176 réponses à ce sujet

[Kroitz]

I'll wait for VORCHA MASTER BAIT'S review before deciding on that.

[In Exile]

Reverse racism actually doesn't exist though. Racism is racism. "Reverse racism" is itself a racist term as it assumes racism is something white people are/inflict on others.

Exactly. There's a clear distinction between objecting to oppressive structures and just being a racist (or a sexist) as the case may be. Although I think etymology-wise the term comes from American "whites" - for which I use quotes only because "white"is a comically flexible term in US history.

[spockjedi]

Reverse racism actually doesn't exist though. Racism is racism. "Reverse racism" is itself a racist term as it assumes racism is something white people are/inflict on others.

I agree. It's funny how Neo-Nazis, Communists, Islamic radicals and every other kind of Jew-haters all claim to be fighting "Zionist Racism."

[In Exile]

Bahar Mustafa was (ironically) Goldsmith University's Student Welfare and Diversity Officer, who organised an event to promote equality. She then promptly banned white males from attending, or in other words, discriminated based on sex and race. It later came out that she was a frequent user of the #killallwhitemen hashtag on twitter which got her into a bit of trouble. Her response was to declare that racism and sexism are power plus privilege, and as a non-white woman, she is inherently unable to be sexist or racist.

That in a nutshell is the problem with the sociological definition of racism.

It's more a problem with the people, who don't understand power. In that case, the person had both power and privilege - much of which derived from status and position, but that's besides the point. From an analytical POV making the analysis about power is useful - the problem is that then it just becomes too nuanced.

I once had someone tell me same sex relationship couldn't be abusive for this reason. Again, obviously stupid proposition.

[pkypereira]

This one invokes a BioWare moderator to have mercy and lock this thread.

[Helios969]

This one invokes a BioWare moderator to have mercy and lock this thread.

Seconded.

[RatThing]

Yeah I got blocked by this Manveer guy on twitter because I didn't agree with his opinion of Christians being a privileged class. I told him we have the same problems as everyone else. His response was to drop the F bomb on me and block me.

So what. I'm not going to deprive myself of a potentially great game because of one bigot.

 

The problem is that people like this love to push their views into their work. Sometimes you cannot separate the art from the artist. I've read some of his tweets concerning "white men" now. He really sounds like a bigoted ****** to me. I just hope as a gameplay designer he doesn't have too much influence on the actual content of the game. (Or does he?)

 

Also seems relevant.

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=JVuVrdyF_ps

 

Apply cold water to that burn, Mr. Heir.

[They call me a SpaceCowboy]

Bahar Mustafa was (ironically) Goldsmith University's Student Welfare and Diversity Officer, who organised an event to promote equality. She then promptly banned white males from attending, or in other words, discriminated based on sex and race. It later came out that she was a frequent user of the #killallwhitemen hashtag on twitter which got her into a bit of trouble. Her response was to declare that racism and sexism are power plus privilege, and as a non-white woman, she is inherently unable to be sexist or racist.

 

That in a nutshell is the problem with the sociological definition of racism.

 

Exactly. Racists don't get to redefine the word 'racism' to not include themselves.

[ACika011]

So you're complaining about someone not being politically correct and yet you keep going on about how much you dislike SJWs and feminists?

So you are implying SJW and feminists are pc?

[They call me a SpaceCowboy]

I have no idea how it works with minority against minority, though if we are going with races aren't they both same race though different nationality and ethnicity.

 

I'd personally just go racism is discrimination and hatred towards person of different race or ethnicity than you, but I don't think it's the current popular definition.

 

You realize, of course, that minorities are the majority in their mother countries, right?

 

Yes I tend to prefer the dictionary definition of words in all cases.

[holdenagincourt]

Bahar Mustafa was (ironically) Goldsmith University's Student Welfare and Diversity Officer, who organised an event to promote equality. She then promptly banned white males from attending, or in other words, discriminated based on sex and race. It later came out that she was a frequent user of the #killallwhitemen hashtag on twitter which got her into a bit of trouble. Her response was to declare that racism and sexism are power plus privilege, and as a non-white woman, she is inherently unable to be sexist or racist.

 

That in a nutshell is the problem with the sociological definition of racism.

 

"In a nutshell" that's nothing more than one person's possibly extreme behavior in the form of an anecdote (in which some sort of entire, objective truth even of that single instance is never known because of the subjective filters and perspectives involved in relating a series of events during and after the fact).

 

The "sociological definition of racism" is founded on the decades of work across the social sciences and liberal arts that situate racism within the larger structures of power, wealth, privilege, inequality and discrimination that are part and parcel of all societies and an inextricable part of their historical development, although the overriding concern has generally been with racism in Western countries. I'll express my skepticism that this one university administrator's behavior somehow invalidates millions of pages of theory and qualitative and quantitative data compiled by thousands of the best scholars in their fields across multiple generations, and which prior to ever being published are subjected to brutally rigorous critical interrogation (unlike, e.g., the ruminations on racism posted by geniuses on the BSN).

