110 réponses à ce sujet

[Danadenassis]

Just to be clear I am pro full dialogues.

 

However, if it could be modded would it probably be fine.

 

Just look at Fallout 4 and one of the most endorsed mods there:

http://www.nexusmods...&preview=&pUp=1

 

If MEA supports subtitles, as usual, does it mean that the text is already there so unless Bioware on purpose tries to complicate and hide the data, should it not be that hard if the MEA supports any modding that is.

 

If not, a checkbox to indicate full dialogue line doesn't sound like excessive workload on Bioware.

[KaiserShep]

I'm curious about this. In Fallout's dialogue, is there ever an instance when the PC might have a word or two that's automatically spoken to keep the flow of a conversation (like how? why? and?). One of the things about Bio's voiced PC's is that they have fairly long lines and multiple sentences. I'd like to know how FO4's dialogue compares in terms of sheer word count for the longest lines spoken.

[fchopin]

Just to be clear I am pro full dialogues.

If not, a checkbox to indicate full dialogue line doesn't sound like excessive workload on Bioware.

 

Last time i asked for this the developers got very upset.

[Giubba]

Just to be clear I am pro full dialogues.

 

However, if it could be modded would it probably be fine.

 

Just look at Fallout 4 and one of the most endorsed mods there:

http://www.nexusmods...&preview=&pUp=1

 

If MEA supports subtitles, as usual, does it mean that the text is already there so unless Bioware on purpose tries to complicate and hide the data, should it not be that hard if the MEA supports any modding that is.

 

If not, a checkbox to indicate full dialogue line doesn't sound like excessive workload on Bioware.

 

No, unecessary.

[AlanC9]

Last time i asked for this the developers got very upset.

Upset? The typical response was more along the lines of "we tested that, it failed, we're done," wasn't it?

[Mirrman70]

They didn't give it for the past couple of dialogue wheel games why would they give it now?

[Altair_ShepardN7]

I wont mind as long as they let us disable it. I really hate the idea of reading a line several times, then having to listen to him/her saying it.

[Sylvius the Mad]

I wont mind as long as they let us disable it. I really hate the idea of reading a line several times, then having to listen to him/her saying it.

Ideally we'd be able to disable the voice, as well (also already available as a mod for FO4), but even without that I'd want the full line.

I have no problem at all with the repetition. When I read the line, I read it--I don't hear it. When the line is spoken, then I hear it (actually, I mostly don't listen to the dialogue - I'd rather read it).

[Hiemoth]

Upset? The typical response was more along the lines of "we tested that, it failed, we're done," wasn't it?

 

Yeah, that's been pretty much the reaction I've seen.

 

Besides, while I haven't played FO4 yet, based on the images of the mod I saw it uses the screen interface very differentely and if those lines displayed are accurate, the FO4 spoken dialogue is a lot shorter than they are ME games. And that doesn't even touch on the flow of dialogue needing to be changed to fit the full line display to be accurate.

[RUDAL]

why do we need mods to make games work properly?

shouldn't it be job for game developers?

 

as to the example provided by OP. isn't that proof that all the wheels and other weird ways of displaying dialogue are just awkward ?

I'm not referring to the shape of it but to the actual content.

This mod shows how much better it would be to have a list of what the character say actually instead of hints of what he might say.

 

Mass Effect and DA suffer from that and it's been discussed in many threads on this forums

[9TailsFox]

Bethesda copied something from Bioware and it was worst think possible.  Everyone complaining about dialogue in FA4. it's huge step back.

[9TailsFox]

Upset? The typical response was more along the lines of "we tested that, it failed, we're done," wasn't it?

Yes they did they well it was David Gaider response.

[Lord Bolton]

Bethesda copied something from Bioware and it was worst think possible.  Everyone complaining about dialogue in FA4. it's huge step back.

It's funny how both Bethesda and Bioware failed their attempt to copy stuff from each other (dialogue system and open world).

[Shechinah]

Bethesda copied something from Bioware and it was worst think possible.  Everyone complaining about dialogue in FA4. it's huge step back.

 

Certainly not everyone complains about it and certainly not everyone considers it a huge step back.

 

 Personally, I consider it to be a feature that I hope to see implemented in future installments of the Fallout series albeit improved upon and a bit more refined. An example of such improvement, in my opinion, would be the dialogue mod that removes paraphrasing and instead displays each dialogue option by what the actual dialogue the option represents is.
 

