26 respuestas en este tema

[Qun00]

There's been a lot on my mind lately and I figured I'd rather not make too many threads, so here we are.

1. Ferelden vs Kirkwall. This is a major plot point in Hawke's character and it is addressed in more than one occasion. Which of them does your Hawke consider to be his/her home by the time you reach Act 3?

2. Where does the idea that Merril is supposed to be underage in Act 1 come from? I don't see how that's possible considering that the vallaslin is given as a mark of adulthood.

3. I'm not sure about you, but Isabela's fame seems somewhat undeserved. We see her turn down Emile as well as the other guy flirting with her in the tavern, so she clearly has standards. She also refuses to sleep with anyone in her crew as it would ruin labor relations.

The only difference between Isabela and, let's say, Aveline is that the former doesn't mind casual sex.

[straykat]

I still consider Hawke a Ferelden. It's almost like the missing human commoner origin in DAO, but a complete game that's all one origin. Mixed with mage stuff (and yet still Ferelden, because of Malcolm).

 

I don't know anything about underage Merrill. I always thought she was at least as old as the Warden in DAO.

 

Isabela isn't as bad as the rep, I agree. It goes with her character though.. she just doesn't care what people think (for better or worse).

[ThePhoenixKing]

Some good questions:

 

1) My headcanon Warrior Hawke has accepted Kirkwall as her home, but still holds great fondness for Ferelden, and is more than willing to work for Alistair as an ally in the Free Marches. She's sorta like a high-fantasy version of Uhtred of Bebbanburg: while she lives in Kirkwall, she personally identifies more as a Fereldan, and mostly stays to prevent its troubles from heading south to Ferelden, as well as to act as an advocate for the city's Fereldan refugees.

 

2) I don't think Merrill's underage; she's just a very slight, quirky young woman (which people automatically associate with childish). That said, age of majority probably works a bit differently in Thedas than in the modern world; looking back at the Medieval period, people were taking on adult responsibilities (marriage, civic duties, military service, etc) at a much younger age. Again, working on headcanon, at the time of the Fifth Blight, I'd consider Merrill about 18.

 

3) In her romance arc, Isabela straight out admits that her reputation as an uninhibited lover is overinflated: she's had a fair share of lovers, but not nearly as many as the stories suggest.

[congokong]

1. Kirkwall; I wouldn't consider any place that I left to find a better life to be my home anymore. It irks me in the real world how many people leave countries because life was so bad yet still feel a kinship to it (ex: rooting for their soccer teams).

2. Merrill just seems under-age because of her emaciated elf appearance and her naivety.

3. Isabela won't sleep with anyone, but she does have many sexual partners, and makes it only a physical act.

[Jeradon]

Some good questions:

 

1) My headcanon Warrior Hawke has accepted Kirkwall as her home, but still holds great fondness for Ferelden, and is more than willing to work for Alistair as an ally in the Free Marches. She's sorta like a high-fantasy version of Uhtred of Bebbanburg: while she lives in Kirkwall, she personally identifies more as a Fereldan, and mostly stays to prevent its troubles from heading south to Ferelden, as well as to act as an advocate for the city's Fereldan refugees.

 

2) I don't think Merrill's underage; she's just a very slight, quirky young woman (which people automatically associate with childish). That said, age of majority probably works a bit differently in Thedas than in the modern world; looking back at the Medieval period, people were taking on adult responsibilities (marriage, civic duties, military service, etc) at a much younger age. Again, working on headcanon, at the time of the Fifth Blight, I'd consider Merrill about 18.

My Mage Hawke also considers Kirkwall as his home, but he associates himself with the "business sphere" of Lowtown-Darktown and he is more enclined to support underground resistance to the templars and the Chantry.

 

I also don't think that Merrill is underage. My mage Hawke considers that she is simply one of those mages who quietly tread the path of blood magic down to its chaotic conclusion.

