1378 réponses à ce sujet

[Sylvius the Mad]

But it's also not quite so simple. I find what many people see as the imaginative position to be anti-imagination. Which is to say that I find the idea of asking me to imagine something so narrow and constrained by so many outside factors to be a sufficient intrusion into my ability to "imagine" that all joy I could get from doing so is gone.

I don't find it that narrow. I get to decide, moment to moment, how my character interprets the things he sees. That's dozens to hundreds of applications of imagination per hour of play.

Beyond that, I just need to work with the awareness that everything is possibly true as long as I can't prove it to be untrue. And as an extreme epistemic skeptic, I can't prove much.

Simplifying assumptions are the enemy.

My general misanthropy probably helps, as I tend to design self-interested characters, so the actions or opinions of NPCs rarely matter.

[Sylvius the Mad]

That's not necessarily true. Frostbite could require critical middle ware that EA can cheaply license for its devs but that would be very expensive to proliferate generally to consumers. An engine isn't a single thing - it's just an amorphous blob of interlaced software.

On twitter, I asked Frostbite what middleware that was. If we knew, we might be able to cobble together a solution.

They didn't reply.

[Ariella]

On twitter, I asked Frostbite what middleware that was. If we knew, we might be able to cobble together a solution.

They didn't reply.

Doesn't exactly sound like something you want to leave to a 120 character reply, Sylvius.

And I've seen mods for DAI, so I'm not exactly sure what the problem is.

[AresKeith]

Doesn't exactly sound like something you want to leave to a 120 character reply, Sylvius.

And I've seen mods for DAI, so I'm not exactly sure what the problem is.

 

Have you seen mods that add things to the game or just texture mods?

[Ariella]

Have you seen mods that add things to the game or just texture mods?

Most of the stuff I've seen has been texture. I play console so I'll glance at mod conversations.

So I'm assume this is about adding entire pieces of either plot or characters to DAI, akin to what was done with BG then?

[AresKeith]

Most of the stuff I've seen has been texture. I play console so I'll glance at mod conversations.

So I'm assume this is about adding entire pieces of either plot or characters to DAI, akin to what was done with BG then?

 

Probably

[Mr.House]

Most of the stuff I've seen has been texture. I play console so I'll glance at mod conversations.

So I'm assume this is about adding entire pieces of either plot or characters to DAI, akin to what was done with BG then?

Ui fixes, game mechianc revamps, massive bug fixes, real new items, new quests ect

 

That is impossible in ME series, DA2 and DAI. What you get is 99% what you will have. No matter if you like certain stuff if say the game mechanics are very flawed you are up **** creek without a paddle. Not the case with Bethesda games and to a lesser extent, TW3.

[Zekka]

Why do you keep bringing this up as if good games don't get terrible ratings for stupid reasons all the time?

 

Seriously, online ratings mean absolutely nothing to me anymore.

You do know I am talking about critic ratings, right? You know, the ones that companies look like if they want to give bonuses, if they want to determine a "critical success" or "universal appraisal" or if they want to know what people liked more.

I'm not talking about metacritic user scores.

[ashwind]

On twitter, I asked Frostbite what middleware that was. If we knew, we might be able to cobble together a solution.

They didn't reply.

 

What would happen to Season Passes for Starwars Battlefront if modder can make maps *gasp* and mod new game modes? 

[AresKeith]

What would happen to Season Passes for Starwars Battlefront if modder can make maps *gasp* and mod new game modes? 

 

By also making mods to have all their weapons be one hit kills, etc

[RoboticWater]

What would happen to Season Passes for Starwars Battlefront if modder can make maps *gasp* and mod new game modes? 

I know it's easy to jump on EA for being slimy (they quite often are), but this just isn't the whole truth. Game development is far more complicated.

 

That article I linked to is about Frostbite 2 (for Battlefield: Bad Company 2), and I can only imagine that the pipeline has only gotten more fragmented and obtuse with more than one developer's hand in the pie. Battlefront in particular is difficult because DICE probably got their hands on a lot of Lucas Art's original assets. Weeding out all that stuff to then cobble together an editor just isn't worth the time.

[ashwind]

By also making mods to have all their weapons be one hit kills, etc

 

LOL. Well... umm. you dont really need mods for that. In Battlefield servers, just set the player health to ultra low and weapons automatically one hit kills.

