71 réponses à ce sujet

[ShadyKat]

Would be a cool concept, but will not happen. I'm just hoping the entire game isn't revolving arounf humanity like the original trilogy was. I can deal with a human protagonist, I just don't want to deal with listening to how awesome humanity is every few minutes.

[Killroy]

They should make it like GTA5 so we can play as 3 different characters or even like Resident Evil Revelations but knowing the current Bioware, that's too much effort for them.

That would be a terrible idea for an RPG. Playing 3 different characters? In a story-driven RPG?

[Statichands]

That would be a terrible idea for an RPG. Playing 3 different characters? In a story-driven RPG?

 

It would work well if Bioware executed it well. Don't be so closed minded, mate. 

[ShadyKat]

That would be a terrible idea for an RPG. Playing 3 different characters? In a story-driven RPG?

Worked pretty well in Drago Age: Origins. It can work, if the effort is put in to make it work.

[Arcian]

With voice filters there's no need for separate voice actors for each species. Not even the models require a lot of work, they need to make those for NPCs anyway.

Arguments against multiple playable species are complete BS.

[ShadyKat]

With voice filters there's no need for separate voice actors for each species. Not even the models require a lot of work, they need to make those for NPCs anyway.
Arguments against multiple playable species are complete BS.

Exactly.
Plus Bioware has done this before with Dragon Age. It's amazing that DA:O had
1 human origin
2 elf origins
2 dwarf origins
1 mage origin


And it worked just fine. Hell, 2 of the better origins were the non human races, in city elf and dwarf noble. I don't see how people say that wanting to role play in a role playinggame isn't a good idea. Yet the people who mostly pick human only, always role play as the exact same character in every game.....themselves.
Playing as a non human would probably open many up to actual role playing and trying to step into the shoes of something outside of their comfort zone.

[Killroy]

It would work well if Bioware executed it well. Don't be so closed minded, mate.

The point of an RPG is to play a role. If you have to play multiple characters you'll never be playing any of the roles, you'll just be playing 3 characters like 3 identical people without getting attached/committed to any of them. It works for GTA V because it's not an RPG.
 

Worked pretty well in Drago Age: Origins. It can work, if the effort is put in to make it work.

Except Origins didn't do anything like that. 

[Killroy]

With voice filters there's no need for separate voice actors for each species. Not even the models require a lot of work, they need to make those for NPCs anyway.

Arguments against multiple playable species are complete BS.

 

Voice filters only change the tone of the voice. They don't change accent, cadence or delivery.

And if making all the models were such a simple task why didn't they do it in ME1? Or ME2? or ME3? Or Dragon Age 2?

[Ahglock]

With voice filters there's no need for separate voice actors for each species. Not even the models require a lot of work, they need to make those for NPCs anyway.

Arguments against multiple playable species are complete BS.

So you don't want to play a turian just a human wearing a turian skin.

[Arcian]

So you don't want to play a turian just a human wearing a turian skin.

Well I'm not bloody expecting them to find a turian voice actor.

[Arcian]

Voice filters only change the tone of the voice. They don't change accent, cadence or delivery.

Why should they? Appearance is purely cosmetic. This was true of Shepard, who spoke and behaved exactly the same whether they were caucasian, african, asian, hispanic, etc.

And if making all the models were such a simple task why didn't they do it in ME1? Or ME2? or ME3? Or Dragon Age 2?

The ME trilogy was about Shepard, who was specifically written as a human. The point was to make the character a newcomer to the galactic scene so you could ask dumb questions about asari reproduction and compare the FCW to the Genophage.

DA2 was likely written with a human-centric protag in mind. But DA2 is also the poster child of corner-cutting so who the **** knows.

[N7Jamaican]

Mass Effect isn't Dragon Age, and Dragon Age isn't Mass Effect.

[Killroy]

Why should they? Appearance is purely cosmetic. This was true of Shepard, who spoke and behaved exactly the same whether they were caucasian, african, asian, hispanic, etc.

 Not every race has the same accent and cadence. 
 

The ME trilogy was about Shepard, who was specifically written as a human. The point was to make the character a newcomer to the galactic scene so you could ask dumb questions about asari reproduction and compare the FCW to the Genophage.

DA2 was likely written with a human-centric protag in mind. But DA2 is also the poster child of corner-cutting so who the **** knows.

 

The point.

