35 réponses à ce sujet

[CATS3688]

The sigils are overall really wonky looking to me and difficult to figure out situations where they could actually provide a clear benefit for your character. Yet there is a special slot for them now in the armor sets which will just be empty otherwise so I feel compelled to try and use them..... post/brainstorm any set ups you can think of where these sigils actually do something positive. Yes a couple of them are quite obviously good, but most of them just seem awkward/weird to actually try and use.

 

--Sigil of Deathroot: +15% attack, -50% heal bonus

 

This one is actually pretty straightforward and would conceivably be nice for any DPS character. Although if it cuts your normal heal pots strength in half (haven't tested out whether it would or not), that is a significant drawback. Might not want it on a Reaver either. I think it would be best on a rogue archer DPS since they have the best ability to not draw aggro and stay at a safe distance from any AoE attacks (which ideally will be centered on the tank).

 

--Sigil of Felandaris: +100% poison damage, -50% attack

 

This is a good example of a sigil I literally can't think of a use for. There are what 2 abilities in the game that deal poison damage? Poisoned weapons and toxic cloud? Even if you spec to use those, the damage of poisoned weapons is much less than the normal damage of your weapon, so it doesn't make sense to boost the former at the expense of the latter. Even though the bonus is twice as much as the penalty, your normal weapon deals much more than twice as much damage as your poison (which only ticks every 2 seconds and deals less than half of your weapon damage per tick).

 

--Sigil of Lyrium: +50% barrier, -50% health

 

Knight-Enchanter I guess? That's all I can think of for this one. Either that or a party set up where you have multiple mages rotating barriers so that it's active all the time, although you are taking a big risk if one of your barrier casters goes down, or gets knocked down when they're supposed to cast it next.

 

--Sigil of the Arcane Horror: +10% spirit damage, -50% all other damage

 

Again, I can only think of Knight-Enchanter. I guess you could try it with a necromancer if you are able to just keep spamming your necro-spec abilities and not doing any basic attacks or normal mage abilities.

 

--Sigil of the Bronto: +100% maximum guard, -100% maximum barrier

 

This is another one that actually looks pretty good on paper, although with the new barrier upgrade that basically makes it last 5 seconds longer, not being able to have barrier is considerably more of a trade-off than it would have been before. But this at least would definitely be useful in a party without a mage, or with only one mage that isn't using barrier. Maybe also good for a dual-dagger rogue with guard on hit effects, since they can build it very fast.

 

--Sigil of the Chevalier: +15% front armor, -50% all other armor

 

If you are controlling the tank, or micro-managing in tac cam, then this could be good since you'd be able to ensure you keep everything in front of you. But even then it may not always be possible to avoid getting hit from behind, and it seems like it would be awful on an AI companion. This is another one where even with specific party set ups built around it, it just seems bad. Maybe see how it interacts with Bear Mauls the Wolves, although from the wording of that perk I don't think you could get around the downside that way.

 

--Sigil of the Deepstalker: +200% flanking damage, -50% attack

 

This strikes me as actually the most straight-forward "good" sigil, albeit only for dagger rogues who can use flank attack, upgraded stealth walkthrough, etc. to make sure they stay behind a target. I wonder how flanking works with high dragons--does being "behind" any of the four legs work, or do you have to be attacking the hind legs from behind to be considered "flanking" them?

 

--Elemental Sigils: +10% (cold/fire/lightning) damage, -50% all other damage

 

The problem with these is the most powerful mage abilities (spirit blade, stonefist, walking bomb, decloaking blast, etc) all deal spirit damage..... so it doesn't seem worthwhile to nuke those by so much for only a 1/5 size increase in the damage of weaker abilities. At least it could be good pre-Skyhold though. Or perhaps if you're combining it with one of those "belt of the whatever pact" belts.

 

--Sigil of the Giant: +50% mana/stamina regeneration, -100% cooldown times

 

The strategy here would be to rely on abilities with very low to no cooldown times, the problem is I can't really think of any which have cooldowns low enough to make this worth it. The blocking skills like shield wall I guess? So early game when that is your tank's main way of protecting himself, it could be useful to help him avoid running out of stamina to block with. The other approach would be to use it late game when you have all 8 ability slots used so there's always something to spend your stamina on, but you would need to find 8 abilities that are equally good in order for that to be efficient.

