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Playable Races?


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#201
AresKeith

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Strange. Every time I saw Bioware talking about why they cut what they did from DAI, the answer was always because of the limitations the Xbox 360 and PS3 had, hence why they didn't even get most of the DLC. I never saw race selection be used as an explanation for why things were cut once. 

 

The inclusion of multiple races especially during DAI's development would in-fact involve rewriting the story and things being cut

 

There were once talks of having a personal story for the Inquisitor based on their background but that got reduced to a war table mission due to lack of time, there's also good evidence that the armor for the Inquisitor was lacking due to the late inclusion of multiple races


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#202
Hanako Ikezawa

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The inclusion of multiple races especially during DAI's development would in-fact involve rewriting the story and things being cut

 

There were once talks of having a personal story for the Inquisitor based on their background but that got reduced to a war table mission due to lack of time, there's also good evidence that the armor for the Inquisitor was lacking due to the late inclusion of multiple races

Oh, I'm not saying Killroy is wrong. It wouldn't surprise me if they did use it as a defense for cut content. I'm just saying it wasn't their go to defense, which is the limitations of the previous gen consoles. 

 

Sounds like I have another reason to be thankful for the inclusion of the other races, if what you described was cut as a result. The story thing, not the armor thing. The armor was just bad, even for the humans. 



#203
Rappeldrache

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I would be happy if I could play a human female and have a romance to a nice human man (not a gmrpfglds lesbian romance again ....).

 

I don't even think about "playing other races".



#204
Pasquale1234

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A character who would do this - announce their candidacy - is impossible. This is not a character that exists in DA:O. If you make this character, the game will refuse to allow you to play him or her. 
 
This is where mental fantasy comes in.


If you make a character that supposedly announces themself as a candidate for the throne at the Landsmeet, then, yeah, it's completely made-up because the game does not allow that option.

That does not prevent you from playing a character who sees their parents' death and brother's disappearance as an opportunity to seize power. The Terynship of Highever is not addressed in the game, and there is another route to the throne via marriage, should the character choose that.
 

No. Drinking the kool-aid, as you put it, allows the GWs to try to claim jurisdiction over you. It may well be that nations will recognize that jurisdiction. But that they can't force you to identify with their order.


Drinking the kool-aid gives you some key attributes of a GW - the ability to sense (and be sensed by) darkspawn, and to slay the archdemon. The taint. Aside from Riordan, I don't see any other GWs showing up to help out, or claim any jurisdiction over you. What it means to identify as something probably varies a great deal with the individual.

In any case, other than setting up strawmen to try to pick apart a quick example I threw out as a way of illustrating how it can feel different to role-play characters with different values and mindsets - or complain about a particular character type you weren't able to play in DAO, what is your real (off-topic) point and purpose here?

#205
Killroy

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Strange. Every time I saw Bioware talking about why they cut what they did from DAI, the answer was always because of the limitations the Xbox 360 and PS3 had, hence why they didn't even get most of the DLC. I never saw race selection be used as an explanation for why things were cut once.


Even the terrible hair was blamed on race selection. They had to make all the hairstyles work for multiple races(except the Qunari) instead of making them work for one race.
 

To let players have fun. Or is that not a valid reason to include something in a electronic entertainment medium?


Lots of things would be fun for players. If they added everything that would be fun they would never actually release a functioning game because there are only so many resources and so much time. I would prefer they focus their energies on narrative and character. Let Bethesda make games with bland campaigns and PCs. Narrative and characters put BioWare on the map, not a scattershot approach.

#206
In Exile

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If you make a character that supposedly announces themself as a candidate for the throne at the Landsmeet, then, yeah, it's completely made-up because the game does not allow that option.

That does not prevent you from playing a character who sees their parents' death and brother's disappearance as an opportunity to seize power. The Terynship of Highever is not addressed in the game, and there is another route to the throne via marriage, should the character choose that.

 

Character personalities lead naturally toward action - this choice rather than that choice. And choices require resources to be implemented. I don't quite get the hostility in your response. 

 

My point is simple: the value in a very open beginning from an RP perspective is radically undercut by a game that doesn't give you the option to follow through on what character concepts you might develop. The game prevents you from playing a character who sees the loss of their family as an opportunity to seize power because there's nothing in the game centered on that content, really, apart from the possibility of marrying into power. And that really only works for Alistair, because Anora directly tells you that you're not going to have real power in the relationship and be the subordinate partner.

 

Fergus is always going to be Teyrn, and there's nothing you can ever do about it. If you're a man, all you can do is take Loghain's fiefdom (which everyone can get) or play trophy husband to Anora.

 

So my point - made very generally and not really an attack on anything you've said, despite your feelings - is that an open-ended beginning isn't always good for RP. Because when the game doesn't tell you what's actually possible in game, it can lead to creating characters whose views and opinions and plots you can never express in game

 

I could invent a conversation in my mind where DudeHN tries to grab the Crown or the Teyrnship and gets rejected. But that's fantasy. The game doesn't allow it. 