[Dr. rotinaj]

 

as to the example provided by OP. isn't that proof that all the wheels and other weird ways of displaying dialogue are just awkward ?

 

 

I would say it's proof that Bethesda made a poor implementation of a dialogue wheel. The simplistic wheel really suited Alpha Protocol and it was not awkward at all. I have only a few issues with ME's dialogue wheel but it got better as the series continued. DA2 and DAI had a couple lines that didn't match the paraphrase but they added tones to the paraphrases and DAI had a clarification pop-up before making a significant choice.

 

Fallout 4's conversation wheel is terrible. It's like a textbook example of what anti-wheelers are scared of. It has very few options, the paraphrases are often very vague, and it's impossible to predict the tone of the line. If I want to pick "Sarcastic" but I can't tell if the line is gonna be light-hearted sarcasm or jerk sarcasm there's a serious problem. The least I request in a dialogue wheel is that other characters will respond as if my character said the paraphrase verbatim. That way I won't be as annoyed by my character saying something different than expected.

[SardaukarElite]

I see it as an unelegant solution. I'd rather they focus on making the paraphrases clear. 

 

It has very few options, the paraphrases are often very vague, and it's impossible to predict the tone of the line. If I want to pick "Sarcastic" but I can't tell if the line is gonna be light-hearted sarcasm or jerk sarcasm there's a serious problem.

 

A lot of the time it isn't even sarcasm. 

[wright1978]

Certainly not everyone complains about it and certainly not everyone considers it a huge step back.

Yeah I think it was a step forward for fallout. The fact that they are open to mods has allowed those who want to adapt backwards, which wasn't possible the other way round.

[Keitaro57]

I had the same problem with ME. Especially while talking with Jacob.

 

[Chealec]

I'm not fussed whether it shows the full text or not - as long as the intent is properly conveyed on the dialogue wheel (or whatever they use in ME:A).

[Sleeper_Tyrant]

The problem is that there isn't enough dialogue options in FO4 like there was before, and even the options given are the same, with just a small remark by the npcs and proceeding to the same path.

Before my character would've been able to know about science and answer accordingly, but now he's just ignorant in all things.

Edit: I'm all for the wheel in MEA, because bioware know how to implement it properly.

[Danadenassis]

I'm curious about this. In Fallout's dialogue, is there ever an instance when the PC might have a word or two that's automatically spoken to keep the flow of a conversation (like how? why? and?). One of the things about Bio's voiced PC's is that they have fairly long lines and multiple sentences. I'd like to know how FO4's dialogue compares in terms of sheer word count for the longest lines spoken.

I feel that Bioware dialogues are richer somehow, but it might be because I like the Bioware characters/npcs far better. Some NPCs got much text I'd say, not that it means I like them more. Especially the female npcs/companions do I think have too little agency and because of that got less strength to them than a typical Bioware character got in the dialogue. Only one male character "suffers" from this in the same way, but that is quite fine and doesn't make me sceptical to the writing in the same way.

 

I that FA4 mod has one of the arguments for making a listed dialogue that some lines can be bit long so it gets bit cluttered if having them centered in the form of a wheel. The mod also got a wheel variant though.

[Sylvius the Mad]

why do we need mods to make games work properly?
shouldn't it be job for game developers?

Sometimes we disagree with the developers about how the game should work. Mods are a way for each individual player to get the game he or she wants.

Casey Hudson thought the surprise we experience when we heard a spoken line for the first time (after we'd selected it) was a good thing. For him, the obfuscatory paraphrases were working as intended.

[Sylvius the Mad]

I that FA4 mod has one of the arguments for making a listed dialogue that some lines can be bit long so it gets bit cluttered if having them centered in the form of a wheel. The mod also got a wheel variant though.

Putting the dialogue wheel in the middle of the screen, thereby reducing by half the maximum length of the paraphrases, was idiotic.

I hope someone mentioned that during development, and they had an actual reason for ignoring the concern.

[Shechinah]

Before my character would've been able to know about science and answer accordingly, but now he's just ignorant in all things.

 

Not quite actually; there are lines where the player character can express knowledge in advance science such as before entering Covenant and to Proctor Ingram. In the latter case, Ingram is even surprised that they know something like that.

 

Those are instances I've found and can remember in detail though I'd have liked some more since sometimes I have to navigate dialogue options to prevent it from looking like my character does not know about something that they should have. 
 

[N7Jamaican]

People really want this to be a thing? Well, BioWare has caved in the past, I don't see why not now.. Especially since this is not an unreasonable request.