995 réponses à ce sujet

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Spoiler

 

Edit:

 

Don't take that as a personal attack or anything. Wasn't meant as such.

Don't worry, I didn't. I've used that same gif a few times myself.

That said, there have been romances like that which are still fun for a lot of people, like those who enjoyed Josephine's or Solas' romances in DAI. 

 

 

Most definitely don't want it ambiguous.

Also personally don't want it optional as that would likely it wouldn't be brought up again.

So you want it to be mandatory? What about players who like the romance stories but for a variety of reasons don't want sex to be a part of it? 

[LightningPoodle]

Don't worry, I didn't. I've used that same gif a few times myself.
That said, there have been romances like that which are still fun for a lot of people, like those who enjoyed Josephine's or Solas' romances in DAI. 
 
 


So you want it to be mandatory? What about players who like the romance stories but for a variety of reasons don't want sex to be a part of it?

I'm all for having a variety of different romances. I like that Josephine doesn't have a sex scene. What she does have is right for her character. Same goes for Garrus, though that could very well have been because it was difficult to animate. I don't want every romance to be a carbon copy of one another. I would like some that are sex free (though if it's very much implied that they do do it, I'm fine with that) and some that are like Miranda's and Isabela's.

[wright1978]

 

So you want it to be mandatory? What about players who like the romance stories but for a variety of reasons don't want sex to be a part of it? 

 

 

Romances are already optional. I just disagree with notion of devaluing them by making the sex within them optional as well and hence offlimits for dialogue or the romance narrative.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I'm all for having a variety of different romances. I like that Josephine doesn't have a sex scene. What she does have is right for her character. Same goes for Garrus, though that could very well have been because it was difficult to animate. I don't want every romance to be a carbon copy of one another. I would like some that are sex free (though if it's very much implied that they do do it, I'm fine with that) and some that are like Miranda's and Isabela's.

Exactly. 

Yeah, I'm not saying have them all be like that. Just to have options for a variety of people. 

 

Romances are already optional. I just disagree with notion of devaluing them by making the sex within them optional as well and hence offlimits for dialogue or the romance narrative.

So if you don't want to have sex, don't have romance? Romance =/= Sex

Why does having it be optional devalue them? Are there not real life relationships where one person for whatever reason doesn't feel it is the right time yet? Are those real life relationships devalued because of that too? 

[Shechinah]

Romances are already optional. I just disagree with notion of devaluing them by making the sex within them optional as well and hence offlimits for dialogue or the romance narrative.

 

How does optional sex within a romance devalue said romance? As far as I am aware, romance tend to be defined as an emotional attachment, not a sexual attachment. The optional sexual content or lack of sexual content would not prevent romantic dialogue nor a romantic narrative. It would merely omit the sexual scene in a way perhaps similar to a fade-out or keep it ambigous as per the player's decision should it be optional. 

 

To some, an optional interpretation of a relationship can serve to avoid some very unfortunate implications such as with the Solas romance in which it could have become a question of questionable consent considering he is deliberately withholding information about his true identity from the player and masquerading by a different persona because he knows who he is will likely prompt a negative reaction from the player especially given his goals as well as his involvement with the plot.

 

I love the Solas romance and I am glad for the ambigous interpretation because it allows the romance to exist without Solas' character having be impacted in a bad way, in my opinion, by having to abide by the previous rules of an obligatory love scene.      

 

TL:DR: Not adhering to obligatory rules in regards to how a relationship narrative has to play out can allow for interesting romances that might not otherwise be possible due to how damaging they could be to the characterization of the romantic partner if said obligatory rules were adhered to. Additionally and importantly, romance tend to be defined not as a sexual attachment but as an emotional attachment therefore it would doubtful, in my opinion, that romance would be made less significant per an optional lack of sexual content and less romantic.
 

