Maker, no.
I'm not so numb and dead inside I'll take any sort of feelz just to feel alive.
Gruesome, realistic war =/=entertainment
That depends on the story being told.
It would have been appropriate for ME3, considering the backdrop was an apocalyptic war where billions were being snuffed out.
That depends on the story being told.
It would have been appropriate for ME3, considering the backdrop was an apocalyptic war where billions were being snuffed out.
Even if it was "appropriate", it would not have been entertaining.
Gruesome warfare is not entertaining.
I don't know TWD but I completely adore Spec Ops: The Line. The mechanics are nothing special but the premise of this game is absolutely fantastic.
Still, I don't believe that there is anything ME can learn from Spec Ops. It was a thing of it's own, something that should and cannot have a sequel or a rip-off or anything like that. It was something special that you can't just replicate and - most importantly for this topic - I think that any game that handles themes like that needs to make those themes the central and exclusive premise of the entire experience. You cannot bolt parts of this concept onto something else as a nice addition or an intriguing side plot, it would loose it's impact and thus simply will not work.
For Mass Effect, it certainly would not work at all. ME has too many other things going on, a background and lore with completely different focus and mechanics that would be terribly at odds with everything that Spec Ops tries to accomplish. In ME, customization of character and decisions stand in the forefront while in Spec Ops, one of the most important factors is that the decisions have no impact.
In ME, the journey, the new and exotic (one might say even alien 
) locations take center stage while Spec Ops is all about introspection.
I really think it would be tough, if not impossible to bring those two concepts for games together. Maybe some very small details might be interesting to look at but as a whole, I don't think there is much ME can learn from Spec Ops, as great as that game is, it's something completely different.
BTW, best analysis of Spec Ops that I have seen so far, definitely recommend watching:
Even if it was "appropriate", it would not have been entertaining.
Gruesome warfare is not entertaining.
Any good story, regardless of whether it is in a book, film, or video game, will provoke some sort of emotional reaction from the people experiencing that story. The emotions the writers provoke in their audience doesn't always have to be happiness.
If the writers don't want the consequences of war to strike close to home for their protagonist, they shouldn't craft a story where a major war is a major plot element.
Any good story, regardless of whether it is in a book, film, or video game, will provoke some sort of emotional reaction from the people experiencing that story. The emotions the writers provoke in their audience doesn't always have to be happiness.
If the writers don't want the consequences of war to strike close to home for their protagonist, they shouldn't craft a story where a major war is a major plot element.
Any good story, regardless of whether it is in a book, film, or video game, will provoke some sort of emotional reaction from the people experiencing that story. The emotions the writers provoke in their audience doesn't always have to be happiness.
If the writers don't want the consequences of war to strike close to home for their protagonist, they shouldn't craft a story where a major war is a major plot element.
Not all emotional reactions are positive. You'd have to be a pretty irresponsible writer not to be cognizant of that.
And yet I don't think the war itself is the major plot element. The major plot element is Shepard trying to save the galaxy, which often results in him either seeing the early invasion (Earth) or the last holdout (Thessia). Shepard is not directly involved with any major battle until he lands in London. Shepard is on the fringes of it all because that's what Shepard's job is.
Shepard spends the entire game trying to save the galaxy from an invasion by genocidal machines.
Shepard is also directly involved in several major battles or campaigns: The invasion of Earth, the Battle of Menae, the battle above Rannoch, the Citadel Coup, the invasion of Thessia, and the Earth counteroffensive.
The Reaper War was hardly a side plot...it was central to the story.
What I hear the OP saying is, "I want to play pretend soldier and go through the horrors of war as I understand them from TV and movies." Which is still not the true horror of war. If you want to experience war, then enlist. Don't complain that a video game isn't living up to your PTSD standards.
The OP could have been worded better.
Not that it matters. Military service isn't necessary to criticize how Bioware portrayed a fictional war in a video game.
The Reaper War was hardly a side plot...it was central to the story.
The OP could have been worded better.
