687 réponses à ce sujet

[SnakeCode]

Let's do some math.

 

Women: 50% of the people on the planet

LGBQT: 10% of people on the planet

People of color: 84% of people on the planet

 

Simple math tells me that the group that identifies as white, hetero males are not the majority of the world's population; and, yet, developers disproportionately cater to this group.

 

As to the rest, I've never said that I don't want straight white males in the games. So, I really have nowhere to go with that statement.

 

You don't think most of those people worldwide have bigger things to worry about than videogame representation?

 

You probably aren't going to like what i'm about to say, in fact it's probably going to offend you, but it needs to be said. It takes an absurd amount of privilege to be a person who's big concerns in life are how many women/LGBT characters are in games, or how much space men take up on public transport. Most of us have bigger fish to fry.

[Mr.House]

Well, the majority of developers are STRAIGHT WHITE MALES, you can't hate them for putting themselves in their games.

Eh you can criticize self insertion, after all authors are critised of it all the time. Even some devs HAVE been critised in the past, a good example being Tadashi Satomi who created a character with the same name who was in a relationship with Tamaki Uchida who was based on an idol he had a crush on in real life. This led to the character being scrapped in EP.

 

Self insert is just bad overall and should be frowned upon.

[maia0407]

That's not what they meant at all, what they meant is that companies should not be forced to add token character of groups just to satisfy people. If a black character is added, they should have a purpose, the purpose should not be to satisfy people. Same with any other group. This is what happen with TW3 that had SJW and people who didn't understand the lore complain there was no "black character" which would have made no sense in the confines of what TW3 was doing.

 

I agree. I do not want token characters either.

Like Mr.House said, that's not what I meant. Also are you really comparing the amount garbage thrown at developers for not appeasing to minorities to actual criticism?  

 

I don't know what 'garbage' you are referring to. Most of the critiques of games I read are reasonable criticism. Of course, I can't speak for every individual tweet or random FB post. I certainly don't exaggerate the criticism as lynchings and the like.

Well, the majority of developers are STRAIGHT WHITE MALES, you can't hate them for putting themselves in their games.

That's another area that needs work. We need more diversity within the developers themselves.

[straykat]

I've said this before, but I'm a minority - and I don't care about Witcher's setting not "catering" to my "race". For heaven's sake, the places have names like "Nilfgaard" and "Hengfors". I'd be annoyed if saw someone Asian in it like myself, for example (without good story reasons at least). It'd just be contrived and ruin my immersion.

 

I'll take a sincere creation over that. Thanks. I might be a certain "race", but I'm also just a plain human with a low tolerance for bullshit.

[Dread-Reaper]

Eh you can criticize self insertion, after all authors are critised of it all the time. Even some devs HAVE been critised in the past, a good example being Tadashi Satomi who created a character with the same name who was in a relationship with a character he had a crush on a idol who was used to create Tamaki Uchida (and  Satomi was in a relationship with said character in game) this led to the character being scrapped in EP.

 

Self insert is just bad overall and should be frowned upon.

I didn't mean it by self insertion, but by writing things you're comfortable with.

[Mr.House]

I didn't mean it by self insertion, but by writing things you're comfortable with.

Ah ok, yeah that I understand.

[maia0407]

You don't think most of those people worldwide have bigger things to worry about than videogame representation?

 

You probably aren't going to like what i'm about to say, in fact it's probably going to offend you, but it needs to be said. It takes an absurd amount of privilege to be a person who's big concerns in life are how many women/LGBT characters are in games, or how much space men take up on public transport. Most of us have bigger fish to fry.

Nice dodge. I'm just refuting your point that people other than straight white males are the 'minority'. I haven't said anything about what other people worry about.

 

No worries. I'm not offended, though. But, honestly, it takes an absurd amount of privilege to have the luxury of posting on a gaming forum in the first place. First world problems, right? It takes even more privilege to complain about people criticizing developers for not representing them in games. White male privilege, right?

[Dread-Reaper]

I don't know what 'garbage' you are referring to. Most of the critiques of games I read are reasonable criticism. Of course, I can't speak for every individual tweet or random FB post. I certainly don't exaggerate the criticism as lynchings and the like.

That's another area that needs work. We need more diversity within the developers themselves.

Like I said previously, The Witcher 3 and Assassin's Creed Unity, hell, I remember seeing some people berate Bioware because they felt that Krem wasn't a good enough transgender representation.

