84 réponses à ce sujet

[Jedi Comedian]

I know this is not going to happen, but I wouldn't mind if the next Dragon Age game took the direction of DAO and TW2 (but without the fanservice of the latter). I like the dark atmosphere of this two games. Anyone agrees?

[thats1evildude]

DRAGON AGE WAS A DARK GAME FULL OF DARKNESS. That's why it had a side quest where you gathered nugs and your pet mabari could pee on trees to get bonuses.

[vertigomez]

Yeah, In Hushed Whispers was way too fluffy for me. I couldn't help but roll my eyes when Leliana freed the nugs and gave Alexius a stern talking to.

[Ashagar]

Envy's attempted mind rapes and people being forced to fight against people who were their comrades moments before in champions of the just was kid friendly and Chateau d'Onterre was rambows and roses apparently.

[Jedi Comedian]

I never do side quests nor use the dog in combat. But I would like to see something like the Dead Trenches or taking bloody revenge on Arl Howe as a Human Noble (I hated the whole happy family thing about that Origin but killing the man who took your former life from you and forced you to become a Warden was cool).

[Elite Fennec]

Couldn't agree more, even when you are dealing with dark subject matter it doesn't feel that way because of the light feel of the game. They should've taken us to Denerim rather than Redcliffe and shown alienages with people despairing in the street similar to the first Witcher game. Included a brothel, not for player purposes but realism and to be more in keeping with DAO and DA2. Emphasised the plight of the elven and the effects that the mage/templar and civil wars have on regular people through more than just the odd codex entry and conversation with npc. It's all to do with atmosphere, even when you are rescuing slaves in Sahrnia it just feels like another fetch quest whereas the orphanage quest in DAO actually felt as dark as it's content. Alternatively Elvhenan should be restored so that the setting for future games is more fantastical.

[Helmetto]

It's funny how people bring up all these examples, and while I agree that if I summed it up several quests for someone, their response would be "wow that's dark," the overall experience for me was just kind of "Oh. Well, better not **** this up, apparently."

 

A lot of the time, it was mostly about being told that bad **** was happening, and the rest was kind of just...

 

Like, I remember that one fight that just broke out in the crossroads of the Hinterlands, and looking back on it now, the only people I had to worried about were the people who had armor and swords and were just too weak to fight. Compare this to a Chantry Board mission where you have to rescue refugees, some of who are poorly equiped, others who don't even have weapons and kind of die quickly.

 

Kind of really put into perspective how dire the Blight was a bit, there.

[Marshal Moriarty]

Dark and gritty suits some games, but I don't feel like Bioware has ever really bought into that mentality in any of its games. They have always seemed more interested in filling their worlds with loveable losers, cheeky and dashing rogues, amusingly shady swindlers etc. Their games are basically just Han Solo simulators, encouraging you to swagger about and be the greatest at everything, rubbing shoulders with rich and poor alike etc etc.

 

The sense of fun and the simple, escapist thrill of having your little gang of characters getting up to escapades has always been the big draw. Trying to get too dark and solemn would put a lot of people off, and undermine one of the key reasons they like playing Bioware games. Plus again, I just don't think that Bioware like or want to do that sort of thing. I'm playing Devil's Advocate on this, because I think Obsidian's KOTOR 2 is better than anything Bioware have done (BW have made great games, but for me KOTOR 2 is a superb example of dark, rich storytelling that is extremely absorbing, but never overwhelms you to the point where its too uncomfortable or not fun to play anymore).

 

I'd love to see more games like KOTOR 2, but I don't think Bioware are the ones to do it. Not because I doubt their talent or think poorly of their games, Simply because I think their focus and talents are better employed on what have traditionally been their strengths. A sense of fun and adventure, epic scale and spectacle, attention paid to making the experience an enjoyable and comfortable one etc etc.

[Jedi Comedian]

KOTOR 2 is my favourite game of all time, I can't beleive Kreia isn't canon and goddammed Rey, Poe and Finn are.

[Absafraginlootly]

*snip*

They should've taken us to Denerim rather than Redcliffe and shown alienages with people despairing in the street 

*snip*

 

Instead of having two one area cities, better I think to have visited the val royeux alienage and more common areas, both to emphasize how the civil war and mage/templar war was effecting the common folk and so that val royeux actually felt like a city instead of a single market place.

