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[SwobyJ]

I'm doing my 'definitive ME2 Insanity' playthrough.

 

I'm finishing the Loyalties and Sidequests, so Reaper IFF/Legion Recruit is coming up soon.

 

I know you can go Legion Recruit --> ONE MISSION --> Legion Loyalty --> Collector Base.

 

For people into a mix of roleplay AND gameplay optimization, does it sound like a good idea to, instead of something like Tali Loyalty (I'm saving that for my friend's playthrough when she visits), I put Arrival there so its sandwiched among other Reapery things? (Derelict Reaper, Heretic Geth, Collector finale)

 

I had been debating whether to optimize everything I can before Collector Base, or indeed doing the bridging story DLC (LOTSB, Arrival, kinda Overlord) post-game.

 

The two downsides I see:

1)I see a Collector General instead of Harbinger. (On the other hand, this means that actually seeing him in ME3 is perhaps more appropriately epicly new for Shepard, instead of "Oh, I just see his face again, and guess I don't get a boss fight in his innards. Shucks.")

2)Its still not the best pacing. The whole idea that Shepard directly stalls the whole Reaper invasion always overshadows the building of a Human Reaper, which only would have made an invasion worse, faster - as far as we know. (On the other hand, this is the spot that would be the best during-game pacing anyway. At least its not right after Horizon lolol.)

 

Gameplay-wise its totally fine. Sure I might be missing the very last of upgrades/whatever for Shepard I might get from Legion Loyalty and Collector Base, but that's super minimal if anything. I'm Level 30 and have almost max Paragon and almost all upgrades so meh. So I'm more concerned with the RP part of it, as well as the 'completionist' feel of 'getting everything' before my final showdown with the Human Reaper.

 

Opinions?

 

EDIT: Alternatively, I'm thinking of doing one of the following:

1)Overlord - Something to do with Legion that is otherwise gethy.

2)LOTSB - Cool adventure while waiting for Reaper IFF to install . Not so ideal when it comes to taking numerous visits to the base as a semi-hub.

3)Samara Loyalty - I REALLY want to do the Charm option with Morinth so... waiting until I have almost as much Paragon as possible would be nice.

4)Miranda Loyalty - The idea of saving her for last is nice, since it can fit with her quitting Cerberus shortly after (she may be in final party, I'm not sure). And like Samara's Loyalty, I'm concerned with having enough Paragon for the Jack+Miranda fight, though I'm pretty confident about this one.

 

Tali's Loyalty is not likely. I don't love her as much as other characters and my friend is already doing this later.

[SwobyJ]

Actually wait. I do want Maximum Legion (one of my favorite henchmen) so the choices are now down to:

1)Overlord

2)LOTSB

3)Miranda Loyalty (least likely)

 

I'll save Arrival for just before Reaper IFF I guess.

[cap and gown]

Some points on gameplay mechanics:

1) You are not getting all the upgrades if you are saving LotSB for so late in the game. Liara will deliver 4 upgrades to you, but it usually takes an average of 8 mission complete screens to get all four of them: SMG, Sniper, Assault Rifle, and Shotgun upgrades. (Whether a new upgrade is available is somewhat random, but generally seems to occur after every other mission.)

 

2) Waiting to "get the maximum paragon points" is a bad idea. The following is what I wrote in another post about the persuade system in ME2:

Spoiler

For ME2 the persuade system is rather opaque. You have paragon and renegade meters, but they actually are misleading and you should not pay attention to them. To pass persuade checks in ME2 each check requires that you are either x% paragon or y% renegade. Sometimes the percentage required is very high, sometimes it is not so high. It will also depend on whether it is an intimidate or charm option. For some persuade checks the charm option (blue) requires a low percentage while the intimidate (red) option requires a high percentage. For others, the charm option may require a high percentage, while the intimidate option may require a low percentage.

 

How are these percentages calculated? Every time you enter some new area/run some mission, there will be a total number of paragon points that can be earned (p), and a total number of renegade points that can be earned ( r). Let's say you land on Omega, the first hub world you will probably go to. Let's say there are a total of 200 paragon points that could be earned here and 150 renegade points that could be earned here based on the dialogue choices you make. Now let's say you earn 100 paragon points and 50 renegade points. (And you missed out on a number of points because you didn't talk to certain people or picked a neutral option.) Your paragon percentage is now 50%, and your renegade percentage is 33%. Now let's say you are presented with a dialogue where you can persuade someone. The charm option requires that you be 40% paragon and intimidate option requires that you be 35% renegade. You will be able to use the charm option (blue) because your paragon percentage is 50% which is greater than the 40% required, but you will not be able to use the intimidate option (red) because your renegade percentage is 33% which is less than the 35% required.