[Daemul]

Let's do some math.

 

Women: 50% of the people on the planet

LGBQT: 10% of people on the planet

People of color: 84% of people on the planet

 

Simple math tells me that the group that identifies as white, hetero males are not the majority of the world's population; and, yet, developers disproportionately cater to this group.

 

As to the rest, I've never said that I don't want straight white males in the games. So, I really have nowhere to go with that statement.

 

Tbh the vast majority of the world population has no interest in video game representation or video games in general. 

[Statichands]

 

This picture is so real. I can name loads of cool white protagonists but I can only name a couple of cool black and asian protagonists and sometimes when we do get these characters, they can be so stereotypical.

[MyKingdomCold]

I haven't read all of the posts in this thread, but isn't there a reason why both genders were in the Fallout 4 trailer?  I mean, you start the game with both genders and you choose in the prologue/at the beginning whether you'll play as the man or woman.  Are there any Bioware games like this? Games where you create both genders in character creation? If not, I don't see the point of this topic.

[The Heretic of Time]

Let's do some math.

 

Women: 50% of the people on the planet

LGBQT: 10% of people on the planet

People of color: 84% of people on the planet

 

Simple math tells me that the group that identifies as white, hetero males are not the majority of the world's population; and, yet, developers disproportionately cater to this group.

 

As to the rest, I've never said that I don't want straight white males in the games. So, I really have nowhere to go with that statement.

 

But not the entire world plays videogames. When it comes to core gamers who invest a lot of time and money in triple-A games, straight white men are very much in the majority. And that's really all that matters if you're trying to sell a multi-million dollar game.

And ironically, most of these men don't even care what the gender or skincolor of the protagonist is. Many are perfectly fine playing as a female or colored protagonist. In fact, some even prefer to play as a female protagonist!

It's the women who make an issue over the gender or skincolor of their protagonist. They are the ones who often won't even consider playing a male, ever, if they're given the option to play a female. 

Just looking at my guild in Guild Wars 2 says enough. All the male members in our guild have a healthy 50/50 balance between male and female characters with multiple skin colors. Meanwhile almost all the women in our guild exclusively play female characters and refuse to play a male character. When I ask them why they aren't playing any male characters, they answer: "because I don't like playing as a male character."

Now who is the intolerant party here? Clearly not us straight white male gamers.


Honestly, I would be perfectly okay if developers made more games with female protagonists, as long as it makes sense within the context of the game, and as long they leave existing protagonists alone. That doesn't mean however that I'm not getting sick and tired of feminists invading gaming and ruining all the fun with their insufferable whining. Stop acting so frikkin' entitled.

[SnakeCode]

Like I said previously, The Witcher 3 and Assassin's Creed Unity, hell, I remember seeing some people berate Bioware because they felt that Krem wasn't a good enough transgender representation.

 

You can add God of War: Ascension, GTA V, Hatred, Dead or Alive, Final Fantasy XV, Tomb Raider, Hotline Miami 2, The Soul Calibur series, Tekken 7, MGS V and Kingdom Come: Deliverance to that list. There are plenty more but those are just recent ones from the top of my head.

[German Soldier]

So, again, you want to go back to the days where developers aren't criticized for ignoring and/or offending the majority of the people on the planet in favor of the white male hetero group? That's what you are advocating? No criticism of developers?

yes straight white protagonist are the best.

 

ps

ok bsn now will kill me.

i threw the bait.

[straykat]

This picture is so real. I can name loads of cool white protagonists but I can only name a couple of cool black and asian protagonists and sometimes when we do get these characters, they can be so stereotypical.

 

It's also just simplifying all of those characters as the same, when they are not. Nico from GTA is nothing like Snake is nothing like Nathan Drake is nothing like Sheploo.

[Mr.House]

But not the entire world plays videogames. When it comes to core gamers who invest a lot of time and money in triple-A games, straight white men are very much in the majority. And that's really all that matters if you're trying to sell a multi-million dollar game.

And ironically, most of these men don't even care what the gender or skincolor of the protagonist is. Many are perfectly fine playing as a female or colored protagonist. In fact, some even prefer to play as a female protagonist!

It's the women who make an issue over the gender or skincolor of their protagonist. They are the ones who often won't even consider playing a male, ever, if they're given the option to play a female. 

Just looking at my guild in Guild Wars 2 says enough. All the male members in our guild have a healthy 50/50 balance between male and female characters with multiple skin colors. Meanwhile almost all the women in our guild exclusively play female characters and refuse to play a male character. When I ask them why they aren't playing any male characters, they answer: "because I don't like playing as a male character."