[Helmetto]

Dark and gritty suits some games, but I don't feel like Bioware has ever really bought into that mentality in any of its games. They have always seemed more interested in filling their worlds with loveable losers, cheeky and dashing rogues, amusingly shady swindlers etc. 

 

Uh.

 

What about the Warden Ritual in DAO, where the loveable, cheeky, dashing rogue dies, and you watch Duncan murder someone straight up to keep their "dark secret"?

 

Or where you watch King Cailin get crushed before being tossed aside like a rag doll, and you feel bad, and then you learn that your great King was going to leave his wife and marry Empress Celene, basically handing Ferelden back over to Orlais?

 

In one of the Origin stories, your father is dying and you can't do anything to save him, and that isn't even the worst thing.

 

Like, even DA2 has some pretty dark moments, not as bad as DAO, but still.

[Jedi Comedian]

And backstabbing Alistair at the Landsmeet and recruiting Loghain was without a doubt one of my favourite gaming moments.

[Marshal Moriarty]

You can quote scenes all you like, but it doesn't make the game feel darker. I happen to agree that the Joining ritual scene is very well done, but it was a false promise. The scene intrigued me and suggested that the faction you were joining were rather more sinister than you had been led to believe. But that is also the last time such an angle is used in the game, and is in fact basically the end of the Grey Warden lore in the game full stop. Every time they have tried to go back to this and recapture that sinister feel to the Wardens, it has never worked IMO (i,e in Soldier's Keep, and the disastrously silly Warden questline in Inquisition). Origins in general is far gritter and darker in the actual Origin stories and Ostafar than it ever is again after that, when it morphs into the usual Bioware world travelling, adventuring experience. Its what people want, so its obvious why they keep doing it.

 

Simply having murder and death does not a dark game make. Its how things are presented. Bioware's attempts at dark and gritty often feel iike they dropped in from outer space, delivering supposedly tragic or shocking events that are rarely refererred to or dwelt on again after said scene. Party members will also have this kind of this thing inserted into their personal stories, intended to develop them, but usually coming across as a complete 'Bolt out of the Blue' moment that will turn out to have suprisingly little importance. Leliana's dark and sinister past for example, feels completely out of place in Origins, and doesn't fit with the character at all. And when they try to develop this and say 'No really, it does work' in Inquisition, she suffers even more from how silly and vampish it all is. Or else you have characters like Sten and Blackwall etc, who are revealed to have committed terrible crimes and nobody really cares or minds very much. Other times they simple make fun of things like this (Alistair's conversations with Zevran usually revolve around Alistair wondering why he's travelling with a self confessed murderer - he even has a special conversation at camp with you about how he basically thinks mostly all the other party members are crazed nutcases).

 

The games have dark elements to them of course, but these are never really sustained or allowed to drag on narratively, no matter how extreme they supposedly are (Hawke's mother being chopped up and stitched back together etc is a good example). Bioware know that people play their games generally speaking to have a good time and be big damn heroes. So that's where the bulk of their attention goes. Intense, oppressive atmosphere and sustained feelings of despair and hopelessness aren't their thing. They've been at this a long time now - they know what their fans want from a narrative and characters broadly speaking, and they have developed a system to reliably churn out such material. They're not going to change that now, because the ihe games industry never changes anything that works for them, until forced to do so by declining sales.

[Tigress M]

I dunno - I like it the way it is.  You don't get truly happily ever afters but there are some bright moments - kinda like RL.  I understand the attraction folks have to Dark Fantasy but the DAVerse is dark enough for my tastes.  

[OMTING52601]

*snip*

 

I agree. There are some dark moments in the games, but there is a clear 'right' and 'wrong' and it's blatant while playing, not after.

 

I know the first time I played the Witcher, I kind of went in with this BW mentality and... Holy wow, that was not a world state I wanted to have at the end. I've never played KOTOR 2, so I can't comment, but dark to me means you really gotta RP the character, you gotta go with your gut and hope, you gotta be informed and have knowledge so you don't make some choice that causes a planet's destruction because you weren't fully involved or whatever. Dark is hard choices where I don't know what is 'right' or 'wrong', where it's all grey, and where the choices I'm making involve serious subject matter - like genocide and mass murder or questionable scientific advancement or even whether its better to nuke a town mostly overrun with plague or try and save the survivors and hope one of them is immune... 

