30 réponses à ce sujet

[Googleness]

So recently due to massive nostalgic attack which arrived due to some forum thread I've reinstalled NWN2 and pondered which class to play.

 

in the past I only played the official campaign either as paladin or rogue (with obvious PRCs for them) but those were mostly it.

 

this time I thought about something new and wanted to consult with you if it will work.

 

race human,

first level bard with Able Learner.

 

kinda even on attributes and going to raise STR with each level up for more damage.

 

levels 2 to 7 will be ranger with TWF as choice, going on that point to take 10 levels of RDD for mass stat boosts.

then 3 levels of NW9 (RP reasons and also free aura and sneak attack, Also took natural leader background and as 1 level bard you get 100% up time on +1 to attack via inspiration).

 

on MOTB I planned to take additional levels of ranger up to level 30, maybe 4th level of NW9 for upgraded aura.

 

I plan to use 2 longswords as the silver sword for feats count as longsword so I'll be able to use it + an actually useful longsword as well.

 

With this build I get massive amount of skills including diplomacy, appraise, tumble, UMD, spot, listen etc....

the RDD adds massive amount of stats and immunity to various abilities.

Bard is mostly for skills and the arcane spell requirement.

Ranger levels gives some nice stuff like the TWF and favoured enemy. actually 4 of them by the end of the OC which I can pick undead, demons, humans etc to gain some extra juice.

 

point is to be usefull in combat and otoh to have loads of skills and abilities to use in dialogs throughout the game.

 

any pointers you can give?

[Arkalezth]

any pointers you can give?

 

Not the strongest build ever, but it should do well. Ranger won't add a whole lot in epic to this particular build, but it won't gimp it either. More bard is an OK alternative if you want a few spells.

 

I'd personally take the 3rd TWF feat manually so I wouldn't have to wait until 25 to get it for free. It's generally better to use a light weapon in the off-hand, but if you prefer dual longswords for looks or whatever, I'm fairly sure you'll manage in the OCs.

 

As far as I remember, Spot and Listen are pretty much useless in those modules. Don't forget to put a couple of points in Perform in order to use the inspiration.

[Googleness]

I actually remember some lines with bishop and in the ember part where those two skills came into use.

 

 

Another build I thought about in some degree was 2 paladin\18 cleric\10 Doomguide

with domain or feat to turn plenar beings as well.

and of course using aasimir but that's that.

 

I also really wanted to try a pure monk but the whole thingy with the silver sword just looks kinda meh with a monk build.

 

I really need some "connection" between my character and the story in order to enjoy the game.

 

I also thought on some sort of evil necromancer mastermind something like Wizard 10\RWOT 10\ASOC10 with massive boosts to necromancy spells. leaving the RWOT levles to MOTB for plot and build reasons (thus I can get illusion spells as well with this build). the problem I've had there is that I won't have dialog skill which fit the build. I'll need either get asap into ASOC for diplomacy or RWOT for intimidate.

 

I actually favor most the thief style classes but with undead as main enemy in this game it will be pretty pita to play.

 

Overall the most interesting class for me to play will probably was the warlock\hellfire class. but I have no idea how to build it properly.

 

 

 

EDIT,

Another interesting build I thought about....

4 paladin \ 6 sorc \ 10 Eldritch knight \ 10 AsOc

kinda battle mage warrior with loads of protective spells and offensive spells.

also higher the spell power (charisma) the higher saving throws are.

Modifié par Googleness, 19 décembre 2015 - 07:11 .

[GCoyote]

If it matters to your TWF plan, there's an override that let's you change the silver sword to any specific type of sword you like so that you get the benefits of whatever focus or specialization feats you've taken. IIRC it's called "silver sword fix".

[Googleness]

yes,

well I started this character and at the "Atttack" on west harbor part after 1 bard and 2 ranger levels it kicks ass but I didn't get the vibe with it.

 

SO I installed Kadrein prc pack for new classes and such.

 

Warlock looks much better now and Warlock\cleric(Evil {Turn planer} - Pride {Epic Resilience}\Eldritch Disciple\Hellfire Warlock looks very solid. beside the obvious perks to warlock spell casting and new abilities from ED you also get pretty solid turn undead.

