130 réponses à ce sujet

[Cyonan]

Which technically is still effecting SP. I don't think there is anything wrong with saying I shouldn't need to do more fetch quests because I don't do MP.

I kind of want SP to effect MP and MP to be allowed to effect MP. Unlock maps in the SP campaign. Have missions in MP tied to off camera events in the SP story. Have a mission in SP with a countdown clock representing how long your soldiers hold off the enemy. Give a default time but allow a MP campaign match in a survival mode style be played to link that time to the SPs campaign. You last 20 minutes in survival mode then your SP character gets 20 minutes.

 

You basically just said "I shouldn't need to do more fetch quests because I don't do MP, but I like the idea of forcing MP players to play SP to get all the maps".

 

I would say ideally, the effects of MP vs SP shouldn't be more than cosmetic.

[Ahglock]

You basically just said "I shouldn't need to do more fetch quests because I don't do MP, but I like the idea of forcing MP players to play SP to get all the maps".

I would say ideally, the effects of MP vs SP shouldn't be more than cosmetic.

No I said there is nothing wrong with wanting no effect at all. I can recognize other arguments see their value and still hold a different personal feeling on the subject.

I personally want both sides to effect the other side. I like the idea of MP having lore of a story a story or campaign mode maybe and linking that to single player progression. I also like having potential effects on SP gameplay gaining tactical advantages or disadvantages based on the success of the MP campaign. Not required just a potential perk.

[Cyonan]

No I said there is nothing wrong with wanting no effect at all. I can recognize other arguments see their value and still hold a different personal feeling on the subject.

I personally want both sides to effect the other side. I like the idea of MP having lore of a story a story or campaign mode maybe and linking that to single player progression. I also like having potential effects on SP gameplay gaining tactical advantages or disadvantages based on the success of the MP campaign. Not required just a potential perk.

 

The problem is that it can easily end up feeling like you're being penalized for not doing the SP content just to get a perk in MP, or being given a disadvantage in SP because you got a bad team in MP.

 

Though I would say that after the whole ME3 thing, the chances of MP or SP having significant influence on each other seems pretty minimal.

[Ahglock]

The problem is that it can easily end up feeling like you're being penalized for not doing the SP content just to get a perk in MP, or being given a disadvantage in SP because you got a bad team in MP.

Though I would say that after the whole ME3 thing, the chances of MP or SP having significant influence on each other seems pretty minimal.

Yeah that just makes me want it more.

And sorry I lost track of my sentence half way through up there. I'm too lazy to edit it to something that makes sense.

[The Real Pearl #2]

Burn the thread mods, OP Confirmed troll, BURN IT

[PresidentVorchaMasterBaits]

Burn the thread mods, OP Confirmed troll, BURN IT

AGREED!!! GRRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGHH!!!

[prosthetic soul]

Basically what you are saying: "I know everything, l know what fun is, I KNOW WHAT'S BEST FOR ALL OF U"

That is quite possibly the worst straw man I have ever witnessed in my 28 years of living.  That wasn't even within a million light years of what I said.

[prosthetic soul]

we are talking about mass effect here, not dragon age

Wow, that is some quality deflection right there. 

 

While I generally disapprove of any singleplayer content being gated by multiplayer in any way, when it's just props and such, I can't say that I care too much. If it was story stuff, then I'd be pretty unhappy about it. 

 

Hey look, I found both of you in a picture online! 

[prosthetic soul]

Possibility 1: Chronoid is so amazingly narcissistic and compacted into his/her little box so as not be worth talking to at all as (s)he will just come up with more inane illogical excuses for his faulty opinion. This is because no matter what logic you use to back up your views Chronoid is just too self righteous and blind to ever accept that (s)he could be wrong on this.

 

What's really amazing is that this person might actually believe their opinion is the only valid one and goes even further to promote this single-handed idiot view to others in a sad attempt at vindication towards it's hilariously ill-informed views.

 

Possibility 2: Chronoid is in fact, trolling.

 

You know, I'd almost accuse this of being the pot calling the kettle black but that doesn't even work here.  This is more of a case of a black pot calling the white kettle black. 

