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Which Mage for the grind? Please Advise..


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#26
TheLeakestWink

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The Thunderdome was about clearing solo. They also used spawn blocking which defeats the purpose of getting as much XP as possible.

 

If you can dodge a wrench, you can dodge a ball (if it works solo, it works in a team). Assuming an NPC doesn't get the kill (lol), it doesn't matter who does, since XP is shared. CB and PC both generate damage XP AFAIK, no special difference to account for, unless you know otherwise.

 

Speaking from personal experience (anecdotal evidence alert), CB is quite viable in Perilous. The idea is to only tag each enemy once (no more) with CB and allow the tick to kill it. If you tag every enemy once, it doesn't matter if they're spread out initially, since they'll cluster up trying to get to you (if melee) or when you turn a corner/break LoS (if ranged) and start splashing damage to each other.



#27
Snakebite

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There is a Thunderdome thread to the contrary... (Cool Beats > Power Chord). This is doubly true on the XBox, where Encore does not trigger off Power Chord, but does off Cool Beats.

 

I will side with ThirdRace on this.  In most instances for players with high end gear and promotes, Power Chord trumps Cool Beats, hands down.

 

 

The Thunderdome was about clearing solo. They also used spawn blocking which defeats the purpose of getting as much XP as possible.

Under "normal" circumstances (team of 4 players without abusing spawn blocking), Cool Beats can't hold up to Power Chord. In 95% of my games, if the enemy lives for 3 seconds then you've failed because someone else will kill it before you do (I've even been trolled by the Inquisition Captain...). In those circumstances, Power Chord is much faster than Cool Beats.

 

But not for the reasons listed above.

  1. As Leakest Wink says, if it works solo, it works in a team.
  2. My Cool Beats solo did not have and spawn blocking in it.  I have asked Drasca on multiple occasions to point out a time in my video where I was blocking spawns.  He has never provided any.  He only latched onto "spawn camping" after Pronto posted a clip showing us clearing the castle in about 6 minutes, assuming it would be a somewhat believable excuse.  In a PM he told me he had not actually watched my video, yet he still claimed I spawn camped.
  3. Related to point two, my Cool Beats score per minute was actually higher than Drasca's Power Chord run.

The only reason Power Chord is more viable now is because of the crazy crit damage bonus on Hakkon weapons;  Without that high crit damage or if Cool Beats could crit, it would still be more viable than Power Chord.  Sadly that is not the case.  If someone doesn't have a Hakkon's Wisdom and good crit chance, then Cool Beats is better.  On Perilous or below, either one is perfectly viable.

 

 

Cool Beats is still awesome, but there are drawbacks: it can miss, you need tightly packed enemies to make the most out of it, it's not as instant as Power Chord and it doesn't scale well in higher difficulties.

 

Power Chord is still awesome, but there are drawbacks:  it can be blocked, you need tightly packed enemies to make the most out of it, it can't be used at range, and it doesn't activate Encore.


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#28
ThatBruhYouDK

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Holy Cheesus, this again lol.
I'd say Power Cord and Cool Beats all depend on who is playing.
I personally doo better with PC because I go with the lightening Pact Belt and try to stack up PC Damage. I'm sure CB would do fantastic as well if you stack items and what not to make it better.

Person to person basis, what works for one may not work for others

#29
Snakebite

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Holy Cheesus, this again lol.

 

I really didn't want to bring this all up again, and I swear, I was going to stay out of it, but when The Third Race repeated Drasca's propoganda...


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#30
Proto

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I love that this pops up as soon as I remove the Thunderdome link from my signature.

TheThirdRace, not sure why you would suggest switching to virtuoso to do DPS once you have the damage to one shot things with powercord? Saarabas kills faster than the Virt under those circumstances.

This whole cool beats vs. powecord has been hashed out already. Perilous and lower promos coolbeats > powecord. Hakkon and high promos powercord > coolbeats.

I'm more curious why you think the virtuoso and powercord is faster and more XP than leaping and Athlok Bursting everything? Or just lightning zapping everything with the Saarabas.
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#31
ThatBruhYouDK

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I'm more curious why you think the virtuoso and powercord is faster and more XP than leaping and Athlok Bursting everything? Or just lightning zapping everything with the Saarabas.

One would think so man. Last x2 exp weekend I got 75 promotes, all legit play. About 50 of those were from Virtuoso and Power Cord, I have no explanation for it but it happened

#32
Proto

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Right Bruh, since you've promoted the Saarabas 130 times.

#33
ThatBruhYouDK

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Right Bruh, since you've promoted the Saarabas 130 times.

