But Solas, he hid, he kept himself safe while everyone else had to cope with the consequences of his actions.. This makes it harder to justify trying to save his character for me.
No. He slept. We're not sure if him being in uthenera for thousands of years was voluntary or not. My personal guess is that the act of raising the Veil weakened him to the point where it was uthenera or death, but that's just a guess.
The thing with Solas, in my mind, is that he's trying to do exactly what Corypheus was doing. Breach the fade, tear down the veil, use the new found power gained to reshape the world and restore their respective people to their former glory.
I can't condone Solas committing the same exact action that I fought so hard to stop Corypheus from doing. Especially when you have the argument that Corypheus may not have been fully aware of the consequences of his actions(mass genocide caused by the falling of the veil), where as Solas has no such excuse.
RE; Sable Rhapsody
I'm going on information and comments made thru the game and some banter from Cole and Codex's from Trespasser, but I got the impression that he sprung a trap that caught the Evanuris but also innocents; its said he chewed off his leg to escape (can't remember which codex) Perhaps he slept because he was weakened, but he also escaped the aftermath of his actions, and blamed the survivors for not being elfy enough, how could they have knowledge and culture he destroyed?
RE; Sable Rhapsody
I'm going on information and comments made thru the game and some banter from Cole and Codex's from Trespasser, but I got the impression that he sprung a trap that caught the Evanuris but also innocents; its said he chewed off his leg to escape (can't remember which codex) Perhaps he slept because he was weakened, but he also escaped the aftermath of his actions, and blamed the survivors for not being elfy enough, how could they have knowledge and culture he destroyed?
RE; Sable Rhapsody
I'm going on information and comments made thru the game and some banter from Cole and Codex's from Trespasser, but I got the impression that he sprung a trap that caught the Evanuris but also innocents; its said he chewed off his leg to escape (can't remember which codex) Perhaps he slept because he was weakened, but he also escaped the aftermath of his actions, and blamed the survivors for not being elfy enough, how could they have knowledge and culture he destroyed?
I share this view. I'm thinking he's feeling guilty for what happened to the elves (loosing immortality, fall of elves etc) but also that elvhen people in uthenera or similar was stuck. Cole says in Trespasser by the coffins in deeproad: "They're all singing. Coffers, coffins, corpses that aren't dead. A song crying out in the dark". I almost get this feeling that erecting the veil made the elves in uthenera become stuck in an eternal coma. There is also another comment made by Cole which says something similar to "They sleep, masked behind a mirror, hiding, hurting, and to wake them...", which i initially thought might be the locked away evanuris. But this could also be a statement explaining the elvhen people stuck because of the veil. So just giving up the idea about tearing down the veil might also be the process of accepting those innocent people being stuck in eternal torment.
I share this view. I'm thinking he's feeling guilty for what happened to the elves (loosing immortality, fall of elves etc) but also that elvhen people in uthenera or similar was stuck. Cole says in Trespasser by the coffins in deeproad: "They're all singing. Coffers, coffins, corpses that aren't dead. A song crying out in the dark". I almost get this feeling that erecting the veil made the elves in uthenera become stuck in an eternal coma. There is also another comment made by Cole which says something similar to "They sleep, masked behind a mirror, hiding, hurting, and to wake them...", which i initially thought might be the locked away evanuris. But this could also be a statement explaining the elvhen people stuck because of the veil. So just giving up the idea about tearing down the veil might also be the process of accepting those innocent people being stuck in eternal torment.
Usually people went in uthenera when they were old and tired , it was a symbolic death for people who couldn't die.
So why bring down the veil , kill thousands of people , to wake some old dudes who were tired of living?
If they are suffering in uthenera , well cut their throat
Usually people went in uthenera when they were old and tired , it was a symbolic death for people who couldn't die.
So why bring down the veil , kill thousands of people , to wake some old dudes who were tired of living?
If they are suffering in uthenera , well cut their throat
If they went into uthenera to wait for the Veil to get into place or for things to settle down, then it wasn't just the old and tired people. It would have been a big chunk of the civilization. Kind of like how Abelas and his sentinels implied they would enter during long periods of time when the temple they guarded was not bothered.
Did you suggest cutting their throats to be flippant, or is that an actual valid option in your mind?
