36 réponses à ce sujet

[Henry Augustus]

Hello everyone, first post here. I'm not much of a forum user and english isn't my first language,

so I apologise in advance for mistakes. I tried to find if anyone had proposed something like my

theory before, to no avail. Hence, I decided to start this thread.

Now, after that N7 Day trailer I think most of us agree that an ark (very likely that ship we saw

there) will almost certainly be our method of travel to Andromeda. And I think it makes more sense

that we depart before rather than after the ME3 ending. Also, I was intrigued by the Black Ark

Theory (which basically proposes the Ark is a modified Collector cruiser) and as I tossed the idea

around in my mind I formulated my own hypothesis. Be warned, this may sound audacious:

 

What if the Ark is actually... the Collector base itself?

Far-fetched? Maybe. But then again, maybe not...

First of all, there is that trailer ship. As I see it, it bears just enough resemblance to the Collector

base to be a quite heavily retrofitted version of it. Remove/Cover the organic matter, add/replace

components... While it's hard to say much about the scale, the trailer ship looks huge, possibly

the size of the base.

I hear you ask: "Wouldn't this make the "Save the Collector base" option in ME2 canon?"

Depends on your perspective. I've always disliked the notion of canon in the context of Mass

Effect universe. Instead, I like to think in terms of timelines. Simply put, my theory posits that

ME:A takes place in a different timeline than ME3 with the base destroyed. And in my opinion,

if we ever get a game set in post ME3 Milky Way, the most reasonable way to do it would be

to pick one ending state. What I'm proposing here is mild in comparison. Hey, if you chose to

destroy the base, don't worry. Since the new game will likely be very much separate from the

Original Trilogy, it doesn't really matter to Shepard (or those close to him) at all whether the

Ark ever exists or not.

 

Next, I'll examine some concerns that follow this line of thought and offer my take on how all

this could play out.

I recall Shepard saying the Collector base isn't "exactly portable" or something like that, but he

really didn't have time to study it. Even EDI probably couldn't analyze it very deeply. Then

imagine if TIM finds out that the base wasn't originally a space station at all, but a vessel: a

Prothean ark, their own contingency plan. (Now, the ark doesn't really have to be Prothean. It

could be much more ancient. I even entertained the idea of the base being a Leviathan ship.)

Reapers obviously thwarted this endeavor, but they didn't outright destroy the ark. Rather, it

was transformed to fit another purpose. TIM, of course, realizes the potential and co-opts the

base to serve as a Cerberus back up plan. Somewhere along the way (probably during the

Reaper war), however, the Council finds out about this (perhaps from Cerberus defectors like

Brynn Cole) and seizes the Ark, immediately turning it into a Council project.

 

Admittedly, this theory has some issues, including, but not necessarily limited to:

- Since it's based on player's decision, some people may have a problem with it. (the canon

issue)

- That base is massive. Could they retrofit it in less than a year? Might be a stretch.

- Is it a little too convenient that the base turns out to be an ancient ark? Alternatively, Cerberus

and/or the Council could try to use the superstructure to create their own ark, but that would be

even more challenging given the limited time.

 

However, the theory has significant benefits, like these of the Black Ark Theory:

- Specifically, if it is a ship of Prothean origin, it would possess highly advanced Prothean/

Reaper/Collector technology. In the course of their long war with the Reapers, the Protheans

could have easily learned to use Reaper tech in large scale, eliminating the problems of drive

discharge and limited fuel. (All this assuming, of course, that Reapers themselves could make

the journey to Andromeda, which is by no means certain.)

- Again, the base is huge. I'd say it could easily accommodate not only millions of people, but

a modest defence/scout fleet as well, along with some colony ships. A Collector cruiser isn't big

enough for that.

 

- Like a Collector cruiser, it has potential to keep vast amounts of people in prolonged stasis.

Some additional points:

 

1) Personally, I like the idea that the existence of the Andromeda timeline hinges on Shepard's

choice.

2) As far as I remember, we never found out what happened to the base if we preserved it. In

fact, the thing was conspicuously absent from ME3 and the decision itself amounted to virtually

nothing in that game. That would finally be rectified.

3) ME2 itself would feel much more meaningful, making it something of a prologue to ME:A.

4) I don't take that latest leak very seriously (the one which says there may be Cerberus ships

in Andromeda), but if it turns out to be true, the theory provides a sensible explanation for those

ships. As the Council takes over the project, guess what they find in the Ark hangar?

5) The timing makes sense, since the Yahg Shadow Broker was perhaps the only individual

who could have uncovered what Cerberus was doing. Well, he turns up dead shortly after the

Suicide Mission (with the help of Cerberus intelligence - nice coincidence...) so he didn't have

time to find out about the Ark project. Liara could have discovered it, but her network was soon

crippled (by Cerberus - another coincidence!) and then the war hit. If we were to assume some

ark plan was going on before ME2, I would find it difficult to believe the Broker didn't know about

it and if he knew, Liara would later know as well, so why didn't she tell Shepard? Though I always

figured the Asari were really not to be trusted, so who knows...
(Concerning Shepard: I don't believe he knew about the Ark, even if that trailer might suggest

otherwise. For me, it seems the teaser was never meant to be taken literally. Same goes for the

Ark leaving Earth. Highly unlikely. Unless, of course, it all happens after ME3, but that's another

story.)

