172 réponses à ce sujet

[Lavellan-San]

I'm really indifferent and I want to get people's opinions on the Chantry, thoughts?

[straykat]

I think the Andrastian stuff is cool.. I like having it's basic ideas and presence in the world. And umm... I have nothing against charity. lol. Other than that, not really. It could use reforms.

[Mlady]

I do not and have never liked the Chantry, and DAI has proven my dislike to be within reason. It's the human version of Dalish idiocy. I wish we could tell them who actually did create the Veil (not their precious Maker) and see what would happen.

[Ieldra]

I don't like the Chantry, but the real axe I have to grind is with Andrastianism as such. The Chantry is just a symptom.

[straykat]

I do not and have never liked the Chantry, and DAI has proven my dislike to be within reason. It's the human version of Dalish idiocy. I wish we could tell them who actually did create the Veil (not their precious Maker) and see what would happen.

 

Does the Chantry even claim that the Maker made the veil? I thought it was the Fade itself.

[Mlady]

Does the Chantry even claim that the Maker made the veil? I thought it was the Fade itself.

 

They say the Maker made it.

 

"He separated it from the first world by putting the Veil in between them, not realizing that His first children would be able to observe His new children and grow envious of them."

[straykat]

They say the Maker made it.

 

"He separated it from the first world by putting the Veil in between them, not realizing that His first children would be able to observe His new children and grow envious of them."

 

Fair enough. What's that from anyways? It doesn't sound like the Chant.

 

In any case, I find it funny that Solas is open to the idea of the Maker. Of course, he's a troll. But still.

[vertigomez]

Well... I've played characters who were Andrastian, ones who may or may not be considered heretics by the Chantry proper, as well as atheists and characters who revere the Stone/Creators. So I don't really know if I "support" the Chantry. It's just sort of there, and if I come into conflict with it I just give it the middle finger and move on.

[KaiserShep]

No, but I suspect it'll end up like modern day churches, its authority waning as more secular societies set in. 

[Mlady]

Fair enough. What's that from anyways? It doesn't sound like the Chant.

 

In any case, I find it funny that Solas is open to the idea of the Maker. Of course, he's a troll. But still.

 

http://dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Maker

 

I think somehow Solas' actions connect with their Maker. I feel that much of the beliefs of the people of Thedas are messed up and misread stories from the fall of Arlathan and somehow Andraste's actions were either combined with it or this Maker who spoke to her is not the real Maker and is what is sealed within the Black City. The same City that holds the taint and that led Corypheus to open the gates and release part of it.

[straykat]

http://dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Maker

 

I think somehow Solas' actions connect with their Maker. I feel that much of the beliefs of the people of Thedas are messed up and misread stories from the fall of Arlathan and somehow Andraste's actions were either combined with it or this Maker who spoke to her is not the real Maker and is what is sealed within the Black City. The same City that holds the taint and that led Corypheus to open the gates and release part of it.

 

Andraste is far after the fall of Arlathan. How is she connected?

[Mlady]

Andraste is far after the fall of Arlathan. She's basically the early beginnings of "modern" history... while Arlathan is ancient. How is she connected?

 

She spoke through the Maker. Whoever is pretending to be the real Maker was most likely something trapped in the Black City I think, and since we have much hints that Solas might have trapped the Evanuris there, it's likely Andraste was a mage who was manipulated, same as Corypheus.

[straykat]

She spoke through the Maker. Whoever is pretending to be the real Maker was most likely somehting trapped in the Black City I think, and since we have much hints that Solas might have trapped the Evanuris there, it's likely Andraaste was a mage who was manipulated by a demon, same as Corypheus.

 

To what end? She only held a rebellion and freed slaves. What was demonic about it? With Corypheus, it's pretty obvious.

 

I'm not trying to stop your speculation, but I don't see how you're connecting her with stuff like that.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

In any case, I find it funny that Solas is open to the idea of the Maker. Of course, he's a troll. But still.

Well, according to Dalish faith there is an entity even higher than the Creators, whom is seen as the one who created the Creators and everything. Since we know the Creators are actually the Evanuris, perhaps this higher being is what the Evanuris and the ancient elves worshiped as a deity before the Evanuris decided they should be god-kings. 

[Iakus]

I support what the Chantry could be, if it got its head on straight.

 

I don't like the Chantry, but the real axe I have to grind is with Andrastianism as such. The Chantry is just a symptom.

How so?  There appear to be a great many stripes of Andrastrianism.  The Chantry is just the one that ended up winning.

[Ilwerin]

Most of my characters are not andrastians, I don´t like Chantry much for what it represents. But I deffinitely like how Chantry is "written" - it is very real, like real religion, with its supporters, fanatics, objectors, pros, flaws and the power... and how it flexibly changes history and twists Maker´s words according to what is convenient at a time... it sounds so familiar...

[Mlady]

To what end? She only held a rebellion and freed slaves. What was demonic about it? With Corypheus, it's pretty obvious.

 

I'm not trying to stop your speculation, but I don't see how you're connecting her with stuff like that.