 

As you travel to more and more places and run more and more missions, the total number of paragon and renegade points you could potentially earn keeps growing and growing, but the likelihood of you earning all the points available is rather low, meaning as the game progresses it becomes increasingly harder to pass persuade checks.

 

For this reason, it is recommended that you 1) try to get to difficult persuade checks early in a game, and 2) import as many paragon and renegade points from ME1 as possible. You can import up to 190 paragon points and 190 renegade points from ME1. Using the above example, a character that imported 190 renegade and 190 paragon points would start out - before even talking to anyone - at 95% paragon and 126% renegade, meaning they could pass any persuade check imaginable. For an experienced player who understands how the system works it is entirely possible to play a character that is 50% paragon and 50% renegade and pass all the persuade checks in ME2.

TL;DR 1) import as many para/ren points as possible from ME2, 2) pick the class evolution that boosts para/ren score by 100%, 3) do the mission as early as possible

 

For Tali's LM it is very easy to get her cleared of the charges: 1) Send Veetor back to the fleet with Tali, 2) Tell Kal'Reegar to stand down on Haestrom, 3) use a persuade option during the initial meeting with the Admirals (the required number of points for the persuade options during the initial part of the trial are very low) 4) pick the "rally the crowd" option when asked for more evidence (middle right option). For the Legion/Tali dispute the paragon points needed are very small.

 

As the mission order:

You haven't really told us anything about who your Shepard is, which would have a huge impact on when certain missions fit in, or if they even fit in at all. In my Katrina Shepard playthrough I didn't do Overlord at all because Katrina would have broken with Cerberus right then and there, and I decided that she would break with Cerberus over the decision to blow up the Collector Base. It was also a tough call with her whether to even do Arrival since that would force her to kill 300,000 Batarians and I wasn't sure she would be willing to do that. Here is my intro into my thinking about Arrival with her. For Tristan Shepard I ended up doing Arrival right after Horizon since Tristan was a suck-up that wanted to curry favor with the Alliance brass. Morwen Shepard (a Colonist/Ruthless) was fairly OK with working with Cerberus, so I used Overlord as the straw that broke the camel's back and caused her to break with Cerberus and turn herself into the Alliance. In that case I did Arrival before the Collector Base (Morwen saved the base) and Overlord afterwords as my last mission.

 

Another thing to consider:

I am getting close to doing a "canon" playthrough. What makes this canon is my realization that Shepard's actions during Arrival practically force a Ruthless background on Shepard. When Garrus talks about the ruthless calculus of war and sacrificing 1 billion here to save 10 billion there, there is no way Shepard can disagree with this statement if she just recently killed 300,000 Batarians just to delay are Reaper invasion for a mere 6 months to a year. If your Shepard cannot agree with Garrus's statement about the ruthless calculus of war I would recommend just skipping Arrival all together.

[SwobyJ]

Reading through:

 

-Yeah, makes sense to not do LOTSB I guess. I knew there was something about it.

 

-Too late for doing mission early. I know how this system works, actually. But I do have an element of personal roleplay that still picks the GENERAL order of things. This meant saving some stuff for later, as if Shepard only just found the time for it. I do make sure my ratio-for-level of Paragon is super high, I'm just paranoid about it is all.

 

-Yep I know how to clear Tali and it'll be fun. I'll be rallying the crowd. I dunno what my friend will pick though, I'm interested in what will happen

 

-My main Shepard is a mix of completionism and Paragon-to-Paragade roleplay. So I'm NOT skipping ANYTHING. I also intend on my final act in ME2 to be either the Collector Base or Arrival. Overlord will either be before or right after Reaper IFF (if after, I'm taking Legion).

 

-I somewhat disagree about Arrival. Just because you're faced with the scenario and see no other choice, acknowledging the ruthless calculus of war is NOT the same thing as appreciating or seeking or succumbing (etc) to it. The alternate way to take Arrival is that Shepard can just regret not being there SOONER and finding a BETTER way to stop the advance of the Reapers, not just accepting that there was never a way to help the batarians. Arrival may have set some of the tone of ME3's war and perhaps be more fitting for Ruthless (or imo, Sole Survivor with how you hold out against Object Rho, heh), but you're still given the option to insist, against even the facts of your failure, that there's always 'another way', even if that other way isn't always found. Basically, I can just see it as another bigger challenge for someone like a War Hero Shepard to face. In any case, the origin is the origin, not the destination. For example, I may have started Paragon in ME and ME2, but this Shepard is decidedly Paragade in ME3.

