410 réponses à ce sujet

[Ariella]

Sigh...

First, Anders and explosives. The quest Justice suffurs from bad writing in that regard because we don't know how Anders got the recipe. There's never been any indication he was an alchemist of any sort. His primary area has always been healing.

Second. Tech vs. Magic. The Dresden Files proves that technology doesn't always trump magic. In fact, anything produced after about the 1950s tends to fry when a Wizard is around. And that's just due to proximity. A wizard in the DF universe can hex technology down to slag should he choose to do so.

A wizard can solidify the air in from of him and deflect bullets, throw fire or ice etc. Harry has a set of rings that absorb kinetic enery when he moves stores it, then releases when throwing a punch

And you don't want to know what happens if someone gets even a fingernail or a hair. Then a wizard doesn't even have to be in the room. He can kill you from across town, or further depending on his strength.

In the tldr department : fictional universes run on the laws their creators set down. If they don't want tech to trump magic or magic to trump tech, then it won't happen.

[Ashagar]

There are too many settings in both games and books where magic and technology including guns and cannons exists side by side to claim that they can't coexist.

[The Baconer]

Alright, Dragon Age : Call of Duty confirmed.

I am done here

The Godwin's Law of gaming.

[myahele]

I believe the Qunari a capable of making guns, but I believe that due to the Qun's rules they can't make/won't the technology to reach that stage.

 

Then there's Bianca not telling them schematics of her crossbow. It's capable of alot of destruction and from there can act as a base to slowly develop gun technology.

 

That and the overall cost to develop such technology when a mage could do that and more and is much cheaper

[DragonKingReborn]

Oh goody. Qistina is back...with a shortened name and weirder threads.

[DragonKingReborn]

Also, PoE has guns in a fantasy setting and does just fine...although personally I don't use them.

[Illegitimus]

Also, PoE has guns in a fantasy setting and does just fine...although personally I don't use them.

 

I have no idea what that stands for.  

[DragonKingReborn]

Sorry, Pillars of Eternity.

[Andraste_Reborn]

Oh goody. Qistina is back...with a shortened name and weirder threads.

 

I don't think we have even approached Qistina's levels of weirdness. I mean, nobody is a weretiger yet.

[Realmzmaster]

I believe Arthur C. Clarke stated "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." Take any advanced technology to a more primitive culture and that technology becomes magic. Take magic from a primitive culture to a more advanced culture and that magic looks like technology.

 

I really do not see the problem.

[TheExtreamH]

Dragon Age 4 Call of Duty!. HELL NO! keep Guns out of Dragon Age, Just keep Bianca.

[DragonKingReborn]

I don't think we have even approached Qistina's levels of weirdness. I mean, nobody is a weretiger yet.

Well, Solas is apparently a werewolf. Despite zero evidence that is the case...

[Andraste_Reborn]

Well, Solas is apparently a werewolf. Despite zero evidence that is the case...

 

Good point.

[Aren]

Well it is certainly impressive from a certain point of view. I am certainly impressed that someone could ignore all evidence to argue how if guns existed magic, armor and various weapons would somehow magically become useless because of science while ignoring all the evidence that shows how flawed such a argument is.

It is not because of science, what that suppose to mean?

It's progress,they are simply developed with a more accurate and sophisticated scientific process,that is way future weapons are always better than primitive one.

You really wanna challenge someone with a modern weapon with an armor?

You wanna call a warrior tank with an armor a worthy opponent of a real tank?

Progress always render primitive weapons useless.

As for those type of weapons against magic,yes they will render mages pretty much useless in battle.

Templars can rival mages(you know those drug addicted guys),if they can do that i imagine that every child with a gun can do the same.

Guns do not relying on skill or ability like bows or swords or spells,they can be used even without being a master.

Try to kill Solas with a sword and he will make you into stone.

Try to shot Solas with a gun and see if he is fast enough to survive.

 

[Heimdall]

 

It is not because of science, what that suppose to mean?

It's progress,they are simply developed with a more accurate and sophisticated scientific process,that is way future weapons are always better than primitive one.

You really wanna challenge someone with a modern weapon with an armor?

You wanna call a warrior tank with an armor a worthy opponent of a real tank?

Progress always render primitive weapons useless.

As for those type of weapons against magic,yes they will render mages pretty much useless in battle.

Templars can rival mages(you know those drug addicted guys),if they can do that i imagine that every child with a gun can do the same.

Guns do not relying on skill or ability like bows or swords or spells,they can be used even without being a master.

Try to kill Solas with a sword and he will make you into stone.

Try to shot Solas with a gun and see if he is fast enough to survive.

 

 

Well, you'll probably miss because early firearms were incredibly inaccurate.  Nobody's talking about modern weapons here.  Then again Shadowrun does exactly that and magic is still badass.

[Aren]

This is only true if magic is stagnant and science is not. Why are you making that assumption?

Magic does not equate to spells which is how magic is used.

It is something inherent to the world and the fade,something that existed from the start.

Dragon age is exactly that, the reverse of progress,the more you dig into the past the more you will find the most admirable creatures and powerful society,the more you are ancient the better that is how it works in Dragon age.