I never said I fought in the war. I studied military history since grade school, and I talked to vets about the Vietnam war, and my family members were vets too.Have you ever fought in a war?
I never said I fought in the war. I studied military history since grade school, and I talked to vets about the Vietnam war, and my family members were vets too.
Ok.I never said you had. I was posing a question with a fairly obvious answer.
Why not go for the impossible? I think BW should learn from different games, stories, and movies to create a mind blowing experience of playing ME3. I also think that they should learn from Spec Ops for their themes of war is hell, and horrifying to put it to use to make the Reapers the ultimate evil that no one is ever faced. ME3 could've been a whole lot better of they only taken their time to make this game their best.I don't know TWD but I completely adore Spec Ops: The Line. The mechanics are nothing special but the premise of this game is absolutely fantastic.
Still, I don't believe that there is anything ME can learn from Spec Ops. It was a thing of it's own, something that should and cannot have a sequel or a rip-off or anything like that. It was something special that you can't just replicate and - most importantly for this topic - I think that any game that handles themes like that needs to make those themes the central and exclusive premise of the entire experience. You cannot bolt parts of this concept onto something else as a nice addition or an intriguing side plot, it would loose it's impact and thus simply will not work.
For Mass Effect, it certainly would not work at all. ME has too many other things going on, a background and lore with completely different focus and mechanics that would be terribly at odds with everything that Spec Ops tries to accomplish. In ME, customization of character and decisions stand in the forefront while in Spec Ops, one of the most important factors is that the decisions have no impact.
In ME, the journey, the new and exotic (one might say even alien
I really think it would be tough, if not impossible to bring those two concepts for games together. Maybe some very small details might be interesting to look at but as a whole, I don't think there is much ME can learn from Spec Ops, as great as that game is, it's something completely different.
BTW, best analysis of Spec Ops that I have seen so far, definitely recommend watching:
https://www.youtube....h?v=wlBrenhzMZI
Why not go for the impossible? I think BW should learn from different games, stories, and movies to create a mind blowing experience of playing ME3. I also think that they should learn from Spec Ops for their themes of war is hell, and horrifying to put it to use to make the Reapers the ultimate evil that no one is ever faced. ME3 could've been a whole lot better of they only taken their time to make this game their best.
I don't think ME3 was lacking because it didn't include "the horrors of war."
Dragon Age Origins done it and succeed with the horrors of war. I say why not?I don't think ME3 was lacking because it didn't include "the horrors of war."
Dragon Age Origins done it and succeed with the horrors of war. I say why not?
Wow. Okay then. First, no it didn't. Second, if you want to experience the horror of war, then enlist. Don't look for a video game to bring it to you.
Wow. IDK why you are taking this personal.Wow. Okay then. First, no it didn't. Second, if you want to experience the horror of war, then enlist. Don't look for a video game to bring it to you.
Wow. IDK why you are taking this personal.
Because there are actual people who are living with the true horrors of war every day, and you're making of mockery of it by even pretending a video game can come close to it. And if it could, you wouldn't want it. You want the experience without having to live with it, and you can't have both. What you're asking for is naive and childish.
Whoa! Chill out! It's just ideas of what they can do to make ME3 a much better game! Why so serious?Because there are actual people who are living with the true horrors of war every day, and you're making of mockery of it by even pretending a video game can come close to it. And if it could, you wouldn't want it. You want the experience without having to live with it, and you can't have both. What you're asking for is naive and childish.
Whoa! Chill out! It's just ideas of what they can do to make ME3 a much better game! Why so serious?
Because it's a serious issue. And if you want to make ME3 a better game, you're about four years too late. And also you might ask for a better narrative, instead of being scared a lot.
It's only a game! And it's not even a request anyways it's simply suggestions. If you want to PM me about this issue feel free to tell me your side of the story.Because it's a serious issue. And if you want to make ME3 a better game, you're about four years too late. And also you might ask for a better narrative, instead of being scared a lot.