 

 Drinking the kool-aid gives you some key attributes of a GW - the ability to sense (and be sensed by) darkspawn, and to slay the archdemon. The taint. Aside from Riordan, I don't see any other GWs showing up to help out, or claim any jurisdiction over you. What it means to identify as something probably varies a great deal with the individual.

 

My point is just that being a GW is different from other people claiming you are one. That's another issue with the RP freedom point - DA:O makes a choice about your self-perception that it never bothers to explain or express to you, but is an important part of how you can act in the world and what options you are given in the story. 

 

This goes back to my original point: it's important in an RPG for the game to explain to you what options you're allowed to have, and how tight the yoke is that restricts your freedom. Because that's the only way you can actually RP in a way that isn't essentially inventing content for yourself that is not featured in the game.

 

In any case, other than setting up strawmen to try to pick apart a quick example I threw out as a way of illustrating how it can feel different to role-play characters with different values and mindsets - or complain about a particular character type you weren't able to play in DAO, what is your real (off-topic) point and purpose here?

 

As I said above - my point is that it is simple. Just getting to be a Turian looking PC instead of a human looking PC doesn't work if you don't get the option to truly act like a Turian. It wasn't an attack on what you said - I just meant to use it as a platform. I apologize if you took offence. 



#207
BaaBaaBlacksheep

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Right, MEA is a new start for the ME franchise. If they choose to make an human as the main character, human who will begin as an N7 soldier, promote to be a spectre, has a badass spaceship and a multirace crew that come with him to kill foes... It will bring absolutely nothing to the ME franchise!

Don't talk about ressources! We know now for sure that most of the money goes to the marketing part (for Witcher 3, devs says that 2/3 of the money was used for that). What I really DON'T want to see, is a very beautiful MEA with awesome graphics but as empty as a bar after an permission of a whole taskforce of Krogans. Destiny was a well-selling game but was almost empty : If EA want that Bioware follow that path to make a game as cashcow as possible it will NOT be for the better of the franchise. For that, I hope to find lot of new features and one of the biggest good point of the ME world is his well-developped races. If MEA is a lot of way a reboot of the franchise, making a cross of a so well-made background sound more like walking in the wrong direction.

For TW3, devs take their time to make a full game. If Bioware must rush out the MEA game to please to EA, we will never seen an good game. Ever.


I think that is the premise of their way of saying "**** our fans! We don't care if you are not satisfied!" This is a new generation of gaming and a whole lot of video games are stepping up and they're making excuses, if that is the problem and they can't handle the pressure and keep up, they might as well stop making games and do something else.

#208
AresKeith

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I think that is the premise of their way of saying "**** our fans! We don't care if you are not satisfied!" This is a new generation of gaming and a whole lot of video games are stepping up and they're making excuses, if that is the problem and they can't handle the pressure and keep up, they might as well stop making games and do something else.

 

If I had a dollar for every time someone said these things 

 

/facepalm



#209
BaaBaaBlacksheep

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I don't know how to explain to you why this is dumb if you're not getting it yet.


Would you happen to have a cubicle @ BioWare? Are you getting a raise for attacking everyone who criticised and having different opinions about BioWare? Do you have a personal stake on this? 'Cause damn. Everybody's entitled to their own opinion and you don't have to attack people for having different opinions about stuff.
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#210
BaaBaaBlacksheep

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If I had a dollar for every time someone said these things

/facepalm


It's the truth and nothing but the truth! OK if it's not the truth then what is it that I'm wrong about? Say your peace and prove I'm wrong, I would like to hear your thoughts on this.

#211
Sidney

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I will never understand the fetish for multiple races. In games like Skyrim or even BG it is meaningless. It games like KoTor or PST it is irrelevant. In ME it would actually detract from the story.

The reality is every race added means thinning the content to support the new option or making the option a skin and not a meaningful choice. I see no upside to either.
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#212
AresKeith

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It's the truth and nothing but the truth! OK if it's not the truth then what is it that I'm wrong about? Say your peace and prove I'm wrong, I would like to hear your thoughts on this.

 

So it's true that Bioware is saying "**** our fans" because they don't want to do something that YOU want?

 

Either you're trolling or have a massive entitlement issue


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#213
Shechinah

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I will never understand the fetish for multiple races. In games like Skyrim or even BG it is meaningless. It games like KoTor or PST it is irrelevant. In ME it would actually detract from the story.

The reality is every race added means thinning the content to support the new option or making the option a skin and not a meaningful choice. I see no upside to either.

 

Roleplaying.
 



#214
Killroy

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Would you happen to have a cubicle @ BioWare? Are you getting a raise for attacking everyone who criticised and having different opinions about BioWare? Do you have a personal stake on this? 'Cause damn. Everybody's entitled to their own opinion and you don't have to attack people for having different opinions about stuff.


Not all opinions are valid. Your opinion, for example, is not a valid one. You think BioWare omitting race selection is a deliberate insult to you. That's entirely stupid.