Magic is in itself stagnant in the setting,since the main purpose of the story is to discover the wonders of the past rather than focus to the wonders of the future.

[Mlady]

The healer at Skyhold said Science is the way of the future, so DA is definitely stepping out of the Dark Ages and evolving like we did in real life.

[Ashagar]

The healer at Skyhold said Science is the way of the future, so DA is definitely stepping out of the Dark Ages and evolving like we did in real life.

 

Sigh... as a student of history I groan when someone uses a term like dark ages almost as much as I groan when people expect medieval to 19th century military firearms being remotely accurate and long ranged when such firearms were extremely inaccurate at even very short ranges.

 

Also I am not sure that someone who starts spewing early renaissance medical science which also decided that the regular bathing people did during the middle ages was bad because it let evil miasma in and that bleeding was the great cure all should be trusted when there are people who can use magic to heal much safer and far less likely to kill someone trying to help them.

[Mlady]

Sigh... as a student of history I groan when someone uses a term like dark ages almost as much as I groan when people expect medieval to 19th century military firearms being remotely accurate and long ranged when such firearms were extremely inaccurate at even very short ranges.

 

Also I am not sure that someone who starts spewing early renaissance medical science which also decided that the regular bathing people did during the middle ages was bad because it let evil miasma in and that bleeding was the great cure all should be trusted when there are people who can use magic to heal much safer and far less likely to kill someone trying to help them.

 

LMAO! It's actually a play on Dragon Age. Chill.

 

And she's talking of Orlais. They are advancing in many things. 

[Aren]

And no, Solas is not dead, considering the fact that a part of Mythal managed to survive a combined assault by the other Evanuris, I'm pretty damned certain Solas can survive a gun shot wound. That is if they can even hit him in the first place.

 

"Firsts of my people don't die so easly"

this however doesn't equate to

"My people are immortal"

Since by study the process that they use to create their "immortality" it is possible to understand how to kill them permanently,kinda what the GW do with the Archdemons,or the Inquisitor did to Corypheus.

Flemeth was killed by the Warden,and only Hawke and Merril saved her life,otherwise she would have remained "dead".

As for Mythal we cannot be sure that she was the one that managed to survive rather than the Evanuris that killed her smashed her soul into a tiny fragment in order to make her suffer on purpose a worse fate than death.

As far as i'm concerned the "trick" to kill these immortal people is to work on their soul,in this way they will not survive.

[Aren]

I believe Arthur C. Clarke stated "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." Take any advanced technology to a more primitive culture and that technology becomes magic. Take magic from a primitive culture to a more advanced culture and that magic looks like technology.

 

I really do not see the problem.

What?

Of course not, that's contrived.

Any advanced technology come with its share of knowledge and scientific process that will allow anyone to be capable to understand it,provided that they study.

Magic is just a marvellous thing that behind it, has itself as explanation or the unsophisticated lore of a writer.

[Aren]

Well, you'll probably miss because early firearms were incredibly inaccurate.  Nobody's talking about modern weapons here.  Then again Shadowrun does exactly that and magic is still badass.

I believe that in this case i didn't miss any point

The post that i was arguing about was not specifically about first firearms,but a comparison between magic and technology and their room  for improvement,the latter is league far beyond the former.

Wanna try to use some spells against and improve them  against a wonder like the Sukhoi PAK F?

Magic and technology do not have the same possibility of improvement.

[Heimdall]

 

I believe that in this case i didn't miss any point

The post that i was arguing about was not specifically about first firearms,but a comparison between magic and technology and their room  for improvement,the latter is league far beyond the former.

Wanna try to use some spells against and improve them  against a wonder like the Sukhoi PAK F?

Magic and technology do not have the same possibility of improvement.

 

Not necessarily, as the ancient elves show us magic is capable of much more than what modern mages know.  Alexius was able to develop new forms of magic that even the elves apparently never used.  Scientific insights into the world could also could spark people to think of new ways to use magic.  Scientific insights into magic itself could do the same.

 

Though even so, there's no reason mages couldn't use technology too in addition to their abilities.  Most mages in Shadowrun use guns in addition to their spells, even though spells are still what makes them primarily useful.  I don't know why this has to be a versus.

[CardButton]

Not necessarily, as the ancient elves show us magic is capable of much more than what modern mages know.  Alexius was able to develop new forms of magic that even the elves apparently never used.  Scientific insights into the world could also could spark people to think of new ways to use magic.  Scientific insights into magic itself could do the same.

 

Though even so, there's no reason mages couldn't use technology too in addition to their abilities.  Most mages in Shadowrun use guns in addition to their spells, even though spells are still what makes them primarily useful.  I don't know why this has to be a versus.

Yup! Things will really start getting scary when science starts dealing with Chemistry of Physics (or man way down the road Atomic Theory) and Mages start learning to apply these academics to magic!  It's not about how much magic is available to use, but how you use that magic available that makes the possibilities way down the line of Thedas (assuming the Veil stays as is) so ridiculous! 

[Ariella]

I don't know why this has to be a versus.

Preprogramming I suppose. Magic/superstition vs technology/science/enlightenment.

Personally, I think the vs is a load of crap especially with the popularity of urban fantasy, but that might explain it.