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[Winged Silver]

There are a few interesting overlaps between various gods and creatures we've come across in Thedas. I've seen some of these things mentioned before, but I thought I might share some of my musings just for kicks.

 

I was considering the shared number of unaccounted for members of the Evanuris, and the Old Gods. Coincidentally, they seem to match. However, there is a discrepancy with the sexes of the dragons and the members of the elven pantheon. For the elven pantheon, looking at the wiki, we have nine members (including Fen'Harel)(We can also discount Mythal and Fen'Harel from the total, as they are accounted for in their current bodies). Five of those are known to be male, and the other four are female. For the Old Gods, we have one female and six males. 

 

Despite the discrepancies, I do feel there is a connection between them all, as so much of the Tevinter Imperium lore potentially rises from the ancient elves (for example, many of the constellation have potential roots in elven history). If I were to wager a guess, I might think the dragons represent certain keys to the Evanuris' prison, and the life/death of the dragons points towards their release. I'm inclined to think their souls may be significantly related to the Evanuris based on Mythal's desire to preserve the soul of Urthemiel, as well as the power to become a dragon, a skill shown to be only related to the pantheon's knowledge (Flemeth, being Mythal, being able to turn into a dragon, and Morrigan gaining the knowledge to become a dragon from drinking at the Well of Sorrows). 

 

A tentative suggestion of how they are connected:

Dumat - Andruil

Zazikel - Elgar'Nan

Toth - Sylaise

Andoral - Ghilan'Nain

Urthemiel - June

Razikale - Dirthamen 

Lusacan - Falon'Din

Draconis (?)

 

I'm uncertain as of now if Draconis holds any significance. The codex entry purports that Draconis may have been a sea serpent or a high dragon struck from the records. 

 

I had originally been hoping to see if there was a connection between Sandal and one of the members of the Evanuris, but based on the above I'm leaning towards his being something entirely different. I had considered him to be most similar to June, God of the Craft, who actual purpose (in a specific sense) had been lost to the records, but I am less certain now. Regardless, we know that Sandal has been to the Crossroads based upon a journal you can find in Trespasser. I also wonder if his lack of presence in Inquisition might be related to he and Solas already knowing of one another. In DA2, Sandal speaks of a scary old woman standing at the foot of his bed, which could possibly be referring to Flemeth/Mythal. He also speaks of a prophecy:

 

One day the magic will come back.

All of it. Everyone will be just like they were.

The shadows will part, and the skies will open wide.

When he rises, everyone will see.

 

(I believe that is how it goes)

 

I took the 'he' to be referring to Solas, as he does seem to be the one gaining power. Had Sandal come to Skyhold, would he and Solas have known each other somehow? 

 

Not to forget the Forgotten ones, I considered they might be related to the Forbidden Ones, who we have seen over the course of the series. They include Gaxkang, Imshael, Xebenkeck, and 'The Formless One'. The Forgotten Ones include Anaris, Geldaruran, Daern'thal, and potentially others. Obviously, a similarity in numbers guarantees nothing, but I did think it of interest that there seemed to be a fair number of overlap. The Forgotten Ones, in legend, were thought to be banished to the Void. If I recall correctly, the Forbidden Ones were found in the Fade, and are thought to be far older than the Tevinter Imperium and Darkspawn. 

 

Speaking of the Darkspawn, that is another area I find particularly curious. I don't recall seeing much mention of the taint in relation to the history of the elves. Its origins are also called into question upon our learning of Solas creating the Fade. If the city was indeed Golden before the Magisters came along, what did they bring with them to cause it to turn black? I sincerely doubt it was simply their 'impurities' as we are told by the Chantry. 

 

Anyway, I'm certain it's all far more complicated than this, but I'm eager to see what reveals we see in the next book or game, and I think I may have to wait some time before learning of anything new >.<

 

Thoughts, questions, counter theories? If anyone has any ideas what significance, if any, Great Dragons and Titans have, I'd be most curious to hear 

 

[Gervaise]

The Forbidden Ones were so called because the Creator Evanuris banished them from the area of the Fade that adjoined their realms and they were forbidden to enter.   This was apparently because they failed to aid in a war, possibly against the Titans.

 

The Forgotten Ones appear to be evanuris or spirits who denied the godhood of the Creators, which is presumably why Fen'Harel is remembered in elven legend as being on both sides and none, locking them both away.    The Forgotten Ones appear to hang out in the Void. 