6) The Ark would have a magnificent history, with Protheans, Reapers, Collectors, Shepard,

Cerberus and the Council all involved in some capacity.

7) It would be logical to associate ME:A to ME2, the best received installment of the Trilogy.

8) Last but not least, if you end up disliking ME:A, you can wipe it out in ME2. That ought to be fun!

This post turned out much longer than intended. I won't make it a habit. Anyway, what do you think?
 

[Arcian]

Could you explain to me in what way this...

 

s

 

... resembles either this...

 

 

... or this:

 

[Neoleviathan]

I find it unlikely the Collector Base itself could have been used as a base(edit- for the ark's design) unless Cerberus is the force(openly or otherwise) driving the Ark project. For one you have to go through Cerberus to get it. They have a presence there, & you have to some how sneak this by Omega. There's also the issue of the hostile environment, & the crazy Reaper husk monsters that Cerberus (what a surprise) set loose.

I find it much more likely that the Ark was either designed based off the Collector ships or retrofitted from one. The two look very much the same as far as the mid & forward sections go. There were multiple Collector Ships active before & during the war, so they were easier to acquire than the base itself especially in playthrough's with the base destroyed. I think it is very likely the freed Collector General sent Shepard alot of info on the Collector tech in addition to the info he shared about the Reapers before his death. They probably learned everything they needed to about buildling an Ark ship of the designs provided by the Collector's.

[wolfsite]

Plus you can destroy the Collector Base and also the base is in an area of space surrounded by black holes so a good amount of the debris would have been lost to those from the pushing force of the explosion.

 

Also the "How do you get past Cerberus who is already scavenging the remains for use in there own projects on Omega and other areas"

 

Though it is easy to argue that the design is based off of the Citadel which was created by the Reapers who were involved in the Collector Base which is funded by Kevin Bacon.

[ZipZap2000]

If that ship reminds me of anything its only because the image resembles so many like it. Ship angled toward beautiful far away destination etc. But that's been going on since book covers and sail boats, in fact im sure the CS is portrayed like that at one point. Maybe that's what you're seeing?

Edit: Cerberus got what was left of the base anyway. And their base is gone now no matter what you chose.

[Henry Augustus]

As I said, the base would have to be heavily modified. But you're right, I am reaching a bit. The trailer ship is vague

enough to be something else entirely. I do think it has a little more similarities with the base than a Collector cruiser,

though. First thing would be to rid the base of those ugly plates and concentrate on the inner hull.

 

Bottom line: as we have very little actual evidence, all we can really do is engage in some wild speculation. Only time

will tell whether any of these theories turn out to be right.

[Arcian]

As I said, the base would have to be heavily modified.

Heavy modification would still mean the end product resembles the original. A heavily modified VW Beetle would still look like a Beetle.

 

The Ark Ship bears absolutely zero resemblance to either Collector craft. Saying it's a modified Collector base is the starship equivalent of saying a Hummer is a heavily modified Beetle.

[Han Shot First]

Hopefully not, as it would mean Cerberus would be in the game. 

[Valdez_ua]

Jesus, don't you have nothing else to do than writing this huge meaningless post? I bet no one even read it through.

[Arcian]

Jesus, don't you have nothing else to do than writing this huge meaningless post? I bet no one even read it through.

Savage.

[Beerfish]

Heavy modification would still mean the end product resembles the original. A heavily modified VW Beetle would still look like a Beetle.

 

The Ark Ship bears absolutely zero resemblance to either Collector craft. Saying it's a modified Collector base is the starship equivalent of saying a Hummer is a heavily modified Beetle.

Not really at all.  You can take a chassis and a motor and drive train and have a very different looking machine.  You can take a motor out of one car and stick it in another that looks nothing like the original car.

[Valdez_ua]

Savage.

Just trying to return a man to the real world. There is a good thing called law of parsimony(or "Occam's razor"), can save you a lot of time.

[Beerfish]

Just trying to return a man to the real world. There is a good thing called law of parsimony(or "Occam's razor"), can save you a lot of time.

Sci Fi fiction likes to break those laws like kindling on a regular basis.

[Arcian]

Not really at all.  You can take a chassis and a motor and drive train and have a very different looking machine.  You can take a motor out of one car and stick it in another that looks nothing like the original car.

Sticking a Collector drive core inside a different ship doesn't make that ship a modified Collector ship.

[DarthSliver]

I think the Ark Ship is generational ship and we as the progatanist will just be learning about its origins from out characters point of view. I think the origins of the Ark ship will be revealed to us much like how the Citadel and all the Mass Relays were revealed not to be prothean built. 