 

But it depends on intimidate and I truly prefer nicer character with diplomacy.

 

So I'm playing a paladin (Aasimir) with 18 cha at start and max diplomacy. but for some reason it keep failing on diplomacy checks for some reason it's just weird...

Then I thought screw all those diplomacy related skills and maybe just make a character for gameplay sake and make some nice build or something.

 

Thing is cleric\paladin\monks gets nice side quest on CK part and I really want some levels tossed in there for that.

 

So overall bit lost but with KPRC installed you got any recommendation to fun build of good aligned character?

[ColorsFade]

Have you messed around with the NWN2 Character Builder at all? 

 

I have loads of fun just making builds with it. 

[Googleness]

ok I took the time to make some build which I can guess will be loads of fun (for my gamestyle) in the OC + MOTB 

 

Human: http://nwn2db.com/build/?231777

 

Aasimir: http://nwn2db.com/build/?231778

 

thoughts? pointers?

 

tested it right now on MOTB.

my most greatest disappointment was the constant need to tinker buffs, there are just too many of them.
with paladin you got 4 levels and from those you only really need 3-4 to have good time.
with Cleric spells... just too many.

But on the upside with buffs it seems it get ridiculously powerful with around 40 SR, massive bonuses to everything etc.

Weird thing was the most fun part were the epic spells, I might need to play pure wizard or something those spells are rather fun.
hopefully I will not deteriorate into maximized Greater Missile Storm. that thing is just.. well...

[GCoyote]

Have you tried any Favored Soul builds? Easy spell casting, persistent buffs, and you get to bash things with the weapon of your deities' choice. 

[Arkalezth]

Both of those builds have a multiclass XP penalty.

 

TBH, it's hard to recommend something when you've mentioned nearly every character archetype out there, all of which work just fine in the OCs. We can't tell you what you're going to find most fun.

[Googleness]

At the end I decided to remove the client fix pack and K-PRC. from what I noticed they increased all roll checks and screwed up some stuff in the OC.

example: on the crypt near fort locke I couldn't disable most of the trap but once I removed those two add ons it worked great.

 

Last time I played was I think when MOTB got released so I never had a go on SOZ and MOW campaigns.

decided to give a go with my good old pally aasimir build.

only 2 skill points per level but I only want diplomacy anyway.

got 4 points at spellcraft for practiced spellcaster (I plan to take few NW9 levels) from there is usual power attack \ divine might-shield.

and as my attributes spread right now I should be able to get epic divine might without great str\char

 

What I am pondering... cleric.

first level cleric you get 2 domains. reading bit about them many of them gives some pretty uber feats and abilities.

would it be worth it to get on the higher levels a cleric level for those 2 domains? mostly I'm interested in the domain which adds teh ability to Turn demons and planar creatures.

Question is if I take that domain will it affect my paladin turn undead or is it going to work with only cleric levels?

 

Also, up to level 15 paladin should be pretty straight forward as I'll get most abilities and level 4 spells, then I always love to get 4 levels of Nw9 for rp reasons.

from there though...

will it be more beneficial to get Divine Champion class for the epic levels?

it seems to be pretty great idea as you get additional 5 feats and on epic levels so you get to choose from larger variety of feats.

Also lay on hands is stacked with paladin levels, you get high bab, smite infidel, loads of free stuff and overall it looks great.

so in the end I'll be able to aim towards: 16 paladin\4 NW9\ 10 Divine champion - I'm using large shield and longsword.

 

my only issue is going to be diplomacy on epic levels. if for 20 levels I'll take diplomacy we are talking roughly about 23 points into diplomacy + boost from charisma. it should be enough to handle diplomacy checks on motb ? if not I'll have to get able learner before I finish the OC so DC levels will work with diplomacy.

 

thoughts?

 

and cheers for the help.

[ColorsFade]

 

my most greatest disappointment was the constant need to tinker buffs, there are just too many of them.


But on the upside with buffs it seems it get ridiculously powerful with around 40 SR, massive bonuses to everything etc.