 

Isabela is completely different from Aveline. One is extremely involved in underworld dealings (and does not mind sex, dodgy money and violence) while the latter minds very much her responsibilities as a representative of the Viscount (and does mind sex, dodgy money and frowns upon unwarranted violence).

[SwobyJ]

My boyfriend was born in Lebanon, left it during conflict (tried to return later but again left it due to conflict), but now Canadian.

 

He is Lebanese. He has attachment to and family in Lebanon. His heart belongs to it. Much of Lebanese culture is likely ingrained and he sees no reason to at least consciously change that. He would like to teach any child of his Arabic and what he knows/can learn of Lebanon.

 

But his mind and possibly 'soul' is more Canadian. He is here now, he's glad for it, it makes more sense, and he would not be happy with how Lebanon works (now and probably in the future) if he goes back and would not be at all against the idea of going right back to Canada if there's any reason to.

 

 

I see similarities with Hawke, really. He's Ferelden. He has connections to Ferelden. His heart belongs to Ferelden. But his heart and earlier memories is not necessarily all there it so it. He has MADE a HOME in Kirkwall. He is not necessarily 'happy' in Kirkwall, but he's MORE happy there. Ferelden is where he happened to be born in, but Kirkwall is where he MADE HIMSELF. 

 

Hawke has his dog(depending on content), his family, maybe even his furnishings and garb and mannerisms if you wanna at least imagine that.

 

And it helps that Kirkwall is not necessarily 'alien' to him. Its close enough to Ferelden and his family has a history there, albeit a greatly diminished present placement. Its less like Lebanon-->Canada and more like America-->Canada or vice versa. Its not like he fled to Antiva or Tevinter.

 

That said, its your RP, and the choices allow things. You can feel more affinity for Ferelden, just not be close enough to it to actively work to return. You can feel more affinity for Kirkwall and totally leave Ferelden behind in all but the most passive cultural ways.

[SwobyJ]

1. Kirkwall; I wouldn't consider any place that I left to find a better life to be my home anymore. It irks me in the real world how many people leave countries because life was so bad yet still feel a kinship to it (ex: rooting for their soccer teams).

2. Merrill just seems under-age because of her emaciated elf appearance and her naivety.

3. Isabela won't sleep with anyone, but she does have many sexual partners, and makes it only a physical act.

 

1. There's still commonalities. Familiar histories, familiar places, familiar ways of speech and food and politics etc etc. Sports teams often mean something far beyond just the X number of people on one team playing against X number of people on another, with no other aspects. And it indeed goes beyond exact national borders, but into more abstract culture and communication and emotions and relationships.

I don't subscribe to it (caring about sports teams), but I know that's how it works for many millions of people. Belonging. And being torn (or trying to reconcile) between 2, 3 or more 'tribes' for things.

[SwobyJ]

Merrill just seems more like a teenager in much of her looks and behavior. It also would apply to someone in their 20s, even 30s, but its still 'young quirky naive girl' nonetheless.

 

Good point about Isabella. She seems to be meant to be very sex positive, and this doesn't necessarily actually equate to 'sl***y'. But she'll be that if she wants to, as well. If she wants to. And she might. But not necessarily. Freedom.

[AnimalBoy]

Kirkwall will always be home.

[dgcatanisiri]

There's been a lot on my mind lately and I figured I'd rather not make too many threads, so here we are.

1. Ferelden vs Kirkwall. This is a major plot point in Hawke's character and it is addressed in more than one occasion. Which of them does your Hawke consider to be his/her home by the time you reach Act 3?

2. Where does the idea that Merril is supposed to be underage in Act 1 come from? I don't see how that's possible considering that the vallaslin is given as a mark of adulthood.

3. I'm not sure about you, but Isabela's fame seems somewhat undeserved. We see her turn down Emile as well as the other guy flirting with her in the tavern, so she clearly has standards. She also refuses to sleep with anyone in her crew as it would ruin labor relations.

The only difference between Isabela and, let's say, Aveline is that the former doesn't mind casual sex.

