^ 6b duration doesn't add near enough to make up for the loss of armour & barrier dps of 6a.
Otherwise, yes, fast cooldown rate is nice. Not just for stacking, but faster combos.
With the boosted dmg vs all target types from reave 6b and the longer duration allowing for a couple/few more ticks of triple stacking, I'd bet the dmg difference isn't as pronounced as you're thinking.
You obviously won't get more damage, but the reason to consider 6b evo is the 15%DR.
The couple hundred extra DPS you might get to armor and barriers is pretty small in the grand scheme of things, and whether or not it matters will depend on your weapons and the team composition.
capn...as a Knower of Things (a veritable thing-knower), I'll ask you...
Are DOTs inclusive with their end time maximums/maxima?
In other words, will a 9.0 sec DOT power experience its last tick at the 8.5 or 9.0 sec mark?
capn...as a Knower of Things (a veritable thing-knower), I'll ask you...
Are DOTs inclusive with their end time maximums/maxima?
In other words, will a 9.0 sec DOT power experience its last tick at the 8.5 or 9.0 sec mark?
Global game speed is actually higher (1.075) on Gold and Plat which effect CD speed. Not sure if it effects DOT length or not though?
capn...as a Knower of Things (a veritable thing-knower), I'll ask you...
Are DOTs inclusive with their end time maximums/maxima?
In other words, will a 9.0 sec DOT power experience its last tick at the 8.5 or 9.0 sec mark?
I would expect it to be at 9s, the first tick at 0.5. For many powers there is impact damage at time 0. In any case, there should be 18 total ticks.
Global game speed is actually higher (1.075) on Gold and Plat which effect CD speed. Not sure if it effects DOT length or not though?
Game speed is the only clock that matters within a game. CD isn't really shortened in terms of game time.
http://kalence.drupa...!22N51384!GD5BC
Fixed...if you don't use Pull on un-shielded mooks then Reave them..I can't help you
I second this build. Rank 4 in Pull is perfect for a weapons build. Pull is too useful (on Gold) to skip, and it's not useful enough on Gold to max it unless you're using an Acolyte build.
You obviously won't get more damage, but the reason to consider 6b evo is the 15%DR.
The couple hundred extra DPS you might get to armor and barriers is pretty small in the grand scheme of things, and whether or not it matters will depend on your weapons and the team composition.
This. Even if you try to max power damage (power amp, passives, etc.) Reave's dps is still kind of underwhelming. The difference between 6a and 6b is about 100 dps to Barriers/Armor- that's pretty whoopty doo, even when stacked. But dps isn't really the ideal purpose of the power anyways, its real utility is as an area primer, and secondarily, a source of DR. And especially if you're playing her as a CQC kit, using the bubble to chain BE's (Reave-Bubble-Reave etc.), getting 40% DR from Reave is pretty nice, it makes her quite tanky and even allows you to forgo a Cyclonic in favor of AMIII, which also really benefits that playstyle. For me at least, the extra duration and DR is easily more valuable than a negligible increase in Barrier/Armor dps.
I would expect it to be at 9s, the first tick at 0.5. For many powers there is impact damage at time 0. In any case, there should be 18 total ticks.
Gotcha. Although in order to be a detonator, doesn't Reave need to apply some dmg at the 0.0 sec mark?
Gotcha. Although in order to be a detonator, doesn't Reave need to apply some dmg at the 0.0 sec mark?
You need impact damage to detonate tech combos.
I used to skip Pull, then I tried with 4 points in Pull, then I decided, F it, Pull is worth all 6, Fitness is for scrubbies. Here is how I spec her:
http://kalence.drupa...!63N51384!GEFB3
Worth noting that the 5th point in Passives can easily be removed and put into fitness if you want a bit more shields, but Reave DR really makes it unnecessary. She is a biotic goddess.
This. Even if you try to max power damage (power amp, passives, etc.) Reave's dps is still kind of underwhelming. The difference between 6a and 6b is about 100 dps to Barriers/Armor- that's pretty whoopty doo, even when stacked. But dps isn't really the ideal purpose of the power anyways, its real utility is as an area primer, and secondarily, a source of DR. And especially if you're playing her as a CQC kit, using the bubble to chain BE's (Reave-Bubble-Reave etc.), getting 40% DR from Reave is pretty nice, it makes her quite tanky and even allows you to forgo a Cyclonic in favor of AMIII, which also really benefits that playstyle. For me at least, the extra duration and DR is easily more valuable than a negligible increase in Barrier/Armor dps.
If you set it up to max power damage, the difference between 6a and 6b is actually about 200dps to armor and 250dps to Barriers. Even taking Radius and Damage Reduction at 4 and 5, it's pretty easy to keep up 3 Reave stacks going. My favorite build can have 3x stacked Reave doing over 1600 dps to armor and almost 2200 dps to barriers. That's not "underwhelming" - it's better DPS than the average PUG does at full throttle.