[ArcadiaGrey]

I agree. Not seeing the flirt option ever again after not choosing it when it appeared for the first time really gets on my nerves. It's like the game is telling you that the attraction you might feel for that particular character only exists at the exact moment the game offers you the first flirting sentence.

"Oh, you didn't want to flirt with this character when I wanted, with the words I wanted? Too bad. You will never get to be happy with him/her ever again!" *evil laughter*

 

Yes, it's way too contrived.  God it's annoying when you accidently don't hit a flirt option, only to find out way later it's too late.  It forces you to religiously hit the flirt option every damn time just to make sure.

 

What counts is not the mechanics (which are part of the content, a detail) but the substance and the context in which you place them.

Horrible scripted romances will produce scareful effects (obviously clapped by the badtasters), no matter how complicate the mechanics are in them.

 

Yeah, trying to make a short title that accurately describes what the topic is about is tricky, so I went with mechanics as it seemed the most general term that most ppl would immediately recognise.

If you can word it better I'm happy to edit it. 

 

<snip>......or they can have their characters politely decline and say "maybe another time" or something. I'm sure they can say that without getting dumped, I mean, we all say that in real life anyway lol.  That way people who want to see more can and the people who want to see less can, all fair.    

 

Surely Shep could have a headache every now and then....or be washing their hair?    

Damn that'd be awkward for bald maleShep 

 

I'm all for having a variety of different romances. I like that Josephine doesn't have a sex scene. What she does have is right for her character. Same goes for Garrus, though that could very well have been because it was difficult to animate. I don't want every romance to be a carbon copy of one another. I would like some that are sex free (though if it's very much implied that they do do it, I'm fine with that) and some that are like Miranda's and Isabela's.

 

I loved the scene with Garrus in ME2 where he and femShep just put their heads together, it was so incredibly sweet and touching.  There's no need to show awkward video game sex with every romance as long as there's some kind of intimacy between the characters.

[Madeline McQueen]

Surely Shep could have a headache every now and then....or be washing their hair?  

Damn that'd be awkward for bald maleShep 

 

Who could blame Shepard for having a headache? He / she goes through a heck of a lot, I'm sure that would be a reasonable excuse. 

 

Lol, bald men can like to keep up appearances as well. He might be washing his scalp, keeping his hair hair shaved and maybe polishing it lol. 

[ArcadiaGrey]

Who could blame Shepard for having a headache? He / she goes through a heck of a lot, I'm sure that would be a reasonable excuse. 

 

Lol, bald men can like to keep up appearances as well. He might be washing his scalp, keeping his hair hair shaved and maybe polishing it lol. 

 

Lol!  Buffing his noggin to a lovely shine so he can blind the Collectors into submission 

[Lucca_de_Neon]

Lol!  Buffing his noggin to a lovely shine so he can blind the Collectors into submission 

 

.....kinky!

[Shechinah]

I loved the scene with Garrus in ME2 where he and femShep just put their heads together, it was so incredibly sweet and touching.  There's no need to show awkward video game sex with every romance as long as there's some kind of intimacy between the characters.

 

I adored the headbump so much and I was so sad to see it go in Mass Effect 3 in favor of kissing. The headbump seemed like such an interesting way of conveying an emotional gesture between two people who were alien to each other in terms of physiology.

 

I would have loved to see more of gestures like it because to me, it helped show in it's own way how this was a relationship between a human and an alien. Instead, they decided to forego any exploration into how this aspect of the relationship might play and instead act as if there were no real differences.

 

I do not even think I can remember any exploration into turian culture and how they might express romantic feelings or gestures with the exception of the compliments Garrus talk about in Mass Effect 2. It's all very human which is not an interesting way, in my opinion, to explore what a romantic relationship with an alien might be like.  
 

[Neverwinter_Knight77]

The problem with the whole sex thing is that in these games' romances, I feel like I'm not "completing the romance subplot" unless they have sex. If they don't, then the game might think they're not together anymore. It shouldn't feel like that. Look at ME2 where the options are "have quarian sex, which is implied to possibly end up killing Tali" or "break up".

