14 réponses à ce sujet

[Dracir101]

Hello, new builder here. Have only built a couple things, not much I am really proud of yet.

 

I am looking to make a sneaker through OC - MoTB. 

Currently don't have my PC setup to play NWN2, but very excited to start it up again. Just trying to figure out my build!

 

I would love some helpful criticism. Hopefully I can make it a bit better.

Click Here for the build. 

 

Thank you very much in advance!

[Raygereio]

An important thing to keep in the back of your mind when designing a build for the singleplayer game is that (not counting the tutorial) the OC starts at level 3 (level 1 for that +2 ECL Yuan-ti). And also that you'll be spending a lot of time at low'ish levels during Act 1.

 

You're not going to be dealing a lot of damage with that build at the early levels. And the OC features a lot of undead who will just look at you funny when you try to sneak attack them.

Don't get me wrong: It's playable. You'll pick up Kelgar soon enough and have him go smash stuff with a big hammer. At later levels the kukri's low base damage and the crit-immune enemies you'll be facing won't matter as you can pile enchants on your weapons and merrily throw 7x 2d6 vs Evil at Black Garius' face per turn. And once you're in MotB you can start feinting liches and whatnot to death after picking up Epic Precision.

But for most of Act 1 and probably even Act 2 of the OC you may feel like your main character isn't contributing all that much.

[GCoyote]

Also, during the OC there are a number of mandatory talk-before-you-fight situations where you cannot necessarily exploit your sneak abilities.

[ColorsFade]

It's a fine build. You end up with the same BAB as my Drow EK. 

 

I've played the OC a bunch of times. The ECL doesn't affect you much. The creatures in the prologue are purposely watered down to be weaker so you can get through that portion of the game even with an ECL character. And as Raygereio says, you get Khelgar soon enough for tanking. You'll have a full group before you can blink and then you can go on your merry backstabbing ways. 

 

The issue, for me, is always to remember the middle of that game, when you have to face Lorne by yourself in the arena (or choose a companion in your place). I hate that fight unless I'm an EK (Sanctuary, buff, pokey-slashy). 

 

One thing though: I've ran the math before with a program I wrote, and you're better off with short swords over the kukri. The bigger critical range of the kukri doesn't make up for the larger damage of the short sword over time (like over an entire game of rolls). On top of that, as mentioned, when things are immune to critical damage, then you just want the best base damage you can get with the lightest weapon possible. For that reason, I stopped using kukri's long ago and switched to SS on my Swash/EK builds. 

 

Have fun. This game never gets old to me... 

[GCoyote]

If you take advantage of the crafting system you can build a custom undead smacking device that best fits your fighting style. Have fun!

[Arkalezth]

There are several things I'd do differently (less or no fighter, no ECL, probably skip feint or get a better bluff, etc), but it'll work. You don't need a superbuild to own the OC.

Also, during the OC there are a number of mandatory talk-before-you-fight situations where you cannot necessarily exploit your sneak abilities.

Not an issue if you have HIPS.

One thing though: I've ran the math before with a program I wrote, and you're better off with short swords over the kukri.

I haven't ran such a program, but I'd say it depends on the character and the enemies you face. Even against crit immunes, the damage type is something to consider. Short swords are piercing, which is typically resisted more often than slashing.

Either way, the difference isn't great (the base damage difference is a single point). I generally favour short swords over kukris, but it's a matter of looks.

[BoardGuest808888l]

Not sure you'd want to have that 1 level of Shadowdancer. If you're after HipS, you can get that by being Assassin anyway and Darkvision, you already have as yuan-ti. Not to mention you have to spend feats for Dodge and Mobility. Meanwhile, another 1 level of Rogue will give you +1d6 Sneak Attack.

[ColorsFade]

short swords are piercing, which is typically resisted more often than slashing.

 

Dope that I am, I never realized this... I just thought "sword = slashing". 

 

Given that I just started a new MoTB session (in an attempt to finally finish it), I decided to quickly reroll my swash/EK and go with the Rapier. If I'm going to poke, might as well make it really pokey!

 

Out of curiosity: I read a lot that poking is more resisted than slashing, but I've been unable to come up with a list of creatures that resist either/or. Do you know off-hand what tends to resist poking vs. slashing? 

 

I don't have a monster manual. I suppose I'm just going to have to break down and get one. 

[Arkalezth]

Out of curiosity: I read a lot that poking is more resisted than slashing, but I've been unable to come up with a list of creatures that resist either/or. Do you know off-hand what tends to resist poking vs. slashing?

I don't think it's really a big deal, even if I may have implied otherwise in my previous post. The most typical examples that come to mind are undead: skeleton types are naturally resistant to slashing and piercing damage, whereas zombies are resistant to bludgeoning and piercing.

Of course, it's entirely possible to play a whole module and never face an enemy with such a DR, so I wouldn't worry too much about it.

