40 réponses à ce sujet

[Mgamerz]

The available bandwidth has relatively little impact on the things that make wireless problematic.

Define "bad 5Ghz setup of neighbors".

[Olivia Wilde]

i rarely get disconnects, but i've had more than my share lately

[Malaclypse The Younger]

On PS3, too, and last night had a total meltdown of 'EA server' connection issues that were so frustrating that I just turned the damnable thing off and have yet to turn it back on. Coincidence? Hellifiknow.

I use wireless as well so off host matches for me are painful more than I'd like. I've had some friends who I just can't play on their host. Luckily, I have done alright with my country ass DSL for the most part.

..like for begrudging nod to 'country-ass DSL' - I have it too and, in the big picture, playing and even hosting ME3 is usually not a problem. *knock on wood*

[Black_Mage]

I did notice the occasional disconnect happening more frequently.  My connection is not too bad so the problem is not at my end.

 

[frank_is_crank]

I did notice the occasional disconnect happening more frequently.  My connection is not too bad so the problem is not at my end.

 

 

E-Ping post.

[nico_wolf]

I did notice the occasional disconnect happening more frequently.  My connection is not too bad so the problem is not at my end.

 

 

that's impressive.

 

and yes, ...there should be a code of honor, to not hosting games using a wireless connection.

Or ping's higher then 10 ms, ... or what ever.

[Fuenf789]

Define "bad 5Ghz setup of neighbors".

Marksmad has a point there, Mgamerz. The 802.11 protocol is fundamentally flawed 4 highly populated areas - with the packet dlays introducing a substantial back-off and wait algorithm when clashes are detected if you are living in a congested area (iiirc 70% congestion is the cut-off point to high unpredictability in QoS. (Even though the 5 Ghz band has non-overlapping channels, and have less radiospectrum overlap with everyday home appliances, the amount of channels are still finite).

The fundamental protocol it still the same one even though there has been backward compatible version increments. In addition the newer routers have multiple antennas which simply grabs more channels concurrently at any specific time.

Luckily the 5GHz signal itself is physically less penetrant than the 2.4 but as a result a lot of them operates constantly in high power mode, stretching their dBm lobes much further than really necessary. And since 5Ghz are even easier to reflect against all type of objects, its resulting in an increased "smog" of shadow signals "jittering" all over the place.

Initially, all in all, it was simply the novelty of the limited number of 5Ghz routers in a neighbourhood- but that is also changing fast.

I'm not gonna get into the "neglibly" small effects of ionization on cellular/molecular level discussion (it wont hurt to ponder a bit on why a microwave that cooks water interfere with your wifi), but a LAN cable is nicely shielding any such energy to where it should actually go...efficiently (but arguably more expensive).

[Mgamerz]

I am talking about how a neighbor setup would affect yours on 5Ghz.. I am perfectly aware the weaknesses of WiFi. I've developed software for routers before.

[Terminator Force]

^ How about developing software to remove all the crazy bugs BioWare lazyly labels as features instead? Come on, Mgamerz. Disabling aim assist should only be the beginning for such a young 22 year old as yourself. The future is not set.

[Mgamerz]

Yeah, build me something that can turn this into something readable, for millions of lines:

        mov     $1, %rax 
        mov     $1, %rdi  
        mov     $message, %rsi    
        mov     $13, %rdx     
        syscall  
        mov     $60, %rax
        xor     %rdi, %rdi  
        syscall      

              

Also I am not 22

[Fuenf789]

I've developed software for routers before...

Then gothpunkboy89 got a router with your software on it- so he can directly claim money back from u.

Probably 21, then?

Yep. The nostalgia of assembler code.

Some of the ol'guys benefitting from PC modmaker cam help u out in a jiffy.
But if they do - whoever is gonna wiggle their fingers in there will have to make the adjustments directly and not translate that in some modern generation language, since nobody willingly writes that low without a proper reason (i bet the original variant was not performant enough). To simply understand what 100 assembler pages does u can use a c decompiler like boomerang in sourceforge.

[Fuenf789]

...how a neighbor setup would affect yours...

The answer is in there, it was probably just longer than your attention span. Read again.

[Mgamerz]

The answer is in there, it was probably just longer than your attention span. Read again.

Please, enlighten me, since you keep thinking I am talking about 2.4Ghz and not neighbors.