 

Notice how he never actually refutes my arguments directly.  He says I'm using inane illogical excuses without actually explaining how my posts are illogical.  He proclaims I'm self-righteous but doesn't back it up with proof.  He just....states things as fact without even listening to what I have to say.  This is basically ad hominem so dense it could probably form a black hole.  Nowhere did I say my opinion was the only valid one.  But when people keep using logical fallacies and other falsities to EXCUSE Bioware's MP obsession, I can't really take it as valid can I?  I used Dragon Age Inquisition and provided specific examples that proved MP was more focused on.

 

But then the only response I get is "This isn't about that, this is about THIS."  How is that a valid response or argument I can even remotely take seriously?  You never denied it, just shifted the goal posts.  I would be perfectly okay to listen to anyone who offers a genuine argument as to why the Multiplayer isn't a big deal.  You just presume otherwise because....reasons?   Instead I get lambasted with insults, basically get called an idiot and am accused of trolling.   Which isn't skin off my ass necessarily but it also kind of irks me because

 

1. Trolling isn't having a different opinion than someone else.  Good lord I wish people would stop using this word out of context.

2. You said I don't think anyone else's opinion is valid but then in the same post you insinuate my opinion isn't valid to begin with.  ???????????  May I have some of the drugs you're using? 

3. If you want to find a troll, look in the mirror.  I haven't been the one insulting others in this thread over differing opinions.  Just been calmly arguing my stance. 

[DragonRacer]

I would like to point out something that I think might be getting ignored here or maybe I'm just full of rubbish. Either way, here is my point:

 

Do you think it's possible that what you see as an "obsession" with MP on BioWare's part is actually just a difference in timeline for how content can be provided based on what it is? What I mean by this is that it takes a longer amount of time for the SP team to develop SP DLC than it does for the MP live team to throw a switch for a weekend challenge which, really, just amounts to playing the game but just doing a particular thing, such as using a certain weapon or character. A weekend challenge is not really "new content", it's just something easy to do to keep the MP fans engaged while the MP team spends time working on actual DLC content (which seems to take about as long as producing SP content takes).

 

That's... not really something you can do with SP content. Such as a splash screen saying - "SP Weekend Challenge - complete five War Table operations!" You know? So, naturally, seeing a splash screen every weekend alerting MP players to a new weekend challenge is naturally going to make things look like there is a greater MP focus.

 

But in reality, I feel SP actually got more overall content or, at least, they were fairly even for DAI. You listed things such as DLCs, new maps, weekend challenges as showing a bias towards more MP content. In reality, SP and MP got the same basic amount of DLCs. SP got Black Emporium (small/minor), Jaws of Hakkon (sizable), The Descent (sizable), and Trespasser (sizable). MP got Destruction... which just added three "alternate" versions of the original three maps and threw wild animals into the mix as enemies. I'd call it a very small DLC, on par with Black Emporium size, and also introduced an awesome game-breaking bug that went unfixed for several months because BioWare released it right before they went dark for the holidays. Then, MP got DragonSlayer DLC, which was sizable - it added a new map, an optional dragon fight on the new map, and some new character kits to play. And that was it. That was literally all of the MP DLC. Two, compared to SP's three. We did get two more playable kits trickled out to us and two new (super annoying) enemy factions around the time of Trespasser. So, I suppose if you add those together with the two official MP DLCs, you could maybe say SP and MP were fairly even as far as new content goes.

 

However, I do speak as someone who likes both modes, so obviously I have a bias to not hate anything related to MP simply on the account that it is MP. I really did enjoy ME3 SP and loved ME3 MP. I really loved DAI SP and sorta enjoyed DAI MP. I don't feel either of them took away from each other. I understand that you, among others, feel very differently about that. I'm sorry, but I am not sorry for enjoying both the SP and the MP of the last two games.

[The Real Pearl #2]

That is quite possibly the worst straw man I have ever witnessed in my 28 years of living.  That wasn't even within a million light years of what I said.

That's the joke, I am sorry you can't handle the fact that I disagree with you. 