I know lol. She has more promotes, either work really well though. The Virtuoso games were much faster, I think because of the higher attack speed. So I was able to do matches alot faster and promote in a shorter time because of it.

#34
TheThirdRace

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I will side with ThirdRace on this.  In most instances for players with high end gear and promotes, Power Chord trumps Cool Beats, hands down.


I must admit I don't remember how it felt being below 60 in all stats. Also, I do realize the Hakkon staff plays a big role in that too.
 

But not for the reasons listed above.


  • As Leakest Wink says, if it works solo, it works in a team.
  • My Cool Beats solo did not have and spawn blocking in it.  I have asked Drasca on multiple occasions to point out a time in my video where I was blocking spawns.  He has never provided any.  He only latched onto "spawn camping" after Pronto posted a clip showing us clearing the castle in about 6 minutes, assuming it would be a somewhat believable excuse.  In a PM he told me he had not actually watched my video, yet he still claimed I spawn camped.
  • Related to point two, my Cool Beats score per minute was actually higher than Drasca's Power Chord run.
The only reason Power Chord is more viable now is because of the crazy crit damage bonus on Hakkon weapons;  Without that high crit damage or if Cool Beats could crit, it would still be more viable than Power Chord.  Sadly that is not the case.  If someone doesn't have a Hakkon's Wisdom and good crit chance, then Cool Beats is better.  On Perilous or below, either one is perfectly viable.

 


I disagree with your #1, things tend to group up when soloing which makes AOE damage a lot better. When in a team of highly promoted players, things dies so fast they don't group as much. This is very bad for Cool Beats since most of its awesomeness comes from the AOE damage, not the direct hit. Although, if you have the necessary gear you won't see much difference on Perilous and lower.

There are a lot of things that lose some luster when playing with great players too. Static Cage is contender for the best CC spell of the game, but who cares when my Archer just mows things down on Nightmare in 2 seconds? The potential of DOT is often "wasted" because the damn DOT takes too long. Who takes longer duration on Dark Channel (ME3) when you can just kill the thing in 0.3 seconds instead? Wasted potential. DOT should always be less than 4 seconds or kill anything at the end of the duration, otherwise the gap in damage and killing time is simply in favor of direct damage. Although, other mechanics also play a role, for example, it doesn't matter if you kill everything in less than a second if the round always last the same amount of time because of how the spawning is done...

Maybe it's just me wanting to actually kill the damn thing in front of me. If playing with 3 other good teammates, most of what I tag with Cool Beats will die by THEIR hands. If I use Power Chord, I do the kill in about 1 second. Thus my reward is instant and tangible, not happening with Cool Beats.

And don't get me wrong, I know how good Cool Beats is. On Perilous and lower it absolutely wreck things up. I have no idea if it actually generates more or less XP than Power Chord though, I've never noticed any difference between the 2 but I could be wrong.
 

Power Chord is still awesome, but there are drawbacks:  it can be blocked, you need tightly packed enemies to make the most out of it, it can't be used at range, and it doesn't activate Encore.


The Virtuoso is my most played Mage (200+ games) and I've done about 50% of my games with Cool Beats. This is just my feeling, but I've seen Cool Beats being blocked more often than Power Chord. I've also seen it miss often, point blank, 2 meters, 5 meters, 30 meters.

I'm pretty sure Encore activates perfectly fine on PC with Power Chord. I've done 50% of my games using mostly Power Chord (95% of the time) and got free cast with Encore more than I can count.
 

I really didn't want to bring this all up again, and I swear, I was going to stay out of it, but when The Third Race repeated Drasca's propoganda...


Please, never mention me in the same sentence as Drasca :sick:

No matter what I do or say, I'll never be even remotely in the same category... Thank you :)
 

I love that this pops up as soon as I remove the Thunderdome link from my signature.

TheThirdRace, not sure why you would suggest switching to virtuoso to do DPS once you have the damage to one shot things with powercord? Saarabas kills faster than the Virt under those circumstances.

This whole cool beats vs. powecord has been hashed out already. Perilous and lower promos coolbeats > powecord. Hakkon and high promos powercord > coolbeats.

I'm more curious why you think the virtuoso and powercord is faster and more XP than leaping and Athlok Bursting everything? Or just lightning zapping everything with the Saarabas.


I don't know, I think it's just a feeling. I've done a lot of run on Perilous with the Virtuoso and you just march fourth and things melt. It's straightforward, you walk, things dies, you get to the door and it's done.

With the Saarebas, I feel you jump around a lot which *may* lead to more spawns. Some enemies also run past you, you need to go after them or let your teammates pick them up. I'm pretty fast with her too, but there is a lot of downtime jumping around and with some of the casting time. It's less linear in gameplay, it does feel a bit less consistent than just a line marching fourth and flies melting with nothing getting past you.

