63 réponses à ce sujet

[MrFob]

I hope you dont take this personally, but genetic engineering between two different alien species like that wouldn't work. Before I did what I'm doing now, which is neuroscience, I did genetics research. Specifically involving transferring bacterial genes into plants, I wont get into it. Point is, something like that is possible on Earth because no matter how diverse two organisms are, as he correctly pointed out, we still share a distant common ancestor. We still share the same genetic code. We still share the same basic cellular machinery or a variation thereof.

It isn't just putting a gene into another genome. That organism has to read that gene, utilizing the same arbitrary genetic code encoding the same arbitrary amino acids after transcribing it into the same ribonucleic acid messenger signal. Then they have to assemble those amino acids into a protein, using the same or similar ribosomal machinery. Then there can be modification of that protein. Then that protein has to interact with other proteins in a vast milieu of cellular automata in order to actually WORK.

Sometimes, all we want to do is take something like a gene from a jellyfish encoding GFP and put it into another organism to make it fluoresce. That is comparatively easy. But it still only works due to common ancestry. When you start talking about complex physiological mechanisms like an increased propensity for healing that require multiple genes, multiple chemical messengers, multiple cellular interactions, multiple organs and organ systems...and I'm sorry, but forget genetics - a basic understanding of physiology and biology would lead one to conclude that this should be impossible (or close to it) between two alien species.

Note:** the one caveat to that would be that what you propose between two alien species could be possible....if and only if both species shared the same or similar biochemistry, necessitating sharing a sizeable portion of their genome. This would be implausible between two completely alien species, but if Bioware went the "some ancient species seeded the universe with life" route, then they could go that way...but that is such a bad trope that I really hope they dont do it.

 

While I agree that it's ludicrous, this seems to be the case in the ME universe. At least there is a lot of information in the games that implies that this is the case.

- First of all, in a lot cases, DNA is mentioned in the context of alien biology, meaning that their genetic code is also stored in deoxyribonucleic acid

- Almost all species (barring turians and quarians due to chiraliry issues) can share food and drink, which suggest a very similar digestive system.

- The Vorcha are releasing a plague on Omega which can jump species. It is referred to as a virus. Viruses usually invade cells and use the transcription mechanism to replicate, suggesting that this is also similar across multiple species

- The krogan, working with Melon use humans when studying ways to defeat the genophage, which also attacks DNA, suggesting a similar structure there as well.

- The synthesis ending - as ludicrous as it is - according to the catalyst manipulates DNA and thereby changes all life in the galaxy (we even see this cartoonishly visualized in the extended cut epilogue).

 

These and other examples all indicate IMO that despite common sense, DNA was intended by the writers to be ubiquitous throughout all organic species in the galaxy ... just like QWERTY keyboards.

[Kabooooom]

While I agree that it's ludicrous, this seems to be the case in the ME universe. At least there is a lot of information in the games that implies that this is the case.
- First of all, in a lot cases, DNA is mentioned in the context of alien biology, meaning that their genetic code is also stored in deoxyribonucleic acid
- Almost all species (barring turians and quarians due to chiraliry issues) can share food and drink, which suggest a very similar digestive system.
- The Vorcha are releasing a plague on Omega which can jump species. It is referred to as a virus. Viruses usually invade cells and use the transcription mechanism to replicate, suggesting that this is also similar across multiple species
- The krogan, working with Melon use humans when studying ways to defeat the genophage, which also attacks DNA, suggesting a similar structure there as well.
- The synthesis ending - as ludicrous as it is - according to the catalyst manipulates DNA and thereby changes all life in the galaxy (we even see this cartoonishly visualized in the extended cut epilogue).

These and other examples all indicate IMO that despite common sense, DNA was intended by the writers to be ubiquitous throughout all organic species in the galaxy ... just like QWERTY keyboards.

All good counterpoints. I would argue that while true, it couldn't just be DNA, but also the arbitrary three codon scheme, RNA, and the same transcriptional machinery. Otherwise none of what you brought up could be possible.

Which is honestly so ludicrous that it would necessitate some sort of 'alien panspermia' or some other such nonsense.

So who knows, maybe Bioware will go the "the Remnant seeded the Milky Way with life" route.

[ABASOVA]

Can someone explain this chirality thing and why humans cannot  (as in absolutely cannot) eat dextro amino acids. A quick search found that:

 

1-Humans have dextro amino acids inside their bodies. They have found it in our CSF, urine, and other bodily emissions. 

 

2-Certain foods we eat have dextro based proteins (particularly fermented foods)

 

 3-Some of the bacteria we have outside our bodies have dextro based proteins

 

In ME2 the Illium banter made it sound like we would nearly die or pass out in a puddle of vomit from ingesting the stuff. Like Traynor, I am very allergic to curry-based spices (levo). I can eat mint, cheese, yogurt  just fine (has dextro). I'm not sure me and a krogan, two levos, can eat the same things without the possibility that something may be an allergen and kill me. And the eezo-laced asari foods don't sound very healthy for a human either even if it is levo-based.

 

 

Edit: If the bacteria on our body has dextro amino acids wouldn't Tali become deathly ill if she was exposed to it since her skin is a sterile site, something a dextro bacterial colony would exploit?

[SerriceIceDandy]

http://masseffect.wi...tic_Engineering

 

The Codex allows it. However, it's generally considered illegal for... reasons.

 

But if ME allowed for cross-breeding, Andromeda would probably start to look like a Dog show.

 

[Kabooooom]

http://masseffect.wi...tic_Engineering

The Codex allows it. However, it's generally considered illegal for... reasons.

But if ME allowed for cross-breeding, Andromeda would probably start to look like a Dog show.