 

--Sigil of the Golem: +10% Attack, -100% crit chance

 

I guess this would be good on a character that never goes above the base crit rate, never gets any bonus cunning, crit chance on weapons, etc. Another one that actually would be pretty straightforward to use, I think S&S would be best as they have few to no effects that proc on crit IIRC.

 

--Sigil of the Great Bear: +100% max mana/stamina, -50% mana/stamina regen

 

This needs to be tested to see how it interacts with the stamina that warriors and rogues gain from basic attacks. If it doesn't affect the stamina gained per hit that would help it out quite a lot I think. Even without that, it could allow abilities that cost a lot (50-65) to be chained, though I haven't bothered to look and see what good combinations of abilities would be for this (hidden blades straight into spinning blades or some such, perhaps). And it should be good for areas where you are engaging in a lot of brief fights and don't have any long, drawn-out fights against bosses or elites or anything.

 

--Sigil of the Nug: +25% healing bonus, -25% attack

 

Good for tanks and characters that are completely support focused (a mage with control abilities, barrier, dispel, etc.) I suppose, assuming it boosts your heal and regen pots.

 

--Sigil of the Revenant: +35% heal on kill, -50% maximum health

 

I would just put this on an "alternate" suit of armor and use it to heal back to full by killing rams in between fights, then put my "main" armor back on >.>

 

--Sigil of the Tusket: +100% max health, -100% armor

 

Seems awful against any phys damage enemies, but if you are going up against pure magic damage, such as a rift of all wisps and despair demons, then it would actually be really great.

[squidney2k1]

Sigil of the Deepstalker is well worth it for a dagger rogue since it is easy to stay behind an opponent. Keep in mind that all attacks from stealth are considered flanking, so it's much easier than you think to constantly flank enemies.

Sigil of the Great Bear is also worth it for non-Rift Mages and those with abilities that have a hefty cost, early in the game (pre-lvl 20).Late game, I often find that my mana/stamina regen far exceeds my cooldosns making this sort of irrelevant after a while. But until you unlock passives & upgradss to boost mana/stamina regen, it's not a bad choice. The only times you'll really suffer are during long battles, like Dragons. In most fights, the 100% extra mana/stamina is enough to carry.

[TheInvoker]

Sigil of the Deepstalker is well worth it for a dagger rogue since it is easy to stay behind an opponent. Keep in mind that all attacks from stealth are considered flanking, so it's much easier than you think to constantly flank enemies.

Sigil of the Great Bear is also worth it for non-Rift Mages and those with abilities that have a hefty cost, early in the game (pre-lvl 20).Late game, I often find that my mana/stamina regen far exceeds my cooldosns making this sort of irrelevant after a while. But until you unlock passives & upgradss to boost mana/stamina regen, it's not a bad choice. The only times you'll really suffer are during long battles, like Dragons. In most fights, the 100% extra mana/stamina is enough to carry.

these 2 are the best i think

i would use Great Bear on all because i think the game should be this way by default and (OT) i would give up to 1.5% attack and 1.5% magic resist from 3 willpower on passive abilities if that willpower gives me 15 mana instead (willpower=mana like all other games)

[ferrus]

How are they applied exactly? If a DW rogue with 0% attack uses sigil of deepstalker, will it be -50% attack or remain 0% attack?

[TheInvoker]

unfortunately it's -50%. i tried because i was thinking it was really great. just not build attack on weapons but critical/flanking damage. 

it goes under 0%

but i think it's worth to have 200% flanking damage.

in stealth with twin fang you can oneshot many enemies.

 

assassins have 75% armor pen in stealth  and auto crit.

[PawsPause]

Malikas Guard amulet and deepstalker sigil is insane. Really no need for barrier on tanks when rolling with bronto sigil with horn of valor fortifying blast and flow of battle passive.

[mesiasmith]

Since I never go for healer ability, so Sigil of Deathroot: +15% attack, -50% heal bonus may be the best for my KE mage.

BTY I noticed that the stat of attack showed on Attribute menu didn't change after equipped this Sigil. Is it bug?

 

Sigil of the Bronto: +100% Max Guard, -100% Max Barrier; look nice for tank character but I m not try yet.

[Wulfram]

Sigil of the Great Bear is working nicely for my Rogue. I get my stamina regen from crits and shadow strike, and the larger pool allows me to deal with peaks in stamina usage without running out.