Let rick and morty explain my apathetic attitude:

[prosthetic soul]

I would like to point out something that I think might be getting ignored here or maybe I'm just full of rubbish. Either way, here is my point:

 

Do you think it's possible that what you see as an "obsession" with MP on BioWare's part is actually just a difference in timeline for how content can be provided based on what it is? What I mean by this is that it takes a longer amount of time for the SP team to develop SP DLC than it does for the MP live team to throw a switch for a weekend challenge which, really, just amounts to playing the game but just doing a particular thing, such as using a certain weapon or character. A weekend challenge is not really "new content", it's just something easy to do to keep the MP fans engaged while the MP team spends time working on actual DLC content (which seems to take about as long as producing SP content takes).

 

That's... not really something you can do with SP content. Such as a splash screen saying - "SP Weekend Challenge - complete five War Table operations!" You know? So, naturally, seeing a splash screen every weekend alerting MP players to a new weekend challenge is naturally going to make things look like there is a greater MP focus.

 

But in reality, I feel SP actually got more overall content or, at least, they were fairly even for DAI. You listed things such as DLCs, new maps, weekend challenges as showing a bias towards more MP content. In reality, SP and MP got the same basic amount of DLCs. SP got Black Emporium (small/minor), Jaws of Hakkon (sizable), The Descent (sizable), and Trespasser (sizable). MP got Destruction... which just added three "alternate" versions of the original three maps and threw wild animals into the mix as enemies. I'd call it a very small DLC, on par with Black Emporium size, and also introduced an awesome game-breaking bug that went unfixed for several months because BioWare released it right before they went dark for the holidays. Then, MP got DragonSlayer DLC, which was sizable - it added a new map, an optional dragon fight on the new map, and some new character kits to play. And that was it. That was literally all of the MP DLC. Two, compared to SP's three. We did get two more playable kits trickled out to us and two new (super annoying) enemy factions around the time of Trespasser. So, I suppose if you add those together with the two official MP DLCs, you could maybe say SP and MP were fairly even as far as new content goes.

 

However, I do speak as someone who likes both modes, so obviously I have a bias to not hate anything related to MP simply on the account that it is MP. I really did enjoy ME3 SP and loved ME3 MP. I really loved DAI SP and sorta enjoyed DAI MP. I don't feel either of them took away from each other. I understand that you, among others, feel very differently about that. I'm sorry, but I am not sorry for enjoying both the SP and the MP of the last two games.

Mother of God...the first level-headed, reasonable, and well-made post in this thread regarding the condoning of MP. 

 

You may be onto something in regards to the bolded part.   You're saying it's a matter of perspective.  Which is definitely plausible seeing as how BW shoved it in your face at the main menu screen whenever they could. That would grate on anyone's nerves.  And I also concede using voice actors can be costlier for the SP DLC, whereas I think...you only record grunts in MP? I guess? 

[The Real Pearl #2]

Wow, that is some quality deflection right there. 

 

 

Hey look, I found both of you in a picture online! 

St

So going off topic is acceptable? k

 

that stock image is super memetastic

[prosthetic soul]

That's the joke, I am sorry you can't handle the fact that I disagree with you. 

Let rick and morty explain my apathetic attitude:

Wait....this doesn't make any sense.  If it was a joke, then why would I be unable to handle it?   An argumentative fallacy isn't really a joke.  Where's the punch line?  Are you saying you were pretending to make a bad argument for the sake of laughs?  ........

 

You're right.  I can't handle this nonsense. At all.

 

[DragonRacer]

Mother of God...the first level-headed, reasonable, and well-made post in this thread regarding the condoning of MP. 

 

You may be onto something in regards to the bolded part.   You're saying it's a matter of perspective.  Which is definitely plausible seeing as how BW shoved it in your face at the main menu screen whenever they could. That would grate on anyone's nerves.  And I also concede using voice actors can be costlier for the SP DLC, whereas I think...you only record grunts in MP? I guess? 

 

Some of us are actually reasonable. We also have our trolls, too. Or just folks who have gotten so tired of the immediate "ewww, MP" bias that they are instantly triggered into defensive/troll mode.

 

Most of us, honestly, are fairly reasonable, though. Maybe moreso actually in-game than on this forum.