Now who is the intolerant party here? Clearly not us straight white male gamers.


Honestly, I would be perfectly okay if developers made more games with female protagonists, as long as it makes sense within the context of the game, and as long they leave existing protagonists alone. That doesn't mean however that I'm not getting sick and tired of feminists invading gaming and ruining all the fun with their insufferable whining. Stop acting so frikkin' entitled.

Crap I need to get back to GW2.

[Panda]

Well, the majority of developers are STRAIGHT WHITE MALES, you can't hate them for putting themselves in their games.

 

That would mean games full of Gary Stu characters though. I'd personally like developers use bit of their imagination, you should be able to create characters that aren't you after all. I don't think it's problem if game about polish folklore doesn't have PoC characters in it, I doubt many African nor Asian folklores would have white characters either, but it becomes problem when it's norm to have straight white male characters as protagonist and it's considered risky to stray away from that. It shouldn't be norm and it shouldn't be risky to do something else.

[maia0407]

Tbh the vast majority of the world population has no interest in video game representation or video games in general. 

I'm seeing stats of 1.2 billion people playing video games. That's a lot of people and makes up about 17% of the world's population. If white males make up about 8% of the world's population that means the majority of gamers are people other than white males (and that's even with assuming that 100% of white men of all ages play video games).

[straykat]

 

yes straight white protagonist are the best.

 

ps

ok bsn now will kill me.

i threw the bait.

 

 

Way to ruin it for the rest of us.

 

Last thing we need is a Stormfront type of poster.

[wolfhowwl]

 

I wish I could find the Japanese version of this where it is all blonde prettyboys.

[Seboist]

 

We definitely could use more blonde and red haired white male protagonists like Volgarr the viking and Adol Christin.

[Grieving Natashina]

I do support House's request to have a trailer including both the male and the female PCs. I participated in a thread for about 6 months requesting a trailer for the female IQ. Some of the folks here I debated with, and they all gave me food for thought. I may not have always agreed, but the folks I debated with really made me think about why I felt the way I did. Good debates all around. <waves to TalisFox>

While this is important to me, at this point I'd rather they keep the new ME:A PC gender neutral. My main thing these days is that I'd like to see someone that isn't white. It can be done by using something as simple as lingering shot of a hand. Men can have delicate hands and women can have large ones, so that would work for me.

I do think there needs to be some more representation of a female PC in RPGs that allow for customized characters. We're getting there though. However, a quick google search told me that 54% of Latino gamers are more willing to buy a game on the first day. Enough with the "white as default" on PCs in games that have a diverse mix of ethnicities (like the ME series. Not talking about TW3.) FB is a beautiful engine, so I think BioWare should show it off.

Honestly, at this point, I'd rather see a PC that wasn't a white guy. Male or female; it doesn't make a ton of difference to me. I would prefer a lady, but in a setting where there is such a mix of backgrounds, I would actually be happier if they showed someone that wasn't white for once.

In the end though, I'd rather see the more ionic N7 armor or the ARK armor than any sort of gender or skin coloring. I'm way more curious about what the new armor is going to look like when it's finalized than I am seeing a male or female PC. Having a female and male PC trailer that weren't white would be nice, but a gender neutral trailer showing off the new armor would be my absolute preference.

Just my two creds.

[AlanC9]

Honestly, I would be perfectly okay if developers made more games with female protagonists, as long as it makes sense within the context of the game, and as long they leave existing protagonists alone. That doesn't mean however that I'm not getting sick and tired of feminists invading gaming and ruining all the fun with their insufferable whining. Stop acting so frikkin' entitled.

How does their whining ruin the fun? The whining of the Gamergate guys didn't ruin my fun. Is feminist whining extra-potent?

[von uber]

 

 

Oooh I'm one of those!

 

My Sheps (all ME2 cos that's as far as the 5th one has got):

 

 

Or... FNV!

 

Or.. DA:I!

 

Or.. you get the idea.

 

Why play as yourself in an RPG?

[Mr.House]

I'm seeing stats of 1.2 billion people playing video games. That's a lot of people and makes up about 17% of the world's population. If white males make up about 8% of the world's population that means the majority of gamers are people other than white males (and that's even with assuming that 100% of white men of all ages play video games).

And how much of that is cellphone and facebook games?