Together with the Artificer's cooldown stuff I kind of miss actually firing my bow

[PawsPause]

Since I never go for healer ability, so Sigil of Deathroot: +15% attack, -50% heal bonus may be the best for my KE mage.
BTY I noticed that the stat of attack showed on Attribute menu didn't change after equipped this Sigil. Is it bug?

Sigil of the Bronto: +100% Max Guard, -100% Max Barrier; look nice for tank character but I m not try yet.

Sigil of deathroot is bugged. The bonus damage is not applied In the attribute menu. Tested to see if the damage is applied thru combat, but thru my findings there was no increase in overall damage.

[Forsythia77]

I've got  the nug on Dorian since my priority for him is to regenerate health and panic the crap out of groups.  And the flanking one on Cole.  I currently have one DW rogue I'm playing but I've not found the flanking sigil in his game yet. 

[Realyn]

Sigil of the Bear + Artificer = Overpowered to the extreme.

 

Makes you throw massive amounts of mines with Throw it all upgrade, which adds 1 mine per 5 (?) stamina spent above the regular ability cost. It uses up all stamina, but every crit of those mines fills up a good chunk of stamina. Followed by a leaping shot, you have full 200 mana back in mere seconds. The entire negative effect is negated. It's basically, throw mines -> nuclear explosions -> leaping shot -> full stamina -> repeat. Infinite stamina and virtually no cooldown times.

 

To make it more fun;

 

Hook & Tackle to a distant enemy -> mines -> leaping shot -> hook and tackle to another enemy -> mines -> leaping shot -> ad infinitum.

 

You zip, flip and jump across the battlefield with impunity, leaving explosions in your wake everywhere you go. It is beyond epic. 

 

The sheer amount of mines you throw is crazy. Unless you have a decent rig, it will drop your fps like a rock due to all the crap blowing up on your screen.

[Evelynne]

Sigil of the Bear + Artificer = Overpowered to the extreme.

 

Makes you throw massive amounts of mines with Throw it all upgrade, which adds 1 mine per 5 (?) stamina spent above the regular ability cost. It uses up all stamina, but every crit of those mines fills up a good chunk of stamina. Followed by a leaping shot, you have full 200 mana back in mere seconds. The entire negative effect is negated. It's basically, throw mines -> nuclear explosions -> leaping shot -> full stamina -> repeat. Infinite stamina and virtually no cooldown times.

 

To make it more fun;

 

Hook & Tackle to a distant enemy -> mines -> leaping shot -> hook and tackle to another enemy -> mines -> leaping shot -> ad infinitum.

 

You zip, flip and jump across the battlefield with impunity, leaving explosions in your wake everywhere you go. It is beyond epic. 

 

The sheer amount of mines you throw is crazy. Unless you have a decent rig, it will drop your fps like a rock due to all the crap blowing up on your screen.

Not to mention, you throw one set of mines (like 9 or so?) AND Then Throw it All. So, 150 Stamina, = 30 more mines. 39 explosions of 1-5k is a lot of damage. In addition, bow of the Artificer gives you NINE MORE. 48 Mines, times 1-5k, equals 48-340k worth of damage (assuming no immunity and boss large enough to set them all off). That's assuming you don't proc Bow of the Artificer more than once.

 

Dragons weren't prepared for Modern Techno-magic Rave Explosions and Fog Machines.

[PapaCharlie9]

unfortunately it's -50%. i tried because i was thinking it was really great. just not build attack on weapons but critical/flanking damage. 
it goes under 0%
but i think it's worth to have 200% flanking damage.

For this kind of question it's a good idea to review the damage formula:

http://forum.bioware...mbat-mechanics/
 

final_damage = (base_damage * rand(0.95 to 1.05) - armor * (1 - armor_penetration))
    * (ability_multiplier)
    * (1 + critical_damage_bonus + flanking_bonus)
    * (1 + attack_bonus + damage_multiplier + type_bonus)
    * (1 - magic_resistance)

In this case, the subexpressions we care about are (1 + attack_bonus) and (1 + critical_damage_bonus + flanking_bonus). Assuming everything else is forced to value 1 (or 0 in the case of crit), a negative value for attack_bonus doesn't necessary mean negative attack. -50% is (1 + (-0.5)), or 0.5.
 
Since that value is multiplied into the contribution for flanking damage, it is having a negative affect on your 200% flanking damage: it's cutting it in half.
 
