I'd have liked to have heard about Vivienne's relationship with her Knight Commander. Either they were Orlesian noble bffs or the KC was a trampled wet blanket.
I have a hard time imagining her alongside Meredith...
It is said that while Vivienne values the templars because they provide protection from dangerous magic, she views them as tools.
She is the First Enchanter of Montsmmard, so the Knight Commander of her Circle would be the same mentioned in Hawke's codex if he sided with the Mages. She seem a nice person.I'd have liked to have heard about Vivienne's relationship with her Knight Commander. Either they were Orlesian noble bffs or the KC was a trampled wet blanket.
I have a hard time imagining her alongside Meredith...
She is the First Enchanter of Montsmmard, so the Knight Commander of her Circle would be the same mentioned in Hawke's codex if he sided with the Mages. She seem a nice person.
Knight-Commander Marteu of Montsimmard. I'd have liked to have met her in-game.
I'd have liked to have heard about Vivienne's relationship with her Knight Commander. Either they were Orlesian noble bffs or the KC was a trampled wet blanket.
I have a hard time imagining her alongside Meredith...
I wouldn't. However, if Viv thought that Meredith was encroaching on *her* perogatives, I can assure you that the Seekers would have 'found' enough evidence against Meredith to oust her (real or not).
I wouldn't. However, if Viv thought that Meredith was encroaching on *her* perogatives, I can assure you that the Seekers would have 'found' enough evidence against Meredith to oust her (real or not).
Assuming Vivienne is allowed outside of the cell Meredith decides she belongs in.
We are talking about the Knight-Commander who had mages beaten for talking to civilians after all.
Assuming Vivienne is allowed outside of the cell Meredith decides she belongs in.
We are talking about the Knight-Commander who had mages beaten for talking to civilians after all.
Meredith was sensitive to politics and political connections (at least enough to handle Bethany with kid gloves and/or an apostate Hawke). Given Viv's political connections and skill at the "game", I doubt very much she would have been locked away.
Assuming Vivienne is allowed outside of the cell Meredith decides she belongs in.
We are talking about the Knight-Commander who had mages beaten for talking to civilians after all.
Only mages who had no political power.
It is said that while Vivienne values the templars because they provide protection from dangerous magic, she views them as tools.
Its true. When first talking with her, if you chose the dialogue that implies "its all the Templars fault" she actually approves.
I don't dislike Vivienne as a character, but if her awesomeness is only apparent in hindsight, then something is poorly executed in the game. I wish she had been shown to be as politically powerful as she kept telling us. As it is, her greatest value is her KE specialization. She has no Winter Palace extras, doesn't bring the Loyalist party's resources to the Inquisition, doesn't really seem to do much apart from receive letters that add war table missions.
I respect that she's able to ascend to Divine if she (via the player) plays her cards right, however unlikely it is for a mage to be elected at this point in Thedas' society. That was the only time in game I felt she demonstrated her much vaunted political prowess. And it's after the fact to the actual game.
Meredith was sensitive to politics and political connections (at least enough to handle Bethany with kid gloves and/or an apostate Hawke). Given Viv's political connections and skill at the "game", I doubt very much she would have been locked away.
Only mages who had no political power.
Had Vivienne been in Meredith's circle in Kirkwall, she would never had had any opportunities to gain political power.
Most of her power comes from her relationship with Bastien, and she was able to meet Bastien because her Circle in Montmissard allowed it.
Had Vivienne been in Meredith's circle in Kirkwall, she would never had had any opportunities to gain political power.
Most of her power comes from her relationship with Bastien, and she was able to meet Bastien because her Circle in Montmissard allowed it.
No doubt. But that just illustrates how frakked up Kirkwall was.
And no, if anything, her relationship with Bastien was a hindrance to both of them. It wasn't until Vivienne attached herself to Celene that she gained real power outside the Circle
The truth? She would be totes BFFs with Knight-commander Meredith.
Nah. Vivienne has no respect for heavy-handed judgmental types. Such is the realm of the crude and unimaginative. Meredith would get no more respect from her than Sera would.
Besides which, while they may share the belief that magic is dangerous, Vivienne's goal is to show that mages are not (outside of a few careless fools) She wants Circles to be strong and responsible, not meek and broken.
Nah. Vivienne has no respect for heavy-handed judgmental types. Such is the realm of the crude and unimaginative. Meredith would get no more respect from her than Sera would.
Besides which, while they may share the belief that magic is dangerous, Vivienne's goal is to show that mages are not (outside of a few careless fools) She wants Circles to be strong and responsible, not meek and broken.
Is it? She does flat out say that teaching people not to fear magic is impossible and that the sheep will always fear the wolf. Which is probably why she embraces the Madame der Fer persona. Dorian seems to more focused on teaching people not to fear magic if his interactions with Sera are anything to go by.
Is it? She does flat out say that teaching people not to fear magic is impossible and that the sheep will always fear the wolf. Which is probably why she embraces the Madame der Fer persona. Dorian seems to more focused on teaching people not to fear magic if his interactions with Sera are anything to go by.
Kirkwall gave the world a reason to remember its fear of magic. A mage killed hundreds with a snap of their fingers. Across Thedas, a new tangible fear of magic grew. Commoners and nobles alike called out to the Chantry for protection. But the malcontents in the towers thought nothing of this.
She wants mages to be accepted as people.
Also, Vivienne likes this line when you become the Inquisitor:
With fear running rampant, they need to see a mage standing for what is right.
Kirkwall gave the world a reason to remember its fear of magic. A mage killed hundreds with a snap of their fingers. Across Thedas, a new tangible fear of magic grew. Commoners and nobles alike called out to the Chantry for protection. But the malcontents in the towers thought nothing of this.
She wants mages to be accepted as people.
Also, Vivienne likes this line when you become the Inquisitor:
With fear running rampant, they need to see a mage standing for what is right.
*shrug*
Conflicting writing when it comes to character traits I suppose.
Not really.
Vivienne clearly sees magic is dangerous "as fire is dangerous" Thus she wants to make sure that everyone free to practice magic is responsible enough to use it without burning themselves or others.
People should be wary of magic. But she also wants those who can safely handle magic to be respected.
I mean, to use her analogy, fire is dangerous. It can damage or destroy property. It can cause painful, even disfiguring burns. It can kill. But it can also cook food, provide warmth, forge metal, sterilize medical equipment. It can bring comfort to others and even save lives. But to do so it must be used the proper way, and not run wild. A properly banked forge can be a boon to a village. A fire at the smithy can burn that village down.
Not really.
Vivienne clearly sees magic is dangerous "as fire is dangerous" Thus she wants to make sure that everyone free to practice magic is responsible enough to use it without burning themselves or others.
People should be wary of magic. But she also wants those who can safely handle magic to be respected.
I mean, to use her analogy, fire is dangerous. It can damage or destroy property. It can cause painful, even disfiguring burns. It can kill. But it can also cook food, provide warmth, forge metal, sterilize medical equipment. It can bring comfort to others and even save lives. But to do so it must be used the proper way, and not run wild. A properly banked forge can be a boon to a village. A fire at the smithy can burn that village down.
She never actually mentions this fact. And like I said she disapproves of the idea that normal people can be taught not to fear magic and not be intolerant or prejudiced towards mages.
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