It's only a game! And it's not even a request anyways it's simply suggestions. If you want to PM me about this issue feel free to tell me your side of the story.
You're right. It is only a game. Which is why asking for something to be "more real" is really kind of silly, isn't it? And I've told you my side of the story.
Why not go for the impossible? I think BW should learn from different games, stories, and movies to create a mind blowing experience of playing ME3. I also think that they should learn from Spec Ops for their themes of war is hell, and horrifying to put it to use to make the Reapers the ultimate evil that no one is ever faced. ME3 could've been a whole lot better of they only taken their time to make this game their best.
I wouldn't say that Spec Ops' theme was "war is hell". Did you watch the video I linked? I agree with those guys. I think the theme of this game was more along the lines of "our depictions of war in contemporary media (and video games in particular) is abhorrent grossly distorting our sense of morality, even in "war is hell" themed instances".
Since Mass Effect is based upon very formalistic adherence to the conventions of modern entertainment media, I don't see how this kind of deconstruction could work without completely messing up the franchise. I guess it can be done but I don't think many people would like it. And there is also no need since Spec Ops already did it.
As for the "war is hell" theme, I think ME did enough of that in ME3 (it could have been done a little better but over all it's not bad and it certainly was enough). Personally, I am quite happy to back to more classic scifi-explorer-adventure themed game with Andromeda.
I did watched the vid and it was very good and thorough understanding of morality and commiting war crimes in the name of greater good is a very profound and very good perspective of shooter games we've played. And how Spec Ops: The Line really delivered on that, but as I said I don't want ME3 to be exactly like Spec Ops, I just wanted elements of what BW can use to draw people by showing how real evil Reapers are to motivate players to be a hero of the story by saving the galaxy with a bang. Like LOTR or The Matrix Revolutions for example. I hope I explained it better.I wouldn't say that Spec Ops' theme was "war is hell". Did you watch the video I linked? I agree with those guys. I think the theme of this game was more along the lines of "our depictions of war in contemporary media (and video games in particular) is abhorrent grossly distorting our sense of morality, even in "war is hell" themed instances".
Since Mass Effect is based upon very formalistic adherence to the conventions of modern entertainment media, I don't see how this kind of deconstruction could work without completely messing up the franchise. I guess it can be done but I don't think many people would like it. And there is also no need since Spec Ops already did it.
As for the "war is hell" theme, I think ME did enough of that in ME3 (it could have been done a little better but over all it's not bad and it certainly was enough). Personally, I am quite happy to back to more classic scifi-explorer-adventure themed game with Andromeda.
That is a bit much don't cha think? But I understand what you're coming from of ME3 should feel more realistic when it comes to facing evil how horror can inflict people fighting the reapers and facing extinction.Oh I didn't meant that Shepard should be like Walker or anything, and I understand that they're two different games. Let me explain it better: I put Spec Ops because they put elements of horrors of war and how people experience war and survival very well like the further you go the more hellish it gets, that's why I think Spec Ops offered to the shooter genre to be realistic as possible. Think of playing one of the Alliance soldiers fighting the Reapers on earth fighting hard and seeing your teammates die, hear screams of women and children crying out for help from the battle scarred buildings and you try to save them but a destroyer lands and crushes them. Introduce brutality of the Reaper forces like if a Brute grabbed one of the soldiers and tears him in half with its claw and hear him screaming with half of his body gone, intestines and gore are shown, have Banshees melt people alive when they're using biotics against them. Have people to have real personalities and strong connection of love and friendship to have the players emotionally invested to care for them to protect them from harm anyway you can, but ending up sacrificing them for the greater good when fighting the Reapers, as well as make the best choices out of the bad situations of what you're going to face. That way they can get players emotionally involved into the game to motivate players to defeat the Reapers anyway they can regardless of good or bad choices they make with Shepard, and set it up for choices to be harsh and do necessary evils for the players to face hardships of fighting for the greater good of the galaxy from the Reapers. Trust me if they put that in ME3 it would be a hit!
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