(1 + (-0.5)) * (1 + 0 + 2.0) = 0.5 * 3.0 = 1.50
 
EDIT: The calculation above is simplified for clarity. In reality, you rarely have 0 Attack% and you always have at least 25% Flanking Damage bonus. You can compare expected damage values by doing with/without comparisons of the sigil.
 
Example With: Base damage 100, 10% Attack -50%, 25% Flanking +200%
 
Front attack: 100 * (1 + (0.1 - 0.5))  * (1 + 0 + 0) = 100 * 0.6 = 60
Flank attack: 100 * (1 + (0.1 - 0.5)) * (1 + 0 + (0.25 + 2.0)) = 100 * 0.6 * 3.25 = 100 * 1.95 = 195
 
Example Without: Base damage 100, 10% Attack, 25% Flanking
 
Front attack: 100 * (1 + 0.1)  * (1 + 0 + 0) = 100 * 1.1 = 110
Flank attack: 100 * (1 + 0.1) * (1 + 0 + 0.25) = 100 * 1.1 * 1.25 = 100 * 1.38 = 138

In this example, you give up 50 points of damage for every front attack, for a gain of 57 points of additional flanking attack. Hardly seems worth it, particularly since you can boost flank attack at 3% per mat with upgrades and gear, without the penalty.

Modifié par PapaCharlie9, 03 octobre 2015 - 05:16 .

[PapaCharlie9]

TL;DR - Great Bear, Bronto, Tusket ... and maybe Deathroot. Those are the winners. The rest suck to a greater or lesser extent.
 

--Sigil of Deathroot: +15% attack, -50% heal bonus
 
This one is actually pretty straightforward and would conceivably be nice for any DPS character. Although if it cuts your normal heal pots strength in half (haven't tested out whether it would or not), that is a significant drawback. Might not want it on a Reaver either. I think it would be best on a rogue archer DPS since they have the best ability to not draw aggro and stay at a safe distance from any AoE attacks (which ideally will be centered on the tank).

Necromancers should have oodles of health, so put this on Dorian.
 

--Sigil of Felandaris: +100% poison damage, -50% attack
 
This is a good example of a sigil I literally can't think of a use for.

Agreed, this was just a test to make sure we were paying attention.

 

--Sigil of Lyrium: +50% barrier, -50% health
 
Knight-Enchanter I guess?

No, KE generates their own Barrier. Putting it on KE would be like putting the Sigil of Depilatory on Solas. Maybe Necromancer, but probably useless.
 

--Sigil of the Arcane Horror: +10% spirit damage, -50% all other damage
 
Again, I can only think of Knight-Enchanter

This is another test to see if we are paying attention. Next to useless.
 

--Sigil of the Bronto: +100% maximum guard, -100% maximum barrier
 
This is another one that actually looks pretty good on paper, although with the new barrier upgrade that basically makes it last 5 seconds longer, not being able to have barrier is considerably more of a trade-off than it would have been before.

What!? This sigil is one of the best of the bunch. Sure, elemental attacks are going to do more damage, but with so many guard generating buffs like Fortifying Blast, this sigil pays above average dividends against physical attacks. I'll take all the ones you don't want.

I wonder if -100% means you just can't have barrier at all, ever, or if it really means your max is cut in half.
 

--Sigil of the Chevalier: +15% front armor, -50% all other armor
 
If you are controlling the tank, or micro-managing in tac cam, then this could be good since you'd be able to ensure you keep everything in front of you.

This sigil stinks for S&S warriors, since they can just get a better shield for the same benefit, without the drawback. But, it might be useful for mages. Assassins notwithstanding, range-attacking mages rarely get flanked. When facing towards the enemy, a little extra defense against those nasty archers isn't too bad.
 

--Sigil of the Deepstalker: +200% flanking damage, -50% attack
 
This strikes me as actually the most straight-forward "good" sigil, albeit only for dagger rogues who can use flank attack, upgraded stealth walkthrough, etc. to make sure they stay behind a target. 

No way. This is the definition of suck, since debuffing attack affects everything. It even debuffs flanking damage! I know there is this idea that rogues depend more on crit anyway so it might be good for them, but negative attack debuffs crit damage as well.
 

--Elemental Sigils: +10% (cold/fire/lightning) damage, -50% all other damage
 
The problem with these is the most powerful mage abilities (spirit blade, stonefist, walking bomb, decloaking blast, etc) all deal spirit damage..... so it doesn't seem worthwhile to nuke those by so much for only a 1/5 size increase in the damage of weaker abilities. At least it could be good pre-Skyhold though. Or perhaps if you're combining it with one of those "belt of the whatever pact" belts.