I'll say it again. This is one of the best villains in DA!, he is so smug you want to punch him half the time and the other he's so sympathetic you want to hug him. But he is seriously messed up, Flemythal whatever she was, at least still saw the modern elves as people! perhaps living thru the modern world along with them helped?? But Solas, he hid, he kept himself safe while everyone else had to cope with the consequences of his actions.. This makes it harder to justify trying to save his character for me.
edit: On the issue of the arm, are some of you seriously saying a person who can turn others to stone with his EYES couldn't save the arm? I honestly believe he did that to remove a rival he knew could impede his goal.
And yes my goody two-shoes inquisitor will try to save that bald head-case and the ancient elves because they are people and innocent lives matter.
How about the millions of modern elves, dwarves, qunari and humans? Do their innocent lives not matter?
My feelings on Solas post Trespasser are as follows; from a moral standpoint he's the worst companion we've had. Worse than Zevran, Sten, Isabela, Anders, and Loghain. He's a madman consumed in equal parts by a Messiah complex and a Martyr complex. He's no better than Corypheus.
But that makes him considerably more interesting than he was previously, so good job on that front.
Exactly, and that's one of the reasons I hate him so much. It's bad enough he's trying to destroy the world, but his whole self-indulgent wangsting about how he's the one who's going to be most affected by wiping out all of Thedas is just the icing on the cake. Really, Solas, if you have to end all of existence as we know it, do you really have to be such a self-righteous shisno about it?
Solas is Hitler, Satan, Pol Pat, Tzeentch, Judas, Benedict Arnold and my last boyfriend combined!!!
Hey, don't go around insulting Tzeentch by comparing him to Solas! At the very least, Tzeentch's plans actually work out! 
Sympathetic character with good intentions?? Did we play the same game? Because all I saw was a supremacist a** who honored us with actually thinking of us as people but is still going to murder us regardless.
He wants to commit genocide... yeah I'm sure a few weeks at therapy will sort that all out
Preach it. Solas is pretty much a card-carrying member of the Thalmor; him being a good kisser doesn't excuse that.
Ok op...Calm down....take a deep breath...
OK...
Now click the spoiler tag.
Spoiler
Did seeing that make you feel better?
Very much so, thank you. It's like seeing Joffrey get slapped; it's actually rather therapeutic (and well-deserved too, those slimy gits).
Oh, I really thought that Solas in an egg would be fun, anyway, I think this one is more accurate with the facts.
Thanks for that, I really needed a good laugh.
There is no room for doubts when you're playing with the fates of millions.
Precisely. Solas is a gambler on a losing streak who's playing dice with the very fabric of reality itself. See how this could be an issue?
If they went into uthenera to wait for the Veil to get into place or for things to settle down, then it wasn't just the old and tired people. It would have been a big chunk of the civilization. Kind of like how Abelas and his sentinels implied they would enter during long periods of time when the temple they guarded was not bothered.
Did you suggest cutting their throats to be flippant, or is that an actual valid option in your mind?
If some old elves went in uthenera , because they were tired of living ...and are now stuck suffering in the fade , for unknown reason..Solas wasn't suffering it seems...well kill them.
That's called mercy killing , that's not flippant , that's what happens everyday when people shut down life support in hospital.
The number of people being warned about the veil being created would have been small...unless Solas wanted to run the risk to be stopped , I doubt he shouted it from the rooftops.
Not all elves were able to survive in uthenera without assistance , and so far there is nothing about slaves ...I don't mean people like Abelas , it seems he was a high ranked priest.
I mean servants who cut the throat of the nobles in uthenera and died because they were trapped.(Again Masked Empire)
Why the servants didn't go in uthenera?Chances are they didn't know how to do it.
So who are those survivors?
Not everyone was following Solas ...some people were still following the Evanuris ...
Felassan and Solas were fine .
If some people are stuck behind an eluvian , tearing the veil apart won't change that , they will still be stuck behind an Eluvian no matter what , and you'd need a key or to repair the Eluvian to reach them.
The thing with Solas, in my mind, is that he's trying to do exactly what Corypheus was doing. Breach the fade, tear down the veil, use the new found power gained to reshape the world and restore their respective people to their former glory.
I can't condone Solas committing the same exact action that I fought so hard to stop Corypheus from doing. Especially when you have the argument that Corypheus may not have been fully aware of the consequences of his actions(mass genocide caused by the falling of the veil), where as Solas has no such excuse.
They are the same in goal, but not in character.
Corypheus was drown in his own confidence and arrogance. He showed little concern about the consequences of his actions and only stopped when he was put down. While Solas on the other hand is perfectly aware of what horror his actions would cause and could still be reasoned with, and perhaps persuaded to change his path.