 

 

 

 

-------->

 

 

 

 

 

Your head.

[Tantum Dic Verbo]

My dream for the next Mass Effect was a game in which we were rebuilding after civilizations were battered by the apocalyptic events at the end of ME3. I envisioned a DA:O sort of beginning in which different races were playable as we rose up from the ashes. Instead of galaxy-crushing monsters, we could have spent a chapter or two just saving a local community from extinction. I thought it would be fun to play a male human trapped on Thessia who faced a dilemma about not wanting to re-establish contact with the galaxy, because guy trapped on Asari planet.

Oh, well. I'm sure Andromeda will be new and fresh.

[CHRrOME]

This is quite possible post number 7 thousand regarding playable races for SP until now.

 

They already said like a year back that it will be human because the story they are making is about humans as protagonists. You can't just switch it to say, krogan and expect it to work.

In Dragon Age it works (kind of...) because of the story. In ME:A it wouldn't work very well if you allow the player to choose whatever race they want because again that depends on the story.

[Ahglock]

Well I'm not bloody expecting them to find a turian voice actor.

 

I hope that was an attempt at humor.  Edit to add as in you understood the point but went with humor instead of addressing it.

 

 

If a turian, krogan, drell, salarain, asari and human have the same dialogue options but just different accents then they failed at writing at a even more epic level than ME3.  In other words a accent shift with distortion wont give any impact of playing a different species, its just a reskin of human. I would pay for them not to put that in, it would be so bad it would detract from the game whether its just an option you can ignore or not.

[Arcian]

I hope that was an attempt at humor. Edit to add as in you understood the point but went with humor instead of addressing it.

Why should I dignify you with a serious response when your argument boils down to "If this feature doesn't live up to my ridiculous expectations, it's a dumb feature that shouldn't be included"? The aliens in Mass Effect 1-3 all sounded like generic americans, with a few exceptions like Tali and some other quarians. You have no basis to expect differently in ME:A.

If a turian, krogan, drell, salarain, asari and human have the same dialogue options but just different accents then they failed at writing at a even more epic level than ME3. In other words a accent shift with distortion wont give any impact of playing a different species, its just a reskin of human. I would pay for them not to put that in, it would be so bad it would detract from the game whether its just an option you can ignore or not.

No other multi-species RPG in history has made different species dialogue remarkably different from one another. Yet the option to play different species has been very appreciated. You cannot reasonably expect ME to be different. Just because your expectations are unrealistic doesn't mean the concept of playable aliens is.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Would be a cool concept, but will not happen. I'm just hoping the entire game isn't revolving arounf humanity like the original trilogy was. I can deal with a human protagonist, I just don't want to deal with listening to how awesome humanity is every few minutes.

According to the leak this game is sadly going to be yet another game stroking humanity's ego. 

[Arcian]

Not every race has the same accent and cadence.

In Mass Effect they do. With the exception of the quarians, most if not all aliens sound like generic americans with voice filters.

The point.




-------->





Your head.

No, you obviously missed MY point. Making the ME protag human was a design choice, not a consequence of budget or development limitations. A human protag in ME:A is also by design. They have both the budget and the technological capacity to include playable aliens, they've just chosen not to.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

 Not every race has the same accent and cadence. 

To be fair, we don't really have any idea how the various races actually sound since what we hear is the work of translation implants. 

[Gothfather]

I agree that the addition of multiple races and multiple voices for the protagonist hurt Dragon Age: Inquisition badly, I believe that it is why the side quests lost a lot of the voice work and conversations because they had to use that voice acting space elsewhere.  I wish I could find the quote, but I think someone from BioWare once posted that 40% of total size of Inquisition was voice work.

I recall the quote as well but I believe that was in reference to the size of the download the game files themselves not the budget. But my memory is fuzzy at best on this and not to be taken as gospel.

 

I do have a blog article that David Gaider wrote that shows how companions are made and how they impact the dialogue budget which shows just how increased player choice will impact how content is experienced.

 

http://www.makinggam...mbers,6845.html

[N7Jamaican]

To be fair, we don't really have any idea how the various races actually sound since what we hear is the work of translation implants. 

 

Wrong. You can close your eyes and tell the difference between a Batarian and a Krogan, a Turian and a Salarian, Hanar from Drell, etc.

[Keitaro57]

That would be a terrible idea for an RPG. Playing 3 different characters? In a story-driven RPG?