Yeah, this is another attention test. Or maybe an IQ test.
 

--Sigil of the Giant: +50% mana/stamina regeneration, -100% cooldown times
 
The strategy here would be to rely on abilities with very low to no cooldown times, the problem is I can't really think of any which have cooldowns low enough to make this worth it.

Immolate/Consuming Fire? Or any ability after using Flask of Fire/upgraded? Or Charging Bull/Gore and Trample? There are lots of abilities, particularly late game, that have 0 cooldown, so late game, this sigil is pretty nifty. Plus with accessories that buff cooldown, you might be able to completely eliminate the debuff.

That said, there are better ways to buff mana/stamina regen.

 

(Stupit BSN won't let me do any more quotes beyond this point, so I'm using blue color instead)
 

--Sigil of the Golem: +10% Attack, -100% crit chance
 
I guess this would be good on a character that never goes above the base crit rate, never gets any bonus cunning, crit chance on weapons, etc. Another one that actually would be pretty straightforward to use, I think S&S would be best as they have few to no effects that proc on crit IIRC.

Low level only, though. It's also not that hard to get +10% attack without the debuff, even at low level.
 

--Sigil of the Great Bear: +100% max mana/stamina, -50% mana/stamina regen
 
This needs to be tested

Yes, needs to be tested, but it is very promising. There are other ways to buff mana/stamina regen that could eliminate the debuff. This Sigil could be great in combination with Immolate/Consuming Fire.
 

--Sigil of the Nug: +25% healing bonus, -25% attack
 
Good for tanks and characters that are completely support focused (a mage with control abilities, barrier, dispel, etc.) I suppose, assuming it boosts your heal and regen pots.

As noted above, anything that debuffs attack% is definition of suck.
 

--Sigil of the Revenant: +35% heal on kill, -50% maximum health
 
I would just put this on an "alternate" suit of armor and use it to heal back to full by killing rams in between fights, then put my "main" armor back on >.>

How about min/max to never take damage? We're pretty close to that with Fortifying Blast and the new accessory that generates barrier. If you never take damage, who cares who your max health is? Of course, by the same token, who cares about getting +35% heal on kill. It's a wash.
 

--Sigil of the Tusket: +100% max health, -100% armor
 
Seems awful against any phys damage enemies, but if you are going up against pure magic damage, such as a rift of all wisps and despair demons, then it would actually be really great.

Magic damage is the same with or without this sigil, that's not the point. If your max health is greater than your max armor, this is always a win (provided you can heal back to max). This Sigil is a gimme for mages. The point is that the extra health is pretty close to a 1-for-1 exchange with armor value. If your max armor exceeds your max health, you wouldn't want this sigil, but for mages and even rogues, why wouldn't you want this?

 

Waking up as a mage in Haven for the first time with no Golden Nug schematics and no Light Armor of the Dragon special deliveries, you'd probably be better off wearing this sigil and nothing else, going Commando, than you would be with any of the armor you could craft or loot at that point. If you could wear the sigil buck nekkid, that is.

 

If you can't heal, well, then it's like your armor gets crappier and crappier every hit you take, until you are down to 100% of your original max health.

 

I guess another way to think of this Sigil is that it turns every Health Potion into a Tonic of Increase Armor.

 

EDIT: As noted later in the thread, something I missed is that armor is subtracted from every damage calculation for every hit and does not decrease. So this sigil trades a steady protection for one that degrades over time (you lose health). Upshot, this is not as good as I originally thought, even buck nekkid. It's actually kind of bad.

[PawsPause]

Quote

--Sigil of the Bronto: +100% maximum guard, -100% maximum barrier
 
This is another one that actually looks pretty good on paper, although with the new barrier upgrade that basically makes it last 5 seconds longer, not being able to have barrier is considerably more of a trade-off than it would have been before.

What!? This sigil is one of the best of the bunch. Sure, elemental attacks are going to do more damage, but with so many guard generating buffs like Fortifying Blast, this sigil pays above average dividends against physical attacks. I'll take all the ones you don't want.

I wonder if -100% means you just can't have barrier at all, ever, or if it really means your max is cut in half.

 

I can post video if you like confirming this, but yes, warriors cant have barrier at all when mage puts barrier on them.