[Madeline McQueen]

Lol!  Buffing his noggin to a lovely shine so he can blind the Collectors into submission 

Lmao! No man wants to go into battle with an unpolished topper. He needs to look his best. Besides, its an advantage when his team is behind him and the enemies reflection shines on the back of his head. It's like having a rear view mirror in front of you lol. 

[ArcadiaGrey]

.....kinky!

 

Okay okay, I meant his head, not his.....well....dammit Lucca  

 

Lmao! No man wants to go into battle with an unpolished topper. He needs to look his best. Besides, its an advantage when his team is behind him and the enemies reflection shines on the back of his head. It's like having a rear view mirror in front of you lol. 

 

Omg that would be so handy!  New combat option right there, just wait....

[ArcadiaGrey]

I adored the headbump so much and I was so sad to see it go in Mass Effect 3 in favor of kissing. The headbump seemed like such an interesting way of conveying an emotional gesture between two people who were alien to each other in terms of physiology.

 

I would have loved to see more of gestures like it because to me, it helped show in it's own way how this was a relationship between a human and an alien. Instead, they decided to forego any exploration into how this aspect of the relationship might play and instead act as if there were no real differences.

 

I do not even think I can remember any exploration into turian culture and how they might express romantic feelings or gestures with the exception of the compliments Garrus talk about in Mass Effect 2. It's all very human which is not an interesting way, in my opinion, to explore what a romantic relationship with an alien might be like.  
 

 

I haven't done ME3 with my Garrus romance yet, but I'm sad that you said it isn't very turian-y.  What a wasted opportunity, Garrus is probably the best character to make a more respectful, friendship based love story for.  And why have aliens at all if you make it human?

[Akrabra]

Don't hate on the Garrus romance, it is sacred!

[Madeline McQueen]

Omg that would be so handy!  New combat option right there, just wait....

Lol! Want to suggest it? 

[Shechinah]

Don't hate on the Garrus romance, it is sacred!

 

I do adore the Garrus romance to precious little bits but I feel it is an example of an alien romance that could have showed some lovely insight into an alien culture and how a relationship with an alien might play out especially in terms of gestures only to make said relationship human in almost all aspect except for skin.

 

It had potential in portraying the duality of a human and alien relationship and showcased a bit of it in Mass Effect 2 but then defaulted to human almost entirely in Mass Effect 3 rather than keep to showing that the parties were alien to each other in more than appearance and would have to gradually learn how this aspect of each other's culture worked.  

 

Personally, I feel it is good to discuss it because I'd like to see the alien side of a romantic relationship being explored as oppose to relying solely on the human side for gestures and behavior. Developing a romantic relationship that features an alien side can provide an insight into said alien's culture and character that might not otherwise be experienced or learned by the player and their character personally.    
 

[wright1978]

How does optional sex within a romance devalue said romance? As far as I am aware, romance tend to be defined as an emotional attachment, not a sexual attachment. The optional sexual content or lack of sexual content would not prevent romantic dialogue nor a romantic narrative. It would merely omit the sexual scene in a way perhaps similar to a fade-out or keep it ambigous as per the player's decision should it be optional. 

 

To some, an optional interpretation of a relationship can serve to avoid some very unfortunate implications such as with the Solas romance in which it could have become a question of questionable consent considering he is deliberately withholding information about his true identity from the player and masquerading by a different persona because he knows who he is will likely prompt a negative reaction from the player especially given his goals as well as his involvement with the plot.

 

I love the Solas romance and I am glad for the ambigous interpretation because it allows the romance to exist without Solas' character having be impacted in a bad way, in my opinion, by having to abide by the previous rules of an obligatory love scene.      