 

While I can understand people wanting mods but really dont see this happening with EA's direction except maybe some texture mods. Mods to me are nice to have but not necessary. More important in the case of Bethesda games because some game bugs are never fixed by them and also because Bethesda games are generally sandboxes.

[ashwind]

I know it's easy to jump on EA for being slimy (they quite often are), but this just isn't the whole truth. Game development is far more complicated.

 

That article I linked to is about Frostbite 2 (for Battlefield: Bad Company 2), and I can only imagine that the pipeline has only gotten more fragmented and obtuse with more than one developer's hand in the pie. Battlefront in particular is difficult because DICE probably got their hands on a lot of Lucas Art's original assets. Weeding out all that stuff to then cobble together an editor just isn't worth the time.

 

The real reason I find to be in the conclusion:

 

In conclusion, my recommendation to the rest of DICE is not to develop mod tools for BC2 PC. There are too many hurdles to overcome. That energy is better spent elsewhere, be that on BC2 or other titles.

 

It is just not commercially viable and thus an endeavor EA would not undertake. It is also not commercially viable for many game developers to do so - spend lots of money and time in creating mod tools.

 

Thus while I like to have that option, I can understand why it is not available and it really isnt a huge deal to me. I also like to keep my games as "original" as possible.

 

Yeah, I hate the new dialogue in FO4, yes there is a mod to show what is to be said. Does that mod improves my experience? Yes. Does it "fix" what I hate about the dialogue? No. 

[Mr.House]

The real reason I find to be in the conclusion:

 

 

 

 

It is just not commercially viable and thus an endeavor EA would not undertake. It is also not commercially viable for many game developers to do so - spend lots of money and time in creating mod tools.

 

Thus while I like to have that option, I can understand why it is not available and it really isnt a huge deal to me. I also like to keep my games as "original" as possible.

 

Yeah, I hate the new dialogue in FO4, yes there is a mod to show what is to be said. Does that mod improves my experience? Yes. Does it "fix" what I hate about the dialogue? No. 

Hey it's still very early into FO4s life and we don't even have the modtools yet, so the fact that we do have a mod that removes the paraphrase system this early and thus removed one big issue with the system is a very good thing. We all know once the mod tool hits that FO4 will become a far different and better game, coming towards its potential.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Doesn't exactly sound like something you want to leave to a 120 character reply, Sylvius.

And I've seen mods for DAI, so I'm not exactly sure what the problem is.

But if they knew there was demand for this information, they could release it in whatever venue they'd like.

And as mentioned, I see no mods that add detailed tooltips (as existed in DAO) or edit existing meshes or replace them with entirely new meshes.

And that's even without modifying the plot or characters. I'm just talking aesthetics and usability.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Hey it's still very early into FO4s life and we don't even have the modtools yet, so the fact that we do have a mod that removes the paraphrase system this early and thus removed one big issue with the system is a very good thing. We all know once the mod tool hits that FO4 will become a far different and better game, coming towards its potential.

I love that there's already a mod that restores the silent protagonist.

And, as you say, we don't even have the toolset yet. I don't even plan to buy FO4 until we do. I like aesthetic mods, and I'd like to see if we can make VATS a proper pause again.

[Zekka]

What would happen to Season Passes for Starwars Battlefront if modder can make maps *gasp* and mod new game modes? 

I think about that then I remember that much wouldn't happen. People mod the hell out of Bethesda's games yet so many still buy the DLC's.

Past COD games allowed you to mod them and even made a Star Wars mod for COD and many still bought DLC.

 

The main problems that could happen are developers blocking mods for things like microtransactions.

 

EA is just being lazy here.

[Sylvius the Mad]

What would happen to Season Passes for Starwars Battlefront if modder can make maps *gasp* and mod new game modes?

It wouldn't be difficult to lock down MP to unmodded games.

SP games should be fully moddable. I'd even happily pay for the privilege. I'm not trying to cost the fevs money; I'm trying to get each gamer the game he wants. If one player wants nudity, but another doesn't, mods let them both have that. If one player wants to increase combat difficulty, while another wants to skip combat entirely, mods let them both do what they want.

[Eelectrica]

What would happen to Season Passes for Starwars Battlefront if modder can make maps *gasp* and mod new game modes?