 

As far as that splash screen goes, I hated it. I found it cringe-worthy and I also knew it would just make people despise MP even more because it screamed of "Look at us, more stuff for the MP people!" when, in reality, it was nothing new at all. A simple splash screen notice upon signing into the MP portion of the game would have been preferred, IMO.

 

Oh, voice acting in MP is a hilarious subject, actually! The original character kits all had recorded dialogue lines, actually, in addition to grunts and whatnot. Those also cycle on repeat... a lot. Got annoying very quickly. Please, don't ever ask me about the ham in camp from last night. Just... don't. But even better was you could tell the MP budget got chopped down to barely anything by the last two added characters - a Silent Sister and a Saarebas. Which meant, of course, that neither of them make any noise at all for lore purposes (cut out tongue for former, sewn-shut mouth for latter). So, no money spent paying voice actors to record any additional dialogue. It was actually a clever way, I thought, for the MP team to try and squeak out a little last bit of content by cutting costs where they could.

[The Real Pearl #2]

Mother of God...the first level-headed, reasonable, and well-made post in this thread regarding the condoning of MP. 

 

You may be onto something in regards to the bolded part.   You're saying it's a matter of perspective.  Which is definitely plausible seeing as how BW shoved it in your face at the main menu screen whenever they could. That would grate on anyone's nerves.  And I also concede using voice actors can be costlier for the SP DLC, whereas I think...you only record grunts in MP? 

They already explained to you that the MP changes **** all in the sp hence the response

[x] SP butthurt

[wolfhowwl]

ME3 MP forum:

 

People discussing combat, enemies, builds, and strategy. The actual meat of the game.

 

ME3 SP forum:

 

THE ENDING RUINED MY LIFE

 

LIARA GOT MORE CONTENT ITS NOT ****** FAIR

 

I DONT LIKE IT THEREFORE ITS POORLY WRITTEN

 

I WANT TO BANG A PROTHEAN

 

Gee I wonder why BioWare caters to the multiplayer fanbase more.

[The Real Pearl #2]

Wait....this doesn't make any sense.  If it was a joke, then why would I be unable to handle it?   An argumentative fallacy isn't really a joke.  Where's the punch line?  Are you saying you were pretending to make a bad argument for the sake of laughs?  ........

 

You're right.  I can't handle this nonsense. At all.

 

that's the spirit.

[CrimsonN7]

ME3 MP forum:

 

People discussing combat, enemies, builds, and strategy. The actual meat of the game.

 

ME3 SP forum:

 

THE ENDING RUINED MY LIFE

 

LIARA GOT MORE CONTENT ITS NOT ****** FAIR

 

I DONT LIKE IT THEREFORE ITS POORLY WRITTEN

 

I WANT TO BANG A PROTHEAN

 

Gee I wonder why BioWare caters to the multiplayer fanbase more.

 

 

Fortunately I'm a fan of both the SP and MP content, all these salty threads though.

[Deathjester929]

ME3 MP forum:

 

People discussing combat, enemies, builds, and strategy. The actual meat of the game.

 

ME3 SP forum:

 

THE ENDING RUINED MY LIFE

 

LIARA GOT MORE CONTENT ITS NOT ****** FAIR

 

I DONT LIKE IT THEREFORE ITS POORLY WRITTEN

 

I WANT TO BANG A PROTHEAN

 

Gee I wonder why BioWare caters to the multiplayer fanbase more.

 

LOL at you thinking no one complains on multiplayer games, and that customer complaints are unique to Mass Effect or single player. Might want to go check out the Battlefront forums.

 

http://starwars.ea.c...eral-discussion

 

Also if you want a MMO? Play an MMO. Bioware makes one. If you think ME multiplayer required tons of strategy? Welp that is just laughable. I would love to see you play say a Subtlety rogue in a mythic 25 man in World of Warcraft. 

 

If we get Battlefront visuals on a horde mode and jetpacks like Battlefront? Heck I will be happy. If they add some casual pvp (like Battlefront) but obviously with less content because it is not the core of the game? Also cool. Expecting more than that? Not really. If they want to make ME: Destiny? Make it. You can go play that, and I will go play a real MMO or a real competitive shooter.