Both are pretty amazing, they're very fast. I wouldn't say the Saarebas is necessarily slower than the Virtuoso, she just plays differently. The only reason I suggested the Virtuoso is that he tends to be forgotten a lot. I've seen players top 50 in the leaderboard that don't even have 30 games with it. It's almost a crime!
 

I know lol. She has more promotes, either work really well though. The Virtuoso games were much faster, I think because of the higher attack speed. So I was able to do matches alot faster and promote in a shorter time because of it.


That pretty much nails my feeling.

 

It's also a lot easier to spam Power Chord than to learn how to make the Saarebas "tic". I've seen countless players not being able to even remotely match my speed with her, it's sad :(



#35
capn233

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I'm pretty sure Encore activates perfectly fine on PC with Power Chord. I've done 50% of my games using mostly Power Chord (95% of the time) and got free cast with Encore more than I can count.

 

I'm pretty sure it works as well.

 

I have the Hakkon staff, and overall prefer Power Chord to Cool Beats if I am just going to use one power.  Even with my relatively low stats.  Over the weekend someone tried to tell me CB does "ten times the damage of power chord" though.



#36
TheThirdRace

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Over the weekend someone tried to tell me CB does "ten times the damage of power chord" though.


Well, 1 cast vs 1 cast, they're right ;)

It does take a lot longer to kill 1 target overall because it's DOT, but why see both sides of a coin if it suits your agenda?

#37
Proto

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One would think so man. Last x2 exp weekend I got 75 promotes, all legit play. About 50 of those were from Virtuoso and Power Cord, I have no explanation for it but it happened

 

 

The Virtuoso games were much faster, I think because of the higher attack speed. So I was able to do matches alot faster and promote in a shorter time because of it.

 

You were playing a non-level one in Perilous with 200 or more in every stat and the best gear in the game. Of course the Virtuoso "felt" faster than the Saarabas. All you have to do in Perilous with a Virtuoso and your stats and gear is casually walk towards the door while pressing right bumper with powerchord qued. Though, Saarabas is pretty much the same thing, you just have to know what stance you are in and pay a tiny bit of attention to positioning. 

 

I don't know, I think it's just a feeling. I've done a lot of run on Perilous with the Virtuoso and you just march fourth and things melt. It's straightforward, you walk, things dies, you get to the door and it's done.

With the Saarebas, I feel you jump around a lot which *may* lead to more spawns. Some enemies also run past you, you need to go after them or let your teammates pick them up. I'm pretty fast with her too, but there is a lot of downtime jumping around and with some of the casting time. It's less linear in gameplay, it does feel a bit less consistent than just a line marching fourth and flies melting with nothing getting past you.

Both are pretty amazing, they're very fast. I wouldn't say the Saarebas is necessarily slower than the Virtuoso, she just plays differently. The only reason I suggested the Virtuoso is that he tends to be forgotten a lot. I've seen players top 50 in the leaderboard that don't even have 30 games with it. It's almost a crime!
 


That pretty much nails my feeling.

 

It's also a lot easier to spam Power Chord than to learn how to make the Saarebas "tic". I've seen countless players not being able to even remotely match my speed with her, it's sad :(

 

I will mention the same thing I hinted to Bruh. Players with our stats shouldn't be playing Perilous other than with a level one...

 

Powerchord, Coolbeats, it's all mute in Perilous. What the heck are we doing playing that difficulty. Everything hits us for one and dies instantly. 

 

 

Please, never mention me in the same sentence as Drasca :sick:

No matter what I do or say, I'll never be even remotely in the same category... Thank you :)

 

Yeah, low blow Snake, low blow. I'll go ahead and apologize for him. Not cool.

 

 

I disagree with your #1, things tend to group up when soloing which makes AOE damage a lot better. When in a team of highly promoted players, things dies so fast they don't group as much. This is very bad for Cool Beats since most of its awesomeness comes from the AOE damage, not the direct hit. Although, if you have the necessary gear you won't see much difference on Perilous and lower.

There are a lot of things that lose some luster when playing with great players too. Static Cage is contender for the best CC spell of the game, but who cares when my Archer just mows things down on Nightmare in 2 seconds? The potential of DOT is often "wasted" because the damn DOT takes too long. Who takes longer duration on Dark Channel (ME3) when you can just kill the thing in 0.3 seconds instead? Wasted potential. DOT should always be less than 4 seconds or kill anything at the end of the duration, otherwise the gap in damage and killing time is simply in favor of direct damage. Although, other mechanics also play a role, for example, it doesn't matter if you kill everything in less than a second if the round always last the same amount of time because of how the spawning is done...

