37 réponses à ce sujet

[congokong]

I think the game made the decision too easy by mentioning that Rainier didn't know that there were children and family there.

They should've allowed it to be more morally conflicting by telling us he knew everything and did it anyway.


I don't see it.

Blackwall: You must miss the comforts of your mansions, traveling with us as you do.
Vivienne: I miss them. I do not require them.
Vivienne: But please, continue to imagine me a pampered lady, if it makes you feel superior.

So that assumption Vivienne makes in your post about Blackwall's inadequacy around nobility somehow voids the conversations where Blackwall wishes he got to Vivienne sooner during a fight, hopes he hasn't offended her, asks what he's doing wrong to get her approval, etc.? You "don't see it" in those banters?

[congokong]

In Blackwall's defense, he admits that while he doesn't like nobility (which was probably a consequence of his backstory) he understands that its better to be on their good side. He's not actually blindingly pro-Grey Warden, in fact, he constantly mentions how the **** everything not related to the Blight mentality is problematic and that the Wardens should be more involved with helping people in general. Dorian treats Blackwall like crap as well, that said, Blackwall seems to be instigator in that relationship. Hard to tell. I'd probably want to know why someone I have to work with seems to hate for seemingly no reason as well. Also, Vivienne technically isn't a noble. 

Blackwall is the instigator in those banters with Dorian; at least initially. He has no interest in trying to stay on nobility's "good side" apparently if it's Dorian, yet Vivienne who is an evil ******, and everything he hates about nobility, is worth sucking up to? And Vivienne may not technically be a noble, but she's immersed in everything nobility stands for. Worse, she loves it. That should be a far greater sin in Blackwall's hypocritical eyes than someone like Dorian who was unavoidably born into it yet wants to exorcise its corruption.

 

When does Blackwall "constantly mention" that the wardens should be more involved in helping people in general or criticizes their "**** everything outside the blight" mentality? I must have missed that; only recalling Solas bring the latter up. Blackwall helps people yes, but remember that he's also not a true Grey Warden. It's not like he can go with the other Wardens on their darkspawn missions.

[Hazegurl]

If you're not that into the romance then you're not gonna have fun playing it.  Just headcanon your dwarf having a lover back home waiting for her.

[dgcatanisiri]

Yeah, I'm in the 'better no romance (or a headcanoned one) than a bad romance' camp. It's honestly why Trespasser killed my interest in Dorian as a romance - he says that he and the Inquisitor are now going to be a long distance relationship for an indefinite period of time (with the ending slides implying that they rarely see each other in person), and he doesn't even ALLOW any discussion? Yeah, no thanks. I want more respect from my partner. And since Iron Bull's romance is too sexual for this grey ace, my future Inquisitors are most likely going to be without an in-game romance.

 

Personally, nothing about Blackwall ever drew me towards him before the game was released (literally, on the occasions I'd think about Blackwall, a lot of my thoughts could be summed up as 'what even is the point of him?'). While the reveal gave him a more interesting character element and approach, he honestly, between appearance and voice, has just generally made me uncomfortable, to the point I don't recruit him anymore. If having him around makes me uncomfortable enough that I don't want to take him anywhere or even talk to him, why even have him in the first place?

[DebatableBubble]

Blackwall is bae. Do it, OP.

[nightscrawl]

As the title says. I'm trying to get a canon run together. Female dwarf and I have strong feelings about that. So it's essentially Blackwall or nobody. I have no issue with his past and I love a good redemption tale. But when I try to romance him I feel like a bit of a schmuck because of the lying. So, is it worth it? Just reading his Trespasser epilogue makes me cry and I feel incomplete without romance.

 

I know this is difficult for some people, but you really need to try and put meta knowledge out of your mind and focus on what your character knows. She doesn't know that he is lying, and will be attracted to him for whatever reason. So try and use that as a jumping off point and go from there. This is also my suggestion for when you get to the big reveal in the game itself. How would your character react? Is she likely to forgive? If so, why? What is her motivation for giving him another chance? And so on.

 

Good luck!