Well I'll be...it absolutely does.

I still maintain that this is 100% unscientific and would be impossible in real life.

[Dantriges]

Intelligent Design is a thing in the ME universe.   The creator god BeoWah was a bit lazy and just copied the same basic mechanisms when designing new species.

[Kabooooom]

Intelligent Design is a thing in the ME universe. The creator god BeoWah was a bit lazy and just copied the same basic mechanisms when designing new species.

Lol. Honestly though, now I'm worried they are gonna pull some BS plot like "the Remnant seeded the Milky Way with life". I dont think they will make Andromeda entirely stand-alone in the sense that it will have no relevance whatsoever on the Milky Way. I think that they will make the MW have no relevance on Andromeda whatsoever (hence the change of scenery), but I do think they are going to try to make some great revelation in Andromeda somehow tie into lore involving the Milky Way.

I just hope it isn't that.

[Vortex13]

Lol. Honestly though, now I'm worried they are gonna pull some BS plot like "the Remnant seeded the Milky Way with life". I dont think they will make Andromeda entirely stand-alone in the sense that it will have no relevance whatsoever on the Milky Way. I think that they will make the MW have no relevance on Andromeda whatsoever (hence the change of scenery), but I do think they are going to try to make some great revelation in Andromeda somehow tie into lore involving the Milky Way.

I just hope it isn't that.

 

 

As I've said in other threads, if the Remnant are ancient, advanced humans...

 

 

Hopefully though, BioWare won't want to copy that from the Halo franchise.

[SerriceIceDandy]

Well I'll be...it absolutely does.

I still maintain that this is 100% unscientific and would be impossible in real life.

 

Before finding that, I'd have been inclined to agree. I imagine it would have been like trying to make a Lego block and a bit of K'Nex stick together. Considering that I think (I may be pulling this out of my arse, but I swear I've seen int in-game) ME has established that Alien DNA is actually structured differently than Earth's double helix. Hell, cross-breeds on earth come out with a multitude of problems.

[Dantriges]

I only remember prothean DNA having four strands instead of 2.

[JoltDealer]

I hope you dont take this personally, but genetic engineering between two different alien species like that wouldn't work. Before I did what I'm doing now, which is neuroscience, I did genetics research. Specifically involving transferring bacterial genes into plants, I wont get into it. Point is, something like that is possible on Earth because no matter how diverse two organisms are, as he correctly pointed out, we still share a distant common ancestor. We still share the same genetic code. We still share the same basic cellular machinery or a variation thereof.

It isn't just putting a gene into another genome. That organism has to read that gene, utilizing the same arbitrary genetic code encoding the same arbitrary amino acids after transcribing it into the same ribonucleic acid messenger signal. Then they have to assemble those amino acids into a protein, using the same or similar ribosomal machinery. Then there can be modification of that protein. Then that protein has to interact with other proteins in a vast milieu of cellular automata in order to actually WORK.

Sometimes, all we want to do is take something like a gene from a jellyfish encoding GFP and put it into another organism to make it fluoresce. That is comparatively easy. But it still only works due to common ancestry. When you start talking about complex physiological mechanisms like an increased propensity for healing that require multiple genes, multiple chemical messengers, multiple cellular interactions, multiple organs and organ systems...and I'm sorry, but forget genetics - a basic understanding of physiology and biology would lead one to conclude that this should be impossible (or close to it) between two alien species.

Note:** the one caveat to that would be that what you propose between two alien species could be possible....if and only if both species shared the same or similar biochemistry, necessitating sharing a sizeable portion of their genome. This would be implausible between two completely alien species, but if Bioware went the "some ancient species seeded the universe with life" route, then they could go that way...but that is such a bad trope that I really hope they dont do it.

 

Thank you for the lesson.  No sarcasm is meant to be implied here.  I'm not sure if I actually need to say that, but I'm just covering my ass.  Some people, like myself, have expertise in storytelling, visual design, and media production.  Others, such as yourself, actually studied something useful in college.  Nevertheless, I always love learning something new.

 

That being said, I'm not sure Bioware would ever go the route of "all life comes from one ancestor."  However, in the books, it's both stated and heavily implied that most of the civilized races of the galaxy all evolved along the same lines -- carbon-based, bipedal, opposable appendages, all breathing more or less the same combination of gases, etc.  Obvious exceptions to this are the Volus (breathes different air), Hanar (big, stupid jellyfish), and Elcor (not bipedal).  There's also the whole "dextro" thing going on with Turians and Quarians, but it's not that big of a deal.  I'm not sure if Bioware puts any faith in the idea of morphic fields or other sci-fi explanations of "why our aliens look like humans," but a base similarity between most species is established.  I have no idea if it extends to genetics.

 

Also, please keep in mind, alien hybridization isn't impossible in the Mass Effect universe -- it's outlawed for a multitude of reasons.  Humans steer clear of it because of fears that it could lead to a loss of biodiversity, despite the advantages of co-opting some alien traits to help with colonizing new worlds.  The rest of the known galaxy stays away from it because it technically counts as creating sentient life.  Genetically engineered humans like Miranda are allowed because she is still human, but an alien hybrid would technically count as something new.  It's still not all too far-fetched of an idea to me.

[10K]

Some weirdos do dogs and horses. On the other hand If a pig could talk and express an agreement...nope, I'm not going there.

Yes please go there, if a pig could express agreement you'd screw it?

[10K]

What if she's a really attractive pig with human-level intelligence?

No, given she is another species my junk wouldn't go near her. That's just disgusting.

[Seboist]

Why limit hybridization to just with aliens? Let's create minotaurs,centaurs,satyrs,etc from splicing humans with terrestrial animals while we're at it.