Weird thing was the most fun part were the epic spells, I might need to play pure wizard or something those spells are rather fun.
hopefully I will not deteriorate into maximized Greater Missile Storm. that thing is just.. well...

 

My favorite class to play in any AD&D setting has always been a fighter/mage. For NWN2, that turned into a Swash(3)/Wizard/Eldritch Knight. 

 

The advantage of the class is that you can become very hard to hit due to all the spells. It's really a class where spells=defense and weapons/dex = offense. 

 

However, buffing yourself with up to 15 buffs prior to a fight can be a lot of work. This is why people use various rods of buffing and other 3rd party content to allow themselves a fast way to buff quickly. 

 

I modified the sequencer rods in my own campaign to allow them to buff 5, 10, and 15 spells at a time, instantly. I then modified them to work in MoTB as well.  

 

It makes it very convenient to play an EK. Especially in the OC and MoTB, where there are usually long cut-scenes prior to a big fight. If you buff before the cut-scene, you can lose some buffs (especially at lower levels when they don't last very long) before the cut-scene finishes. But with modified sequencers, or rods of buffing, you don't need to worry about that. Don't buff before the conversation, and as soon as the cut-scene ends, hit the rod and buff immediately. 

 

I've never played a straight wizard, so I can't comment on the epic offensive spells. They do look like fun though. 

[ColorsFade]

 

What I am pondering... cleric.

first level cleric you get 2 domains. reading bit about them many of them gives some pretty uber feats and abilities.

would it be worth it to get on the higher levels a cleric level for those 2 domains? mostly I'm interested in the domain which adds teh ability to Turn demons and planar creatures.

Question is if I take that domain will it affect my paladin turn undead or is it going to work with only cleric levels?

 

my only issue is going to be diplomacy on epic levels. if for 20 levels I'll take diplomacy we are talking roughly about 23 points into diplomacy + boost from charisma. it should be enough to handle diplomacy checks on motb ? if not I'll have to get able learner before I finish the OC so DC levels will work with diplomacy.

 

thoughts?

 

and cheers for the help.

 

If you're going to go cleric, I'd recommend something like fighter/cleric. I was always drawn to the Paladin class in old 2.0 rules. And with NWN1, I played the whole thing with a Paladin. Then I decided to try a second playthrough, and went fighter/cleric. That ended up being way more fun, especially for expansions like Hoards of the Underdark. 

 

If I recall correctly, a Fighter (4) / Cleric ends up with better BAB than a straight paladin (thanks to Weapon Specialization), and you end up with a LOT more spells than a Paladin. You can also use a Tower Shield... You can turn undead better than a Paladin, you get the two domains (as you said), and cast some sweet AOE (like Sunbeam, Storm of Vengeance). You can buff yourself and team really well. It's just a way more powerful class combo than a straight Paladin. 

 

In fact, a Fighter/Cleric is what I imagine a Paladin actually being like. But AD&D rules really nerf the hell out of Paladin. I can't think of any reason to play one other than RP reasons. 

[GCoyote]

The past year I've played with adding Cleric to a number of builds for various synergies. So far I've tried adding cleric to fighters, rangers, and favored souls. Each adds a little twist and flavor depending on the game environment. In each case carefully selecting the cleric domains changes how you play and role play the build. 

[Arkalezth]

Paladins are good and underrated, and can do a lot of damage to undead and evil creatures. The gripe I have with them is that their spell progression is quite slow. But yes, a paladin is a good choice.

 

If you can't decide and want to play a character that can do a bit of everything, a cleric with the right domains can still be a melee god while throwing the occasional fireball and lightning without having to worry about armour spell failure (just an example). Turning Undead becomes kinda crappy as you level up, so I personally wouldn't bother with turning-related feats.

[Googleness]

yes I plan to stick with divine might\shield on higher levels.

 

two things I noticed in the campaign so far.. 

1. Qara \ Elanee. I don't know what they did to spells in NWN2 but offensive spells are just overkill... normal melee fights takes time with those two girls it's Greater call lightning + fireball = everyone dead.

this is why I decided no more then one caster in the team... too easy. also, Dinosaur animal companion lol.