[Ahglock]

^. I can only speak about the last 4 months or so of the MP forum for ME3. But maybe it's the co-op nature or the horde mode design but there is very little bitching in the forum. Maybe at launch when bugs were getting handled or balancing of X was a issue. But it's pretty damn helpful currently. though the sp forums aren't bad either as long as you aren't in the story based sub forums. If you go to combat and gameplay people are helpful there.

[Cyonan]

ME3 MP forum:

 

People discussing combat, enemies, builds, and strategy. The actual meat of the game.

 

During the first year when support was still going on there was a lot of crying any time the word nerf was ever used, and plenty of "RUINED FOREVER!!!!" comments whenever something was nerfed.

 

Especially when it came to Tactical Cloak.

[SLooPPy JOE]

Key to Andromeda MP success comes from DAI's example:

 

1. Introduce crippling "key" glitch

2. Take a 6 month break

3. Release DLC to the 100 players that stuck around

4. ???

5. Profit

[Vortex13]

Key to Andromeda MP success comes from DAI's example:

 

1. Introduce crippling "key" glitch

2. Take a 6 month break

3. Release DLC to the 100 players that stuck around

4. ???

5. Profit

 

Don't forget the promise that Dragon Age Multiplayer would be: "Supported longer than Mass Effect's Multiplayer." 

 

Seriously, DAMP's handling was so bad compared to MEMP that I almost found it hard to believe that the same company was involved with both game modes. I am hoping that what occurred in Dragon Age was the low point of BioWare's (non-MMO)multiplayer career, and that DAMP will only be looked at as an example of what not to do moving forward.  

[Deathjester929]

During the first year when support was still going on there was a lot of crying any time the word nerf was ever used, and plenty of "RUINED FOREVER!!!!" comments whenever something was nerfed.

 

Especially when it came to Tactical Cloak.

 

The cat goes meow the cow goes moo and stealth classes are always impossible to balance and the cause of most crying and complaints.

 

When they are OP? Everyone rolls one. When they are balanced? People complain they are OP. When they get nerfed? They get nerfed to the ground. When they are buffed back up to be balanced, people want them nerfed again.

 

I would say rogues have been the most complained about class in World of Warcraft, while never winning a Blizzcon. The crying over Sith Agent operatives/Smuggler in SWTOR at release was the stuff of legends. I had a scoundrel on The Fatman server named Liu-kang and ran around with my chest armor off and got literal death threats from people who played Sith sorcerers, whom I targeted in War Zones without mercy lol. Having played beta I knew everyone was going to play a sorcerer (they were considered OP), so I picked their anti class. Good times.

 

^. I can only speak about the last 4 months or so of the MP forum for ME3. But maybe it's the co-op nature or the horde mode design but there is very little bitching in the forum. Maybe at launch when bugs were getting handled or balancing of X was a issue. But it's pretty damn helpful currently. though the sp forums aren't bad either as long as you aren't in the story based sub forums. If you go to combat and gameplay people are helpful there.

 

Release was different as the other guy said. PVE is not near as bad as PVP complaints as long as there is no super high end PVE like raiding in a MMO. Then the PVE players are actually worse than the pvp players. PVP players talk a lot of @$%#, but it is usually in good fun (with some exceptions). The biggest scumbags I have ever met in my life have been hardcore raiders in MMO's. I have witnessed girls brought to tears, marriages broken up, people stealing guild banks/gold and server transferring, you name it.

 

If they add PvP to Mass Effect or big PVE raids or something with high end loot drops? The complaining about balance will never stop. Just horde mode? Yeah not much complaints there.Horde mode is not really putting a heavy focus on PVE though. To be honest Bioware probably only put it in to hamper piracy with the war assets thing and surprisingly people liked it. 

 

Because Horde mode is not a PVE Multiplayer focused game to begin with (large raid boss encounters or epic loot drops), the argument that people do not complain about "balance" in it, or comparing it to complaints about story arcs is kind of silly.

 

No one would buy ME if it were just horde waves with no story or campaign and no PvP as well. If they do make PVE a bigger deal with drops, boss fights? People will complain and you will laugh pretty hard at their lunacy.