 

Since lyrium is said to be the blood of the Titans and red lyrium is lyrium corrupted with the Blight, it is clear that the origins of the Blight do not lie with the actions of the Magisters.   At most they can be said to have been tricked into releasing it on the world.    Some action of the evanuris would seem to have caused it to come into being, possibly killing a Titan or corrupting it with magic in some way.     Merrill recounts a variant on the legend of Fen'Harel imprisoning the gods, where it is said that he tricked both Creators and Forgotten Ones into his trap by suggesting a way to access a weapon that would give them the edge against the other.    I believe the weapon is red lyrium, which is much more potent than ordinary lyrium but at a terrible price.    Mythal was the first to realise see how bad it was and so tried to prevent the others from getting to it, which is why they killed her.   Then Solas collapsed the tunnels leading to the source of it in the Deep Roads and trapped the gods behind the Veil so they would no longer be able to reach it.    This is why he says that if he hadn't trapped them, they would have destroyed the world.

 

I think the Forgotten Ones are likely the old gods of Tevinter.   Once the evanuris were out of the way, they were free to contact human mages and tempt them in their dreams.    The humans appeared in Thedas before the raising of the Veil, so they would have seen the god dragons of the elves and thus associated the dragon with godhood.   From everything I have read in the source books, I do not believe they ever actually encountered their gods for real, until Dumat was released in the form of the arch demon.   Otherwise, if they had been actually seen in the world, why did Corypheus say at the end "Dumat, if you were ever real save me now."   Gelduran, one of the Forgotten Ones says of the evanuris "Their pride will consume them" and Solas means pride, "and I, forgotten, will claim power of my own."   Which fits with him speaking to and helping the Tevinter dreamers and thus eventually gaining revenge on the people who forgot him, the elves.    The arch demons are also said to tap into a different source of magic to the Fade, possibly the Void, which would fit with them being the Forgotten Ones because of their connection with the Void/Abyss.

 

The Golden City could have been a reflection of the inside of a Titan in the Fade, which turned Black when killed.   Or it could have been a reflection of ancient Arlathan.    Mythal was said to be the evanuris who specifically constructed cities, so may be Arlathan was her ultimate creation, with 7 gates for the 7 other gods who would visit her there.    Of course there are also 7 Tevinter gods.     The elves and the ancient Tevinter believed the Golden City to be the seat of the gods, which Andraste then altered to being just the seat of the Maker.   Even in Drakon's vision of the Maker's return at the end of time, the Black City has 7 gates, so it seems everyone is in agreement on that.     Everything in the Fade is said to be a reflection of things in the real world, so I wonder if the Golden/Black city is merely a vision of a city deep underground where the taint originated and the Black City in the Fade was just the entrance to a portal (disguised eluvian?) which took them there.

 

Sandal's prophesy could be about Solas or simply an end of time prophesy like Drakon's.   Both see the skies opening wide, someone making everyone whole again.  In Drakon's case he recounts the return of the Maker to the world with Andraste.   The portents for this suggest that after the sky opens, the Titans arise and the ancient ones awake whose dreams had been devoured by a demon that prowled the Fade like a wolf (evanuris or simply ancient elves in uthenera?), also the mountain on which Andraste's ashes rest rising up to heaven (a bit like what Corypheus did) after he opened the sky.   There is also talk of fire and having to pass through it to be forged anew (reborn?).   Now Sandal also said about a scary lady watching him, who could have been Flemeth, so may be his vision came from Mythal.    If there is any sort of connection between Andraste and Mythal, then I'd say both Sandal and Drakon could have been having a vision about what Mythal was intending to happen once Solas put his plan into action.   Except this is what should have happened before when Solas first awoke but instead he gave his orb to Corypheus and it all went wrong.  

 

Anyway, hope you find my reflections of interest. 

[nette000]

....

One day the magic will come back.

All of it. Everyone will be just like they were.

The shadows will part, and the skies will open wide.

When he rises, everyone will see.

 

....

 

Thoughts, questions, counter theories? If anyone has any ideas what significance, if any, Great Dragons and Titans have, I'd be most curious to hear 

 

One could easily see this as a reference to the Breach and Corypheus, but if that was intended, the return of all the magic is still missing. But that might be part of a next installment, either as part of Solas' plans or with unforseen consequences.