 

Flemeth's words alone. She gives history a push or nudge and many believe the wisp of Mythal in her might have also chosen Andraste first. Personally I think that Mythal's meddling and the whispers in the City all connect to whatever she has planned. My theory is she made Andraste what she is, thus started the ball rolling with all that's happened. And if the Old Gods are the ones who provoked Corypheus and not a fake one like the Evanuris, we know she is connected because she wanted the Old God spirit from the 5th Blight to survive and Mythal herself was worshiped as a dragon.
 

It would take a lot of time and work, but if someone complied everything, it seems we are all being played by something bigger than anything else we'd assume.

[Jaison1986]

She spoke through the Maker. Whoever is pretending to be the real Maker was most likely something trapped in the Black City I think, and since we have much hints that Solas might have trapped the Evanuris there, it's likely Andraste was a mage who was manipulated, same as Corypheus.

 

It's possible she was an old god vessel. There are a few events that almost feel on purpose. Like Andraste being born the exact same year Dumat was slain, the armor of the warden that slew Dumat can be found in Ferelden, Andraste's birthplace, and a mosaic of Mythal can be seeing in the ruins of the temple of sacred ashes during the final battle against Corypheus (and keeping in mind that Mythal was the one that came up with the dark ritual).

[TheEnigmousPretentiator]

No.

 

They say the Maker made it.

 

"He separated it from the first world by putting the Veil in between them, not realizing that His first children would be able to observe His new children and grow envious of them."

 

Andrastrian scripture also say it, though not explicitly:

 

So the Maker turned from his firstborn

And took from the Fade
A measure of its living flesh
And placed it apart from the Spirits, and spoke to it:

 

-- Threnodies 5

[straykat]

Flemeth's words alone. She gives history a push or nudge and many believe the wisp of Mythal in her might have also chosen Andraste first. Personally I think that Mythal's meddling and the whispers in the City all connect to whatever she has planned. My theory is she made Andraste what she is, thus started the ball rolling with all that's happened. And if the Old Gods are the ones who provoked Corypheus and not a fake one like the Evanuris, we know she is connected because she wanted the Old God spirit from the 5th Blight to survive and Mythal herself was worshiped as a dragon.
 

It would take a lot of time and work, but if someone complied everything, it seems we are all being played by something bigger than anything else we'd assume.

 

I thought Flemeth was well after Andraste (Towers age or something), and the spirit/Mythal dormant until then.

 

In any case, I felt like dropping this here:

 

http://forum.bioware...2#entry16597906

 

 

It's an old post from Sheryl Chee. It doesn't entirely apply, but I always got a kick out of it.

[Mlady]

It's possible she was an old god vessel. There are a few events that almost feel on purpose. Like Andraste being born the exact same year Dumat was slain, the armor of the warden that slew Dumat can be found in Ferelden, Andraste's birthplace, and a mosaic of Mythal can be seeing in the ruins of the temple of sacred ashes during the final battle against Corypheus (and keeping in mind that Mythal was the one that came up with the dark ritual).

 

Yeah I noticed that. That would make a lot of sense actually. I also found it interesting that Andraste and Flemeth wore those gold crowns too. I wonder if it's symbolic or implying more?

[Qun00]

The Chantry isn't inherently bad. It just needs to be guided by better hands.

[Mlady]

I thought Flemeth was well after Andraste (Towers age or something), and the spirit/Mythal dormant until then.

 

In any case, I felt like dropping this here:

 

http://forum.bioware...2#entry16597906

 

 

It's an old post from Sheryl Chee. It doesn't entirely apply, but it always got a kick out of me.

 

She is, but Mythal isn't and Flemeth as Mythal told my Inquisitor she nudges or shoves history when needed. She is seeking revenge and plans to shake the world. The story is she heard Flemeth's cries, but we honestly have no clue if she was around before that.

[berelinde]

I don't have an opinion about the Chantry at all. It's a part of a fictional universe and therefore has zero impact on my life.

 

Some of my characters are devout Andrastians, for whatever reasons. Others oppose the Chantry for a variety of reasons ranging from "I'm a mage, and I like living free, so therefore, I oppose the Chantry" to "Creators, yo."

 

So, if you're trying to formulate an opinion about the Chantry, I'd say that the best way to do so is to use your character's personality and values as a guide.

[Korva]

I support what the Chantry could be, if it got its head on straight.

 

Pretty much this. I'm an atheist IRL, but my concept and inspiration for my Inquisitor was to challenge myself to play a devout and open-minded believer. It was actually a lot of fun, and the wrestling with the "Herald of Andraste" angle was the icing on that cake. I wish I could have interacted with various Chantry folk of different stances a lot more, debated doctrine and my position in it, and so on. There's potentially a lot of good there, if charity, scholarship and greater inclusivity can win over powermongering. Unfortunately, with many of Justinia's probably more progressive-minded followers dead at the Conclave, the new Divine is going to have her work cut out for her there.

 

It's definitely an interesting and IMO in some aspects quite realistic facet of the setting, though at the same time it is kinda marred by the writers not thinking some things through and apparently never being quite sure what they want the faith to be. Deistic versus theistic, for example.