Sippin mah tea readin da thread, lookin cool as I chill out
If some old elves went in uthenera , because they were tired of living ...and are now stuck suffering in the fade , for unknown reason..Solas wasn't suffering it seems...well kill them.
That's called mercy killing , that's not flippant , that's what happens everyday when people shut down life support in hospital.
No, it's like stumbling upon a dog locked in a kennel, and I decide to kill it because I can't be bothered to find the key.
Assuming this is the situation, and Solas is trying to save people trapped in Uthanera, killing them isn't the answer. Destroying the world to break them out isn't the answer either, but let's say Solas sees this as a mercy killing himself. He thinks the mortal world is full of pain, suffering, and pointlessness. That they'll all die soon anyway ("Soon" compared to him, an immortal) relieving them of their pain, and making a better world in it's place - that's merciful, isn't it?
No, because like Solas, maybe I should try seeing if I can save these people before just straight up murdering them for the sake of "mercy?"
Also, as for the "if they're stuck behind an Eluvian dropping the veil won't save them" - perhaps not, but the return of magic would certainly make it easier to repair eluvians, or even make new ones. Really, we don't even have factual evidence that trapping them behind an Elvuian means they're stuck there, veil or no veil. As a matter of fact, I have reason to doubt that claim since, if it were true, Solas would've just done that to the Evanuris.
All I have to say is that the protagonist of DA4 is going to have to be mighty indeed because Solas can turn people to stone without even looking at them.
I've been hoping he would be a dreamer. Capable of shaping the Fade and thus having some supernatural power that might somehow help against Solas.
Also, look at the potential of having a dreamer protagonist. Someone who has power over spirits, over people's minds through dreams? Who can reshape reality through the Fade? Someone like that would be a natural rival to Solas. And could easily be seen as the next best hope for Tevinter against the Qunari. We do know DA 4 will focus on Tevinter...
I've been hoping he would be a dreamer. Capable of shaping the Fade and thus having some supernatural power that might somehow help against Solas.
Also, look at the potential of having a dreamer protagonist. Someone who has power over spirits, over people's minds through dreams? Who can reshape reality through the Fade? Someone like that would be a natural rival to Solas. And could easily be seen as the next best hope for Tevinter against the Qunari. We do know DA 4 will focus on Tevinter...
Only mages can be dreamers. For gameplay reasons, that kind of protagonist wouldn't be possible.
Assuming this is the situation, and Solas is trying to save people trapped in Uthanera, killing them isn't the answer. Destroying the world to break them out isn't the answer either, but let's say Solas sees this as a mercy killing himself. He thinks the mortal world is full of pain, suffering, and pointlessness. That they'll all die soon anyway ("Soon" compared to him, an immortal) relieving them of their pain, and making a better world in it's place - that's merciful, isn't it?
Asking the question about the trapped elves has proven to be interesting. We really have no idea if it's true at this point, so it's just idle speculation and what-if. But I have found that when asked, many people will introduce reasons why it's okay to let the trapped elves die in order to save their own people. Which I get. It's fair. Anyone would want to save their people and look in horror on others who would have them die for any reason. But "they're old and probably tired of life" is just another way of saying something like "it's a world full of tranquil" to me.
'Sides, when did we get to where it's okay to kill old people for being old and wanting a nap? 
And that is why I get confused on how people don't understand Solas's reasons for thinking the way he is. It's not a good thing, and causing the death of a lot of people is terrible. But when given the exact same situation where it's completely equal -- if the elves die, Thedas lives, but if Thedas dies, the elves live -- people are going to defend saving Thedas. Even if you don't agree with what Solas intends to do, and I don't, not at all understanding where he is coming from when you'd do the same thing in his situation is kind of baffling.
Naturally, this doesn't mean anyone has to like him or agree with his plan or not want to kill him. That's all valid and fair. And again, I don't agree with his plan either. I just like having an antagonist I can understand, and to where I can look at their reasoning and make sense of it. It's nice getting to see the other side of an antagonist instead of just facing down another black-and-white villain, you know?
They are the same in goal, but not in character.
Corypheus was drown in his own confidence and arrogance. He showed little concern about the consequences of his actions and only stopped when he was put down. While Solas on the other hand is perfectly aware of what horror his actions would cause and could still be reasoned with, and perhaps persuaded to change his path.
Maybe he can, maybe he can't. I, for one, have no intention of trying to talk him down.
