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[giveamanafish...]

So I was lurking in the official Tomb Raider Forums when I came upon this thread:

http://www.tombraide...ad.php?t=213673

 

There is a game mode in Rise of the Tomb Raider that includes a randomly generated landscape for Lara to explore in:

From the blog presented above:

 

"You can’t feel truly lost and alone in the woods, unless you can actually get lost. This meant we couldn’t have a single fixed map that players could memorize over time. Our solution for this was to build a procedural world generator. Every time you play Endurance Mode, the level is constructed around you out of a series of tiled hex pieces, creating a large area of forest."

 

 

This is how it looks like:

 

 

It's not just the forest that is randomly generated, as you can see at about 1:51 in the above youtube video, tombs and traps are also randomly generated. It all looks pretty good (Xbox only at this time).

 

I bring this up because

a) first time I've ever heard of a randomly generated map in a AAA game and I am excited. I had always hoped open world games would move to this type of landscape generation;

it's not well known. After reading the thread in the Tomb Raider Forums, I did a google search on rotr endurance mode and had to go thru 8 articles and 3 reviews before I found a reference to the random maps. 2 reviews complained that there was only one sandbox. Here's a review referencing what to me is the key cool feature here:

https://www.inverse....is-a-hidden-gem

 

So I would think that this is something that could work in ME:A. Maybe mostly in multi-player but in at least certain points in the main game. (There's a good point made in the last post on the Tomb Raider Forum thread, in that this type of map could be a problem in terms of driving a story. In RotTR its a seperate independent play mode.)

[rapscallioness]

I think that would be cool for MP. Help keep it fresh. And keep people on their toes.

[xAmilli0n]

I think that would be cool for MP. Help keep it fresh. And keep people on their toes.

Same here. I feel like if this were implemented well into a MP game, it could potentially be very exciting.

[Deebo305]

I haven't beaten RoTR yet so I haven't tried endurance mode but I believe the dungeons in DA:I MP is supposedly randomly generated so Bioware has dabbled with the idea. I'd say it would work well during side missions like the ones from ME2 that dealt with the merc bands like Eclipse and Blue Suns

[NKnight7]

It'd be cool to see this in MP, would keep things exciting and 'new' for players.

[Han Shot First]

One of the rumors is that Andromeda features hundreds of randomly generated planets to explore.

 

Lets just say that after DA:I, I'm kind of hoping that rumor isn't true. Sometimes less is more, and I'm not too confident in Bioware's ability to make hundreds of planets interesting...particularly if they're randomly generated.

[Andrew Lucas]

One of the rumors is that Andromeda features hundreds of randomly generated planets to explore.
 
Lets just say that after DA:I, I'm kind of hoping that rumor isn't true. Sometimes less is more, and I'm not too confident in Bioware's ability to make hundreds of planets interesting...particularly if they're randomly generated.

Inquisition's problem is other, the lack of interesting side quest.

MEA can have 20 maps/planets, that's not the issue, what matters is balance. If those maps are filled with fetch quests that adds nothing to the game, story - wise, then Bioware will have failed again.

Now, if they have interesting tales to share, then they learned their lesson.

[The Real Pearl #2]

having it be an option to have an rng map would be fine, But i had enough RNG, What if it spawned a map like condor? 

[LinksOcarina]

One of the rumors is that Andromeda features hundreds of randomly generated planets to explore.

 

Lets just say that after DA:I, I'm kind of hoping that rumor isn't true. Sometimes less is more, and I'm not too confident in Bioware's ability to make hundreds of planets interesting...particularly if they're randomly generated.

 

I'm not against the idea of randomly generated maps.

 

I am, however, curious as to what the game will be if that is the case. Namely, how do you put quests on something procedurely generated, when the only way for content like that to work is for the player to set their own goals.

[Jorji Costava]

This would be really bad for anyone who wanted to do a 100% speedrun of the game (been watching a lot of those recently, as AGDQ happened earlier this month).

[Hiemoth]

I'm not against the idea of randomly generated maps.

 

I am, however, curious as to what the game will be if that is the case. Namely, how do you put quests on something procedurely generated, when the only way for content like that to work is for the player to set their own goals.

 

I would be terrified for the game if they announced random maps as in that case the planets have no narrative purpose since you can't fit story with random maps, yet they need a reason for the planets. Which would most likely lead to resource grinding and attention diversed from the main narrative. It would also take away resources from creating actual plot planets with a driving narrative.

[LinksOcarina]

I would be terrified for the game if they announced random maps as in that case the planets have no narrative purpose since you can't fit story with random maps, yet they need a reason for the planets. Which would most likely lead to resource grinding and attention diversed from the main narrative. It would also take away resources from creating actual plot planets with a driving narrative.

 

Well, I did have one idea, and that is radiant questing like Bethesda, but then it is about specific resources or areas or strongholds or colonies, which means it is going to be very same-y sidequests in that regard over hand-crafted ones.

 

Not that there is anything wrong with that either, so long as it's not the ONLY form of side-questing in-game. I can see some planets being procedurarly generated due to resources by "name." So here is a list of 20 planets, lets say, and they show up randomly in each solar system you explore save for main questline planets, which are fixed.

 

That could, at least, be a way to get around it, but it still not work well, I think. 