#215
BaaBaaBlacksheep

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So it's true that Bioware is saying "**** our fans" because they don't want to do something that YOU want?

Either you're trolling or have a massive entitlement issue



Dude, really? Why can't I state what I wish to see in a game without being told I'm an egoist? If I didn't believe they were capable of more, I'd say give em a tee shirt and sign them up for the special camp. I'm just saying... Why can't I be a drell in the next ME?

#216
Sidney

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Roleplaying.


Right.

God knows PST was a disaster for role playing with only one character. Same for KOTOR, TW123 or FO1/2. I really felt like that race I picked meant so much in Morrowwind - I mean seeing dark elf hands changed my game entirely. DAI would have been better with the Qnari and dwarves who were badly underdeveloped left out and focus on the more interesting elves and human stories. DAO was functionally the exact same game once you left the O part of the DAO which was sad.

If the game doesn't react to what you have chosen then whatever narrative you build in your head is pointless. You might as well imagine you are a Turian who has a projected hologram of a human as a stealth interface but the projector is stuck on in MEA then and thus you are playing another race.

#217
BaaBaaBlacksheep

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Not all opinions are valid. Your opinion, for example, is not a valid one. You think BioWare omitting race selection is a deliberate insult to you. That's entirely stupid.



Whoa whoa whoa dude chill! I never said or meant my opinion is more valid than anyone else's, nor my intention to be an egotistical fanboy. You can believe and say what you want to, and nobody values opinions but their own. Obviously you're having issues about that. You have a good day.

#218
Killroy

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Dude, really? Why can't I state what I wish to see in a game without being told I'm an egoist? If I didn't believe they were capable of more, I'd say give em a tee shirt and sign them up for the special camp. I'm just saying... Why can't I be a drell in the next ME?


You don't seem capable of expressing what you want without making it all about your ego. You think the omission of race selection is a personal insult meant to anger you. You ARE entitled.

#219
AresKeith

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Dude, really? Why can't I state what I wish to see in a game without being told I'm an egoist? 

 

Because you outright claim that Bioware is saying "F their fans" because they chose not to do so along with saying they should stop and making something and that it's true

 

Why can't I be a drell in the next ME?

 

 

Because Bioware doesn't want to? It's their game and they can do want they want with it



#220
Killroy

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Whoa whoa whoa dude chill! I never said or meant my opinion is more valid than anyone else's, nor my intention to be an egotistical fanboy. You can believe and say what you want to, and nobody values opinions but their own. Obviously you're having issues about that. You have a good day.


I value all valid opinions. My opinions are often changed when a different opinion from a different perspective is presented because I'm not an egotistical anus. But not all opinions are valid. Some opinions are very stupid.
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#221
Malleficae

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I still want to play quarian. :|



#222
Sidney

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I still want to play quarian. :|


I want to play a Quarian in a Quarian centered story -- sure. Love to see game mechanics around their immunity problems and also interest around the geth issue. I don't want to play Quarian skinned generic hero # 6.

#223
Shechinah

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If the game doesn't react to what you have chosen then whatever narrative you build in your head is pointless.

 

A lack of reactivity on the game's part does not mean I cannot react to what I am playing as. I enjoy reactivity and consider it wonderful but it is not always necessary for enjoyable roleplay.

 

In some games I've even modded in racial options and had no problem roleplaying it since my racial roleplaying is not always contradicted by the games because the games often react very little to the actual race of the character and so makes little to no mention of it. 

 

One example would be in Fallout: New Vegas where I've played a ghoul and excused the game's lack of reactivity with my character having a tendency to hide his face and how he had escaped the usual raspy voice that was common with ghouls. There was a precedence for the latter since Jason Bright is an example of a ghoul with a normal voice from what I can remember.

 

Second example would be in Knights of the Old Republic II where I've played a twi'lek and did not, to my memory, find that the game contradicted my roleplaying more than once or twice which was not very noticable.    
 


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#224
Barquiel

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Speaking for myself, I know I'm tired of playing as a Human in the ME universe. It's the most boring race in the setting. I know humans, I've played them a million times...and if a scifi or fantasy game doesn't do anything interesting with them (and ME didn't do that...except for making them the Mary Sue race of the galaxy), I'm not too keen on them by default. I was annoyed at how much the writers favored this one boring race over all the others. Humans already took the spotlight in the first three games because of Shepard being the protagonist and basically space jesus. And now it seems we get the same nonsense again in Andromeda (and the leaks seem to confirm this). That's why I'd have prefered a 'blank' character like the inquisitor with race selection where I can fill the gaps via headcanon...and not another boring "Mass Effect human".
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#225
Laughing_Man

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I want to play a Quarian in a Quarian centered story -- sure. Love to see game mechanics around their immunity problems and also interest around the geth issue. I don't want to play Quarian skinned generic hero # 6.

 

That's like a niche of a niche.

 

The DA stats show that most players play as human pc even when presented with a race selection.

Out of the few that would play Quarian, probably even fewer would be interested in a game about getting the flu.