71 réponses à ce sujet

[ShadyKat]

It is a design choice because the VAST majority of players never make a non human character according to the metrics of DA:O. 80% of people played Human's, only 15% of players played elves and 5% played a dwarf.

So this is factual evidence that shows 4/5 player do NOT play other races when given a chance. So why should Bioware make content that 95% of the player base will never play? I am referring to all those resources made to give us the Dwarven origins. I also believe that most of the elves made were mages so again all those resources used to make the alienage and the Dalish origins were not experienced by most players or even most of the 15% of player who made an elf. Again two origins that were a waste of resources in terms of cost and the number of players that experienced the content.

We as a community are not served when lots of resources are put into a game that the vast majority will never use or experience. It is far better to put content in that 4/5 players will experience vs 1/7 or 1/20 will experience.

You may WANT to play a different race but that does not mean it is a wise use of resources or that it will make for a better game. We don't always want what is good for us and we often want things that are not good for other people. It is a sign of maturity to put aside our wants for the better then simply demanding something because we want it.

Source: http://forum.bioware...-da3/?bioware=1

Notable quotes by David Gaider





Numbers for total elves made





On the sample size






Given FACTS vs Emotion i don't think race choice in a Bioware game is worth the cost. It is not a feature that most players use and these are facts so how do YOU justify the expense needed to add these to the game when the VAST majority of players will not use the feature?

As an FYI I have played every origin in Origins, I have made an elf circle mage, Dalish mage, and rogue. Yes a Dalish mage using a mod called adoption I believe. I have also made a Dwarf rogue. I have also made a Elf, Qunari and Dwarf in DA:I along with Humans in both games but i don't let EMOTION cloud my judgement. So don't assume that my position is because I don't use or like racial choice.

Stats also say most people didn't make a female Shepard. Something like 18%. So I guess the female option in ME:A should be removed as well.

[Galbrant]

Worth the cost to me. I made a Dwarf and Qunari in Inquisition. I had a blast playing them. I'll be okay if they don't hire voice actors to voice the player character. In fact the voices for the Inquisitors were pretty garbage in my opinion especially for the the female player character. So scrap it  and leave it to mah imagination.  Mass Effect has this huge universe and some time I think its better to explore it as a species that isn't human.  Whether that be Salarian or KROGAN KROGAN KRO-erm or any other species for that matter. Screw the Hu-Mans(Ferengi accent).

Spoiler

I love my Femshep until she failed hard at the end. But I'll let her go in the blender.  Did I mention that I want Krogans!? Pretty sure I didn't mention it.   Besides.... Human had their chance to save the galaxy and they blew it. It's time for the Kro- err some other species else take the mantle which is KROGAN!

[Sanunes]

I recall the quote as well but I believe that was in reference to the size of the download the game files themselves not the budget. But my memory is fuzzy at best on this and not to be taken as gospel.

 

I do have a blog article that David Gaider wrote that shows how companions are made and how they impact the dialogue budget which shows just how increased player choice will impact how content is experienced.

 

http://www.makinggam...mbers,6845.html

 

That was what I was trying to say for something that takes up that much disk space there is only so much they can accomplish.  For all that voice acting has checked with QA to make sure it was recorded properly and triggers properly in the game.

[Killroy]

No, you obviously missed MY point. Making the ME protag human was a design choice, not a consequence of budget or development limitations. A human protag in ME:A is also by design. They have both the budget and the technological capacity to include playable aliens, they've just chosen not to.

 

Oh, so you know the game's development budget? Please, share this information with the rest of the class.

[N7Jamaican]

Oh, so you know the game's development budget? Please, share this information with the rest of the class.

 

As much as people THINK they know about Mass Effect and game development, they know nothing. Never take these self proclaim industry insiders on the forums.  However, one could get BioWare's budget for certain games through press releases and other articles, no one in this forum aside from the workers at BioWare know how much is in this game's budget.

 

They also do not know the technical limitations that BioWare can or can not achieve.  

[CHRrOME]

Stats also say most people didn't make a female Shepard. Something like 18%. So I guess the female option in ME:A should be removed as well.

 

Only if Bioware would like to commit seppuku or get their offices nuked, lol.

 

Now, at this point people can't expect they to change their design choice (I mean at this point in the development process of ME:A).

I know people wanted different playable races for ME since ME2, I believe. But the way I see it is that they either don't feel confident making a game that allow you to play as, say 4 different races because it will need a monumental ammount of work/resourcess and if it ends up in 4 different skins people like me are going to complain until the end of times. That or they simply want to keep telling the story of mankind rather than making a story that fits multiple playable races like DA:I (and as I always say, DA:I is not particularly great in this matter either).