[Hiemoth]

Well, I did have one idea, and that is radiant questing like Bethesda, but then it is about specific resources or areas or strongholds or colonies, which means it is going to be very same-y sidequests in that regard over hand-crafted ones.

 

Not that there is anything wrong with that either, so long as it's not the ONLY form of side-questing in-game. I can see some planets being procedurarly generated due to resources by "name." So here is a list of 20 planets, lets say, and they show up randomly in each solar system you explore save for main questline planets, which are fixed.

 

That could, at least, be a way to get around it, but it still not work well, I think. 

 

Yeah, but even in that case even creating a good random map generator is a huge resourcesink. Asides that, what would be the role of those randomly generated worlds? They are obviously there to be explored, but what is honestly there to be found as they are randomly generated. Thus the only thing would be resources, which would need a creation of a need for resources, which would lead to resource grinding while shouting about exploration.

 

This is actually something I feel DAI fell into, in a way, and I hope that MEA avoids despite their great focus on exploration. In order to really have exploration, you first need there to be something to be found by exploring. One of the reasons DAI maps feel so empty to me, no matter how beautiful they are, is that there really much to find there. Some flavor text in form of journals and some random loot/schematics. There really isn't a lot of things that made me stop and think how awesome that was, because there was nothing in the narrative to support that, nothing to really draw your attention or want to find out about the secrets of a half-buried statue head or something. And I can't see how that would be avoided with randomly generated maps.

[Nitrocuban]

In theory stuff like that always sounds great, in reality it's not.

Randomly generated maps/quests get boring very fast and a "been here, done that" feel kicks in while the player is still forced to keep playing over and over the same poopoo cause making  that tool to create all that random stuff did take so much time during developement that is has to generate at least XY hours of gameplay time.

Fallout 4 tried to get around this problem a bit and uses handmade locations with randomly generated "go there, kill that, find stuff" quests. Kinda ok but still annoying after 100hrs and maybe a bit too much quests of that kind alltogether.

MEA could do the same, including "Defend UR settlement, Commander NotShepard!" with a low rate of all these events like only one every 2hrs playtime or so.

[Deebo305]

having it be an option to have an rng map would be fine, But i had enough RNG, What if it spawned a map like condor?

I liked Firebase Condor though

[DarthCompetent]

having it be an option to have an rng map would be fine, But i had enough RNG, What if it spawned a map like condor?

Ughh...Condor. And I thought I was the only one that didn't like that godforsaken map lol

[RZIBARA]

no. screw that. it would suck. 

 

Less crap with higher quality is better than lots of crap with lesser quality. 

 

Call me crazy, but one of the things I loved about the ME games was that they were pretty short. You could 100% each game within 30-40 hrs each. MAX

 

Like ME1 was the one that took me the longest to 100%, at 38 hrs. I love that. Less is more

[AlanC9]

Should the time to hit 100% be the criterion?

[Gothfather]

One of the rumors is that Andromeda features hundreds of randomly generated planets to explore.

 

Lets just say that after DA:I, I'm kind of hoping that rumor isn't true. Sometimes less is more, and I'm not too confident in Bioware's ability to make hundreds of planets interesting...particularly if they're randomly generated.

 

I agree and disagree.

 

There are a few games out there that are going back to procedurally generated content but I think this might be a bandwagon that ME:A should skip. Not because I am against the idea. i'm not I think it is great but because i think developers should WAIT and see how various up coming games approach this. The last thing I want is another spore with regards to procedurally generated content.

 

There has always been limitations to this technology which is why hand crafted environments eventually took over once storage issues where solved with the CD-rom. I think the tech while "old" is still undeveloped and I think maybe Bioware should take a more cautious approach to this and see if all these games promising great environments actually create great environments before we pressure bioware to follow suit.

[Kabooooom]

I rarely make statements this absolute, and I have never (to my memory) used this phrase on these forums so far...but I really, really hate this idea. Like, passionately. I think it is a horrible idea, and will contribute nothing (and possibly detract) from the story.

Lifeless worlds are fine. Space is mostly lifeless. That makes sense. I didnt mind Mass Effects worlds - next Gen versions with more balance would be ideal. But randomly generated ones? No.

[o Ventus]

no. screw that. it would suck. 

 

Less crap with higher quality is better than lots of crap with lesser quality. 

 

Call me crazy, but one of the things I loved about the ME games was that they were pretty short. You could 100% each game within 30-40 hrs each. MAX

 

Like ME1 was the one that took me the longest to 100%, at 38 hrs. I love that. Less is more

 

Procedurally-generated (which is the term you're looking for, OP, not random) levels wouldn't make the game any longer, not unless you're deliberately making the experience slower. Diablo, Torchlight, and plenty of ARPGs utilize procedurally-generated dungeons to promote replayability, and they never take any more than 2 or 3 minutes to complete assuming one doesn't artificially ramp up the difficulty or play slowly.

[SardaukarElite]

Procedural generation is a very powerful tool if you know how to use it. Invisible Inc builds great levels procedurally, I have high hopes for XCOM 2.

 

It's easy to assume that the levels will be lifeless but we already have lifeless hand crafted levels being made by people prioritizing breadth of content over quality. Building a procedural level system requires you to think about and implement rules which define a good level, and if you can get it right then you have a system which can build levels on the fly.