 

1. My Hawkes tend to have come to accept Kirkwall as their home. Their family is there - even with Carver in the Wardens/Bethany in the Circle and Leandra dead, their found family is there in Kirkwall, and even if they leave Kirkwall, they'd probably all still be drawn back there sooner or later. They were born in Ferelden, but they expect to die in Kirkwall. And insert your own joke about that here. They have fond memories of Ferelden, might even go back for visits, but when they think of home, of the place that they belong, it's Kirkwall they're thinking of.

 

2. Merrill is infantilized a lot by the narrative and the decisions of those around her, considered to be unable to handle the consequences of her choices - that's the heart of Marethari's actions, that Marethari refuses to let her accept those consequences. "You always knew there would be a price for your blood magic. I have chosen to pay it for you." This is Marethari denying Merrill her agency. Since Marethari is the local authority figure, her attitude spreads out to the players, and they miss the fact that Merrill is perfectly capable of making her own decisions and facing those consequences. So people take on this attitude of infantilizing her because the narrative treats her like a child - I've heard that some of the writers think that it's 'better' to rival her, where Hawke is doing the same thing to her. Because she's naive, that she is socially awkward and out of her element when moving into the city, people believe that she's 'no more than' a child, underestimating her entirely.

 

3. Yeah, Isabela has her standards. It's just the fact that she DARES to be a woman who enjoys sex, and sex with no strings that gets her this bad reputation. Of course, she doesn't give a damn about her bad reputation (insert guitar riff).

[straykat]

I never saw Merrill as infantile. She's just funny. I wish my Dalish Warden acted like her. I see it more as a "fish out of water" scenario. Almost like Borat.

 

The blood magic thing is a seperate issue. There are a lot of themes with "control" concerning both her and Anders. Along with Fenyriel. Hell, most of the mages in the story are out of their depth. They either need mastery or help. I don't think it's condescension. And Merethari wouldn't be much of a Keeper if she went all willy-nilly with whatever her First does. That's not the relationship.

[Qun00]

It is true that the eluvian isn't a threat and Marethari's paranoia is mostly baseless.

That said, Merril's sarcasm when Aveline politely asks if the mirror is dangerous makes me wanna rival her really bad.

As for the blood magic, I don't believe in tales of blood mages that are satisfied with just using their own blood. She needs to abandon this path before it corrupts her.

[sylvanaerie]

Kirkwall is where my Hawke considers home.  Ferelden was her beginning, and she will probably always miss her life there.  She had a full family and grew up there.  You can never really leave that behind as long as you have memories, but for me, personally, 'home is where I hang my hat'.  It was that way for Kit.  By Act 3 she has Bethany, Isabela, Aveline, and to a lesser extent the rest of her companions as 'family' making Kirkwall a home, not just some place to stop off for 10 years.

 

Merrill is an adult.  The act of receiving the vallaslin is  rite of passage a Dalish to adulthood since it requires not only preparation, tests etc but that the recipient must remain still and silent during the application, which can only be painful considering its a tattoo on the face.  She has an air of innocence and received the too-slim body of a DA2 elf, making the young elf woman we saw in the Dalish origin look far too young in DA2. I prefer rivaled Merrill as she comes accross even stronger than friended Merrill, experiencing a lot of character growth, so I'd recommend doing it at least once just to see the difference.

 

Isabela is my favorite romance in DA2, and my canon Hawke who romanced her was cool with an open relationship, accepting that's a part of who Isabela is.  She wouldn't confine Issa to one person, she'd chafe.  She reveals in her romance arc how that affects her.  She does have standards she just doesn't give a crap what anyone else thinks since 'you don't know me' (her).

[Qun00]

Say... is there any real difference between the friendship and rivalry paths for Isabela? She seems to learn her lesson about selfishness just fine on friendship.

[straykat]

Say... is there any real difference between the friendship and rivalry paths for Isabela? She seems to learn her lesson about selfishness just fine on friendship.