 

I'm sure they considered the option, but maybe for one of the reasons above or maybe because something else, they've dismissed it.

[Gothfather]

Stats also say most people didn't make a female Shepard. Something like 18%. So I guess the female option in ME:A should be removed as well.

 

Its not a case of blindly following the numbers, I even quoted Gaider saying as much because I knew some fool would IGNORE the facts and let emotion rule them because humans are intrinsicly selfish. FemShep use the same animations and has 99% the same dialogue responses to maleShep so the COST to implement a Femshep is a LOT less then it would cost to implement a multiple racial option Protagonist. If you are able to create content that a few will experience but it is cheap then it is worth doing.

 

You are comparing apples to oranges it is also know as a FALSE equivalency. Femshep creates diverse representation for the players. AlienShep does not create more diverse representation because there are NO aliens playing Mass effect. So there is no intrinsic value to its inclusion of this player choice which can't be said about including a MaleShep and a FemShep as this choice does have intrinsic value.

 

It is about FACTS and reason vs Emotion and selfish desire. Factually speaking racial options add ZERO value to a game for most people while gender options do add value even when not chosen because it shows and promotes gender equality. Gender equality isn't SJW nonsense either, it is providing players the ability to play a hero that is representative of them even if they choose Not to. But Now that I used facts and talked about gender i am sure this will result in a couple of internet "rules" being proven true.

 

Gamers need to get over the childish notion that "I want" is a valid argument for game design. Its all fine to want things but that doesn't justify the inclusion in and of itself. Cost and benefit should dictate what is included and racial options haven't shown to be really all that of a bargain when you compare the cost vs the number of people that gain any advantage to their inclusion. Remember only 20% of people even TRIED a different race in DA:O so we can assume that a given percentage of them DISLIKED the experience so it is not outlandish to say that less than 1/5 people gained any advantage for having 6 origins in DA:O when two could have served around 90% of the player base. Reducing the costs of the origins chapters by 2/3. It isn't hard maths, "it will cost 1/3 the money and please around 90% of the players. hmmm... maybe it wasn't the best approach in hindsight to triple the costs to add 4 more origins that make 10% more people happy?"

 

I'll grant that race inclusion with Origins wasn't a design mistake because they DIDN'T have the metrics during production, but I will say that it was a huge design mistake for DA:I because they did have the numbers and it was a whole lot of resources that could have been spent to make side quest dialogue more engaging or to flesh out the companion stories so they were not all two conversation arcs.

 

"My name is Cassandra and i am having a crisis of faith."

 

"Hey Inquisitor how are things? Thanks for talking to me the other day my crisis of faith is over."

 

inquisitor - "Wait? what? its over? You just told me it happening last conversation how does that work?"

 

Player choice isn't good in and of itself it needs to further the game and the gaming experience. Race options have numbers that show they do NOT improve things for the VAST majority of players at all.

[sleasye74]

They could've stared a different race instead of human, I think Turians and Korgans would be best choice Imo to be the protagonist cause the customization you could do to them.
For those who say it's to far into development to add races, remember DAI got pushed back a year to add multi races(which I did not agree with but I still use other races) so I wouldn't say it's too late yet.
It would be nice to play a different race for SP but I don't need to if the games story and characters are well written.

[Killroy]

They could've stared a different race instead of human, I think Turians and Korgans would be best choice Imo to be the protagonist cause the customization you could do to them.
For those who say it's to far into development to add races, remember DAI got pushed back a year to add multi races(which I did not agree with but I still use other races) so I wouldn't say it's too late yet.
It would be nice to play a different race for SP but I don't need to if the games story and characters are well written.

 

Inquisition was delayed because it was behind schedule, not because they needed a year to add additional races.

[KaiserShep]

They could've stared a different race instead of human, I think Turians and Korgans would be best choice Imo to be the protagonist cause the customization you could do to them.
For those who say it's to far into development to add races, remember DAI got pushed back a year to add multi races(which I did not agree with but I still use other races) so I wouldn't say it's too late yet.
It would be nice to play a different race for SP but I don't need to if the games story and characters are well written.

Playing a krogan PC in Mass Effect wouldn't really work if the krogan are still a demilitarized group that has no place in the Council. There would be no Normandy to command

[sleasye74]

Inquisition was delayed because it was behind schedule, not because they needed a year to add additional races.

Can you source that cause I'm pretty sure they delayed DAI to add mult races when DAI was suppose to be human only?

Playing a krogan PC in Mass Effect wouldn't really work if the krogan are still a demilitarized group that has no place in the Council. There would be no Normandy to command

I ment star Korgan or Turian for MEA
In MEA I don't think the council will matter as much and the Normandy was shepherds not the ship I'll have in MEA.