[Dracir101]

 

Not sure you'd want to have that 1 level of Shadowdancer. If you're after HipS, you can get that by being Assassin anyway and Darkvision, you already have as yuan-ti. Not to mention you have to spend feats for Dodge and Mobility. Meanwhile, another 1 level of Rogue will give you +1d6 Sneak Attack.

Shadowdancer was taken to get Hide in Plain Sight 5 levels earlier than Assassin would. The build was really nothing without HiPS. Doesn't matter too much anymore. The build has been completely revamped. Shying away from Sneak Attack-but still being a super sneaky hard hitter.

 

Thanks for the comments everyone! I have used all the advice I had been given and updated the build.

Feel free to check it out again, it has been overhauled!

[BoardGuest808888l]

Hmm, do you really need TWF that badly ? Dual-wielding scimitars will give AB penalty to your character. Why the need to swap between TWF and single-handed style ? It seems maxing one style is better than being something-in-between both style. Not to mention it'll be difficult to actually find two good weapons of the same type (even in epic like MotB).

Expose Weakness, I don't quite remember how it go, but IIRC it burns all your attacks for the round in exchange for damage equal to your Dex. It is good is you have few attacks per round and high Dex. But your character has many attacks per round and low Dex.

I think level 13-19 will be the defining move for your character's career. Are you going to be a fighter, ranger or berserker? Choose wisely here. As ranger, you got no survival, concentration, spot and listen.

UMD is another point. Do you have specific goal to use certain item that requires as much skill points ? For wands and most items you need most probably 10 points top. Over this, only if you absolutely 'must' use scrolls of certain level (and you got to have someone who can make such scrolls too).

[Arkalezth]

Expose Weakness, I don't quite remember how it go, but IIRC it burns all your attacks for the round in exchange for damage equal to your Dex.

It burns only one attack, and DEX damage aside, it's a guaranteed hit (good against enemies that are hard to hit) and reduces the enemy's AC by 3 points, so it's a good feat regardless of your DEX.
 

As ranger, you got no survival, concentration, spot and listen.

I agree that Survival is handy (though not a big deal), but Spot and Listen are worthless in the OCs, and Concentration isn't needed on a ranger.

For wands and most items you need most probably 10 points top.

Yeah, it's (modified) 10 for wands and 11 for restricted equipment. Scrolls need a lot more.

[Dracir101]

Hmm, do you really need TWF that badly ? Dual-wielding scimitars will give AB penalty to your character. Why the need to swap between TWF and single-handed style ? It seems maxing one style is better than being something-in-between both style. Not to mention it'll be difficult to actually find two good weapons of the same type (even in epic like MotB).

 

Short of it

Question: Why TWF?

Answer: Utility - a luxury you do not have when you force yourself into 2Handers.

~~------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------~~

TWF is king in MoTB. You craft your own gear, and you get 4 enchants on weapons. Elemental 5d6 X 3(+Enhance).. It pulls ahead of 2H in every single situation, extra hits! That is why the build waits till then to actually use it. 

Switching to 2H(just remove one Scimitar) will boost attack for hard to hit targets. 

 

[You can hotkey weapons, just drag your weapons while they are equipped(to the same icon if dual wielding)] - Makes this instant, even  in battle.

 

The build would be fine using 2H only - Its not like we wasted any feats on GTWF. Just ranger levels, which were needed to get favored enemy.

 

(this does not include equipment or power attack)

[2H - hits per round] +45/+40/+35/+30/+25/+20

                                              vs

[DW - hits per round]+39/+39/+34/+34/+29/+29/+24/+19/+14

 

2 Extra hits(not counting the +14).

MATH! Enhance Power Attack @10 dam/hit(5single) + 15d6 enchants + GWeapon Spec(+4)

2H - 10x6 = 60 +15d6(6) = 330+ 6x4 = 354

DW - 5x8 = 40+ 15d6(8) = 400+ 8x4 = 432

 

Even if you get only 1 extra hit in - the damage will be very similar to 2H.

 

Using Supreme Power Attack(2H build) - damage pulls ahead, but - you would be dropping your Attack by 3 more(Imp Pwr atk), almost down to DW levels.. You also don't have the option of sword and board.

[BoardGuest808888l]

It seems you overestimate TWF a bit here. Sure, 5D6 x 3 damage is cool, but remember, your craftsman need to be level 30 and spends tons of essences (twice as much for 2 weapons). By the time you can pull that, most probably there is nothing left to use them against, even you might have already finish the game. And this is not to mention there are some creatures immune to elemental damages.

Having Ranger level for Favored Enemies might work, but if that's what you want, why not go with 10 FB instead ? Then you'll get Favored Power Attack: Everything.

[BoardGuest808888l]

.Yeah, it's (modified) 10 for wands and 11 for restricted equipment. Scrolls need a lot more.

Yeah, if we put UMD into equation, lots of skills/feats can simply be replaced by wands/scrolls. I prefer to invest in other skills which can't be replaced by magic.