Maybe it's just me wanting to actually kill the damn thing in front of me. If playing with 3 other good teammates, most of what I tag with Cool Beats will die by THEIR hands. If I use Power Chord, I do the kill in about 1 second. Thus my reward is instant and tangible, not happening with Cool Beats.

 

You won't be getting an argument from anyone about Coolbeat's effectiveness compared to Powercord in NM. More enemies with cold immunity than lightning AND no critical hits = gimp.

 

But, Coolbeats OPness in Perilous is well documented. The following video was taken when we had promo scrub stats by today's standards, dragon weapons and crap armor. If Coolbeats was capable of critical hits I imagine the results would be similar in NM. Have you played with someone using a Winter Pact Belt and Coolbeats against Red Templars? Only thing you get to kill is Knights. Imagine that damage, but better, and you get to keep your full health bar. The fact that more things are immune to cold in NM would still be annoying but hey, its not like the Virtuoso is limited to one ability.

 

Sorry, I couldn't help re-posting a video that highlights the greatness of our previous "God of DAMP."

 

 

 

I'm pretty sure it works as well.

 

I have the Hakkon staff, and overall prefer Power Chord to Cool Beats if I am just going to use one power.  Even with my relatively low stats.  Over the weekend someone tried to tell me CB does "ten times the damage of power chord" though.

 

Yarpen tested Powerchord on PC during the Thunderdome thread. If I remember correctly it was very random and didn't work consistently, barely at all. I know forsure it does not work on Xbox, 1/5 of the time max.

 

I have waay over 250 games on the Virtuoso. 


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#38
ThatBruhYouDK

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I will mention the same thing I hinted to Bruh. Players with our stats shouldn't be playing Perilous other than with a level one...

And I 100% agree. But I was going for promotes that weekend..the results more than show for themselves don't they?

#39
DrakeHasNoFlow

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And I 100% agree. But I was going for promotes that weekend..the results more than show for themselves don't they?


It's only legit if it's not on pc....

=)
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#40
Snakebite

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I disagree with your #1, things tend to group up when soloing which makes AOE damage a lot better. When in a team of highly promoted players, things dies so fast they don't group as much. This is very bad for Cool Beats since most of its awesomeness comes from the AOE damage, not the direct hit. Although, if you have the necessary gear you won't see much difference on Perilous and lower.

 

This argument works against Power Chord as well, seeing as it is an AoE ability also.  Clearly this isn't true with Power Chord, so why is it true with Cool Beats?

 

 

The Virtuoso is my most played Mage (200+ games) and I've done about 50% of my games with Cool Beats. This is just my feeling, but I've seen Cool Beats being blocked more often than Power Chord. I've also seen it miss often, point blank, 2 meters, 5 meters, 30 meters.

I'm pretty sure Encore activates perfectly fine on PC with Power Chord. I've done 50% of my games using mostly Power Chord (95% of the time) and got free cast with Encore more than I can count.

 

Cool Beats can only be blocked by enemies with shields.  Enemies that actually block things, where it shows "blocked" when they block things, cannot block Cool Beats, but they can block Power Chord.  You can see both of these in mine and Drasca's videos.

 

Also during the thunderdome, I showed that Encore only activates off of about 5% of kills with Power Chord.  Drasca denied that this happened on PC, even after I pointed out that the same thing happened in the videos he posted.  Only after Yarpen confirmed that it does not work on PC did Drasca accept this.  Again, you can see this in both mine and Drasca's videos from that period.  This may have changed since then on PC, but it still does not work on console.

 

 

Please, never mention me in the same sentence as Drasca :sick:

No matter what I do or say, I'll never be even remotely in the same category... Thank you :)

 

Yeah... sorry about that.  But I wonder why you claim that either of us were spawn camping in that competition.  Anyone who watched the videos would know that isn't the case, and the only person who claims otherwise is Drasca.  So where did "The Thunderdome was about clearing solo. They also used spawn blocking which defeats the purpose of getting as much XP as possible" come from?

 

 

Maybe it's just me wanting to actually kill the damn thing in front of me. If playing with 3 other good teammates, most of what I tag with Cool Beats will die by THEIR hands. If I use Power Chord, I do the kill in about 1 second. Thus my reward is instant and tangible, not happening with Cool Beats.

 

I would talk more on this, but Proto summed up my stance pretty well already.  All I want to say is that my advice in my first post in this thread was to use Power Chord instead Cool Beats if you are in Nightmare and/or if you have a Hakkon's Wisdom, namely because of your reasoning above.
 