[Arcian]

I think the Ark Ship is generational ship and we as the progatanist will just be learning about its origins from out characters point of view. I think the origins of the Ark ship will be revealed to us much like how the Citadel and all the Mass Relays were revealed not to be prothean built. 

"The Reapers were destroying us and we didn't have any faith in Shepard's Crucible, so we conveniently found a massive Ark ship with the conveniently necessary FTL drive and life support to harbor all of the galactic species for centuries of convenient travel, it apparently comes from a mysterious alien apex race from Andromeda that was conveniently invented to enable the convenient existence of this ship, which enables our convenient escape to the convenient neighbouring galaxy Andromeda because the Crucible's effect will inconveniently change the galaxy so drastically no interesting events can take place in it anymore without ignoring the effects of the Crucible, and the Crucible's effects apparently can't be ignored, so goodbye inconvenient Milky Way and hello convenient Andromeda."

[DarthSliver]

"The Reapers were destroying us and we didn't have any faith in Shepard's Crucible, so we conveniently found a massive Ark ship with the conveniently necessary FTL drive and life support to harbor all of the galactic species for centuries of convenient travel, it apparently comes from a mysterious alien apex race from Andromeda that was conveniently invented to enable the convenient existence of this ship, which enables our convenient escape to the convenient neighbouring galaxy Andromeda because the Crucible's effect will inconveniently change the galaxy so drastically no interesting events can take place in it anymore without ignoring the effects of the Crucible, and the Crucible's effects apparently can't be ignored, so goodbye inconvenient Milky Way and hello convenient Andromeda."

 

I was more thinking it was a crashed Andromeda vessel and we study the ship and that is the birth of the Ark ship. Long scientific study and Andromedians trying to come to Milky Way galaxy.  

 

Our conflict with them is they think we destroyed their fleet that went to the Milky Way but we actually had stumbled across the remains after the Reaper War like the Reapers disabled the ship for later study after they snuffed us out. (cue the bum bum bam)

[Beerfish]

Sticking a Collector drive core inside a different ship doesn't make that ship a modified Collector ship.

http://www.wombatcar.com/

 

The wombat also known as the humbug.

 

A VW frame and motor and just about all things VW with a Humvee body kit.

 

I'm not about to argue the validity of the whole theory of the op but it is very viable to suggest all important pieces of a collector ship could be removed and another ship built around it.

[DarkLordAngel916]

Could you explain to me in what way this...

 

s

 

... resembles either this...

 

 

 

... or this:

 

they resemble each other not exactly but they look similar of course with modification.

[Arcian]

http://www.wombatcar.com/
 
The wombat also known as the humbug.
 
A VW frame and motor and just about all things VW with a Humvee body kit.

Well sh!t. On the long list of things I seriously didn't believe existed in the real world, this is up there with GOP politicians with actual brain cells between their ears.

I'm not about to argue the validity of the whole theory of the op but it is very viable to suggest all important pieces of a collector ship could be removed and another ship built around it.

Sure, but removing all the important pieces sort of defeats the purpose of modifying the Collector vessel in the first place. Any modifications to a Collector vessel would be made for practical reasons, not aesthetical as seems to be the case with the HumBug. And at least the HumBug has elements of both vehicles that show up in the final design, whereas the Ark ship looks entirely like a new ship with nothing that would suggest it is made from the frame or the parts of a Collector vessel.

[Beerfish]

Well the collector ship has never looked that practical to me, s hip encased in a rock?  Or whatever that is. 

 

The important hing would be to get the important parts.  For this re-purposing we need the actual ship to be a lot different.

 

We need a drive system, nav system, could be any of a dozen types of tech.  We already stole their FF systems.

[Arcian]

Well the collector ship has never looked that practical to me, s hip encased in a rock?  Or whatever that is. 
 
The important hing would be to get the important parts.  For this re-purposing we need the actual ship to be a lot different.
 
We need a drive system, nav system, could be any of a dozen types of tech.  We already stole their FF systems.

So, basically taking the drive core and the intergalactic FTL tech (assuming the Collectors even have such technology) and sticking it in a completely different ship.

[Eryri]

So, basically taking the drive core and the intergalactic FTL tech (assuming the Collectors even have such technology) and sticking it in a completely different ship.

This is something that always bothered me about the 'Black Ark Theory' (using a captured Collector Ark to go to Andromeda). Why would the Reapers bother installing trans-galactic drives on Collector Ships? Their job seems to be to hang around in the Milky Way to provide back up for the Vanguard Reaper (though why Sovereign didn't use them during his assault on the Citadel is another question). Giving them fancy, non-discharging drives would risk the design falling into the hands of the current crop of MW species, who would then upgrade all their ships accordingly and make the job of harvesting them a heck of a lot harder.

[Drone223]

The ark ship bears little resemblence to anything collector it looks like it was a large scale project (similar to the crucible given its nature) that was built from the ground up.

[ArabianIGoggles]

Jesus, don't you have nothing else to do than writing this huge meaningless post? I bet no one even read it through.

Let me guess, you'd rather see another, "What can ME:A learn from..." post?