do so in a new IP. Not the next major installment of the franchise that has always used TPS combat.

 

The walking analogy was said in response to the "why should we fix what's working" and the reason for that should be bleedingly obvious: to avoid stagnation.

 

I never, ever said that FP or TP were superiour/inferiour/whatever compared to each other.

 

And why exactly shouldn't BioWare attempt something new like using FP instead of TP in a new installment of the same franchise? What is TP for ME? Or do you expect the devs couldn't handle it right and you'd rather have them try it out on a game you wouldn't care about if it wasn't executed perfectly?

 

I'm really interested in your reasoning here, because TP is nothing integral to ME. What makes those games are the setting, the characters, the writing and the combat. Whichever perspective they use only directly effects the latter and it should go without saying that FP can make for great combat, it would simply be different from what we know from ME so far, which hardly is a bad thing if done correctly and the opposite idea that ME games should always be TP based is just a road to creative stagnation, bringing me full circle.

[KaiserShep]

There's nothing inherently special about FPS that would bring something new to players, other than it simply being new to the franchise. Besides, BioWare will never commit to a full first person perspective like CoD, where everything that happens is through the eyes of the character, rather than the outside view, like, say, Destiny, which zooms out into third person view often for abilities and even certain special weapons and for cut scenes. 

[maia0407]

Fallout 3 is an FPS and includes this thing called V.A.T.S., which is aim-assist.

I've played Fallout and really had a hard time with it despite VATs as I couldn't use VATs often enough to compensate for my injury. I had to bump the difficulty way down to get through the game. I'll still get FO4 though and play on the easiest setting. I really hate to put the game on casual (or whatever their version is, can't remember) as I like to feel like my character's upgrades and stuff are helping. Playing on easy takes away that feeling but, oh well, it's either that or not experience the game. I can play first person in Skyrim as the medieval weapons don't require the same sort of movements for accuracy that aggravate my thumb injury.  I can just run up and whack on a monster and be fine.

 

Despite my physical reason for having problems with first person, I still don't get the appeal. My understanding is that first person is supposed to make the story and environment feel more real to the player. For me, first person makes me feel disconnected from my character as I can't see her. I like watching my character in third person and rarely seeing my character distances me from her. First person also feels weird as there is no body awareness like there is in real life. Sometimes you might see your hands but you rarely see feet or your nose when you cross your eyes like you would in real life. It feels like I'm a body-less phantom running around the game doing stuff.

[Fidite Nemini]

There's nothing inherently special about FPS that would bring something new to players, other than it simply being new to the franchise. Besides, BioWare will never commit to a full first person perspective like CoD, where everything that happens is through the eyes of the character, rather than the outside view, like, say, Destiny, which zooms out into third person view often for abilities and even certain special weapons and for cut scenes. 

 

That's why I had been wondering how BioWare would try and handle the dialogue.

 

I disagree though that FP would bring nothing special to players. FP if handled correctly can be incredibly immersive with a game's atmosphere as you aren't a disconnected camera floating above your character and instead look directly through his/her eyes. For one, cou are closer to the earth in that perspective. That might not sound like something special, but that alone can be exploited to create an intense feeling of dimensions that level artists can play with which doesn't easily compare to panning around a camera.

 

We could probably go back and forth about the difficulties and possible benefits to having a ME FP that wouldn't be answered until we actually get a sample to really experience though.

[Kevinc62]

Didn't know this was a thing...

I prefer TPS, since I consider ME more of a RPG than shooter, and it'd be too expensive, which would left other aspects of the game lacking, so nah. I play ME and DA for story, not gameplay. Beside, there are TONS of excellent FPS, so this seems pointless. Beside I moslty just used biotics to kill things 

[Mummy22kids]

Despite my physical reason for having problems with first person, I still don't get the appeal. My understanding is that first person is supposed to make the story and environment feel more real to the player. For me, first person makes me feel disconnected from my character as I can't see her. I like watching my character in third person and rarely seeing my character distances me from her. First person also feels weird as there is no body awareness like there is in real life. Sometimes you might see your hands but you rarely see feet or your nose when you cross your eyes like you would in real life. It feels like I'm a body-less phantom running around the game doing stuff.

 

I have to agree with this.  I connect much better with a character I can see than one I can't.

[7twozero]

Couldn't hurt to make it a toggle setting or a mouse zoom thing like oblivion. Me3 already has it but you need to go into the console to toggle it. It'd just be something that you don't have to use if you don't want yet would make the game appeal to even more people, don't see how that's bad. Oh wait this is bsn, carry on then.