 

 

Anyway, its now down to:

1)Overlord

2)Miranda Loyalty

 

....Okay actually, I'll do Overlord .

 

If I do future playthroughs, I'll do plenty more stuff (in particular DLC) post-game, but I just want to be in the very best shape (not just for combat, but just to 'feel finished') to face the Collector Base in this specifically Insanity playthrough.

 

 

So, new question - is this order correct?: Reaper IFF --> Overlord --> Legion Loyalty --> Collector Base

 

Does Overlord count as just one safe mission, not several-and-therefore-my-crew-is-dead?

[cap and gown]

 

 

So, new question - is this order correct?: Reaper IFF --> Overlord --> Legion Loyalty --> Collector Base

 

Does Overlord count as just one safe mission, not several-and-therefore-my-crew-is-dead?

 

This order works just fine. I have done it in this order several times. Your crew will be fine.

[cap and gown]

Oh, BTW

 

MAXIMUM LEGION!

 

Spoiler

[SwobyJ]

This order works just fine. I have done it in this order several times. Your crew will be fine.

 

Okay sounds good! While I'll be missing out on Legion-unique-and-cool lines he can say in main game story missions, having him around for the couple hours of Overlord will be a nice adventure. He'll also be by my side throughout Suicide Mission and of course Legion Loyalty, so I'll get some use out of him.

[cap and gown]

Okay sounds good! While I'll be missing out on Legion-unique-and-cool lines he can say in main game story missions, having him around for the couple hours of Overlord will be a nice adventure. He'll also be by my side throughout Suicide Mission and of course Legion Loyalty, so I'll get some use out of him.

 

Legion works great on Overlord. Hacking is an extremely powerful tool when dealing with Geth and is fairly good against Loki mechs.

[SwobyJ]

Legion works great on Overlord. Hacking is an extremely powerful tool when dealing with Geth and is fairly good against Loki mechs.

 

After Horizon and the first fight of Collector Ship, its all easy.

[Arkalezth]

I'm doing my 'definitive ME2 Insanity' playthrough.

 

I know you can go Legion Recruit --> ONE MISSION --> Legion Loyalty --> Collector Base.

 

I'm 99% sure that the "ONE MISSION" bit only works if it's a loyalty one (assuming you want to save every crew member). Otherwise, and IIRC, you'll get Legion's loyalty mission right after you recruit it.

[SwobyJ]

I'm 99% sure that the "ONE MISSION" bit only works if it's a loyalty one (assuming you want to save every crew member). Otherwise, and IIRC, you'll get Legion's loyalty mission right after you recruit it.

 

Damn, I just did all other Loyalty. Guess its just LOTSB (with 2 more visits to the Base when I can) --> Arrival --> Legion Recruit --> Legion Loyalty --> Collector Base for me now.

[cap and gown]

This may be too late, but you could just skip a loyalty mission before picking up Legion. For instance, don't do Jacob's mission. It has no impact on ME3 except for missing an investigate option. By leaving that mission undone you could do Overlord and then Legion Loyalty. (My previous response was based on my usual experience of skipping Jacob's mission so that I had two missions between the IFF and the kidnapping.)

[SwobyJ]

This may be too late, but you could just skip a loyalty mission before picking up Legion. For instance, don't do Jacob's mission. It has no impact on ME3 except for missing an investigate option. By leaving that mission undone you could do Overlord and then Legion Loyalty. (My previous response was based on my usual experience of skipping Jacob's mission so that I had two missions between the IFF and the kidnapping.)

 

Yeah its too late! I want everyone's Loyalty when I go to the Collector Base anyway.

 

I just finished the main part of Lair of the Shadow Broker. Instead of stepping forward to visit her, I went straight for the Normandy. I'll be making periodic visits to her.

 

Question: Could I do something like..

1)Overlord

2)Visit Liara and Feron, have her bring up visiting me in the Normandy

3)Arrival, Legion Recruit, Legion Loyalty, Collector Ship

4)Have Liara visit me, but if she does, she'll then bring up the Reapers instead of Collectors? This scene could be the wrap up of everything.

 

I'm not super inclined to doing this because I'd kinda like the credit roll to be the last thing I see, but it tempts me. Alternatively. I could do only Arrival then ask Liara to visit, before I make the final stretch.

[Arkalezth]

This may be too late, but you could just skip a loyalty mission before picking up Legion. 

 

Yeah, that's what I actually meant to say: You don't get Legion's loyalty mission right away unless you've already done everyone else's. I haven't tried to do a non-loyalty during that gap, but I guess it should work.