 

Yeah, if she sticks around at all, she's going to learn either way, simply because the whole Arishok deal changes her. So it's more a matter of flavor how Hawke goes about it. There's a bit more guilt tripping in Act 3 as a rival.

[ArcadiaGrey]

Say... is there any real difference between the friendship and rivalry paths for Isabela? She seems to learn her lesson about selfishness just fine on friendship.

 

I haven't done the Friendship path yet, but I've let her run away in Act 2 in one playthru then went full rivalry on my latest.

 

Have to say it was awesome, I love how it played out.  Isabela thought Hawke was prissy and boring but Hawke just kept being her belligerent self, failing miserably at the whole 'friendship' thing whenever she tried with Isabela in the rivalry cutscenes.  Then at the end I killed Castillon and Izzy had her 'oh my god I've been a selfish cow, you were right all along' moment and it felt. so. good.   One of the best character arcs I had experienced till that point (pre-Inquisition).

 

Of course the friendship one might be just as good, don't know haven't done it yet, but that rivalry path made sense to me.  The aggressive/sarcastic Templar Hawke who was fiercely loyal to her friends even when they were rolling their eyes as she killed Javaris, would be the one to finally make Izzy see sense.  So for my Hawke in that playthru it was great.  Highlight of DA2 for me tbh.  

Tempted to rivalmance her that way sometime, think it would work well....

[AnimalBoy]

I could never bring myself to form a rivalry relationship with anyone. I wanted to be and was everyone's friend.

[SwobyJ]

I could never bring myself to form a rivalry relationship with anyone. I wanted to be and was everyone's friend.

 

I did too, but I kept being unable to help myself from contradicting Merril.

[springacres]

I did too, but I kept being unable to help myself from contradicting Merril.

Same.

[straykat]

They're all so different.. I can't be friends with all of them. Not on one character.

[Qun00]

They're all so different.. I can't be friends with all of them. Not on one character.

It's even weirder to be on friendship with both Fenris/Anders or Aveline/Isabela. A character with clear beliefs and personality can't please everyone.

Even Varric and his No Opinion About Anything policy doesn't manage that. Aveline doesn't like his roguish ways.

[springacres]

It's even weirder to be on friendship with both Fenris/Anders or Aveline/Isabela. A character with clear beliefs and personality can't please everyone.

Even Varric and his No Opinion About Anything policy doesn't manage that. Aveline doesn't like his roguish ways.

Try being at full friendship with everyone besides Merrill and Carver, the way my current Hawke is.  Carver is on the friendly side of neutral and Merrill is at full rivalry, while everyone else is at full friendship.  It's one of those things that makes me wish they'd stuck with the approval/disapproval mechanic of Origins.

[LorenzEffect]

It's bizarre to me how many people don't get that a woman can sleep around a lot and still have standards. It's like, if I love food, that doesn't mean I'll eat a cow's brain.

I don't think Merrill's age is even mentioned. Do Dalish bother to count their years?

[springacres]

It's bizarre to me how many people don't get that a woman can sleep around a lot and still have standards. It's like, if I love food, that doesn't mean I'll eat a cow's brain.

I don't think Merrill's age is even mentioned. Do Dalish bother to count their years?

IIRC, the only character whose age is ever mentioned specifically is Hawke's sibling, and even that's only by reference to their twin in a side convo you can have with Leandra.

 

I assume Dalish count their years, since the codex for vallaslin mentions that it's a mark of adulthood, so there's obviously some way of measuring age or maturity.

[SlackerBoe]

1. My mage tends to relate to kirkwell, I enjoy the an anti-class story so mage is a Templar supporter and liked Meredith's no nonsense approach to the circle. 

   My warrior/templar tends to sympathize with the mages and feels like an outcast in both cities.

My rouge, wishes she was back into fereldan and cannot wait to go home.

 

2. I've never heard of that.

3.  She totally earned the reputation for me when she had a threeway with the hero of ferledan and Leliana in DA:O