[Sarayne]

I can't believe this thread is still not locked yet lol.

[Kookoo]

I don't care what some of the devs do in their freetime. I mean, most of the guys do more than decent work. If one of them does something stupid (I dunno if that's the case as I didn't really inform myself very well) It's no reason for me to not by the game.

[In Exile]

"In a nutshell" that's nothing more than one person's possibly extreme behavior in the form of an anecdote (in which some sort of entire, objective truth even of that single instance is never known because of the subjective filters and perspectives involved in relating a series of events during and after the fact).

The "sociological definition of racism" is founded on the decades of work across the social sciences and liberal arts that situate racism within the larger structures of power, wealth, privilege, inequality and discrimination that are part and parcel of all societies and an inextricable part of their historical development, although the overriding concern has generally been with racism in Western countries. I'll express my skepticism that this one university administrator's behavior somehow invalidates millions of pages of theory and qualitative and quantitative data compiled by thousands of the best scholars in their fields across multiple generations, and which prior to ever being published are subjected to brutally rigorous critical interrogation (unlike, e.g., the ruminations on racism posted by geniuses on the BSN).

You misunderstand. You can't just look at the physical characteristics of a person - say white female and white male - without considering the issue of intersectionality (which is absolutely in play) and the particular facts of the situation and the institution, as well as the view being advanced.

For example, an extremely poor white man and an extremely wealthy white woman - from generations of wealth - find themselves in totally different positions. And there are cases where status and wealth - class - matters more than sex. And the reverse is true as well.

To say that someone can't advance an objectionable view about race in virtue of being in a disadvantaged position in society is stupid.

To return to the example, the person wielded power in virtue of her position. And she wielded it in a way that was directly targeting a particular group. That's an exercise of power.

Also, you have way, way too idealistic a view about peer review. Seriously. Peer review is valuable, but not perfect. And empirical methodology in the social sciences - which is ultimately statistical modeling applied to concepts that aren't always amenable to it - isn't immune to conceptual criticism.

 

Edit: Beyond that, a useful analytical framework from a scientific perspective could very easily lead people astray. Evolution is a well-established biological phenomenon. If someone starts to advance a social Darwinist perspective, well, that's not really applying the theory, and pointing it out is not an attack on evolution or the scientific method.

 

As far as I am aware there is no sociological literature - or any credible academic literature - to suggest that it is impossible for someone to act in a discriminatory manner in virtue of being disadvantaged. The only views that do this, really, are the ones that define the term - say racism - in a tautological way, i.e., by assuming their conclusion. But that's, again, stupid. 

[ACika011]

I can't believe this thread is still not locked yet lol.

It's the 31st of december mods probably have a day off

[Lucca_de_Neon]

I can't believe this thread is still not locked yet lol.

aaaaaany minute now

[RZIBARA]

I agree with this guy. Fire him, what a fraud. Never heard of him, thanks for letting me know

[RatThing]

I can't believe this thread is still not locked yet lol.

 

I don't really see a reason to lock this thread if people find it worthy of discussion. One of the devs of the upcoming game showed that he has really questionable views. I cannot blame people who feel uncomfortable with this. Locking this thread would look like the mods want to sweep it under the rug.

[SnakeCode]

I'd also add that many sociological arguments surrounding racism (and sexism) rely heavily on the apex fallacy. The belief that because the top 1% of people in power and privileged positions happen to be white, or male, or straight, then all people who share those traits happen to be powerful and privileged (over minorities, or women etc) as well. It just doesn't work when you look at those arguments on anything other than the surface level. It would mean that your average homeless straight white guy has more power and privilege in society than say, Barack Obama, Caitlyn Jenner or Angela Merkel, which is ridiculous.

[Andrew Lucas]

I don't care, I just want the game, I'll buy it.

Deal with it.

[Heathen Oxman]

This thread has reminded me why I'm not on Twitter, and couldn't give one winged rat turd what anyone says or does on it.

[Panda]

You realize, of course, that minorities are the majority in their mother countries, right?

 

Yes I tend to prefer the dictionary definition of words in all cases.

 

Which is why I question the context, I'd rather have broader definition to work with that fits to different contexts cause racism in US compared to racism in Japan likely isn't exactly similar and towards same races and ethnicities.

[Steelcan]

Which is why I question the context, I'd rather have broader definition to work with that fits to different contexts cause racism in US compared to racism in Japan likely isn't exactly similar and towards same races and ethnicities.

why is a broader definition than "discrimination based on the differences in race/ethnicity" needed?  Sounds plenty broad to me

[Panda]

why is a broader definition than "discrimination based on the differences in race/ethnicity" needed?  Sounds plenty broad to me

 

That's what I used earlier as well so no, not broader than that.

[Jen-Yu]

I can't believe this thread is still not locked yet lol.

 

 

    no one reads it,We are alone in here for years.except one mod guy,and obviously he's on vacation.