 

TL:DR: Not adhering to obligatory rules in regards to how a relationship narrative has to play out can allow for interesting romances that might not otherwise be possible due to how damaging they could be to the characterization of the romantic partner if said obligatory rules were adhered to. Additionally and importantly, romance tend to be defined not as a sexual attachment but as an emotional attachment therefore it would doubtful, in my opinion, that romance would be made less significant per an optional lack of sexual content and less romantic.
 

 

Sex is a pretty core part of most adult relationships, that sits along side emotional attachment. Optional or ambiguity removes the chance to integrate that into the wider romance arc because it is suddenly no longer a definite aspect. You can't have any sort of reference, no innuendo or sultry comments between lovers etc. If you did that to the Isabela romance in DA2 you'd cripple it imo.

 

Personally i disliked those chaste romances in DAI where there was no sexual component. I suppose some can pretend there's a non referenced sexual component and not something that improves the relationship experience imo anymore than removing voiced PC(thereby allowing someone to pretend the PC has a different voice.) would improve the immersive experience of being that character.

[marcelo caldas]

I really really hated how no one ever criticized Shepard's decisions throughout the trilogy always made me angry. It was like they all joined the Cult of The Shepard just ugh.

 

They knew best than second guessing Shepard on his own ship

[Battlebloodmage]

Honestly, the only scene that was missing in GayKaidanmance was the scene where FemShep sat on his lap for a kiss and Kaidan had to lift FemShep in his arm. Its one of the thing I doubt would look right for heavier set BroShep.

 

Bioware is rather formulaic : You recruit, you do their loyalty test, you initiate interest, courtship, sex, crisis/separation, realizing that the two of you were meant for each other, affirming love.

 

And screw damsel in distress + love at first sight trope.....

 

I guess obligatory asari, turian, quarian mance... ... predictable. I want a krogan romance. Specifically someone who spouts poetry about how he adores my petals.

1. They cut sitting on the lap during the romance scene

2. They cut the butt staring

3. The cut the hand holding and kissing on the hand

4. They cut Kaidan and Shephard holding hands during the Citadel scene.

5. A lot of dialogues in between. I watched both.

 

Yeah, they cut a lot of the stuffs, that is not to mention the stuffs maleShep missed out for not being able to import. 

[Panda]

I haven't done ME3 with my Garrus romance yet, but I'm sad that you said it isn't very turian-y.  What a wasted opportunity, Garrus is probably the best character to make a more respectful, friendship based love story for.  And why have aliens at all if you make it human?

 

Well it is respectful and friendship based. With Garrus I felt most the "we are in this together"-vibe, that you are both high ranking soldiers that have been through lot together, are in same line and understand what each other feels. Like you are partners or something ^^ I also think Garrus has best friendship arc in the ME3 as well.

[ArcadiaGrey]

Well it is respectful and friendship based. With Garrus I felt most the "we are in this together"-vibe, that you are both high ranking soldiers that have been through lot together, are in same line and understand what each other feels. Like you are partners or something ^^ I also think Garrus has best friendship arc in the ME3 as well.

 

Yay!  Very happy to hear that.  Romancing Garrus in ME2 is perhaps my favourite Bioware romance ever.  

 

Love it so much I'm kinda scared to do ME3 with that femShep.  I keep putting it off 

[Eleonora]

Yay!  Very happy to hear that.  Romancing Garrus in ME2 is perhaps my favourite Bioware romance ever.  

 

Love it so much I'm kinda scared to do ME3 with that femShep.  I keep putting it off 

 

Do it. Garrus is a treasure

 

He keeps ME3 bearable.

[ArcadiaGrey]

Do it. Garrus is a treasure

 

He keeps ME3 bearable.

 

I've played with a Tali romance once before, and I have to say her romance didn't capture me as much as it had in ME2.  It'll be Miranda and Ash this time round, and I'll save Garrus to lighten up either my third or fourth run.  Keep the awesome for when I really need it!  

[TheBunz]

I want to be able to play an Ardat Yakshi and break hearts and take souls.