If you take 6b, you can get an additional damage stack going due to the increased duration, so you can ultimately reach almost the same armor/barrier DPS. But you don't get to that point until you have applied 4 Reave stacks, which takes a long time. 6A combined with Warp Ammo drops Phantom and Banshee barriers extremely quickly, which makes it easy to neutralize two of the highest-pressure enemies in the game.
TL; DR: 6A is going to do more armor/barrier damage more quickly, but 6B is obviously better for damage reduction. If you're going for a max power damage build, I prefer 6A, but it's debatable. If you're doing a weapon-based build, 6B is a no-brainer (EDIT: same for a Pull-Reave Acolyte build).
Damage reduction Reave , skip pull, full offense bubble, slap a PPR on her. (Scorpion sidearm for Phantoms.)
Destroys Plat.
If you set it up to max power damage, the difference between 6a and 6b is actually about 200dps to armor and 250dps to Barriers.
Sure- the way I worded it was misleading. I didn't mean that the difference is 100 dps with the maxed power damage (pistol/smg power mag, power amp IV, maxed power passives), but that the difference between the two evo's, in themselves, is about 100 dps- and that, even with the maxed power build the damage difference still isn't that great, especially considering what you're giving up to get there (DR and increased priming duration from 6b, a mod slot on your gun, your Armor Bonus gear slot). And if you're using a big shotgun with Warp Ammo (as you should), then stuff like phantoms/collector captains/brutes/etc. aren't going to stay alive long enough for that extra 6a damage bump to matter anyways.
If you set it up to max power damage, the difference between 6a and 6b is actually about 200dps to armor and 250dps to Barriers. Even taking Radius and Damage Reduction at 4 and 5, it's pretty easy to keep up 3 Reave stacks going. My favorite build can have 3x stacked Reave doing over 1600 dps to armor and almost 2200 dps to barriers. That's not "underwhelming" - it's better DPS than the average PUG does at full throttle.
Well the first question is how much DPS do you lose by having no cover penetration whatsoever?
Secondly, how many Paladin shots are you saving by taking 6a instead of 6b?
For some perspective on dps, Hurricane will do ~ 5100 / 4140 barrier DPS on Justicar.
I like two builds for the justicar.
Melee. Run in and cast biotic sphere. Execute a heavy melee. Release venom during heavy melee recovery. Cast reave. Repeat. You'll get about 120% DR during your heavy melees and you do about 4400 damage to protections. Cast pull on unshielded mooks for some ridiculous heavy melee effects. Really fun build; highly recommend hosting though.
Shield recharge magic. Works great with any AR with a big magazine. Set up a defensive bubble, cast reave and lay waste spawns with your warp ammo. Probably one of the few builds that makes hard cover a viable strategy since hard cover prevents most staggers, stabilizing aim for ARs like the typhoon, reventant and spitfire, and gives you another 40% DR on top of your reave and bubble sources. You're shield recharge rate is nearly instantaneous so you can maintain a nearly constant stream of bullets and I think hard cover actually factors into shield recharge -- could be wrong about that. Works great with the PPR too. Suffers only because the game (as it exists today) actively sabotages a hard cover playstyle.
I remember reading that Reave could only stack a maximum of three times. That's not to say that whether that is true, or that I can even remember where I read it, but I remember it being said at some point.
It would certainly make more sense if it didn't have a maximum number to how many times it can stack.
I remember reading that Reave could only stack a maximum of three times. That's not to say that whether that is true, or that I can even remember where I read it, but I remember it being said at some point.
It would certainly make more sense if it didn't have a maximum number to how many times it can stack.
I'd always assumed that was a limitation of it's duration and recharge rate rather than a stacking limit due to the game engine.
I'd always assumed that was a limitation of it's duration and recharge rate rather than a stacking limit due to the game engine.
Yes, Justicar can hit 4.
I'd always assumed that was a limitation of it's duration and recharge rate rather than a stacking limit due to the game engine.
Ah, it could well have been someone theory-crafting on paper.
Yes, Justicar can hit 4.
By which I mean: someone theory-crafting on paper who apparently got their math wrong.
It's good to know that I can Reave to my heart's content without being concerned about redundancy.
Sure- the way I worded it was misleading. I didn't mean that the difference is 100 dps with the maxed power damage (pistol/smg power mag, power amp IV, maxed power passives), but that the difference between the two evo's, in themselves, is about 100 dps- and that, even with the maxed power build the damage difference still isn't that great, especially considering what you're giving up to get there (DR and increased priming duration from 6b, a mod slot on your gun, your Armor Bonus gear slot). And if you're using a big shotgun with Warp Ammo (as you should), then stuff like phantoms/collector captains/brutes/etc. aren't going to stay alive long enough for that extra 6a damage bump to matter anyways.
You're right, the damage difference isn't that great on its own, but that small difference multiplies itself for every stack of Reave you apply AND for every additional enemy you hit in your Reave radius. I understand what you're saying, and I agree - if you're using a big shotgun or other weapon damage build, Rank 6A doesn't make much sense. In fact, Rank 6A doesn't make much sense for any build, EXCEPT if you're going for an maxed Reave DOT-based build.