 
Edit:  As to the question posed by the OP, either the Virtuoso or Saarebas.  Whichever one you prefer.  Better late than never, right?


#41
ThatBruhYouDK

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Let's all agree to disagree?

Ha! This is BSN! We will disagree on that too. xD

#42
Texasmotiv

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I like cool beats for less mathematical or practical reasons: the spell is more satisfying to me. Spamming power chord for someone without guaranteed crits is a very frustrating feeling mixed with sound it makes and the vibration feedback it just makes me upset.
Hitting a couple guys in a big grouping and seeing the whole pack freeze and crackle is much more satisfying.
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#43
Proto

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Not gonna lie. I just got sidetracked for about 20 minutes re-reading the Thunderdome thread. FREAKING EPIC.

 

Highly recommend for anyone new to the boards.

 

THUNDERDOME



#44
Snakebite

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Let's all agree to disagree?

 

I'm fairly certain we are all in agreement that Cool Beats is not good above Perilous.  That's the real point, right?

 

 

Not gonna lie. I just got sidetracked for about 20 minutes re-reading the Thunderdome thread. FREAKING EPIC.

 

Highly recommend for anyone new to the boards.

 

 

Well maybe if someone had it in their signature, it would be easier to find.

 

Seriously though, that thread is way too long and way too circular.  People really shouldn't start reading that unless they feel like reading the same thing over and over and over again for a few hours.



#45
ThatBruhYouDK

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I'm fairly certain we are all in agreement that Cool Beats is not good above Perilous. That's the real point, right?

Ahhhhh..let's not mention that. However true it might be

#46
ThatBruhYouDK

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Not gonna lie. I just got sidetracked for about 20 minutes re-reading the Thunderdome thread. FREAKING EPIC.

Highly recommend for anyone new to the boards.

THUNDERDOME


I did the same thing..it is hilarious every time xD
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#47
JiaJM98

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Please, no need to prove/force anything. Everyone has their preference. It's aLso hard to follow since I'm unfamiliar with the Saarebas.
I also confused with the storm pact belt because they just seem to do random stuff like drop my health down to nothing

Pact belt = glass cannon belt. It massively reduces your health but buffs up your elemental damage (storm belt buff electric damage for instance). 

 

I like saarebas because of a few things:

 

1. all the abilities have no CD or mana cost, so spam it! (And assara's leap is also great for zipping around if you hate walking like I do, and you get this right from lv1. It's my favourite part of her. With other mages their fade step does similar stuff but it has a pretty long CD.)

 

2. you get a free storm pact belt from the passive From knowledge, Power, so you can put on an ice belt instead and Itwa-adim explosion makes use of both. The starting stance of it does good aoe electric damage, and finishing stance does great aoe ice dot damage. If something is immune to one of the elements, then just use the other one. Barquen Barrage is also great in doing monstrous single target damage.

 

3. you are pretty survivable. From knowledge, strength gets that reduced health (due to pact belt) back over time by gradually increase your maximum health. Other abilities / passives like electric glyphs and static cage and guardian spirit can let you dodge some hits should you have made a mistake. Both IA Explosion and BB are ranged skills so you can hang back a little before your health builds up and decide to face rush everything.

 

Of course, if you are a promotion scrub, just wear fire pact, jump into the middle of a horde with assara's leap and use starting stance anthlok burst and 1 shot everything...


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#48
JiaJM98

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On the other hand.. playing Saarebus is probably toughest on the keyboard.. just saying! :D  Think of all those 1 2 3 you will pressing non stop with no cooldown....

So you are saying you prefer holding onto the shift button for sprint for the whole match instead of just tapping a number key whenever you need to move? No way you are serious...


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#49
JiaJM98

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Wait, the Saarabas has barrier?

 

Just give me a fire glyph, please.

Next time when Proto is doing HB, someone should bring a bard with inquisition staff and just give him a tiny bit of barrier every time, hoping that damage carry over from the barrier would 1 shot him  :D

 

Tried this on Bruh's #The Destroyer when we were doing NM.  :devil: Didn't work at all, except I wasn't doing it properly (Forgot to put on inquisition staff and forgot to take off my barrier ring. It was an error!)



#50
JiaJM98

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Yarpen tested Powerchord on PC during the Thunderdome thread. If I remember correctly it was very random and didn't work consistently, barely at all. I know forsure it does not work on Xbox, 1/5 of the time max.

I second this. Just tested power chord + Encore again on routine and the encore proc seems totally random. When I kill more than 1 enemy with a single power chord the encore definitely won't proc at all. If I kill only 1 enemy with power chord then encore seem to proc about half the time.