A pro dev team should always be able to beat hobbiest modders though.

In that instance Modders keep the game alive and when DLC ships players jump on board. Also Modders then use resources from the DLC to produce future mods. In short modders increase sales opportunities.

[pdusen]

You do know I am talking about critic ratings, right? You know, the ones that companies look like if they want to give bonuses, if they want to determine a "critical success" or "universal appraisal" or if they want to know what people liked more.

I'm not talking about metacritic user scores.

 

Let's assume for a moment that critic ratings are any more useful as a metric than user score is (which I don't believe, but I'll play along for the sake of this argument).

 

The game you're loudly (and repeatedly) proclaiming as "Bethesda's lowest-rated game" has the following scores on Metacritic:

• PC: 85
• Xbox One: 88
• PS4: 87

These scores lead me to believe that, overall, critics pretty much like the game, while acknowledging that it has flaws.

 

So tell me, even if those are truly the lowest scores Bethesda has ever had (which I haven't verified because it doesn't f***ing matter), who really cares when they're still that high?

[ashwind]

Hey it's still very early into FO4s life and we don't even have the modtools yet, so the fact that we do have a mod that removes the paraphrase system this early and thus removed one big issue with the system is a very good thing. We all know once the mod tool hits that FO4 will become a far different and better game, coming towards its potential.

 

True but by the time Skyrim has been fully modded 1-2 years later, many would have already moved to other games.

 

It is not only the paraphrasing that is bad, it is the unresponsiveness of the conversations, the lousy NPC keeps moving and playing long slow fugly animation before they would talk to me, block me by repeating the same lame line over and over when I just want to buy something or sell something or just swap items. The whole system is messed up.

 

I am annoyed and find most conversation to be poorly written, juvenile, badly voice acted and atrociously animated. Check out Angryjoe's review where he pitch FO2's conversation against FO4.

 

Can modders save this? Another Skywind perhaps? Rewrite and revoice all the conversations? I am sure they can and if I'd wait for that, I should be buying FO4 in 2020. 

 

Releasing a modding tool for my pleasure is one thing, releasing a modding tool for people to fix your droppings is.... lame     

 

Between a game that has no mod but a studio who strive to create the very best experience and a game that is release for the modders to salvage... I'd pick the former because I no longer have the time to tinker as much as I use to.

[AlanC9]

Releasing a modding tool for my pleasure is one thing, releasing a modding tool for people to fix your droppings is.... lame     
 
Between a game that has no mod but a studio who strive to create the very best experience and a game that is release for the modders to salvage... I'd pick the former because I no longer have the time to tinker as much as I use to.

Is this just rhetoric, or do you really think that's Bethesda's plan?

[rashie]

By also making mods to have all their weapons be one hit kills, etc

You do know its possible to do that right now even without mod support, right?

 

Although punkbuster will likely ban you for it all the same.

[In Exile]

Doesn't exactly sound like something you want to leave to a 120 character reply, Sylvius.

And I've seen mods for DAI, so I'm not exactly sure what the problem is.

 

To be fair, devs have often had multiple tweet posts on the same subject. And many people do try those - sequential tweets on the same subject.

 

That aside, DA:I mods are largely cosmetic. It's hard to do much more with the toolset. 

[In Exile]

I don't find it that narrow. I get to decide, moment to moment, how my character interprets the things he sees. That's dozens to hundreds of applications of imagination per hour of play.

Beyond that, I just need to work with the awareness that everything is possibly true as long as I can't prove it to be untrue. And as an extreme epistemic skeptic, I can't prove much.

Simplifying assumptions are the enemy.

My general misanthropy probably helps, as I tend to design self-interested characters, so the actions or opinions of NPCs rarely matter.

To me, imagination is not about bounded constraints. It's about the absence of constraints. Imagination, to me, is enjoyable because you go beyond the role of a particular bounded person and into the role of, essentially, author. It is more than just interpreting how a character sees things - it's more even than how many characters see things. It's about fundamentally controlling the world itself, and what it is in its truest sense. 

 

The second you say to me, you cannot control anything but this one figure, and the world itself is static and beyond your control, then the very thing that makes imagination worthwhile is gone. Because it's no longer a free exercise. I only have the freedom to do what the world permits. And what the world permits in a CRPG is very narrow.