 

Watching Duncan kill the Jory was dark, but I played no role in it. I couldn't stop it and I couldn't check out of the initiation either. My player has to be the one doing the doing and making the choices, otherwise I don't usually find a game 'dark', more atmospheric, I guess.

[straykat]

I think the Warden could do some dark things, but the world itself wasn't that way in general. And even then, choices don't mean a lot without consequences. A crappy Warden still gets lauded like anyone else. Even if you let Redcliffe burn, and sacrifice elves for +1 con, they build statues for you and want you to dictate terms to the Chantry. lol. It's very player centric in the end.. rather than character centric. Whatever makes you personally feel good. That's the only rule of the day. And that's not dark at all.

[Catilina]

Like, even DA2 has some pretty dark moments, not as bad as DAO, but still.

DA2 much more darken than DA:O, just not monumental.

[Elite Fennec]

I think the Warden could do some dark things, but the world itself wasn't that way in general. And even then, choices don't mean a lot without consequences. A crappy Warden still gets lauded like anyone else. Even if you let Redcliffe burn, and sacrifice elves for +1 con, they build statues for you and want you to dictate terms to the Chantry. lol. It's very player centric in the end.. rather than character centric. Whatever makes you personally feel good. That's the only rule of the day. And that's not dark at all.

 

Oh, I remember doing a deal with a demon in order to possess knowledge of blood magic meaning that a little boy would become possessed latter on and is something I still feel in DAI when connor doesn't appear like he's supposed to.

 

I'm just a horrible person is all.

[SomberXIII]

DA2 much more darken than DA:O, just not monumental.

Agree. Let's hope they don't make the next DA as dark as DA2. The game was almost unplayable.

[Tidus]

The highlight of the Landsmeet for me was my Elf warden beating Loghain and later through fiery hate filled green eyes executes Loghain for his treason and crimes against humanity. The second highlight of the game comes when my warden tells Alistair he/she will not help him rule Ferelden  nor will he/she become Alistairs General. Nor will Camine be any man's strumpet  so,she breaks up with Alistair since he is engaged to Anora..

[Catilina]

Agree. Let's hope they don't make the next DA as dark as DA2. The game was almost unplayable.

I like it.

[OMTING52601]

Agree. Let's hope they don't make the next DA as dark as DA2. The game was almost unplayable.

 

You know, you can fix that in options, just adjust the light scale

 

I'm teasing, I am teasing!

[In Exile]

I know this is not going to happen, but I wouldn't mind if the next Dragon Age game took the direction of DAO and TW2 (but without the fanservice of the latter). I like the dark atmosphere of this two games. Anyone agrees?

 

DA:O wasn't very gritty, and it didn't have a dark atmosphere. It had a brown atmosphere, because everything was brown. But, if anything, DA2 had the "darkest" story because it was one where the protagonist failed. DA:O was about the invincible ubermensch Warden defeating all enemies and crushing the blight singlehandedly through being so great. 

 

 

Uh.

 

What about the Warden Ritual in DAO, where the loveable, cheeky, dashing rogue dies, and you watch Duncan murder someone straight up to keep their "dark secret"?

 

Or where you watch King Cailin get crushed before being tossed aside like a rag doll, and you feel bad, and then you learn that your great King was going to leave his wife and marry Empress Celene, basically handing Ferelden back over to Orlais?

 

In one of the Origin stories, your father is dying and you can't do anything to save him, and that isn't even the worst thing.

 

Those aren't that dark. We could - at random - make a list for DA:I.

[Illegitimus]

I know this is not going to happen, but I wouldn't mind if the next Dragon Age game took the direction of DAO and TW2 (but without the fanservice of the latter). I like the dark atmosphere of this two games. Anyone agrees?

 

Actually once you play Trespasser, Inquisition is plenty dark.  

[OMTING52601]

Why/how do you think Trespasser is dark? I didn't find that, myself, but of course it is all about perspective. Just curious