[PawsPause]

 

 

--Sigil of the Great Bear: +100% max mana/stamina, -50% mana/stamina regen
 
This needs to be tested

Yes, needs to be tested, but it is very promising. There are other ways to buff mana/stamina regen that could eliminate the debuff. This Sigil could be great in combination with Immolate/Consuming Fire.
 

I put this sigil on dorian who uses spells with high mana cost. With the amulet of renewal, His mana regens pretty quickly, and spams big mana powers like static cage walking bomb etc. Its great for rift mages with weakened passives and knight enchanters with that one passive that helps them regen mana when near enemies. 

[PawsPause]

 

 

 

--Sigil of the Great Bear: +100% max mana/stamina, -50% mana/stamina regen
 
This needs to be tested

Yes, needs to be tested, but it is very promising. There are other ways to buff mana/stamina regen that could eliminate the debuff. This Sigil could be great in combination with Immolate/Consuming Fire.
 

I put this sigil on dorian who uses spells with high mana cost. With the amulet of renewal, His mana regens pretty quickly, and spams big mana powers like static cage walking bomb etc. Its great for rift mages with weakened passives and knight enchanters with that one passive that helps them regen mana when near enemies. 

 

UGH my quoting sucks on phone -__-

[PapaCharlie9]

(snip)
 
Example With: Base damage 100, 10% Attack -50%, 25% Flanking +200%
 
Front attack: 100 * (1 + (0.1 - 0.5))  * (1 + 0 + 0) = 100 * 0.6 = 60
Flank attack: 100 * (1 + (0.1 - 0.5)) * (1 + 0 + (0.25 + 2.0)) = 100 * 0.6 * 3.25 = 100 * 1.95 = 195
 
Example Without: Base damage 100, 10% Attack, 25% Flanking
 
Front attack: 100 * (1 + 0.1)  * (1 + 0 + 0) = 100 * 1.1 = 110
Flank attack: 100 * (1 + 0.1) * (1 + 0 + 0.25) = 100 * 1.1 * 1.25 = 100 * 1.38 = 138

In this example, you give up 50 points of damage for every front attack, for a gain of 57 points of additional flanking attack. Hardly seems worth it, particularly since you can boost flank attack at 3% per mat with upgrades and gear, without the penalty.

Just noting that I added a somewhat more realistic example for comparison of the Deepstalker Sigil.

[Exalus]

Just noting that I added a somewhat more realistic example for comparison of the Deepstalker Sigil.

What about at an end game example where characters already have a lot of crit/CD and attack%?

 

It seems like stat per unit wise 200% flanking>50% attack at a certain threshold and there are ways to consistently get flanking attacks. It also assumes you're doing nothing but auto attacks which isn't really how real combat works, generally you're zipping around doing precise twin fangs instead of dagger mashing their faces.

 

Really seems like a way to encourage flanking/stealth play to make your abilities hit for ridiculous amounts of damage.

[I saved Star Wars :D]

--Sigil of the Giant: +50% mana/stamina regeneration, -100% cooldown times

 

Could work nicely on a tank with the new 0 cooldown toggle on challenge. Just constantly taunting and building guard.

[InquisitorPotato]

Deepstalker sigil on archer tempest is just as good or even better on tempest rogues since you can pretty much stop time and ****** behind your enemies back all you want.

https://www.facebook...090590197033452

^ best example i can give with the Flank Damage+Stopped time combo.

[PapaCharlie9]

What about at an end game example where characters already have a lot of crit/CD and attack%?
 
It seems like stat per unit wise 200% flanking>50% attack at a certain threshold and there are ways to consistently get flanking attacks. It also assumes you're doing nothing but auto attacks which isn't really how real combat works, generally you're zipping around doing precise twin fangs instead of dagger mashing their faces.
 
Really seems like a way to encourage flanking/stealth play to make your abilities hit for ridiculous amounts of damage.

I agree that you can arrange for most of your attacks to be flanking attacks and make the most of a flanking damage bonus. But we always need to weigh these options against all the other options available at the time. In a Trespasser end-game situation, where all main game mats are available, you can buff your Flanking damage bonus to at least +200% with crafting, without the penalty. That seems preferable.

The bottom line is that a -50% Attack debuff hurts everything, including Flanking damage. That's a tough debuff to minimize. Not impossible, but tough.