[nightscrawl]

It's honestly why Trespasser killed my interest in Dorian as a romance - he says that he and the Inquisitor are now going to be a long distance relationship for an indefinite period of time (with the ending slides implying that they rarely see each other in person), and he doesn't even ALLOW any discussion? Yeah, no thanks. I want more respect from my partner.

Aw, I am always sorry to see people's negative reactions to the Dorian Trespasser ending. Since I like the character and the romance so much, I feel bad when others have been disappointed by it, as you were. Of course I do respect your feeling about it, but just find it unfortunate. /hug

[Ryzaki]

jtav if your character being played for a fool is going to bother you. No. Run. Romance ANYONE else. (except Qun Bull because that's even worse in the being played as a fool department). Blackwall's conversations are filled with moments where I'm just. "Wow. Obvious lie is obvious."

 

Even if you somehow make it past the love scene there's still that godawful judgement. Just...don't.

 

At least tweak the concept so being played for a fool isn't gonna bother you. Because yeah. SMH.

[Zafireria]

Its only you who knows the possible outcomes of it. Your character doesn't, if you are into role-playing you can just say that your character isn't lying because she doesn't know. Try be her and take the decisions as if you were her and forget the things you know will happen. That's what I did, I have watched some youtube clips about some of the romance scenes, so when I got to that scene myself, I tried to forget what was coming and tried to pick a choice based on her personality. Bit harder than it sounds, but it is possible  

[Dancing_Dolphin]

The depth to Blackwall's character arc makes it so compelling in such a unique way, but the only way you really get to experience it fully is if you let him live and don't make him a Warden. Moving past wanting to punish him for what he did was very challenging for me while rp-ing a forgiving character because I personally believe he should pay with his life for his crime, but forgiving him was oddly cathartic. Playing an Inquisitor who not only forgives him but accepts him, and seeing Rainer accept himself, was very rewarding from the player's perspective. I'm not talking about what Blackwall deserves, just how illuminating his journey can be.

 

That being said, the qualities that make Blackwall a compelling character, at least to me, are the very things that make him off-putting as a LI, at this point anyway. It's just too heavy for me. Keep in mind that my first LI was Solas though, so I'm all tapped out in the tears department.

[Ieldra]

jtav, You said you feel imcomplete without romance but don't like being lied to. So...if you want it authentic and you're playing enough of a self-insert for the lying to bother you, then start the romance, and when the big reveal comes, break up with him.

 

Only if you want a reasonably happy epilogue you'll need to compromise.

[themikefest]

Don't recruit him.

 

If you want to recruit him, wait till after getting to skyhold to get some interesting dialogue if you bring Varric and Cassandra

[Korva]

I'm not about to advocate for his (or anyone's) romance since I'm a repulsed aroace, but as far as Blackwall the character goes, I don't think he's as bad as many other present or past companions, "LI" or not. Even as a liar playing and using his bedmate, he doesn't hold a candle to Iron Bull or the ever-popular Solas. The main difference between him and most of these other characters is that for the most part he makes no excuses for himself. He is guilty as hell and he loathes himself for it -- that makes him vulnerable and attracts player hostility in a way that even many of the gleefully murderous and/or evil characters don't. Because being unapologetic and proud of one's horrible actions is "cool", while being sincerely guilt-ridden and remorseful is "weak". We are not invited or allowed to judge other characters as we can him, so he gets a lot of hate while other characters get admiration and excuses. Leliana, for example, is never called out for anything she did and does, instead we're meant to see her as maybe a slightly whacky crazy-nug-lady but ultimately as an admirable and charismatic reformer.

 

My main beef with Blackwall's arc is that there is no possibility for a slow rebuilding of trust and friendship. He is guilty, no bones about it, and because he's very human his quest for redemption is as flawed as it is sincere, potentially causing trouble for the Inquisition along the way. Bouncing back from all that would take most people quite some time ... but we don't get that. One moment he publicly insults us, the next moment we're instant buds again. The only lasting consequence is the broken bond between him and Cassandra, which I suspect most people will never see since running with more than one tanky warrior type (if that) doesn't seem to be very popular.