Anyone can drink Dragon's blood, and during the final battle with Titus, Maric kind of stated that Aurelian was only dreamer due Maric's blood.Only mages can be dreamers. For gameplay reasons, that kind of protagonist wouldn't be possible.
Solas isn't going to go through with it in the end.
One way or the other.
There's the idea that even if he doesn't, someone will, since there are supposed prophecies saying as much. That should be interesting.
Asking the question about the trapped elves has proven to be interesting. We really have no idea if it's true at this point, so it's just idle speculation and what-if. But I have found that when asked, many people will introduce reasons why it's okay to let the trapped elves die in order to save their own people. Which I get. It's fair. Anyone would want to save their people and look in horror on others who would have them die for any reason. But "they're old and probably tired of life" is just another way of saying something like "it's a world full of tranquil" to me.
'Sides, when did we get to where it's okay to kill old people for being old and wanting a nap?
And that is why I get confused on how people don't understand Solas's reasons for thinking the way he is. It's not a good thing, and causing the death of a lot of people is terrible. But when given the exact same situation where it's completely equal -- if the elves die, Thedas lives, but if Thedas dies, the elves live -- people are going to defend saving Thedas. Even if you don't agree with what Solas intends to do, and I don't, not at all understanding where he is coming from when you'd do the same thing in his situation is kind of baffling.
Naturally, this doesn't mean anyone has to like him or agree with his plan or not want to kill him. That's all valid and fair. And again, I don't agree with his plan either. I just like having an antagonist I can understand, and to where I can look at their reasoning and make sense of it. It's nice getting to see the other side of an antagonist instead of just facing down another black-and-white villain, you know?
People justify Solas action by imagining there's some elves trapped somewhere.
And no I can't for the life of me understand Solas reasoning.
The ancient elves who survived are still alive , like him , the Sentinels and Felassan.
The current elves are the children of ancient elves...while he was sleeping , his people kept on living and had children.
So who is he saving exactly?
The ancient elves still alive and who don't need saving?
The current elves he's willing to sacrifice?
It's not if the elves dies , Thedas lives etc...
The elves are alive right now , it's not about elves ...it's about sacrificing everyone so immortal , magical elves will be born again.
Immortal , magical elves had their time under the sun , they destroyed themselves , no one else did , they were so powerful , they were about to destroy the world , Solas had to sacrifice the part of the nature of the world , and the nature of his people to contain the threat.
And now he's the ancient immortal magical elf who is bend on destroying the current world.
Maybe immortal magical elves are the one broken , no?
I've been hoping he would be a dreamer. Capable of shaping the Fade and thus having some supernatural power that might somehow help against Solas.
Also, look at the potential of having a dreamer protagonist. Someone who has power over spirits, over people's minds through dreams? Who can reshape reality through the Fade? Someone like that would be a natural rival to Solas. And could easily be seen as the next best hope for Tevinter against the Qunari. We do know DA 4 will focus on Tevinter...
Argh noooooo!!! I HATE the Fade. 
I've been hoping he would be a dreamer. Capable of shaping the Fade and thus having some supernatural power that might somehow help against Solas.
Also, look at the potential of having a dreamer protagonist. Someone who has power over spirits, over people's minds through dreams? Who can reshape reality through the Fade? Someone like that would be a natural rival to Solas. And could easily be seen as the next best hope for Tevinter against the Qunari. We do know DA 4 will focus on Tevinter...
Also, why the hell would I want to back Tevinter in that fight?
Corypheus was drown in his own confidence and arrogance.
So is Solas. You have to be supremely confident in yourself, in your PoV, in thinking that you are objectively correct to go ahead and plan to kill everyone in exchange for the lives of your objectively superior people. You have to be extremely arrogant to 'correct' a mistake you made thousands of years ago and consider all the intervening history, life and living that took place in the interim to be not as important as you 'fixing' it.
He showed little concern about the consequences of his actions and only stopped when he was put down.
So far this is true of Solas too.
While Solas on the other hand is perfectly aware of what horror his actions would cause and could still be reasoned with, and perhaps persuaded to change his path.
Self-awareness is not some kind of healing balm. In fact it makes it worse. It means he put a lot of thought into it and still came to a deplorable conclusion. It means he's completely clear-sighted and doing it anyway. There's no crazy interfering with Solas. He's just an awful person.
If he can be convinced and depending how he's convinced he can get kudos points for not completely sucking tho.
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