About the only way I could see there being an optimal usage of the Deepstalker Sigil is if you are either material or material slot limited in some way. IF you've run out of slots or mats AND you will mostly do flank attacks AND you have more than 50% Attack% THEN maybe the Sigil is optimal. That's a long parlay ...

[Lexifer452]

My two cents...

 

The only sigils I have used are:

 

Sigil of the Tusket (+100% Health, -100% Armor) - for my companions who tend to die more often; Sera, Cole, Dorian, etc. The doubling of their health is way more useful than their armor rating which tends to be around 180-300 depending on what class armor I have on them.

 

Sigil of the Great Bear (+100 Mana/Stamina, -50% Mana/Stamina Regeneration) - I'm currently using this on my female Elven Dual-Wield/Archer Rogue Tempest Inquisitor (I tend to go back and forth from DW and archer every 15-20 game hours depending on what I feel like playing)  in combination with an Amulet of Renewal. It was pretty good up until I found that amulet. Now that I have it though it practically negates (from what I can tell) all of the 50% loss in stamina regeneration effectively giving me 200 stamina with no ill effects. Highly recommended even without the amulet.

 

Sigil of the Golem (+10% Attack, -100% Critical Chance) - I use this one for my warrior companions since their critical chance ratings aren't high enough to be of any real use anyways. I feel the 10% bump in attack is more worthwhile than the usual 5-10% critical chance ratings that Cassandra, Blackwall and Iron Bull tend to have.

 

The only other sigils I've found that look like they might be useful are the Deepstalker one and the Nug one but I haven't tried them out yet to see.
 

Edit:  Forgot to mention that although I haven't found on yet I would definitely use the Sigil of the Bronto on any of my rogues/warriors (or mages with on hit: guard passives) if and when I do find one. I'll take guard over barrier anyday. BTW does anyone know of a fixed drop location for this sigil. I know you can get it as a random trials reward but I've not had any luck so far. Thanks in advance

Modifié par Lexifer452, 04 octobre 2015 - 05:16 .

[ottffsse]

I agree that you can arrange for most of your attacks to be flanking attacks and make the most of a flanking damage bonus. But we always need to weigh these options against all the other options available at the time. In a Trespasser end-game situation, where all main game mats are available, you can buff your Flanking damage bonus to at least +200% with crafting, without the penalty. That seems preferable.

The bottom line is that a -50% Attack debuff hurts everything, including Flanking damage. That's a tough debuff to minimize. Not impossible, but tough.

About the only way I could see there being an optimal usage of the Deepstalker Sigil is if you are either material or material slot limited in some way. IF you've run out of slots or mats AND you will mostly do flank attacks AND you have more than 50% Attack% THEN maybe the Sigil is optimal. That's a long parlay ...

idk for every buff to one stat through crafting you give up to potentially boost another stat through crafting effects. I can definitely say that in a team composition (4 party members) deepstalker sigil is great for the player controlled character for the at least the assassin (considering you have malika's guard), a stealth mage striker (who gets even more flanking damage through RoD, and a "flank and destroy" (not tanking) reaver. The damage you will do with it if you control those characters will average more than without it. If you are soloing that goes out the window though as all enemy attention will be on YOU anyways.

I will try a close combat mage with lyrium sigil and mind blast (in addition to barrier and barrier strength upgrades) though just for the laughs to see if it holds up.

Bear works like a charm on necromancers with renewal or andraste amulet, especially while soloing. Same on artificer with those stamina gain passives (and probably as a result on tempest though why do you need stamina on tempest?)

Yeah and unfortunately deathroot does not really work otherwise it be a good one too.

On warriors definitely go bronto, on ANY warrior, except the flanking off-tank reaver where deepstalker can be considered.

[Wulfram]

Regarding Deepstalker, say you were a mage who wanted to get into flanking. Either you could make a Staff of Lovias with 100ish flanking and barely any attack, or you could make an Encore with 65 attack then use the Sigil to turn it into 15 attack and 200 flanking. The second option is straightforwardly superior. The only question is whether its worth getting into flanking at all.

It's slightly more complicated for rogues, because when it comes to the Attack * Crit+Flanking equation, the rogue is likely to be quite heavily invested in the Crit/Flanking side already, which means that losing attack hurts more, to the extent that it may well keep even the gains when you're flanking minimal as well as hurting your frontal attacks badly.  But it seems like it should still give you a few extra % to your damage when flanking, which is nice if you like seeing those big numbers fly.