 

2. Grobnar! I was always annoyed by his voice and lines in the past but for some reason this time he reminded me of conan O'brien for some reason. just placed him on overkill and use all abilities and wow.. just wow.

my paladin + neeshka + cassivir on the orc tribes caves and it's critical hit fest all over the place with hits high as 55 damage per one hit with the buffs. he is buff machine.

[ColorsFade]

 

two things I noticed in the campaign so far.. 

1. Qara \ Elanee. I don't know what they did to spells in NWN2 but offensive spells are just overkill... normal melee fights takes time with those two girls it's Greater call lightning + fireball = everyone dead.

this is why I decided no more then one caster in the team... too easy. also, Dinosaur animal companion lol.

 

 

There are two things at play here. 

 

First, early in the OC, enemies are low HP. 

Second, you are probably playing on normal difficulty, which allows you to fire AoE without affecting your own team, which allows your companions, if the AI is turned on, to go hog wild. 

 

I would recommend playing the game on "D&D Hardcore" rules. It changes the complexion of battles quite a bit when you cannot fire AoE spells like Fireball all over the place without fear of hurting your own team members. It adds a lot more strategy. 

 

Also, for myself, I typically play with the auto-AI off, and micro-manage the team, or else a lot of unnecessary things can happen. 

 

Curious: are you using TonyK's AI? I ask because some folks like it. I had one tester who used it in my mod, and I had to change some encounters, because TonyK's AI caused some vital NPC's to get eaten by enemies... 

[Arkalezth]

To add to Colors' points:
 
3) The OC has unrestricted resting, which pretty much translates into infinite spellcasting, should you rest after every battle. This is often not an option in other modules.
 
4) Not all enemies are equally vulnerable to those spells. Good luck killing a group of rogues with a fireball.
 
Buffing to the infinite and beyond and proceeding to smash things in the face is generally a more fool-proof "strategy" (if you can call that strategic). But if you can and don't mind resting a lot, go ahead and fireball on.
 

I had to change some encounters, because TonyK's AI caused some vital NPC's to get eaten by enemies...

 

 
For the record, I always use that mod and I've never had such a problem. Maybe there's some setting at play there that I don't use.

 

Also, not saying Googleness is wrong, but the KPack and/or the Client Extension making traps stronger sounds... well, impossible. If it's indeed one of those which causes the problem, I'd say it's probably the latter. It still sounds bizarre to me, but I've seen/heard of a couple of other strange things happening with it installed.

[ColorsFade]

For the record, I always use that mod and I've never had such a problem. Maybe there's some setting at play there that I don't use.

 

Also, not saying Googleness is wrong, but the KPack and/or the Client Extension making traps stronger sounds... well, impossible. If it's indeed one of those which causes the problem, I'd say it's probably the latter. It still sounds bizarre to me, but I've seen/heard of a couple of other strange things happening with it installed.

 

The instance I'm talking about is with my campaign, the Darkening Sky. The prologue. I had a bear in a cave next to some trapped kids. It was one of the very first encounters I ever built. Without TonyK's AI installed, the bear did his normal thing, and walked around the main cavern in a circle. With TonyK's AI on, the bear's aggro range changed or something, and he would go and eat the kids (who were on a different faction). It took my playtester and me quite a while to suss out what was wrong. He kept telling me, "The kids aren't there." 

 

He finally uninstalled the mod and everything was normal. All we could figure out is that the bear must be attacking the kids due to TonyK's AI. 

 

All that has done is make me cognizant that hostile creatures near NPC's is a situation to be avoided regardless of what AI is at play  A learning experience.

 

I, myself, haven't actually played with TonyK's AI yet. I need to. I want to see how it affects my own companions.

 

For The Darkening Sky, it should be safe to use when I finally release the full campaign. As long as TonyK's AI obeys the X2_SPECIAL_COMBAT_AI_SCRIPT variable, then all will be cool. Because I've written some pretty extensive AI for the enemies in TDS. That's something I keep getting requests to release actually...   