Ever heard of Live a Live? A Squaresoft game from 1994 where you play with 7 different main characters, each with different gameplay inside a cross scenario. And it worked well.

 

Well, what would be good, not a strain on the poor devs who are totally unable to make new things and are totally worhtless when they try to made a good game : Make the companions playable! If we have some parts where we control our companions and longer parts than the Joker one, we would be able to play other races in the main quest.

[Gothfather]

In Mass Effect they do. With the exception of the quarians, most if not all aliens sound like generic americans with voice filters.

No, you obviously missed MY point. Making the ME protag human was a design choice, not a consequence of budget or development limitations. A human protag in ME:A is also by design. They have both the budget and the technological capacity to include playable aliens, they've just chosen not to.

It is a design choice because the VAST majority of players never make a non human character according to the metrics of DA:O. 80% of people played Human's, only 15% of players played elves and 5% played a dwarf.

 

So this is factual evidence that shows 4/5 player do NOT play other races when given a chance. So why should Bioware make content that 95% of the player base will never play? I am referring to all those resources made to give us the Dwarven origins. I also believe that most of the elves made were mages so again all those resources used to make the alienage and the Dalish origins were not experienced by most players or even most of the 15% of player who made an elf. Again two origins that were a waste of resources in terms of cost and the number of players that experienced the content.

 

We as a community are not served when lots of resources are put into a game that the vast majority will never use or experience. It is far better to put content in that 4/5 players will experience vs 1/7 or 1/20 will experience.

 

You may WANT to play a different race but that does not mean it is a wise use of resources or that it will make for a better game. We don't always want what is good for us and we often want things that are not good for other people. It is a sign of maturity to put aside our wants for the better then simply demanding something because we want it.

 

Source: http://forum.bioware...-da3/?bioware=1

 

Notable quotes by David Gaider

 

 

 

Elven mage was the most popular elf origin, by far. Then the city elf, then the dalish. Don't remember the distribution, sorry, just that city elf and dalish were both well behind. All I remember is the dwarf origins: 3% for the dwarven nobles, 2% for the dwarf commoner.

I don't know if you can translate into an actual number based on shipped units, or at what point these figures were arrived at. Either way, it's a pretty notable trend.

Regardless, does having a low percentage of use mean we don't do it? I don't think so-- there's only so far you want to take that argument, lest you arrive at a point where you say that all content is required to be seen by every player. At that point you have no choices... and, like I said, there's a certain value to players that choices exist even if they aren't taken. So it's good to notice the trend, if not to have the trend always dictate response.

 

Numbers for total elves made

 

 

 

It's probably worth mentioning that elves were only played by 15% (or less? I don't remember the exact number) of DAO players... as in ever. Meaning only 15% even tried the elven origins on one of their playthroughs.

Which is not to say the new elven look in DA2 would make it more or less popular, if offered... or anything, really, other than that the DAO elves were not inherently popular options to begin with.

I think this is one of those places where the telemetry doesn't lie. Race options are very popular with a smaller group of players-- to them, the expense is totally worth it. But the vast majority of players will only pick humans, even when options are offered. Whether there's any value to those people that such options exist, even if not taken, is the only intangible element in the equation (and should probably not be underestimated).

 

On the sample size

 

 

 

For DAO you had to specifically disallow telemetry to be delivered-- and that's separate from the login. Considering our sample size of data is in the millions of individual players, I don't think it can really be discounted as statistically inaccurate.

 

 

Given FACTS vs Emotion i don't think race choice in a Bioware game is worth the cost. It is not a feature that most players use and these are facts so how do YOU justify the expense needed to add these to the game when the VAST majority of players will not use the feature?

 

As an FYI I have played every origin in Origins, I have made an elf circle mage, Dalish mage, and rogue. Yes a Dalish mage using a mod called adoption I believe. I have also made a Dwarf rogue. I have also made a Elf, Qunari and Dwarf in DA:I along with Humans in both games but i don't let EMOTION cloud my judgement. So don't assume that my position is because I don't use or like racial choice.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Wrong. You can close your eyes and tell the difference between a Batarian and a Krogan, a Turian and a Salarian, Hanar from Drell, etc.

That's how the translators make them sound, not how they actually sound. For example, the Hanar don't even make sound. They communicate via bioluminescents. Until we experience them communicate in their native languages without any translation, we don't know how they sound.