Well the first question is how much DPS do you lose by having no cover penetration whatsoever?
Secondly, how many Paladin shots are you saving by taking 6a instead of 6b?
For some perspective on dps, Hurricane will do ~ 5100 / 4140 barrier DPS on Justicar.
I actually lose very little DPS by using no cover penetration. I tend to prioritize enemies out of cover over enemies in cover anyway. Plus, if I want to hit something that's in cover, I can just use Pull or Reave on it to stagger it out of cover. With the Paladin's high damage per shot and Warp Ammo's armor weakening, I'm losing very little damage to armor DR. And the pistol piercing mod isn't going to give me enough penetration to double-hit anything anyway. The biggest thing I think I'm losing is the extra DPS I would get by using the extended mag. But I don't really care much about that, because emptying the 3-shot clip takes about the same amount of time as Reave's cooldown, which gives you a good rhythm when you're playing.
I don't get what you're trying to say with your second point.
Anyway, I never held this out to be an optimum high-DPS build. This is an "EZ-mode" build - it doesn't take a ton of skill to be extremely effective with it, even on Platinum. Also, DPS is limited by situation. A lot of stuff (including Phantoms and Dragoons) can be dead with this build before they even get in the Hurricane's effective range. No, it's never going to outperform a Hurricane (or any number of other weapons) right in a boss's face, but it will outperform a Hurricane when you're shooting at something (especially mooks) halfway across the map.
Shield recharge magic. Works great with any AR with a big magazine. Set up a defensive bubble, cast reave and lay waste spawns with your warp ammo. Probably one of the few builds that makes hard cover a viable strategy since hard cover prevents most staggers, stabilizing aim for ARs like the typhoon, reventant and spitfire, and gives you another 40% DR on top of your reave and bubble sources. You're shield recharge rate is nearly instantaneous so you can maintain a nearly constant stream of bullets and I think hard cover actually factors into shield recharge -- could be wrong about that. Works great with the PPR too. Suffers only because the game (as it exists today) actively sabotages a hard cover playstyle.
You know, I have used a similar build before, and it's actually pretty good with the Revenant (well, "good" by Revenant standards anyway). The main weaknesses of the Revenant are accuracy, stability, and the fact that it slows you down when you're shooting. Hard cover really helps with the first two, and the third isn't a concern if you're sitting in hard cover.
I wasn't really talking about enemies behind cover, what I was getting at was that in order to max power damage that way, you lose the ability to double hit some of the armored targets. Also makes some shots against buffed Cannibals and Husks or Brutes do 0 damage if you manage to hit armorI actually lose very little DPS by using no cover penetration. I tend to prioritize enemies out of cover over enemies in cover anyway. ...
This has to do with the utility of pure DPS numbers when enemy HP pools are finite.I don't get what you're trying to say with your second point.
I only quoted you to try and make some points about DPS from DOTs, specifically as it relates to how much damage you really gain or lose from going 6a or 6b. I would have to run pistol piercing if it were me, but I can't stand not being able to hit through cover, or not getting even partial damage double hits when available.Anyway, I never held this out to be an optimum high-DPS build.
I wasn't really talking about enemies behind cover, what I was getting at was that in order to max power damage that way, you lose the ability to double hit some of the armored targets. Also makes some shots against buffed Cannibals and Husks or Brutes do 0 damage if you manage to hit armor
This has to do with the utility of pure DPS numbers when enemy HP pools are finite.
Most of the time, the bulk of the damage on a larger target will be from combos and weapon damage, which are applied as spikes in comparison to mild DOT dps. With something like Paladin that has relatively good ROF, there might be shot savings. On lower ROF or single shot weapons, like say Wraith or Claymore, where a target ends up taking the same number of shots with either evolution, with the difference between 6a and 6b really just determining what amount of armor < damage per shot is taken off with the last shot.
I only quoted you to try and make some points about DPS from DOTs, specifically as it relates to how much damage you really gain or lose from going 6a or 6b. I would have to run pistol piercing if it were me, but I can't stand not being able to hit through cover, or not getting even partial damage double hits when available.
Can you get double hits with just the Pistol Piercing Mod and Warp Ammo? I thought you couldn't, but I could be wrong. Also, you're right with Brutes, but I generally use Cannibals/Husks as opportunities for AOE damage with Pull/Reave.
OK, I understand what you're getting at with the 2nd one. I never consider ammo savings to be an issue with the Paladin though.
I almost never take builds without some cover penetration (assuming no projectile weapon), but this is one exception. I tried it both ways, and I ultimately don't think it's necessary. it's occasionally frustrating not to be able to shoot through cover, but it only really makes a difference for me a couple times in any match.
Use arc pistol with her. It's a great way to stay in shape. AcLOLyte is too tedious...
The Acolyte / Pull build does turn cerberus into a joke.
The only reason I see to skip Pull is Platinum.
On Gold in each faction ..there are quite alot of unshielded mooks that spawn together & hang next 2 one another..so I do take Pull up to rank 4 radius...double mook boom
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