[Arkalezth]

The instance I'm talking about is with my campaign, the Darkening Sky. The prologue. I had a bear in a cave next to some trapped kids. It was one of the very first encounters I ever built. Without TonyK's AI installed, the bear did his normal thing, and walked around the main cavern in a circle. With TonyK's AI on, the bear's aggro range changed or something, and he would go and eat the kids (who were on a different faction). It took my playtester and me quite a while to suss out what was wrong. He kept telling me, "The kids aren't there."

Now that you mention it, that sounds VERY familiar... As in it was probably me-familiar.

Let me rephrase then: I personally don't remember having any similar problems aside of that damn bear. Still, there are a couple of settings (heartbeat detection, use doors...) I usually turn off because they might make enemies a bit too intelligent and break a cutscene or something. No idea if it was this or something else that made the bear kid-hungry.

[kamal_]

Now that you mention it, that sounds VERY familiar... As in it was probably me-familiar.

Let me rephrase then: I personally don't remember having any similar problems aside of that damn bear. Still, there are a couple of settings (heatbeat detection, use doors...) I usually turn off because they might make enemies a bit too intelligent and break a cutscene or something. No idea if it was this or something else that made the bear kid-hungry.

The toolset has a "slather children with honey" setting.

[Googleness]

hmm yes it does seems I play on the normal difficulty, I'll try harder one.

also no mods playing vanilla I had some weird things going on with mods in game.

 

Edit:

small update.

 

finished the campaign on level 20! with aasimir. 

had 15 paladin (with practiced spellcaster) and 5 neverwinter nine levels.

that build kicked ass.

 

used shield + longsword and skipped divine shield due to the fact that once I started chapter 3 and got the red dragon armor + that 300k large shield from the temple of tyr I had around 38 AC which is pretty much enough.

started MOTB last night and so far pretty great I get the feeling it will do alright.

 

_________________________________________

 

Really wanted to try evil power hungry warlock build after that.

what are the bugs with the warlock which render him problematic in the unmodded vanilla?

[ColorsFade]

Good luck with MoTB. I've never been able to finish it due to the Spirit Eater mechanics. 

 

I restarted it the other day to try some stuff out (namely my new and improved Sequencer Rods, which make playing a Spellcaster way more fun). I think I'll have to break out Kaldor's Spirit Eater Recharger this time. I am determined to finish this campaign... one way or another. 

[Googleness]

you can do console code to "reset" the meter to 100 very simple.

you can disable it as well.

 

it's kind of cheating but if it's either quit or enjoy the story I prefer to enjoy the story.

 

I'll try to play with the meter on and try to do it legit...

 

btw the mobs in motb are constantly re-spawning right? so I can farm those essences for crafting?

[ColorsFade]

Yeah, you can do the console, but I find it tedious to tilda, type, and reset. I just want to play. 

 

I remember a couple years ago I tried to do it legit, and I found some really helpful tips on how to do it, and I got quite a ways into it without needing to cheat (I think I made it to the red wizard school.) Then I didn't finish for some other reason, then I changed computers, and lost those save games. 

 

Last year I made another attempt, without any help from hints on how to manage the spirit bar, and I promptly gave up. 

 

I'm going to try real hard this time to do it legit. We'll see how far I get. 

 

As for mobs respawning: I can't remember that for sure. I think some spirits, like the ones in the forest, will respawn.

 

For me, if I remember correctly, the issue was that Suppress could only be used once per day? And so the amount of spirit you lost from resting (to memorize spells) couldn't be overcome by Suppress, and pretty soon you were too low in the Spirit Bar. The way the mechanics worked out, at least to my memory (and I can be very wrong here), it seemed like it really paid to be evil and just eat spirits left and right. A do-gooder, like me... it was a lot harder to manage the spirit energy. 

[GCoyote]

I've played MotB twice without the re-charger and twice with it. It's a bit tougher for spell casters but you should have enough regeneration items that you don't need to rest too often if you play a fighter type. Also some of the other tips reduce the PC's craving level to very very low levels. To be honest though, I had more fun using the spirit re-charger mod. It just reduced the extra logistics of the meter so I could enjoy the game. There is also a fix that stops the energy drain while you are shopping and other non-strenuous activities.