[Fuenf789]

Paragraph #3. Congestion. There's no Wi-Fi spec in common usage yet that would allow all the adapters and the base station to agree to move to a different channel if interference were detected.

[Mgamerz]

Many routers already have smart channel changing, which will change to the least congested channel. With the larger bandwidth for 5Ghz that's not really an issue anymore unless you live in a country where the airwaves are not regulated. Even on the university here where there's an AP every 10 feet there is only 25% congestion among the bandwidth according to the enterprise router I have.

When the router changes channels the clients will automatically scan to find it again when it loses connection.

[Fuenf789]

Rest assured. I promise not to write superiority statements herebelow like QMR, so we can relax our ring muscle, since we only have 1 :

Tldr.

***Disclaimer – the following info might inflict severe pain and mistrust in the world around u. Or cause bouts of severe outbursts of hysterical laughter. Proceed at own caution***


Continued conversation with Mgamerz.
Short variant =No

Spoiler

Long variant. Let's take your example then:

Test 1) Setup a netflix stream or skype call and walk down the aisle along those many modern 5GHz routers. Your connection will drop, when you reach the 92m (46m for 5Ghz) margin (look and see 100% excellent signal strength while walking-> What happened? (remove tongue from cheek)

The AP might renegotiate a "fresh" wifi channel, but existing streamed communication sessions will be broken down and reestablished.
It's like playing monopoly and going back to "start" without collecting the money.
DFS-enabled means it hops automatically, but not by seamlessly continuing session comms.

Everyday analogy of how it works :

If u started a transcontinental trip from an arbitrary location, let's say Boise University,ID to visit a fictive person, say Crimmy in the Netherlands, then you'll be first sent back to BOI (Idaho), with all your baggage, when, in LHR (Heathrow), a flight was overbooked between Heathrow and Schippol. DFS (which also coincidentally manages signal power) will automatically book your flight again from US->NL but u have to start a streamed session from scratch.
Of course, if you traveled a-synch with ur family & Mom, Dad, Sus, girlfriend and each booked independently, some might arrive earlier at Crimmy's doorstep. (for example email – bc non-time critical comms are less error "visible" due to reassembly). To increase the problem, recall that we have UDP ports opened, so the data is send on without error checking, and not even in the correct order... which is CRC'd only on Layer 2, and simply dropped when it's a garble.


Test 2) handling of interference - setup a netflix or skype session , and simulate a normal high-rise by putting 8 un-configured plain vanilla routers from Walmart in a domestic radius of 15.3m (5Ghz nominal reception distance) from another with some drywall/20 cm concrete and many reflecting surfaces, in between. (I.e. not the clean lab setup of a corporate/ university with uniform configured high-end auto-power adapt switches). See how the congestion explodes when two of them, with quad antennas, is used to watch something as mundane as a youtoob video. Instead of speaking softer, all wifi AP's, in unison, start to shout louder and louder (like people at party with house music playing in the background)

Now one might ask where this congestion all of a sudden came from with so much seemingly available channels (Theoretically 24 is available on 5Ghz non-overlapping). The answer lies exactly in regulation- the military (also TDWR) is using some of those bands, so any small misunderstood squeak (PHY error) causes a knee jerk reaction in those affected channels (standard for 30minutes). Most Wi-Fi chip designers & sw library developers (it’s still a separate modem chip in there even in your mobile) cut the crap and only use 8 of those non-affected channels (13 other available channels are simply avoided). If u built routers, would you make them country specific?..., or built one that can be used globally?...

Small titbit -> Even Apple, which is developing a tad more professional than Microsoft , is limited to 8... (I won't even mention the another spaghetti OS starting with A [A=Advertisting & selling private information] in the same sentence)

One step further - if you have a modern dual band WIFI router, that handles both 2,4 and 5 GHz, the simple momentary presence of an old Wifi Receiver/headset/mobile/notebook (in the 46m-92m radius), will cause most commercial wifi routers (default settings) to "automatically" switch to "compatibility mode". That means "or and not either" : by default it will be so nice to switch all comms to 802.11b while the old guy is in the room, only switching back to 802.11g/n/ac when retro leaves the area.

What do we learn from all this? If you live in a congested area, reboot your router daily to “flush” its memory of accidental “holes” to be avoided, or get a proper cable as TF said.