[Killroy]

Can you source that cause I'm pretty sure they delayed DAI to add mult races when DAI was suppose to be human only?

 

Only Qunari were added in that additional year. They added Elves and Dwarves 2 years before release. Check the Inquisition Twitter thread for quotes from devs. IIRC it was almost exactly 2 years before release that they announced Elves and Dwarves were added.

[sleasye74]

Only Qunari were added in that additional year. They added Elves and Dwarves 2 years before release. Check the Inquisition Twitter thread for quotes from devs. IIRC it was almost exactly 2 years before release that they announced Elves and Dwarves were added.

Alright I thought it was all 3 not just Qunari, but they did delay for a year to add another race which could happen if the demand is high enough. Like I said before it doesn't matter to me as long as the story and characters are well written.
Thanks Killroy for clearing that up for me, should have done it myself but I finally got a day off so I'm steady chillin aka being lazy

[rashie]

Either put proper effort into developing unique content for each choice that does more than slight dialogue changes, or don't bother including race picks. The inquisitor was quite bland in this regard, much because they didn't go far enough with it.

[ozenglish]

I don't think we need multiple races to play.  The story is about something that we as a species in real life are only just getting to the beginning of, and that is exploring our world, the ones near us, and who knows, maybe in the not too distant future, we might find out there are Asari and Turian in the galaxy after all.  Look at all the information we have just found in the last year about our solar system.  If BioWare could actually use some of it in the beginning legs of the game, like training on Pluto, or finding Voyager 1 being infested with some weird space creature.  

But I have to agree with a few people, Inquisition was let down by too much player choice in voice overs alone.  We could have had more game, or more fun with our party members.  Also, I think too much choice makes a game too prone to criticism.  When you have no choice, people get annoyed at it, but as long as you can create a virtual version of yourself or your alter ego, then most people are happy with that.  But when you get to the point that you are paying more money on dialogue and voice acting, which could go into making the world even more rich, or the game longer with more content, then I think this is a great option.  To be fair, Mass Effect could really benefit from less on the VOA, and more money on the story/game world/graphics and other things that a lot of people are mad about.  

The one thing I would eventually like to see though, maybe in book form, or mobile phone context even, would be small stories of different races able to be played.  Say a 3hour mini game with a Quarian protagonist or any other species.  Plus, if less VOA means more content or lower shelf price, then I am good with that.

[Killroy]

Alright I thought it was all 3 not just Qunari, but they did delay for a year to add another race which could happen if the demand is high enough. Like I said before it doesn't matter to me as long as the story and characters are well written.
Thanks Killroy for clearing that up for me, should have done it myself but I finally got a day off so I'm steady chillin aka being lazy

 

They didn't delay the game to add Qunari though. The Qunari were an afterthought(hence the total lack of content for Qunari inquisitors), added to the game because they had an additional year. 

[sleasye74]

I wonder if people would be open to the next ME(if there is one) having a different race as the protagonist?

[Ahglock]

I wonder if people would be open to the next ME(if there is one) having a different race as the protagonist?

Less interested but I'd be open to any species being the protagonist if the gameplay is solid.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I wonder if people would be open to the next ME(if there is one) having a different race as the protagonist?

I'd be more open for that than if it was yet another human. 

[Fortlowe]

I'll wait and see on the playable races thing. Worked out just fine in Inquisition if you ask me, but ME is a different ballgame, so I digress. I do see an opportunity in perhaps playing as a squad member every now and again, though. There will inevitably be some hard points in this branching narrative believably to keep it moving in the direction of its intended conclusion. Why is that burden always shouldered by the main player character?

I'd like to play through, or even better, unlock some short, very streamlined missions where I play as a squadmate. I'd recommend very little in the way of game changing choice on these vingettes. I see it as an opportunity to see the story go forward, without such a heavy burden of choice, while gaining insight into my squadmates character.

Its not unprecedented, by the by. Joker was playable in ME2. So far as explaining the shift in perspective, make it a flashback, or a secret op the character hides from the main character unlocked by conversations.

[KaiserShep]

Its not unprecedented, by the by. Joker was playable in ME2. So far as explaining the shift in perspective, make it a flashback, or a secret op the character hides from the main character unlocked by conversations.

 

BioWare's gone even further than that with Leliana's song, where we play strictly as Leliana and even have dialogue choices, which I guess is where BioWare really starts using the paraphrasing for the voiced PC. 

[KaiserShep]

I wonder if people would be open to the next ME(if there is one) having a different race as the protagonist?

I'd probably be very reluctant to buy it. I don't really have a great deal of interest in the aliens of the franchise that I'd want to play one for hours on end in the game's story.